META Request to our Fearless Leader Brian - UFR for Defense

Submitted by alum96 on

Dear Fearless Leader,

I realize you are a busy man this week and I realize looking at game film is nearly pointless at this point since... welp.

There is no reason to look at offensive film v Minnesota at all, just burn it.  But I am deathly curious what  the f*** happened to our defense this week.  Rush defense was supposed to be this team's strength.  A respectable but average/middle of the road Big 12 TCU team held Cobb to under 50 yards and decimated Minnesota in an efficient manner.   We have much higher rated players than TCU, who are not all "young", with a highly respected DC - and we sucked.

I realize that offense affects defense but this team was getting gashed early in the game before it was apparent DOOM was the only play the offense could run.  So it's too easy to blame it all on the offense sucking all life out of the defense - this was not a defense that wore down as the game went on, it was an uninspiring effort from play 1. We gave up more yards to Cobb about 7 minutes into the first quarter than TCU did the entire game despite our "very strong rush defense".  And this was with Taylor and Wilson back on the field. 

If you could carve out some time to explain to us what the hell happened to this side of the ball prior to Gary Nova-ball it would be much obliged.  If not, I understand. Thank you sir.

jg2112

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:29 PM ^

Minnesota ran 70 offensive plays.

Is it that hard for you to track down those plays, spend the 10 minutes it takes to watch them, condensed, and figure it out yourself?

It's a serious question. Brian can't do it this week. If you want to know, you're going to have to figure it out yourself.

alum96

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:43 PM ^

I've contributed  20,000+ words this week in 6 diaries breaking down coaching prospects past and present to help the MGo community understand their pros, cons, and how they compare to each other.   

 I have not looked at each play for 6 years or however long Brian has done and can do an apples to apples comparison as he has.  So yes I can look at them but not in a manner Brian has.

Sorry my pithy contribution doesnt rank up there with your "#FireBrandonandBrady" this week.  I asked in a respectful tone.  If he can't do it he can't, I simply asked if he could rather than wait for a bye week as I am trying to figure out what to expect vs Rutgers.  The firestorm of Brandon and Hoke is over now - we are in a holding pattern unless someone gets fired in the next 48 hrs so if Brian has time in this window I put it out there.  If not, ok.

 

alum96

October 2nd, 2014 at 2:16 PM ^

I meant that in relation to this week.  i.e. if Hoke wasnt fired Monday Tuesday or Wednesday I dont see it happening Thursday or Friday or Saturday.   Brandon's situation is ongoing and will hang in the air until it is resolved.  If someone gets fired in the next 72 hrs ok lets turn all attention back to that. Regurgitating the same litany of complaints about Brandon each and every day is not value add at this point.   We already know a ton of people hate him and until the President fires him nothing is changing in that regard.  The same people who hated him will hate in 48 hrs and the same complaints raised this week will be the same complaints in the next 48 hrs.

IncrediblySTIFF

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:33 PM ^

I would like it too-- However, this week is being dedicated to political purposes, rather than football news.  Hopefully this ship is righted next week.  Obviously, Brian can do what he wants with his site.  

I wonder if writing DraftStreet (among other mgoblog sponsers) could be the encouragement needed to point the focus on what many of us come here for in the first place: helpful and thoughtful game analysis.

IncrediblySTIFF

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:42 PM ^

I do like the content.  That's why I'm here.

And while I don't feel bad about expressing my sentiments, I also don't feel bad for pointing out that the "actual football stuff" has taken a huge back burner to the political agenda.

I am not actually going to write anyone about this, and I am still going to spend most of my day periodically refreshing mgoblog. 

klctlc

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:44 PM ^

Who in the heck is complaining?  I thougth the original request was well written and spot on.  If Brian does not do it, no big deal. If somebody THEN bitches about Brian not doing it, have at it.

I truly look forward to UFR.  I don't pick up everything Brian does and I love the summary data at the end.

Once again, No big deal if it does not come out right now.

LSAClassOf2000

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:47 PM ^

Like the actual athletic department, football content tends to drive the bus here in terms of sheer volume generated, but more broadly, this site is primarily for (save for OT season, when virtually everything is talked about) Michigan athletics as a whole and for the goings-on at the University Of Michigan. That's perfectly OK if you would like to stay away from the current controversy, but understand that since it directly relates to the athletic department and the university, it will be discussed. 

I would like to see the UFR too, but I have no problem with the primary thrust right now being some of the cultural issues of the program and department. 

IncrediblySTIFF

October 2nd, 2014 at 2:06 PM ^

I do understand.  I guess as an outsider, and as someone who is at his fifth college across a decade, I am just less concerned when it comes to re: ticket prices/branding.

As a fan, I can choose which things will affect me more/less, and as someone who genuinely believes Hoke can get the job done (I know, I know --and we already had this discussion), I can ignore select aspects and focus on my passion : Michigan football.

