Will Brazdeikis help our recruiting more than NCAA tourney performance?
Will Iggy’s role as a starter/contributor immediately begin to help our recruiting? I know the big knock for top talent is that every player has to wait their turn and learn the system no matter how talented (McGary only really got going in the trounament at the end of the year). Top talent definitely would slot nicely into Beileins system, especially ones with the athelticism to defend and shoot the three. Will this development help us finally start getting elite basketball recruits?
December 7th, 2018 at 2:34 PM ^
The big knock for top talent is waiting their turn? have you paid any attention to the FBI scandal?
December 7th, 2018 at 4:00 PM ^
Not to mention the OP's point doesn't even make much sense if you ignore that we'll never pay players under Beilein. Here's a list of players since coach has been here who have started a decent amount of games in their freshman year (if they didn't start the majority of games it's noted):
Kelvin Grady
Stu Douglass
Zack Novak
Darius Morris
Jordan Morgan
Tim Hardaway Jr.
Evan Smotrycz
Trey Burke
Glenn Robinson III
Nick Stauskas
Mitch McGary (started final 8 games)
Derrick Walton
Aubrey Dawkins (started 13 games)
MAAR (started 13 games)
Kam Chatman (started 15 games)
Ricky Doyle
Ignas Brazdeikis
Sorry for the long ass list, but the long ass list should tell you that the very core of OP's post is just completely wrong. Beilein has started 17 true freshmen for at least a decent chunk of the year in 12 seasons as coach.
December 7th, 2018 at 4:41 PM ^
Reading your list reminded of when multiple players transferred before our season last year. Several people on this blog adjusted their expectations and had a pretty bleak outlook for 2017-2018. Boy did that turn out to be wrong. This Belein guy knows what he is doing and it makes me happy.
Go Blue!
December 7th, 2018 at 6:51 PM ^
add manny harris, too, off the top of my head. so on avg, nearly two freshmen per year get significant starts under JB. that is KY-esque, w/o the bagmen.
December 7th, 2018 at 9:24 PM ^
Agree. This is one of the most misguided posts I've ever seen here, and that takes some doing. Go watch the interview with him at UM Hoops previewing the SC game that's up now; he talks at length about how the two incoming freshmen will see plenty of PT next year.
December 8th, 2018 at 2:31 PM ^
Would be nice to be able to neg the OP. Perfect example of what we just discussed yesterday.
December 8th, 2018 at 7:14 AM ^
Also he rolled with Eli Brooks to start the season last year until Simpson earned the start.
December 8th, 2018 at 3:01 PM ^
And Caris LeVert
December 8th, 2018 at 4:39 PM ^
I think Michigan is hurt more by the fact that Beilein gets guys to the NBA too quick sometimes. I don’t think we would have won last year, but if the team had DJ Wilson to spot at the five in last years national championship game, along the other playing another 4 that could stretch the floor, then I think it would have been close. Michigan was way overmatched every time wagnor took a break and then got tired.
Im ok with grabbing and recruiting the guys Beilein is recruiting. Fun teams to watch and easy to root for with no concern about scandal.
December 7th, 2018 at 2:35 PM ^
Will this development help us finally start getting elite basketball recruits?
You mean like . . . the kind of players that will help us go to the national title game twice in five years?
December 7th, 2018 at 3:12 PM ^
Perhaps we can finally start winning it, instead of being a runner-up.
Dont get me wrong, I’m not complaining. But I am a bit miffed as to why we can’t reel in any super elite recruits (bagman implications aside). The type of super elite recruits that can put us over the edge and win a damn championship.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:18 PM ^
Michigan Basketball is a sleeping giant... when the bridge goes back to Webber and the Fab Five, only then will you see what you're hoping for..... until then, this is the best it will get, am sorry to say.
Still am in disbelief about the entire Webber thing... he was a kid.. enough said... let it go already...
December 7th, 2018 at 3:58 PM ^
Perhaps we can finally start winning it, instead of being a runner-up.
With this comment, we have reached Peak MGoBoard.
Incidentally, didn't our 2013 team send more guys to the NBA than Louisville's?
December 8th, 2018 at 12:01 AM ^
No, Peak MGoBoard will be after five consecutive titles, "Perhaps we can finally start winning it by more than 30, instead of letting the other team hang around and go on a run so we only win by 10." :)
December 8th, 2018 at 10:26 AM ^
except for the fact that Michigan didn't lose to Louisville because of some 5* beat them... they got beat cause a 2* somehow got dialed in and did something he'd never done previously nor since...
