Next year's RB situation: any concerns?
By the evidence of our own eyes, as well as RR's admission, we are a different team on offense with Brandon Minor in the game. As we look to next year's RB's, we see Smith, who showed lots of potential, Shaw, who I think it's fair to say the jury is still out on, Cox, who gets an incomplete, and then freshmen of the redshirt and true variety. I am fairly confident that out of this group we will find a couple of guys (Smith and someone else) who will be productive or perhaps better than that. But what I don't see is the next candidate to get the tough yards that this year it seemed only Minor could get. I think the running game will improve simply because of an improved offensive line, but watching our non-Minor RB's this year get stopped by the first tackler leaves me wondering where the tough yards will come from. Anyone more sanguine on this than I?
November 21st, 2009 at 6:15 PM ^
Not worried. With Smith, Shaw, Cox, Touissaint (sp?), etc. etc. etc. we should be fine as far as RBs go.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:16 PM ^
None. Vincent Smith is the best runner on this team, he makes the reads and cuts necessary to get going in this offense, also is a receiving threat. Shaw is a servicable spell.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:17 PM ^
If a tough yardage back is not found on the current roster then I'd say we don't redshirt Hopkins since he is of the big back variety.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:18 PM ^
Fitzgerald Toussiant......I think I may have convinced myself he is gonna be great. I dont know why, but I just think the kid is gonna be special!
November 21st, 2009 at 11:57 PM ^
it's Toussaint.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:18 PM ^
I agree completely. That was my first thought after the game is that we need someone who can get tough yards, making punishing runs to complement Smith's shiftiness. I think with a healthy Minor the outcome today would have been different. Not so sure it would have made it a win, but it would have taken some pressure off of Tate, IMO.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:18 PM ^
#2 is a beast. he will wreck the big-ten next year. get ready columbus and your stupid signs, we're coming.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:19 PM ^
Between Cox, Toussaint, and Smith, we'll be fine. If Shaw can stay healthy, we'll be even better. I'm not too concerned about the running backs at all.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:34 PM ^
I didn't say we wouldn't have good backs, I think we will. But none of the guys we've seen so far has shown the ability to break tackles.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:51 PM ^
yardage guy - he is a beast runs angry like Minor.
November 22nd, 2009 at 8:35 AM ^
Cox can break some tackles, and I think you'll see that Toussaint can, too. Beyond that, there's Hopkins, but I don't know if he'll play next year or not.
January 11th, 2010 at 8:47 PM ^
When have we seen Cox run except against Delaware State or the spring game?
January 12th, 2010 at 6:33 AM ^
Eastern Michigan. He had a 24-yarder on which he broke a couple tackles and a 7-yarder.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:19 PM ^
is lack of Senior experience.
I like Smith, he seems to 'get it'. Shaw seems to headed for disappointment land. Cox might end up being the short yardage guy.
I'm hoping Toussaint can get in the mix.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:21 PM ^
I am a bit concerned if Austin White doesn't play. I think our size at RB is a bit of a problem. None of them look like Minor. All though on the plus side, none of them get hurt as much as Minor (knocked on wood).
November 21st, 2009 at 6:59 PM ^
Are you under the impression that Austin White is "big?" He's under 6 feet tall and well shy of 200 pounds. Having seen only the Austin White film that's been posted here, he doesn't exactly look like the sort of guy you shoot to the top of the depth chart.
ETA: He's apparently listed at 6 feet, but I'm guessing he's an inch or so shorter. Also, look at this picture and tell me his frame reminds you of Minor's: http://umgoblog.com/post/AWhite.aspx
November 22nd, 2009 at 1:16 AM ^
expect freshman/sophmores to look or run like Minor. Minor was stuck behind Hart, so he had time to figure out how to run violently.
November 22nd, 2009 at 8:36 AM ^
Have you heard of Michael Cox? He's a Brandon Minor clone.
Austin White is a finesse back. He's not going to run like Minor.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:22 PM ^
Don't forget to mention Smith's ability to catch the ball and run after the catch. He's a shifty runner who runs well between tackles and patiently follows blocks. He's also hard to bring down if you try to just wrap around his legs, which is surprising for his stature. Again, if there is no read option with Forcier, a bruiser must emerge. All hope rests on Cox, who is a question mark because he hasn't played. Regardless, I expect to see more backs going for catches and use of the slot receivers on end arounds to try to maximize spacing.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:25 PM ^
I think Smith is going to step up next year and make a big impact. He has a bright future and I'm looking forward to watching him play for the next 3 years.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:25 PM ^
Not concerned.
Smith is an absolute stud!!
