crg

September 5th, 2020 at 8:17 AM ^

The degree of shameless money-grab moves of late in CFB has dampened my enthusiasm for the game.  Not that anyone should care what one person's opinion is, but it's just one more way the world seems to be getting a little darker.

Joined: 04/30/2015

MGoPoints: 75054

wolverine1987

September 5th, 2020 at 10:33 AM ^

I don't discount your opinion and am sorry you feel that way. I'm also in that boat but for different reasons. I am actually there for the opposite reason, I don't think closing of schools and football can be justified on the science and facts that I read every day. But that's a different post and I'm not arguing with you on this particular point. It's sad when anyone has less enthusiasm for college football. 

Joined: 07/07/2008

MGoPoints: 18065

wolverine1987

September 5th, 2020 at 2:15 PM ^

The players have the same risk of serious outcomes from Covid as they do for flu. That is a statistical, objective, documented fact. Arguably less risk than flu given their superior conditioning. Therefore anyone arguing for player safety simply does not know what they are talking about. That is not an opinion.

The other concern is spread to coaches or for regular students, spread to teachers. Teachers can quite easily be distanced from students in any number of ways. Coaches can mostly be distanced, but there are occasions when that's not possible. The coaches understand the risk and apparently universally accept it. Coaches can also quite easily distance from others who might be at higher risk (the obese and people over 70, primarily). 

Lastly, we have the experience from the world. English and German soccer leagues--no increased spread. Schools across Europe--no increased spread. Swedish schools, open the entirety of Covid with no masks and no testing--no spread of any consequence, and Teachers tested positive at similar risk of any other profession. 

And the last gasp of the close athletics down group, heart problems--debunked yesterday on this board, also debunked here in medscape: https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/936098

But do go on smugly because clearly you have the facts on your side

 

 

Joined: 07/07/2008

MGoPoints: 18065

wolverine1987

September 5th, 2020 at 10:28 AM ^

Cancelling a football game because college athletes test positive for a virus that has almost zero risk to them, based upon PCR tests that the NYT discussed a week ago that are filled with false positives, when they are universally asymptomatic, and when it is quite easy to distance them from people that are actually at somewhat higher risk, is a conspiracy--a conspiracy of ignorance of the facts and science of the virus, replaced by misguided emotion and fear. There is quite literally zero science based reason whatsoever for this, just as there is zero science behind closing schools. 

Joined: 07/07/2008

MGoPoints: 18065

wellington

September 5th, 2020 at 10:58 AM ^

I don’t want to get into the same arguments that have been recycled dozens of times on the board lately... but where do you get “universally asymptomatic” from? Not the original article. You speak as if you know exactly what Is going on when I feel pretty darn sure that you are not linked, in any meaningful way, to the inner workings of either football program. 

Joined: 11/09/2013

MGoPoints: 603

Teeba

September 5th, 2020 at 11:26 AM ^

For the week ending April 18, there were 8.7 hospitalizations per 100,000 of the population for the 18-to-29 age bracket, compared with 128.3 per 100,000 of the population for patients over 65. By the week ending June 27, the figures were 34.7 and 306.7 respectively, representing a 299 percent increase in hospitalizations for young adults, versus a 139 percent increase in hospitalizations for older adults.

https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/07/418081/1-3-young-adults-may-face-severe-covid-19-ucsf-study-shows

Can one be asymptotic and hospitalized at the same time? I didn’t think so.

Joined: 09/25/2019

MGoPoints: 3282

MJG

September 5th, 2020 at 11:21 AM ^

You didn’t make any points. It’s all opinion. Provide data that suggests there is no risk to these athletes, either now or concerning long term effects, and that opening schools poses little risk to the students or their families. Both are incorrect, but I’ll let you provide the links. The response to Covid is not fear and emotion, it’s science. 

Joined: 08/29/2011

MGoPoints: 3540

wolverine1987

September 5th, 2020 at 2:20 PM ^

This is the CDC site on deaths by age: here you will see that the risk for Covid for 0-24 year olds is similar to the risk for flu, pneumonia, and other respiratory diseases. there have been 357 deaths of people under 24: 357 deaths out of 180,000. In statistical terms that's basically zero. 

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid_weekly/index.htm

Here's the data confirming that the scare about long term impacts is wrong, if the statement yesterday from the PSU doctor walking back his claims didn't convince you

https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/936098

 

 

 

Joined: 07/07/2008

MGoPoints: 18065

skwasha

September 5th, 2020 at 3:18 PM ^

Your first point seems to equate death as the only reason to be concerned. There are multitude other outcomes from contraction of the virus. Some are likely perfectly fine for continuing to participate in college sports (*not* just football, right?) Others, ehhh not so much.

Your second point is in fact a link to an *opinion piece*. It is hardly the mic-drop you claim it to be.

Joined: 10/09/2010

MGoPoints: 633

wolverine1987

September 5th, 2020 at 5:32 PM ^

An opinion piece from a cardiologist. I thought we were all supposed to listen to experts? I guess it's just the experts that agree with our pre-exiting worldview right?

I'm interested to hear just what these "other outcomes" are, and look forward to the study you link to that proves this is the case.

Joined: 07/07/2008

MGoPoints: 18065

skwasha

September 5th, 2020 at 5:58 PM ^

Cardiologist or not, it's still just the opinion of one doctor. The piece is labeled "Commentary" for a reason. Whether I agree with his opinion or not doesn't really matter. You, however are presenting it as if it's a definitive opinion. It most definitely is not. This is evidenced by the fact that we have some schools with doctors saying it's safe to play and others with doctors that have said the risk is too great.

Other outcomes being any of the following (though certainly not limited to):

That graphic came from this report in The Lancet by the way. It in turn has links to several other studies. Though obviously this is also not an exhaustive list.

Joined: 10/09/2010

MGoPoints: 633

skwasha

September 6th, 2020 at 1:54 PM ^

So... When presented with actual data/facts that disprove your point your defense is to change the point? Well played.

This indicates someone unwilling to entertain any sort of reasonable debate. The University of Michigan I graduated from taught critical thinking among other things. Perhaps you skipped those days.

I tried. I'm done.

Joined: 10/09/2010

MGoPoints: 633

Teeba

September 5th, 2020 at 11:09 AM ^

The only other person I have heard claiming there is “literally zero science” is Tucker Carlson. So, congrats for joining his distinguished company. For the thousandth time, how old are the coaches? How old are the officials? How old are the bus drivers and training staff? How old are the equipment staff people?

Joined: 09/25/2019

MGoPoints: 3282

UMgradMSUdad

September 5th, 2020 at 12:16 PM ^

As if this football season weren't annoying enough. Now it seems we'll have to go through Ricky's "I toda so" every time a game gets canceled or played. This place becomes insufferable when a raft of Rickies are yelling at each other from opposite sides of the spectrum.

Joined: 07/02/2011

MGoPoints: 13185