MSU legal defense now apparently investigating victims
WARNING: Freep Link
“I had no choice in now disclosing my own story,” Powell said in an interview with the Free Press this week. “This was my own story. This was not their story to tell.”
Powell's claim that an investigator checked into her background suggests the university is taking steps to construct a defense amid a growing pile of litigation.
February 9th, 2018 at 9:46 AM ^
They should. And I take comfort knowing Michigan would do the same in the situation. While it also would be searching for a new football coach and basketball coach. Or welcoming freshly hired ones.
No one is bigger than the University. Ever.
February 9th, 2018 at 9:49 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 9:49 AM ^
I mean, I get it that it's a bad look...but does anyone really expect a company/person/institution to not prepare a defense in the face of a billion dollars worth of lawsuits?
This is totally expected.
February 9th, 2018 at 9:57 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 10:09 AM ^
Well they have to, thats how the legal system works in America. People are coming after their money now and MSU has to protect itself. I mean this isnt really rocket science, its a messed up system, but its the one we got.
AKA....MSU legal team is doing its job. Not saying I support it, but that's what these lawyers are paid to do, create doubt....
February 9th, 2018 at 10:15 AM ^
That's not exactly true, MSU could have taken the PSU route and showed some class (that was gross to type).
February 9th, 2018 at 10:30 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 11:09 AM ^
How is it different from what PSU did (I guess did PSU investigate the victims)?
February 9th, 2018 at 11:36 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 1:15 PM ^
That's the thing, no two case's are exactly the same. So you can't really compare MSU with PSU. There are what like 253 accusers to this point. As been pointed out a baseline needs to be established order to know how to proceed.
To your point about class, yes MSU could have handled that situation with much more grace....
February 9th, 2018 at 10:16 AM ^
I find it odd that MSU's lawyers are paid to "create doubt" when MSU's employee Larry Nassar pleaded guilty. Nassar already admitted to it.
February 9th, 2018 at 10:21 AM ^
and conflating criminal guilt of one person with both the liability and the damages for a separate entity which benefits from some substantial immunity defenses.
one thing they would be checking too is whether all the victims really were part of the program, had that kind of contact, how long/how frequent contact, etc. they will do a substantial check of social media of the claimants as well.
February 9th, 2018 at 11:11 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 12:33 PM ^
'the thing is decided'. it could apply to some or many issues in the case. the single biggest issue is the immunity issue - molestor state is immune from most regular things that we all aren't. they can't be found liable for even gross negligence unless they are the sole cause of the injury. (that's from a case in antrim county having to do with a building inspector who wasn't doing his job). that is a very difficult standard to overcome b/c the 'sole cause of the damages means you almost have to pretend nassar doesn't exist - and you can't.
however, clever lawyers can make an argument, especially for the later victims, that had molestor state done their job and notified/intervened/protected, whatever, then victims #2-250 could've avoided this horror. we'll see.
also, while res judicata might not technically apply to any or many of the downstream cases, there is the practical effect of earlier rulings on similar cases - it could take the starch out of the plaintiffs and/or the defense at various points along the way. if you know that judge X thinks this way about issue Y, and you also have judge X, how much fighting about issue Y do you really want to do in your case?
the other big factor is whether they file in state or federal court. the judges are different, the law is different. this might be a good case to file in fed court. i haven't researched it, but maybe somebody could find out if any cases have been filed and if so, where/what court.
.
February 9th, 2018 at 2:55 PM ^
Nope. Res judicata applies to claims involving the same issues between the same parties that have already been decided. (Depending on the facts, collateral estoppel might apply when different parties--such as other plaintiffs--get involved.)
February 9th, 2018 at 4:04 PM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 5:11 PM ^
for instance i had a woman claiming a number of injuries due to the alleged assault by a client of mine i had a field day impeaching her with FB posts about her fun day drinking and rafting on X river a couple of days after the alleged assault and received a not guilty verdict after about 5 minutes of jury deliberation. not saying that's the case with any of the young ladies involved, but that you'd be surprised what a treasure trove social media can be.
