Marcus Ray interview on ‘The Player and the Fan’ offers provocative, insightful, and entertaining podcast
The Player & The Fan is consistently a quality podcast with enjoyable banter between the hosts with fresh, unique perspectives about Michigan football. However, the latest installment from yesterday brought on the ever opinionated Marcus Ray and things rose to a different level.
Marcus tells the stories of his recruitment and his early days on campus. Then there is the revelation of the details of how Marcus‘s girlfriend cheated on him with Chris Howard, and the two were then in a group of warring factions which tore apart the team in the mid 90s. They then talk about how the team overcame this and other forms of adversity to put the team ahead of the individual on their way to the 1997 national championship.
After this, Marcus provides a raw and harsh take about the realities of the current state of Michigan football program. As he has been known to do, he holds no punches, and he says exactly what he is thinking and feeling. His knowledge and logic are hard to refute in many instances. His cockiness is brash, but his convictions are sincere and thought-provoking.
This is one of the most compelling individual podcast that I have heard a long time.
https://m.soundcloud.com/chris-howard-799448430
October 2nd, 2018 at 11:43 PM ^
Thanks, Marcus.
October 2nd, 2018 at 11:49 PM ^
If I had an ounce of his athleticism and cockiness, I would have taken a different career path.
j/k, you are welcome
(signed) -M. Ray
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:24 AM ^
You’re welcome
October 3rd, 2018 at 12:03 AM ^
So I guess he is admitting that his exgf was a cause of team strife before '97 and may have cost us some wins, and for those who bet, some real money, nice.
October 3rd, 2018 at 2:01 PM ^
After listening to it, the story was actually funny. He was cheating on her and she cheated on him. She knew what she was doing. She knew his room was next door.
I'm the same age as Marcus Ray. My friend's cousin went to Michigan. I can't remember if she was in the same class as us. That summer, we met her roommate. That had to be the finest room on the entire campus. Its too bad Chris Howard didn't mention the girl's name. It had to be one of them.
October 3rd, 2018 at 1:02 AM ^
Never liked this guy, don't care what he says
October 3rd, 2018 at 1:14 AM ^
Right, i mean it's easy to look good when Charles Woodson is covering half the field for you.
October 3rd, 2018 at 7:54 AM ^
^^^^^end thread
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:25 AM ^
Sucks to be you
October 3rd, 2018 at 1:14 AM ^
Chris Howard is great to listen, awesome perspectives. On the other hand I can't stand the fan, who's all bravado. But this podcast plays up these 2 polar opposites.
Marcus Ray can be very informative. He did a great job breaking down Michigan's defense vs OSU in 2016, explaining 1/2 man side, 1/2 zone on the field. However he gets carried away at times so that's preventing him from being a national analyst.
October 3rd, 2018 at 1:25 AM ^
Anybody remember a few years ago when Marcus insisted that Butch Jones was the best available head coach on the market?
October 3rd, 2018 at 5:09 AM ^
You know, I heard they had a pretty good friendship, and Marcus thought he was gonna get a job on his staff on 2 different occasions. Not sure what the Butch Jones / Michigan connection was, but it never came to fruition. He was never a Harbaugh fan.
October 3rd, 2018 at 5:24 AM ^
There are a lot of current Michigan fans who were not Harbaugh fans because of his comments about M's academics.
How times have changed...
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:49 AM ^
You are correct.
It's funny - in the 2 minute Google search to find that quote, I found a number of other things Marcus Ray has said about Michigan football. He seems, um, "professionally angry" about a lot of things.
October 3rd, 2018 at 5:24 AM ^
I will never forget Marcus Ray saying Butch Jones is a better coach than Jim Harbaugh.
While Marcus may have an understanding of some things, he has a propensity to make very stupid comments that age even more poorly.
He can kick rocks.
October 3rd, 2018 at 8:18 AM ^
Sounds like he would be well received here at Mgohottakecentralblog.com.
October 3rd, 2018 at 11:05 AM ^
I love how former players, who have actually played the game, know less about football than most of MGoBlog who have never played a single snap of football.
October 3rd, 2018 at 5:04 PM ^
Being a former player does not mean you can evaluate talent, coach, or scheme. Fans may not know more about football in general, but we can tell a hack with an axe to grind when we see one.
