Word Of Mouth: Fall Camp Tidbits
For awhile now, after camp, I call up a buddy who's been around the program (full time support position) for quite a few years (since late-Carr era). The past couple of years, I've made a thread to share some of that summary on here for those who care. It's straight word of mouth, so a disclaimer there. And unfortunately much of this year's info has become common knowledge. In fact, we joked because we (MGoCommunity) know more about the team this year (without seeing one practice) than we ever have. It's just the information age that we live in. So hats off to MGoBlog, because much of the stuff you read here that comes off as opinion is very close to accurate. That said, nothing too ground breaking. Also, there just hasn’t been much debate this year.
Thoughts? Thoughts.
QB – Gardner is as good as the hype. He’s gotten “twice as good” over the summer and has really taken charge of the offense. Still presses a bit under pressure and makes the “oh no” throws that he needs to eliminate (I believe we saw one in a scrimmage video). Plays like Kapernick or a thin Cam Newton. Was told that if he has a big year, he’s talented enough to go to the NFL. But if he has a big year and stays, he could very well win the Heisman next year. I specifically asked about Morris. He looks good, and NO DECISION has been made on his status. Redshirt could be an option if all he'd get is mop up duty. He's not that far ahead of Cleary that Cleary can't take those snaps in a blowout. Probably won't make that call until the situation presents itself...and that's going off of what Hoke's done in the past. (Why say he is or isn't going to play when you don't know if you even will have the opp? What if we don't get up big until late in the 4th when it's best to just hand the ball off and run the clock out?)
RB – Fitz has his job and it’s HIS job. More dedicated and determined. A lot of people don’t know, but he played with a lot of pressure last year...wanted to play well and go pro to provide for his family. Tried to hit a homerun on every single play. More determined now and extremely motivated by the Green hype. Not even close most days. Green plays overweight and could very well redshirt this year. However, he’s the most improved RB over the fall camp period. Still worried that he’s Grady part II, but it’s WAAAY too early to say that Smith also motivated by the Green hype. The other returners are all better than last year, but so is the OLine.
WR – Gallon is the favorite target, but Gardner is starting to spread the ball around a lot more. Chesson and Reynolds look to replace Darboh who was the clear #2 WR. Darboh was also a great blocker. That said, expect Jackson to be used in running situations. Dileo is the “Novak” of the team. Freshman WRs have potential, but still learning the offense and how to run routes and/or block. None can be trusted right now, but at least 1 may play special teams because he could help in the 2nd half of the season (on offense).
TE – No real news...Butt is better than people realize, we could have the best TE group in the conference.
OL – Better than we’ve had since the Carr-era. Already better than last year and not even close. Here’s the C debate, same as last year. Miller is the better snapper, Glasgow is the better blocker. Expect Miller to win as Mealer (who was the better snapper) won last year. Glasgow and Bryant are in a dead heat for the LG spot. Coaches seem to want Bryant to win so Braden can be first tackle off the bench and Glasgow can be first interior OL (regardless of position) off the bench. Bryant doesn’t play C. If Glasgow is ever in at C, look for us to go under Center more than Pistol or from the Gun.
DL – Most DL depth charts that have been reported are true...Clark was working inside for the Dime package. We do have a situation package where Ojemudia, Clark and Charlton all play on the DL. I guess it’s our version of the NASCAR package the NY Giants have. Still trying to “earn the right to rush 4.” Better, but not there yet. Then again, it’s harder when Lewan and Schofield are on the other side.
LB – Ross may be the best player on the defense. He’s also improved over the summer. Morgan is the MLB despite rumors of Bolden. Gordon will be the SLB. RJS-Bolden-Beyer are in the 2nd group and expect Bolden and Beyer to play close to starter’s snaps. GMat is rotating this year more than he has at any point in the last 2 years.
DB – Still sorting out CB. Countess is the only lock. (personal thought – can we get a question to GMat to provide clarity on the depth chart at CB?). Avery is playing both (CB and S), it’s not even a big deal...it stems from the SCar game where we didn’t have guys ready that knew multiple positions. So when Floyd was out and guys went down...we had Wilson running around trying to learn on the fly. We gave up too many big plays in the secondary and coaches felt like it was because we we’re playing 10.5 on 11 because there wasn’t enough flexibility. Remember, the guys that we did have were ALL young. So they were focusing on learning THEIR position before expanding their roles. THAT is why Avery is the one bouncing around, because he’s got the most experience and knows the CB and Nickel spots. There is less separation here than anywhere else on the team. Need more consistency from the “up-and-comers.”
K/P – We’re going to be A-okay.