Not saying I'm right or wrong here, and absolutely not implying that I deserve a UFR today (or any other day).   But I am certainly going to request that which I both desire and find tremendously more valuable/interesting.

BornInAA

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:39 PM ^

ok

suck

followed by more suck

not bad

then terrible

ok

not good

OMG

suck

RINSE REPEAT

Do you want me to start on the offense? That might get NSFW.

MI Expat NY

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:39 PM ^

To be fair to the defense, Cobb had 5 carries for 54 yards after our give up and punt with 4 minutes to go.  I think there were a fair amount of subs on the field at the time, as well.  27 carries for 129 yards is still a good day for Cobb, and I'm not trying to say the defense didn't play poorly, but before that last drive they were giving up 3.6 yards a carry (sacks included).  They weren't exactly being gashed.  

alum96

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:57 PM ^

Ok insert your own adjective rather than gash; I used gash as what I saw happening vs our run defense.  "Surgically strike" "pitter pattered" "touched aggressively" could be replacements if you prefer - terminology is besides the point. 

You are also looking at Minnesota in a vacuum.  I am looking at Minnesota vs TCU and comparing to us as TCU is the only team with a heartbeat Minn has played.  

Minnesota had 268 yards of total offense in that game, including 41 from Cobb. 

Minnesota's offense had the ball for 34 minutes against both TCU and UM.  (I am throwing that out there for the "UM's offense barely held the ball, what did you expect!" crowd) 

TCU's offense also had 2 turnovers.  UM had 2 turnovers.  Yet TCU found a way to limit Miinn to 7 pts.

Minnesota had 14 first downs in those 34+ minutes versus TCU (20 vs UM). 

So we don't have the "way more turnovers than TCU" excuse.  We don't have the "way less possession time than TCU" excuse.  So I am curious how our defense had so much pitter pattering against it.

MI Expat NY

October 2nd, 2014 at 2:36 PM ^

Did you even use gash in your OP?  I simply used it as my adjective of choice because, while our defense, in my opinion, had probably their worst half of the season, overall, I don't think they were really terrible.  Again, 54 yards came after our coaching staff effectively gave up on the game (twice).  Take that away and we're talking about 319 yards, a whopping 50 more than they produced against TCU.  The real difference between the two games was Leidner throwing 3 pics and Minnesota losing two fumbles against TCU.  That had Minnesota down 24 midway through the second quarter.  That doesn't exactly play into Minnesota's strengths on offense.

I'm not sure why we aren't generating turnovers, but that is really the only problem I see with the defense at the moment.  Look at the box score.  Minnesota had two long, sustained drives resulting in 10 points in the first half.  In the second half, they scored off of a 7 play, 8 yard drive for a 48 yard field goal; a pick-6; a 5 play, 30 yard drive for a TD; and a 7 play, 37 yard drive for a 25 yard field goal.  The final drive was aided by Maxxxxx's one handed grab on 3rd down.  Overall, how many of thesse points can you really pin on the defense?  I don't think it's very many.  Even if you're being nit-picky... maybe 17 points?  All 10 in the first half, not holding the second half TD drive to a FG, and not somehow preventing one of the other FG attempts?Overall, that's a day you should be able to win easily with, even if it is on a day where the defense wasn't at its best.  

alum96

October 2nd, 2014 at 3:52 PM ^

Yes I did use gash in this context - I remember MN came out in the first drive and had a lot of plays if not a long drive in yardage.  Then later in the 1st half they had drives of 72 and 92 yards.  MN is not a good offense, it is 1 dimensional and BOTTOM 25 in the entire country.  It is not going to put up 500+ yards on BCS type defenses.

Guys please stop defending our defense in this game due to not giving upp 600 yards.  Minnesota is 104th in the country in total offense.  They average 343 yards a game - that is Temple, Miami of OH, Wyoming territory.  3 of those games have been against horrible teams.  The other 2 were TCU and Michigan. You can not evaluate teams in a vacuum.  If UM held Baylor to 550 yards when it averaged 700 that would be far more impressive then holding Minnesota to 300 when it averages 343.

http://www.ncaa.com/stats/football/fbs/current/team/21/p3

MI Expat NY

October 2nd, 2014 at 4:16 PM ^

I said it was the worst half they had played.  I just think the performance was still good enough to win.  Yes, you can't evaluate teams in a vacuum, but that cuts both ways.  Our offense was atrocious.  We never got ahead and were able to get them out of their comfort zone.  We didn't generate any turnovers.  Minnesota got to play the game exactly how they wanted.  That matters. 

We held them to 5 drives of 5 plays or less (exclusing a short TD drive and end of game drive).  We held them to 5-13 on 3rd down.  Minnesota did some good things and we didn't play great.  But every indication is that the defense gave us a chance to win.  If you're trying to hang this game on the defense, I think you're barking up the wrong tree.  