February 9th, 2018 at 5:40 PM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 10:15 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 10:23 AM ^
A) As stated by others, this ithe MSU attorney(s)' job.
B) This only reinforces the incredibly bravery of the women who came forward, especially Denhollander, the first one to make her story known. They are in for a long, painful process.
C) Most of them were probably counseled by their own attorney that this kind of investigation was inevitable, which is why that there are likely 2-3 times MORE victims than the 150+ that already came forward, but who didn't want to be subjected to this kind of scrutiny.
D) I personally could care less about civil court damages. MSU is a big enough organization (like PSU) that the dollars will only mnatter to them short-term. But the people responsible for covering this up for so many years should be in jail. Period.
February 9th, 2018 at 10:21 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 10:25 AM ^
I'm no lawyer but I'm assuming their defense team is doing what its supposed to be doing by investigating the victims. They were hired specifically to defend and protect MSU. If they're not going to do that, then what the hell is MSU paying them for?
February 9th, 2018 at 10:30 AM ^
Sounds like a move right out his playbook.
February 9th, 2018 at 10:50 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 11:06 AM ^
To me it makes a big difference what is being investigated. If they are investigating whether the claimed events actually happened (to the extent that is possible given the circumstances) I have no problem with it. So, did the girl actually see Nassar, are there witnesses who can corroborate (office personel, friends, family, etc), etc. are legitimate issues to determine. On the other hand, if they are simply digging up dirt about the claimants personal lives to try to discredit or embarass them, its shameful. The line is more than a little blurry here because many of the victims are making claims about the effect of the abuse on their personal lives and have put personal events in issue in the litigation. As a lawyer, I hope the lawyers for MSU realize that overzealous investigation of these women will only further damage their client.
February 9th, 2018 at 11:34 AM ^
I don't think that most people, and especially most MSU fans, truly understand what is going to happen in East Lansing over the next few months and years.
The lawyers are now running the University and no decent lawyer is going to risk his career and reputation by doing a piss-poor job of protecting his client. This does not mean that they are going to be part of any alleged or real cover-ups that have occurred at State. What it does mean is that they are going to be uber-responsible and that they are going to have to install a new regime in East Lansing that is extremely strict and pure as the driven snow. This is necessitated by the accountants and the insurance firms. No insurance company in the world is going to indemnify the school without a complete purge of the administration as well as the athletic leaders who even have an inkling of impropriety associated with their names. No university in the country can operate without comprehensive insurance coverage.
The interim president and athletic directors are just figureheads who will be washed away once the financial settlements are determined. The coeds on campus will team up with the metoo# movement and put enough pressure on the administration to affect change. Izzo and Dantonio will soon be gone, either through termination or "early retirement", simply because their failings have been exposed to the public and their reputations are no longer "pristine". Recruiting will suffer immensely due to the school no longer being able to accept any student-athletes that have borderline or sketchy backgrounds (I'm assuming the NCAA will continue their long track record of ineptitude and will not dock the school any scholarships or even put them on probation.). MSU sports will probably be B1G cellar dwellers for quite a while once their current talent leaves, which will be relatively soon in basketball and two to three years for football.
I have friends and relatives who went to MSU, so I am not reveling in their despair. I only hope that this never happens again at any school in this country and that others see this as an example of what happens when you recruit, protect, and cover-up for low-life scum who have no business being on a college campus in the first place.
February 9th, 2018 at 11:44 AM ^
Penn State says "Hello, and, you're wrong."
February 9th, 2018 at 11:52 AM ^
February 9th, 2018 at 2:04 PM ^
Your first point is 100% correct. You second point is 100% speculative bullshit.
Izzo and Dantonio SHOULD be gone, but that is not only uncertain, but very unlikely. The gymnastics coach and program were rightly wiped clean, but the football and basketball are a completely different animal, with no direct connection to Nassar despite their tendency to look the other way in areas of player misconduct.