October 4th, 2018 at 8:32 AM ^
So because he played football his opinion of Jones>Harbaugh is accurate? Sounds like an appeal to authority fallacy to me.
October 3rd, 2018 at 5:36 AM ^
As much as MRay can be a Deebie Downer and a bit of a grudge holder he is a riot to listen to and tells it like he sees it. I like Chris Howard as well...and their stories about their time together, their “rivalry” while they were on campus, and their individual roads to greatness during a legendary time (in my mind) in Michigan football history is definitely worth a listen.
Marcus definitely has a chip on his shoulder. And you can see that it drove him to be an accomplished athlete. You can also see where his mouth probably has gotten him into a lot of trouble. Lol. I do think he adds some interesting insight to our coaching situation at Michigan. To the overall picture at Michigan right now. He has incredible football IQ and I could see him going a long ways in the booth..although he may have to learn when to check the attitude at times...maybe be a little more diplomatic...if he really wants to climb that ladder.
October 3rd, 2018 at 8:11 AM ^
the issue I have is he seems to check his objectivity at the door because he had an axe to grind with Harbaugh. I’m done with that.
October 3rd, 2018 at 10:15 AM ^
If you bash bash bash and never acknowledge the other side of the argument, your argument is invalid imo. They teach you that when writing a 5-paragraph essay in elementary school...
You can be right, and loud, and be an asshole, and that is Marcus Ray.
Look at the 2nd offensive play against Northwestern. You could argue that it's the reason we ended up in a 17-0 hole. Harbaugh took the ball to go on a long drive and suck the air out of the building. Instead, going backward on 2nd and 5 stalled that drive and boosted Northwestern onwards. You can place blame on at least three different things and be 100% right, but without the whole picture you aren't doing anyone justice.
Playcalling
Argument: Got too cute. We won first down, so being conservative and getting 1-2 yards still keeps us ahead of the sticks.
Counterpoint: Fans bitched about conservative 1st down, 1st drive, hand offs to Higdon that set downs on fire all year long. The end around is a good break of tendancy.
2nd Level: puts the end around on film and now that action allows us to have success on future iso plays as seen in Seth's Neck Sharpies.
Personnel
Argument: Ronnie Bell? When Ambry and DPJ are on the team?!
Counterpoint: Ronnie Bell is unexpected. Could have caught them thinking he was just a decoy. Another tendancy breaker fans have been clamoring for.
Execution
Argument: If Bell cuts upfield right on the handoff, he can get 3-5 yards and stay ahead of the sticks.
Counterpoint: We don't know if he is coached to do that or not. Hard to expect a true freshman running his first live rep of this end around to have the best vision. Blame Harbaugh for Playcall/Personnel.
I mean this is how you argue. You don't pick your favorite and run with it.
October 3rd, 2018 at 10:29 AM ^
If by "riot to listen to" you mean "makes me want to immediately turn off the radio" then I agree. Even if he his valid points, his delivery is terrible and he comes off as bitter.
If I recall, Marcus played in the consecutive games in 1998 where the Michigan D was torched by Notre Dame's running QB and then Syrcuase's McNabb. I remember that as the start of Michigan's inability to defend running quarterbacks. I would like to here him discuss that sometime. I remember watching those games coming off a national championship year. What changed....oh, there was no Woodson covering the defensive backfield.
October 3rd, 2018 at 8:13 AM ^
I feel like Marcus wanted to be a coach at UM but didn't get that chance therefore he is critical of the program.
October 3rd, 2018 at 8:39 AM ^
I quit listening to that podcast a long time ago and Marcus Ray is not even close to being a good enough reason to start again. Hard pass.
You can get enough criticism of Michigan football from a billion other places.
October 3rd, 2018 at 8:43 AM ^
It is such a Marcus Ray thing to say that factions within the team are the reason for losses (not beat for other reasons), then due to their (his) great leadership they (he) fixed them and they went undefeated and won a national championship.
He was a great player, but he is, was and always will be the Mercury Morris of the '97 team. I'm convinced he does not want a Michigan team to be as successful as his last team so he can continue to talk down to the program.