Some would argue we didn't lose period.
December 7th, 2018 at 2:36 PM ^
Doubt it... Beilein has never been shy about putting freshmen on the floor - if they can play without being a liability. In his offense, most freshmen are going to be a big liability. I don't see that changing. The other thing with the 5* bball guys is the payment system. Look no further than Brian Bowen - dude was not alone in getting paid. Also, Adidas is not alone in doing the paying...
There's a reason nobody treated that DOJ trial for anything other than one-off. Any changes of that system will bring the whole house down. And nobody but some fans want that...
December 8th, 2018 at 2:04 AM ^
Wouldn't the relatively clean programs like UM want that too?
I always wonder why such programs stay silent when they know what's going on out there and it puts them at a significant disadvantage...they have to see it as they recruit many of the same players.
So why not snitch?
December 8th, 2018 at 7:59 AM ^
I've always had that question, myself. I have no idea why nobody snitches. Maybe coaches and administrators don't want to be found guilty by association, or black listed for the rest of their lives? I just can't answer that...
December 7th, 2018 at 2:40 PM ^
In the last 8 years, Beilein has 4 Sweet 16s, 2 Final Fours, has won the Big Ten tournament or regular season title 4 of those years and put 8 or 9 players in the NBA.... Whatever the level of recruiting you think Michigan is at right now, I'm okay with it.
December 7th, 2018 at 6:39 PM ^
And unless I've forgotten, he's done it without a whiff of scandal. Excluding McGary going one toke over the line, of course.
December 7th, 2018 at 6:55 PM ^
Final Four has the cool alliteration, but you should really call it two NCAA Finals. Got to take all the credit our team earned.
December 7th, 2018 at 2:40 PM ^
We raise banners every year* and are currently 9-0 and ranked #5 in the country, but where are the RECROOTZ?
*Every year that we don't lose our backcourt to injury
December 7th, 2018 at 2:43 PM ^
Although Iggy may be a one and done, he may be different. If you come to Michigan, you must play school and you must be a team player. Many of the 5 star recruits want to do neither nor. Beilein will not recruit anyone that does no embrace the philosophy. Success will bring recruits that are like minded. Beilein's success developing NBA talent is the primary draw so if Iggy goes to the NBA and succeeds, it will foster more recruiting success.
December 7th, 2018 at 4:24 PM ^
"If you come to Michigan, you must play school and you must be a team player. Many of the 5 star recruits want to do neither nor. Beilein will not recruit anyone that does no embrace the philosophy."
This is very much inline with what Jay Wright is doing at Villanova in recruiting. I read an interview with Wright ahead of the championship game that spent a lot of time on this concept. The worst results he had were when they had some success and were able to pursue the "elite" recruits as opposed to identifying the players that were going to play the way that fits Nova's system.
and one other issue... we aren't going to pay players, so Kentucky, Duke and Kansas aren't going to be the teams we recruit against.
December 9th, 2018 at 8:22 AM ^
Devin Booker and Luke Kennard (among others) respectfully disagree with the analysis in your final paragraph.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:04 PM ^
Yes but I think it's safe to say with slightly better recruiting we probably would have won the whole shebang.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:42 PM ^
No one was beating nova at the level they played in the tournament last year, I dont care who we had on the court, but did you forget how close we were to beating Lousville? The chips didnt fall our way, but we were 100% in that game.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:48 PM ^
I was referring to Louisville. Are you intending to agree with me? Lol
December 7th, 2018 at 4:10 PM ^
The second and fifth-highest scorers in that game in total (Hancock and Albrecht) were an unranked guy who started his career at George Mason and a low-star with one P5 offer. Michigan didn't lose that game because Louisville recruited better.
December 7th, 2018 at 4:33 PM ^
That's some irrelevant, cherry-picked data if I've ever seen any.
December 7th, 2018 at 4:15 PM ^
That team had 5 first round and 1 second round pick on it; including 2 top-10 picks. Outside of Duke, Kentucky, and UNC that is about as talented as any team could be. We lost that game because the refs sucked and that Louisville player who was a second fiddle all season hit a bunch of shots.
If we can be as talented as the 2013 team every year, we will win a National Championship eventually.
December 8th, 2018 at 9:19 AM ^
Silly me for assuming you were speaking of the national title game that was played just a few months ago after you explicitly stated what you were talking about.
December 7th, 2018 at 7:02 PM ^
we win in 2014 if mcgary isn't injured. we don't lose to KY by a bucket in the elite 8 and easily roll that horrible UConn offense in the finals. should have beaten KY anyway but for the ticky tack fouls on morgan in the first half.
