Is John Beilein the Bo of Michigan Basketball?

Submitted by JamesBondHerpesMeds on January 8th, 2021 at 11:19 AM

It's clear that Coach Howard is an exceptional win for Michigan Basketball - I know we had our questions, but he truly has an opportunity to carve his legacy over the next few years.

I was reflecting on John Beilein's role in all of this - notably it's significant, and if anything it has some parallels to how Bo Schembechler took a middling football program in 1969 to a perennial Big Ten powerhouse. In his shadow, Gary Moeller (kinda) and Lloyd Carr carried on Bo's longtime legacy of success. No matter what happens to Michigan basketball from here on out, I'd place Coach Beilein on the pedestal of the architect of the program's current successes. 

Does this seem like a reasonable take on John Beilein's history? Will his name be included on a Big Ten memorial award, or our home court at Crisler? Seems like a reasonable way to honor him.

A Lot of Milk

January 8th, 2021 at 11:32 AM ^

A lot of schools do it, to be fair. They latch onto a figure as the pinnacle of their school's success, of which all should emulate. The difference is that successful schools don't linger in the past. OSU fans canonized Woody Hayes, but are now probably embarrassed of his Michigan record when compared to their more recent coaches. Bama fans worshipped Bear Bryant, but would probably burn every houndstooth hat in existence for an extra year with Saban.

Until Michigan gets a coach successful enough that fans no longer need to search for 1970s football games on YouTube, Bo will be held on a pedestal 

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Sambojangles

January 8th, 2021 at 12:26 PM ^

Also I believe their football program is housed in the Woody Hayes Athletic Center. In parallel to ours, of course, which is in Schembechler Hall. Hayes may be out of minds since it's been 40 years since he was fired, but he was not only a football coach but a university professor. He's as much of an institution there as Schembechler is here.

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Hab

January 8th, 2021 at 11:44 AM ^

You're getting hung up on the order in which they coached?  It's early in Coach Howard's tenure, but I'm talking about their ultimate roles and standing when it is all said and done.  I'm predicting that Coach Howard's ultimate results will be more comparable to Fielding Yost's, making Coach B's accomplishments more comparable to Bo's. 

Besides:

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bacon1431

January 8th, 2021 at 11:28 AM ^

I think what John Beilein did is more impressive than what Bo did IMO. The basketball program was wandering aimlessly in the wilderness. We had a rich history, but we had about a decade of incompetence. When Bo took over, the football program had a rich history and had also won a conference title just a few years before. Plus, the MW was more populated and Bo did not deal with scholarship limits. 

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jmblue

January 8th, 2021 at 11:44 AM ^

I think they're pretty similar.  Michigan football won exactly one Big Ten title from 1951-68. 

Michigan basketball in the decade before Beilein was regarded as a huge underachiever.  We made the national title game in the '60s, '70s, '80s and '90s.  Most observers expected us to return at some point.  

The scholarship issue could be debated either way: Bo had no limit in the beginning, but so did every other program.  In basketball, Izzo probably could have landed every top Michigan prospect in the 2000s, but scholarship limits prevented him from doing so.  Bo inherited a solid team, but Beilein's tenure got off the ground with the help of two key Amaker recruits (Manny Harris and DeShawn Sims).

In the end I think the biggest diifference is that Bo turned down a chance to leave (for Texas A&M) a dozen years in while Beilein left.  If Bo had left in 1981, we'd look at him very differently.  Likewise, if Beilein had given us two full decades of coaching, he'd be a Bo-type figure, there's no question then.  

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A Lot of Milk

January 8th, 2021 at 11:44 AM ^

Beilein took over a program that had to compete with an in-state rival that was in the midst of their most successful era in history with their most successful coach in history. To the south, he had to compete with his second biggest rival who was going to final fours and pulling in elite recruits regularly. To be fair, the format of college basketball and its postseason certainly helps in this regard, since you don't have to directly beat those teams to achieve your season goals. That said, Beilein still provided more than his fair share of glorious OSU and MSU beatdowns and solidified his title of best coach in program history, in my opinion

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snarling wolverine

January 8th, 2021 at 12:14 PM ^

I like Coach B, but...

Bo coached here 21 years and won 79.4% of his games overall and 85.0% in Big Ten play.

Beilein coached here 12 years and won 65.0% of his games overall and 57.8% in the Big Ten.  

Beilein left right when he had things humming along and he could have pulled up those percentages a bit, but we can only evaluate him on what he actually did.  

Beilein's reputation is bolstered by the two runs to the national title game, which were awesome.  Bo didn't get that chance because football's postseason is dumb.  Imagine basketball taking a month off and then playing one game with nothing at stake.

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bacon1431

January 8th, 2021 at 12:45 PM ^

Winning % is a bad comparison between the two sports. Coach K's winning % overall and in conference play is less than Bo's. He's a more successful coach overall than Bo. 