RJMAC

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:49 PM ^

Disappointed in Defense right before the half . Under 2 minutes left and pinned down at their own 2 yard line, Minnesota moved it all the way to inside the Michigan 10 yard line. Not good.

alum96

October 2nd, 2014 at 2:08 PM ^

That was a heartbreaking drive because they started inside their own 10.  I think we actually called a timeout after their 1st play to stop the clock to get the ball back and try to score.  I believe Minn only threw twice on that entire drive.  I've never seen a 2 minute offense work that was almost solely on the ground.  Granted its easier in the NCAA than the NFL because a first down stops the clock but still - it was so disheartening. 

That was a 12 play, 90+ yard drive in 2 minutes...

EDIT - here is the drive from ESPN.  Only 3 completed passes.

Minnesota at 2:17 MINN MICH
1st and 10 at MINN 1 David Cobb run for 1 yd to the Minn 2 7 7
2nd and 9 at MINN 2 David Cobb run for 4 yds to the Minn 6    
  Timeout MICHIGAN, clock 01:31    
3rd and 5 at MINN 6 Mitch Leidner pass complete to Lincoln Plsek for 21 yds to the Minn 27 for a 1ST down    
1st and 10 at MINN 27 David Cobb run for 14 yds to the Minn 41 for a 1ST down    
1st and 10 at MINN 41 Mitch Leidner pass incomplete to Lincoln Plsek    
2nd and 10 at MINN 41 David Cobb run for 8 yds to the Minn 49    
  Timeout MINNESOTA, clock 00:42    
3rd and 2 at MINN 49 Mitch Leidner pass complete to Maxx Williams for 10 yds to the Mich 41 for a 1ST down    
1st and 10 at MICH 41 Mitch Leidner run for 3 yds to the Mich 38    
  Timeout MICHIGAN, clock 00:23    
2nd and 7 at MICH 38 Mitch Leidner pass complete to David Cobb for 11 yds to the Mich 27 for a 1ST down    
1st and 10 at MICH 27 TEAM pass incomplete    
  Timeout MINNESOTA, clock 00:06    
1st and Goal at MICH 7 Ryan Santoso 24 yd FG GOOD 10 7
  End of 2nd Quarter    
MINN DRIVE TOTALS: 12 plays, 92 yards, 2:17

 

MI Expat NY

October 2nd, 2014 at 2:43 PM ^

Coaching didn't help matters.  With that offensive performance, I would have been content not using that first timeout and helping go into the half tied at 7 (but that may only be a fair statement with 20-20 hindsight).  The second timeout before the spike was inexcusable.  Maybe the convert on third down with the same play call, but maybe not.  

Also, FWIW, that summary is missing a play that took them from the 27 to the 7.  I don't really remember what happened.  

ST3

October 2nd, 2014 at 1:49 PM ^

I watched about a quarter of the game last night on BTN-60 and focussed on Jake Ryan because I noticed he only had 5 tackles in the game. He was held, A LOT, but he also had a bad game for him - missed tackles, poor recognition, etc. He's the leader of the defense, he's going to be the focus when things go wrong. I think his UFR number is going to be bad when Brian does the UFR in the bye week.

BlueGoM

October 2nd, 2014 at 2:12 PM ^

Defense isn't this team's problem.   Even for the somewhat disappointing rush defense, they only gave up 23 points.  (pick six puts it at 30).  If this team had even an average offense the game is very different.

 

VintageBlue

October 2nd, 2014 at 2:29 PM ^

File this under feelingsball but for me this game was 2013 MSU Lite.  Both games started as a slog-- Minnesota wasn't exactly gashing Michigan early and neither did MSU.  But with the offense stagnant the defense eventually breaks.  Yes, they'll have breakdowns when the game is tight but man playing defense often and from behind just isn't easy to do for four quarters unless the D is truly elite.

 

In a parallel universe Michigan might enjoy a modest second half lead at home against a Power 5 school and I think most of us would feel pretty damn confident about the defense closing the game out. Some day.

 

Edit: For spelling and another thought:  I wonder what %age of the time UM plays from behind against Power5 schools during the 4-9 stretch?  Obviously it's a lot but it might be interesting to know in terms of how hard is it to play defense when the offense doesn't hardly score. 

alum96

October 2nd, 2014 at 3:58 PM ^

We've beaten every other topic into the ground

  • Hoke is a good man
  • Hoke is a good DL coach
  • Hoke is not a good HC
  • Hoke should be fired
  • When will he be fired
  • Who can we get to replace Hoke
  • Brandon sucks
  • Everyone hates Brandon but the lacrosse softball swiming team
  • Brandon should be fired
  • When will be he fired

How many more times can we talk about subjects everyone agrees upon.  It's all recyling and piling on at this point. 

MAKarmanesq

October 2nd, 2014 at 4:07 PM ^

He's gotta be burned out, and it's barely October. Who gives a damn anyway? Not like it matters. We know the D is pretty good overall. Howeva, when you have basically ZERO offense and the WORST special teams and coaching in America, it doesn't matter now does it?