Agree w/ others that I haven't seen anything from Shaw to get me excited.
As for Cox, can't tell.
As for short yardage, Big Tex, come on down!!
November 21st, 2009 at 6:29 PM ^
Not one back on the roster after Minor or Brown have demnstrated breakaway speed, and not one of them really displays the toughness and decisiveness of Minor. I think this offense needs a running back in the mould of a healthy Minor--who can also block like a motherfucker.
I'm not saying that guy won't be on the roster next year (and in the form of one of the younger guys), but he ain't this year.
November 22nd, 2009 at 8:57 AM ^
Shaw certainly has top end speed, he may not be able to run through the tackles as hard as we'd like, but he is fast as hell. Smith on the other hand, can run through the tackles, but doesn't have top end speed.
November 22nd, 2009 at 12:17 PM ^
If you dont think Toussaint and Shaw have breakaway speed, then you just dont know football.
November 22nd, 2009 at 12:21 PM ^
Mike Hart did not have breakaway speed
November 21st, 2009 at 6:41 PM ^
As everyone else has said. Smith looks to be the guy. I would like to get a hard runner with speed. Yet to see that. I though Shaw was gonna be that, but he falls on first contact it seems like. Or maybe just doesn't find the hole quick enough. IDK. But we have a stable of backs, I'm sure someone will come through.
November 21st, 2009 at 7:36 PM ^
I think this kid is going to be really good, actually. It'll be between him and Vince next year. Shaw has been banged up most of the year, but he's shown that he can run tough and run fast when he's healthy. He's only a true sophomore, too. I think he'll have a good career here.
November 22nd, 2009 at 10:38 AM ^
Does not go down on first contact, no. He is always looking like he should go down, but pops back up and keeps going. I think he'll be fine, if healthy.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:44 PM ^
to teach these kids the proper tech. of holding onto the ball. Bring in Wheatly to show these kids how to lower the shoulder and bring in Tim Biakabatuba(sp) for pure heart of a fighter, also Ricky Powers that guy could spin off a blocker and get extra yards, man that was cool when i was a kid. Chris Perry because he was a stud and A train because his legs were always churning.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:48 PM ^
I don't know enough about O-line play, but I would be curious to know what those who do would say about their play when Shaw is in there vs. Smith. Every time Shaw is in there, it seems like he gets swallowed up behind the line, and that doesn't seem to happen hardly ever with Smith. Is this really a case of Shaw having that bad of luck on blocking or is he doing something wrong? I don't know, but it seems like Smith always got positive yards and Shaw rarely did.
BTW, I love Smith and I think he is going to be a great RB next year and we have nothing to worry about. The position is in good hands.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:50 PM ^
Yes, their will be problems with not having a big back in the Big ten. It was clear today. We did not havea running game whatsoever. Cox would be great, although he was on the Scout team this year. I hardly doubt he is going to make the jump to solid starter. I wish we could have gotten a big blue chip recruit this year
November 21st, 2009 at 6:56 PM ^
I don't know if it rises to the level of "concern," namely because we have a large quantitiy of guys. It's going to be a question mark, for sure. Smith looked good for a freshman these past two weeks, but he's still gotta make the leap to full time player.
Additionally, as RichRod has said, this offense needs a number of running backs. Who else will step up? As noted in this thread, Shaw hasn't shown a whole lot yet. Cox looked good, but only against Delaware State.
So basically we're gonna have to count on someone to emerge. I think that means we need to be cautious about our expectations.
November 21st, 2009 at 6:57 PM ^
I like Vincent Smith a lot. He is fun to watch and runs hard despite his size. That said, I think some people on this board need a little perspective, and to stop reading recruiting press clippings. Right now we don't have a big time, every down type of back. As good as Smith was today, Shaw was very unimpressive. Could Shaw develop as an upperclassman like Chris Perry did? Sure. But I think there is some room for concern with our RBs. I was excited about Toussaint when we recruited him, but we have no idea how he will be, and Michigan very well could be taking a big step back at this position next year. I realize this will be unpopular, but I don't think we can assume that every guy we recruit will be a stud when he hits the field without any real evidence.
November 21st, 2009 at 7:34 PM ^
Unfortunately Minor and Brown were injury prone.
We'll see how our new batch fair. For now, I agree Vincent Smith appears to be the guy. Both him and Roundtree really came on the past few games (which is good).
My question is, who is the big blocking back that replaces Grady or Minor? I guess Moundros will be back.
Well it would have been nice to have Minor in the red zone today.
You know what though -- they really played a good game. Tate just needs to learn the lessons. Pryor for example, seems to have been much smarter about when to throw it away, and when to force than he was last year.