One of the best things I got was that all of the young guys are truly good character people. By Lewan's example, Tom Brady's story, etc. they're learning what a special place Michigan is and they aren't in a hurry like most freshman are. They're fighting to truly get better, knowing that it may be a couple of years before they're called on. I was told in "3-4 years this team could be SCARY" because you're going to have guys that truly know the system and they're going to be starving to show what they can do...and for once, they're going to be TALENTED! I personally think this next 5 year period, starting this year, could be one of the best 5 years periods any of us have ever seen at Michigan. Hope I'm right!
August 25th, 2013 at 9:24 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 9:27 AM ^
Given 90% of this info is positive I guess you have to take the good with the bad. If the stuff he said about the line is true then we don't need a super star running back to get a good ground game going and return to MANBALL that Hoke has preached since his introductory press conference.
August 25th, 2013 at 9:40 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 10:07 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 9:48 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 9:50 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 10:01 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 10:13 AM ^
Rawls could even take over the starting spot
no...
August 25th, 2013 at 10:26 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 11:07 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 11:30 AM ^
??? The coaches already did decide... We've already established that Fitz is the starter.
August 25th, 2013 at 10:00 AM ^
I'm really surprized that everyone seems worried about the Avery move and not worried about the 5* RB coming in @ 240 and not being top 4 on the depth chart.
the OL consternation seems legit: youth, new starters but there's lots of positive buzz there.
August 25th, 2013 at 10:03 AM ^
Where is this depth chart you speak of? Does it really exist in the really real world? Is it the one to bind them all?
August 25th, 2013 at 10:30 AM ^
Depth Cart, Aug 2013
RB
1) Fitz Toussaint
2) Thomas Rawls -or- Justice Hayes
3) Drake Johnson -or- Dracula
4) The Trix Rabbit
5) Derrick Green
:(
August 25th, 2013 at 11:20 AM ^
That's not the depth chart I got in my inbox this morning. The chart I got was,
1) F. Toussaint
2) T. Rawls -or- J. Hayes
3) A. Pacino -or- R. DeNiro
4) D. Johnson -or- D. Johnson -or- T. Rock
5) C. Crunch -or- C. Chocula
Yeah, no D. Green here either.
August 25th, 2013 at 3:07 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 11:34 AM ^
Why would we be worried about the 5* RB when we don't need him right away? We have a 1000 yard rusher coming back in case you've forgotten (and better than ever according to reports). And as far as worrying about youth and new starters... This is college football. There is turnover every year, and as long as there's talent to fill in the losses are minimal. We have huge jumps in talent from last year to this year.
August 25th, 2013 at 10:04 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 10:27 AM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 10:48 AM ^
If the 2013 Devin is as good as advertised --- and I have no reason to think he's not --- look for what happens when the CMU safeties pinch up into run support. We'll find out quickly whether CMU is mistaken not to respect Devin's arm. And if Devin can loosen the secondary a bit, that will allow these young linemen better opportunities to get to the second level and create running lanes for Fitz et al. To me, the running game's success is as much about Devin's ability to connect with his receivers as it is how well the line runblocks.
August 25th, 2013 at 12:30 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 10:56 AM ^
I'm jumping on the Deveon hype train... I would almost like to see Hayes or Smith as the 2 back and Green redshirt to be able to get into better shape and more familiar with the spot... Then again, it would be really nice to have some fresh legs going into November, so having Green redshirt may not be such a great idea.
On another note, the word on the O-line is very encouraging. If they are already better than last season's, that is a great sign as it will probably get even better as the season progresses and chemistry improves.
August 25th, 2013 at 11:02 AM ^
It's good to hear that the shuffling of positions for DBs is with an eye for developing depth at each position--not as some had surmised a late-camp panic move because certain players aren't panning out at their positions.
August 25th, 2013 at 11:36 AM ^
I'm just happy that we have a complete (not perfect) team on offense. We have an O-line built for, you know, blocking. We have a QB who can throw the ball (and run it). We have multiple RB's and WR's. We have TE's. Gone are the days when a good defense can prep for our entire offense by prepping for one person.
August 25th, 2013 at 11:42 AM ^
"Gone are the days when a good defense can prep for our entire offense by prepping for one person."
Don't you mean "Gone are the days when a good defense can disable our entire offense by prepping for one person"?
August 25th, 2013 at 11:50 AM ^
Nah, I think they had to wait for the game to start before they could disable the entire offence.
August 25th, 2013 at 12:05 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 1:44 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 2:33 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 3:04 PM ^
Extrapolating results from limited perspective makes for odd rationalizations. Like Green is now a likely bust because he didn't make a splash in fall camp.