October 3rd, 2018 at 8:59 AM ^
This is exactly correct. It’s funny too, jackasses like Marcus Ray and Braylon Edwards will be the first ones standing there trying to steal glory when Michigan does win something again. It’s predictable.
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:13 AM ^
I always felt like Ray came into the '98 season out of shape, and that really hurt us in the first couple games that season.
All the comments about Ray got me thinking about that again.
October 3rd, 2018 at 8:45 AM ^
For those of us that don’t want to dignify this with a listen, what exactly are Marcus Ray’s complaints now?
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:13 AM ^
Nothing really new if you're familiar with his takes.
Claims that a big part of the team's problems are psychological: the players don't know how to win and don't truly believe that they can be great, in large part because they don't have a real "signature" win.
Also claims that Don Brown's man defense is exploitable because it demands too much of linebackers in coverage.
Finally claims that the offense is too archaic and if we turned Shea loose, he'd be just like McSorely.
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:20 AM ^
Dude you should listen to this Bullshit, it's not his show, it's Chris Howard's and he is a guest.
- They will never beat OSU until they recruit Ohio better. He and Woodson wouldn't allow there team to lose to Ohio
- He's the only one speaking the truth, and it's because he is no longer in the area
- They will probably be ready to win in 19
- He was watching the game with 9 other guys and Braylon when Braylon sent the tweet, and they all agreed with it.
- The team has fake swag. they look good , but don't back it up
- He could never play for Don Brown, his system doesn't work against good teams
- Brian Kelly schemed Don Brown up
- When Ty Wheatley and Jedd Fisch left the offense went into the toilet
Nothing we haven't already heard, but according to him, he is the only one speaking the truth. Until Harbaugh beats OSU, MSU, PSU, and wins a B1G championship we will continue to hear it.
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:25 AM ^
Oh, I’ve got nothing against Chris Howard. I may check out the podcast, but not for this guest. Sounds like more of the same crap from Marcus. He and Braylon are not good ambassadors for the program. Doesn’t mean you have to agree or kiss anyone’s ass, but this negativity is toxic.
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:50 AM ^
That guy's a windbag that likes to hear himself talk. That being said, I agree with the Fisch Wheatley take.
The fake swag thing is just another hot take that I don't need to hear about either, the rules have changed and some of the things that those guys got away with in the '90's are no longer tolerated.
Brian Kelly Schemed Don Brown up really?! we're a jump ball away from being down by 4 instead of 11 and after that ND got shut down.
Marcus Ray is like the 1972 Dolphins. In fact, I'll bet he pops a champagne cork every time we lose to the Buckeyes.
Fuck him, Braylon Edwards and the other 9 guys in the room that got Drunk Braylon to send that tweet. If I never hear from him on anything Michigan Football related it will be too soon.
October 3rd, 2018 at 7:55 PM ^
Sam Webb was in that room too.
October 3rd, 2018 at 10:26 AM ^
Don’t kid yourself. Even when they do there will still be the hot takes. Unless Marcus is coaching.
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:31 AM ^
I'm not going to listen unless you can promise me he'll mention Woodson at least a dozen times.
October 3rd, 2018 at 11:45 AM ^
Ha ha... You know he does. That's his claim to fame. He was such a good ball player, with Charles on the team. They would have lost 3 games, and never played in the Rose Bowl without Woodson. That was their only B1G Championship, but if you didn't know that, you would think they won it every year.
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:36 AM ^
Or he just knows what he is talking about and everyone who doesn't agree thinks it is an axe to grind.
October 3rd, 2018 at 10:13 AM ^
He makes a ton of valid points. Truth hurts when the messiah isn't quite that.
October 3rd, 2018 at 12:57 PM ^
Disagree. As an example I've read/heard multiple times when he talks about how his teams dominated the B1G. Yes, they won more titles. However, the B1G was far weaker. The two situations aren't comparable. And it wasn't like in his day (which closely aligns with my day) at UM we just owned the B1G. I remember lots of single win seasons.
So, his points aren't valid. That's just the start. He's too negative.
October 3rd, 2018 at 2:25 PM ^
Nobody will win the big ten with 8 or 9 wins like the 90s or 2000s unless one division completely goes into the toilet. Not the same as his day with shared titles. They did no "dominating of the big ten".