Bottom line: if we can find someone who can stay consistantly healthy, we'll be fine.
November 21st, 2009 at 7:38 PM ^
i couldn't believe mike shaw started the game and was calling for vincent smith from the beginning (no offense to shaw bc i think he can be productive in certain situations but is not nearly as elusive as smith). also, i'll go on record as saying austin white will absolutely not redshirt. this kid is made for this offense and is deceptively powerful. white has great hands and very good top end speed. i think he pushes shaw for playing time early in the yr and passes him on the depth chart come the middle of the season. cox will see some time in short yardage situation and fitz is the wildcard. no position on offense is a question mark (i'm confident qb play will take another step forward). defense is what i want to hear about all spring ball and fall camp.
November 21st, 2009 at 8:00 PM ^
I like Smith and Shaw. Shaw more than most others it sounds like.
Vincent Smith has a unique Hart-like cutting ability and some pretty good vision. He seems to sense the hole and has a feel for squeaking through and getting tough yards, even though he is so small. I think he almost gets lost behind the offensive line and then he just has this sense of when to dart out unexpectedly and the dline can't find him. As everyone else, I'm also excited for his future at UM.
If you think about what we're losing from this year, besides RAGE when he was available, not much. Both Brown and Minor gave us what they had when they were healthy, which was almost never.
I don't know a lot about White or Touissant, but hopefully they can supplement Smith and Shaw nicely. Cox is a good short yardage option, as well as Tex if we get him, but I think Smith is deceptively powerful and able to get tough yards. He plays so low to the ground (obvs) it seems like he can get more tough yards then we would assume from his size.
November 21st, 2009 at 8:05 PM ^
Have you seen Smith run? He seems to have that ability to shake the first tackler. I think the kid will be Hart II. No concern at RB. In fact, that's the least of our problems.
November 21st, 2009 at 11:16 PM ^
Well, yes. But that's also tied with the OL situation. Minor and Brown were always hurt, and I hate to say it, but neither established himself as an elite back. We really really really need one. And of course some of the OL is gone, so that will probably affect things too.
November 21st, 2009 at 11:36 PM ^
I think if Shaw can get some shiftiness he has the skill set to be as good a back as Steve Slaton. The kid is fast as hell.
November 22nd, 2009 at 11:24 AM ^
He has that right now (Looking back to the Iowa game). He needs vision, that's what made Slaton great, it's how Noel Devine spereates himself from the pack of backs, and how Smith doesn't get gutted. Although, i do think Shaw has ability (More than any other back), but it won't do him much good without vision. (See: Carlos Brown, Brandon Saine)
January 11th, 2010 at 7:33 PM ^
could solve a lot of problems. Here's hoping for more USC bad press.
January 11th, 2010 at 7:48 PM ^
Yeah, I thought that all of you guys were set on Dillon Baxter leaving USC and the nice weather and hot girls for Michigan and saving the program. Only seen like one post about him when it seemed before that everyone was pretty confident. Not so confident anymore?
January 11th, 2010 at 7:50 PM ^
check the dates on all but the last few posts.
January 11th, 2010 at 7:48 PM ^
Yeah, I thought that all of you guys were set on Dillon Baxter leaving USC and the nice weather and hot girls for Michigan and saving the program. Only seen like one post about him when it seemed before that everyone was pretty confident. Not so confident anymore?
January 12th, 2010 at 6:53 AM ^
he blew his knee out (torn ACL). No one knows whether or not he'll be ready for next season. The coaches might let him rehab the knee during the season and take a med RS.
January 12th, 2010 at 8:13 AM ^
If you're worried about the rushing game, I encourage you to go read the following over at Maize n' Brew:
2009 Potent Notables
Among all the other season review stuff there is a telling note. Minor and Brown, together, put up only 177 rushes for about 900 yards. I will guarentee to you we can make that up easy. That's not that much.
January 12th, 2010 at 8:36 AM ^
"I will guarentee to you we can make that up easy."
That's a pretty strong guarAntee, considering that everyone's front-runner for the job (Smith) is coming off ACL surgery; the other potential front-runner (Shaw) has never been able to stay healthy, much like Minor and Brown; the only other experienced runner didn't play much (Cox); and nobody else has played a down of college football (Toussaint, Hopkins, White).
I have high hopes for a few of these guys, but guaranteeing an improvement from the lead running back might be kind of a big leap.
January 12th, 2010 at 9:39 AM ^
The running back position is definately an area I think we have the most depth, which is not surprising considering we are implementing a running spread attack. Depth and experience is the teams biggest concern. We have a fine coaching staff.