Mike Hart didn't really play until his fourth game as a freshman when he did break out. Let's just remember that neither Chris Perry nor Anthony Thomas were immediate stars. Thomas, Perry and Hart are all atop Michigan's all-time rushing chart. The only guy who broke this mold was Shoelace, who is a player apart from everyone else.
As I recall, Grady and Minor both played as freshmen, and both made some early contributions. They just weren't dominant. I mean the perspective here on unseen performance and reliance on word of mouth reports and inneuendo is ridiculous. And Michigan has never wanted freshmen to start in the first place, unless they were overwhelmingly better and needed to start.
The only guy in recent memory who actually did play a lot as a freshman was Sam McGuffie. And he contributed. The fact that he left Michigan after being injured doesn't change the fact that he was highly thought of coming in and worked his way into the lineup early, and made a difference. Check the stats. He just didn't stick around. And there are a host of guys like that who didn't make it after stellar high school careers.
I mean if you want to contrast what it means to be great at Michigan, then contrast Woodson and Brady, two of this school's greatest recent stars and compare their entry into the program and their playing experience for the Wolverines.
But it's about competition and making the grade.
August 25th, 2013 at 3:04 PM ^
All the talk, re: Green is hilarious to me. Is everyone utterly incapable of waiting another six days (or another couple years for a rational person) to see him in person before claiming he's a bust, or will probably be a bust, or that we should be concerned he might be a bust?
Calm down and watch the games, we can evaluate once his elegibility is up whether he's the next Ron Dayne.
August 25th, 2013 at 3:15 PM ^
+ ALL THE POINTS.
August 25th, 2013 at 3:10 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 4:50 PM ^
I'm guessing he's more of a bulker in bodybuilding terms which means lots of heavy lifting in the gym, but a high bodyfat percentage. Cardio will take it off. So be patient.
August 25th, 2013 at 11:41 PM ^
Derrick Green was once 270 lbs at one point....
August 25th, 2013 at 4:52 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 5:56 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 7:29 PM ^
have a higher basal metabolic heart rate than non gym rats, i.e., more calories burned at rest than sofa spuds.
August 25th, 2013 at 9:36 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 5:42 PM ^
.....how do we compare to last year. That really is the only barometer to go off of.
QB - Better. Devin is more experienced and fits the offense. Depth is a concern but could Shane be worse than Bellomy was last year?
RB - Better. Fitz is back. Green/Smith/Rawls/Johnson/Hayes are a much better supporting group.
TE - Better. Funchess and Butt plus a better offense for Funchess.
WR - ???? Who knows. Gallon and Dileo are back. Roundtree and technically Gardner are missing. Reynolds/Chesson/Jackson/Norfleet - depends on their level of improvement
OL - Better Lewan is back, supporting cast is better.
LB - Worse for now. Losing Ryan hurts but he will be back (hopefully). Will he be the same though? Ross will be even better and there is a solid rotation. Once the old Ryan returns, this turns to a "better".
DL - Probably a bit worse. Hard to replace Martin, Roh, and even Campbell. Some freaks out there but unproven. Upside is high.
Secondary - Better. Despite the loss of Kovacs, Countess is back and there are a slew of talented newcomers.
Special Teams - Pretty much the same. A full season of Norfleet at KR/PR will be interesting.
So, yeah, I'm excited for this year. Improved at most positions and most importantly stability at QB within the system could lead to a special year. 2014 could be even better.
August 25th, 2013 at 6:23 PM ^
Roh and Campbell only losses on the DL, and there is a slew of young talent coming in = plus.
August 25th, 2013 at 6:48 PM ^
Sorry about that....brain fart, feels like yesterday with Martin.
So, I take it back, DL - definitely not worse if the only losses are Roh and Campbell.
And yes, slew of young talent might mean we might ACTUALLY have a pass rush.
Thanks for the correction.
August 25th, 2013 at 7:10 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 8:44 PM ^
August 25th, 2013 at 9:10 PM ^
Serious question: how did his predictions/evaluations shake out vs. past couple of years actual season performance? I tried searching your 'blog' but the last few diaries I saw from you were from back in 2011.
August 26th, 2013 at 6:43 AM ^
I expect Hoke to come out vanilla on offense and defense against CMU. Its the Michigan way. Any odd looks will be there just to set up ND. Like everyone else, I'm very interested in the OL play, ability to rush with four and how Gordon fills Ryan's shoes. If we get positive looks in these positions and no real surprises (negative) elsewhere, I'll be optimistic about the season. 5 days.
August 26th, 2013 at 2:31 PM ^
agree against CMU, especially since the coaches are going to want to run the ball better than last year.
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