October 3rd, 2018 at 4:21 PM ^
If by "ton of valid points" you mean selective arguments with limited support, then sure For example, his insane rant comparing Michigan last year going to PSU and 1997's travel to PSU, which ignores a mountain of context. Or his argument that Michigan's man coverage is somehow at issue because teams throw slants and WR screens, ignoring the fact that Michigan is 4th in the nation in yards per pass attempt.
Not everyone who graduated from Michigan is an expert forever and should be taken as a "truth talker" just because they burned too many bridges for people in power to take their calls.
October 3rd, 2018 at 9:51 AM ^
Always the Best, Marcus Ray 29
October 3rd, 2018 at 10:28 AM ^
Fresh perspective? Last episode of this podcast I attempted to listen to included the claims that Devin Bush looks "a step slow" and that it's actually better to show more of your playbook so teams have to look at more stuff.
I think I'm good.
October 3rd, 2018 at 10:43 AM ^
Huge fan since I was a kid and love this blog with the breakdowns and such, but I hate when we put our heads in the sand like we are now. Marcus Ray and Edwards are only saying what every non-Michigan fan is saying about Michigan football. Last year for the first 4 games we all knew they were bad but Brian and everyone kept saying “ No Guys we are ok. Purdue is really good! And Cinni and Air Force is a great team!” But then we alll knew what was to come but we put our head in sand and acted surprised when sparty beat us AT HOME! We blamed the weather??? Is that what Meeechigan is about? Blaming refs and weather? Lemme guess , suddenly after all the words on how bad NOrthwestern is, they blanked Michigan in the first HALF and it took EVERYTHING Michigan had to come back , suddenly they are a pretty good team? Come on! When sparty loses to these teams we all laugh. Even when it’s close we laugh. But Underlining it all, there is a reason we are scared of MSU: they are who we used to be! They lose stupid games but win the big ones that count on the national stage! That’s what we USED to hang our hat on! We never won nattys but We beat good teams on TV. Then lose to Purdue. Personally , I’d rather have that then this. Ray is right, this defense is good but not good enough to win and we all know it. Let’s stop pretending every team that spanks us is suddenly secretly good or that every good team we lose to on prime time was because of refs or the rain. This is a blog about football right? Not some propaganda machine that will be punished for saying bad things about our beloved? We can say we are bad right? Because if we aren’t saying it then the players (excuse me, little baby children) won’t say it and they’ll never get to the point where they win. They’ll always think they are good enough and get spanked by a sparty team that almost lost to Utah state and a Ohio team that was very much beatable ( except by Michigan) by PENN STATE (Now we look up at Penn State?). Now go ahead and call me a troll and pretend I’m an Ohio fan and Pretend we are fans of a great meechigan football team until November comes. Because we All know where we’ll be: complaining about how the ref screwed us in Columbus or how harbaugh didn’t have any EXTRA plays in Lansing. How many seasons do we need to understand that THERE ARE NO EXTRA PLAYS waiting for sparty , or penn state or Ohio. THIS IS IT. I Deperately hope I’m wrong or Marcus is wrong or (sigh) Braylon is wrong but from being a fan who watches old Michigan games from the 90s for fun, we sure look a lot like IOWA.
October 3rd, 2018 at 11:14 AM ^
Michigan is not as good as they showed when they beat the brakes off Nebraska. But we CAN play that good.
Michigan is not as bad as they showed when they squeaked by Northwestern. But we CAN play that bad.
Michigan isn't a National Title contender, but is a B1G Championship contender. We were an inch from Indy just 2 seasons ago, and have every opportunity this year but we need to grow, and we are growing.
October 3rd, 2018 at 11:39 AM ^
NW shut UM down in the 1st quarter not the first "HALF" and then UM won the next 3 Qs 20-0 and outgained NW 350 - 97. Good teams do that. Nobody said Cincy or Air Force were great last year. PU was a decent team last year, but regardless, a bad UM team won all those games.
ND isn't "secretly good" they're just good and maybe better than good. Many teams are looking up at PSU, but Harbaugh is 2-1 vs them.
October 3rd, 2018 at 12:36 PM ^
if it take you that many words to make a point, you’re dumb.