February 9th, 2018 at 2:51 PM ^
February 10th, 2018 at 12:38 AM ^
at the very least had a player admit to being part of a rape with another player and hid behind the legal system to not only keep them on the team but without any punishment or consequences at all. He more than likely did the same thing after Walton's alleged assault.
Dantonio has had 16 players involved in instances of sexual assault or violence against women. The only time he actually kicked players off the team he lied and said it was "new territory" for him.
Both are guilty of incubating this culture. The environment in which there are no consequences for this type of behavior, regarless of the outcome of the legal system, is directly on them.
February 10th, 2018 at 8:33 AM ^
February 10th, 2018 at 9:06 AM ^
RCMB much?
I have no feeling one way or another about ESPN. I've read the police report. I was no less appalled before the ESPN report. BTW, as appalled as I was about the Gibbons and Lewan situation. Unacceptable standard for coaches at MSU, Michigan, PSU, Baylor--it doesn't matter.
My university or any university should be protected from predators, not be an enabler of them. Hiding behind the legal process is not an acceptable standard.
Also, you forgot to include the words "Witch Hunt" in your post. You get points off for being incomplete.
February 10th, 2018 at 10:11 AM ^
Nah, I mostly agree with you. no RCMB. Groupthink is very prevalent here too in the same manner and isn't healthy. Both places repeat things till they become some form of "truth" that doesn't exist in any form of reality outside of said message board. This MSU thing is a great example of how neither side can look at things objectively and look at the larger picture.
I'm just saying you can't take much of anything at face value when it comes from ESPN. There's nothing new that they presented. Everyone here knew everything presented in it but now Dantonio and Izzo should be fired.
I think there's Appling/Payne on par with Gibbons/Lewan, which are very bad and I think both universities would have handled them differently today than they did. More minor things like Walton, Perry, Lewis, Mumphrey that are too common everywhere in terms of violence or other mistreatment towards women and it's somehow been engrained in college athletics. I agree, it's not acceptable anywhere.
February 10th, 2018 at 10:37 AM ^
More's the pity.
There is a culture about all college sports that is a microcosm of the larger picture. It is just enabled more because guys that score touchdowns, etc are sources of income and pride for universities.
MSU is like a lot of places. The desire for success or the maintenance of some degree of success often results in a certain moral ambiguity. Botched rape scenes at Iowa. James Franklin contacting potential assault victims at Vanderbuilt. No one is immune. ESPN just placed a light on one such place. I don't think they (ESPN) did anything evil or purposeful. We just need more lights.
February 9th, 2018 at 11:42 AM ^
Lawyer here. Think of it this way.
There are 265 victims, of which some number are named plaintiffs and some others might be witnesses.
Investigating the background of each takes several to dozens of hours.
MSU's lawyers are paid by the hour.
February 9th, 2018 at 1:24 PM ^
All 265 of them are liars. Fake news! Never happened . . .
February 9th, 2018 at 1:58 PM ^
Me too.
I can tell you there is a difference between practicing law and doing the right thing.
MSU stays 100% consistent here. The absolute WRONG move at every juncture. Between the victims and the lawyers, Chapter 11 is going to be looking good someday.
February 9th, 2018 at 3:01 PM ^
While I agree (I'm in-house) that there definitely will be a good amount of churning on a case like this, there still is no doubt that there needs to be some investigation. Doing anything otherwise is basically malpractice.
February 9th, 2018 at 4:06 PM ^
While I understand it, the problem I have is they tend to attack the character of the victim and most of these victims are children
February 9th, 2018 at 6:07 PM ^
Anyone, especially young people is dispicable and the offenders hopefully will rot in jail. But let's refrain from piling on using information you have no idea about. It's a bad look.
February 10th, 2018 at 4:09 PM ^
Burn MSU to the ground. Start over