December 7th, 2018 at 2:48 PM ^
Any notoriety helps. With Iggy showing that a Freshman can learn our offense and defense, as well as thrive in it, it will raise visibility for the program. It will not swing the pendulum to create an rush of elite recruits, but it may cause a few to consider the Michigan program a bit more closely. Granted, we are already recruiting good talent and doing well in post season play, so all of these factors (including a lack of scandals) combine to help in recruiting.
December 7th, 2018 at 2:49 PM ^
The FBI scandal, and any nonzero impact it has on cleaning up basketball recruiting, will help more than Iggy starting.
December 7th, 2018 at 2:52 PM ^
I think this is a fair question and I think the answer is yes. Despite our recent success, recruiting hasn't taken off the way I hoped it would. Iggy is a "freshman" and definitely turning heads around the country. I think his impact will definitely help somewhat.
December 7th, 2018 at 4:40 PM ^
If recruiting "hasn't taken off like you had hoped" then it's because you want Michigan to get the players that Beilein will never recruit. We will never pay a guy as long as he is coach. Mid 4 stars like Johns, Simpson, Walton, Poole, etc. are the perfect guys for Beilein and with Bajema and Wilson in the next class it looks like he is prepared to continue along this path.
If we do happen to grab a player above that level it'll be the Wagner and Iggy types who are in completely different situations than most high school recruits and aren't ranked as highly despite being clearly above that level. That's not to say we'll never get a 5 star commitment. There'll probably be another McGary at some point. It'll never be a consistent thing, though. Given how much he's accomplished I am perfectly fine with that.
December 7th, 2018 at 7:07 PM ^
we could also land a 5 star after he blows up after committing, like GRIII. not sure there is any coach in the country i would take over JB at evaluating talent. i wonder how typical it is for outside the top 50 who jump after their soph or junior season. JB has a laundry list there; including a few outside the top 100.
December 7th, 2018 at 8:28 PM ^
This too. Take my comment as more of a "when they commit" reflection of their ranking.
December 7th, 2018 at 2:54 PM ^
I think we are already starting to see an uptick in recruiting. I like getting 2 top 100 kids a year with one of them being top 50. Those kids tend to stay awhile and you can sustain success. The 2018 class was amazing. The 2019 has a Top 50 kid and the 121st ranked kid, and the 2020 has the composite 65 rated player. I don't think we are ever going to live and die on one and done kids. Coach B just does such a good job with player development that we lose guys earlier than anyone expects.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:00 PM ^
Pretty obvious that Iggy was an elite recruit.
And yes, landing elite recruits helps in getting future ones.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:00 PM ^
Brazdeikis is a month from being 20 years old with plenty of international basketball experience. He's not the typical freshman. This type of recruit is atypical.
What may help more with recruiting is what Jon Teske is doing in this system. Walker Kessler, come on down!
December 7th, 2018 at 3:26 PM ^
There you go! Just browsing down through here...wondering why nobody was citing Walker Kessler...and your point about Teske is well-made. Kessler will be a difference-maker...hope he lands in Ann Arbor.
I know a thing or two about basketball...liked Brazdeikis' clips a lot...he has surpassed my anticipations. He certainly will not harm recruiting. This kid is a player!
December 7th, 2018 at 4:21 PM ^
Actually, Moe Wagner helps more with Walker Kessler more than Teske because Wagner is what Kessler look for in a JB's system since he can shoot and drive.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:03 PM ^
I don't want a bunch of one and dones. Those teams often don't do as well as you would think. Duke may be the exception this year, time will tell. But consistently getting top 100 kids would be nice, and seems to be the direction we are trending.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:05 PM ^
Hopefully both but even if we were recruiting at a more "elite" level, I think you'll still see Coach B go after certain types of guys and certain types of guys be enticed to play for him. Do I see a lot of "traditional" one-and-done type guys thinking Michigan is going to be a great use of their biding their 12 months of time until they can get drafted? No. Can we get some elite level guys who fit his systems and might want more than just a place to tread water for a year? Sure
December 7th, 2018 at 3:05 PM ^
....in Canada for sure, eh!
December 7th, 2018 at 3:06 PM ^
I was wondering where Maizen went. Guess he just got a new account.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:20 PM ^
The NBA ending the one-and-done rule will help more than anything. 60% of Duke's starting lineup should be in the NBA.
December 7th, 2018 at 3:34 PM ^
I think players that are only thinking of staying 1 year want to showcase their talent to the NBA and that might not fit well within a system.