For most of Bo's tenure, he had to worry about OSU. If he beat them, it was probably very likely he would win the conference. Wasn't until the 80s when Iowa was good. In basketball, a single does isn't as detrimental to your season. But Beilein couldn't look at the schedule and say "sweep MSU and we win the conference." Because Bo Ryan, Thad Matta, Tom Crean, and Matt Painter were around along with Izzo. 

Bo's accomplishments are great. Maybe he has more than Beilein. But I'm more impressed with what Beilein did given the circumstances. 

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snarling wolverine

January 8th, 2021 at 1:15 PM ^

Coach K's winning percentages are 78.8% overall and 71.1% in conference - lower than Bo's, yes, but quite a bit higher than Beilein's.

Consider this one: Thad Matta.  No one thinks of him as a legend, but at OSU he won 73.3% overall and 65.8% in conference.  

Beilein was awesome for us.  But we tend to focus on the highlights now that he's gone.  There were long stretches of his tenure where people weren't happy with him.  This was posted four years ago.

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snarling wolverine

January 8th, 2021 at 2:19 PM ^

There was rarely anything at stake.  A bowl bid was a reward for a good season.   You spent half your time practicing and the other half going to Disneyland and the beach.  The NCAA didn't even consider bowl stats to be legitimate for a long time.  

Getting to Pasadena was the most important thing.  Winning it was just a little cherry on top.

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Blue Me

January 8th, 2021 at 11:31 AM ^

Love Coach B and give him much credit for resurrecting M basketball. Having said that, was less than thrilled by the timing of his departure and the lurch it left us in.

Didn't know much about Juwan's coaching background but always liked the way he carried himself and his love of Michigan and felt he was a good hire at the time given the situation.

Fast forward a couple of years and I'll say Coach Howard is an upgrade over Beilein. His in-game adjustments are second to none and his style of play is more fun both to watch and for the players. He's going to make a lot of kids a lot of money with his coaching skill without being a smarmy POS like many/most of the blue blood coaches.

It warms my heart to see how much fun the players are having; after all, it's a game at the end of the day.

I hope he retires at M as he could leave one helluva legacy!

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A Lot of Milk

January 8th, 2021 at 11:38 AM ^

Juwan has been great so far, but declaring him an upgrade over Beilein 1.5 seasons in is a little much. The guy hasn't coached a single postseason game yet, which is about 75% of what makes Beilein's legacy

I have confidence in Juwan to succeed in all facets, but to dismiss a guy who led all of college basketball in tournament wins since 2013 is crazy. I don't agree with a lot of stuff Harbaugh does anymore, but his quote that he hates comparing things or people because "somebody will always be diminished" rings true here

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matty blue

January 8th, 2021 at 12:04 PM ^

i'm guessing that the same people who suggest that juwan howard is an upgrade over beilein, today, right now, are the same people who would periodically pop out of their caves to bitch about beilein in the first place.  not so much beilein 'haters' as much as MAKE PLAYS types with short memories and even shorter attention spans.

(please note - _not_ a comment on the poster who suggested this above)

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Blue Me

January 8th, 2021 at 1:25 PM ^

I didn't dismiss Beilein -- just said I like the way JH is running the program better. There was a reason top talent didn't want to come and play for Beilein and it was his style of play. We clearly have an NBA offensive system in place now and it will definitely pay off both in recruiting and on the floor IMO.

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KTisClutch

January 8th, 2021 at 1:41 PM ^

It had nothing to do with style of play. I mean the effing NBA hired him and you think elite talent didn't play for him because of play style? He routinely got guys overdrafted because his system was so good it masked their issues. He just wasn't a great recruiter.

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outsidethebox

January 8th, 2021 at 2:33 PM ^

Beilein set a high floor for this program. 

The negatives for John revolve around how he left Michigan. And let there be no mistake, he screwed up big-time on all counts. We all make mistakes...what he did here in this regard was mind-numbingly, staggeringly out of character. Many make excuses for him in this regard but that is all they are-excuses. What the hell was he thinking!

Otherwise, the OP premise is a narrow recency bias. 

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FrankMurphy

January 8th, 2021 at 2:00 PM ^

Beilein had earned the right to depart however and whenever he wanted, as far as I'm concerned. The program was a dumpster fire when he arrived. He had to build a winning culture completely from scratch. He also paid his own WVU buyout to take the job (a fact that many forget). He brought the program back to the cusp of elite status, and he did it without engaging in shenanigans or embarrassing the university. Juwan is now building on the foundation that he laid.

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jmblue

January 8th, 2021 at 11:31 AM ^

I don't know why fans are so fixated on memorializing everything.  He's not a war hero or tragic figure, he's just a sports coach.

John Beilein is a very good coach and had a nice tenure.  But 12 years isn't all that long, and 283 total wins isn't an eye-popping number.  He went to two Final Fours, which is great, but Fisher went to three and Strack to two himself.

Beilein had the opportunity to ride it out here for another five years or whatever and pad his career numbers, but the lure of the pros was too strong.  That was his choice, and both parties have moved on.

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jmblue

January 8th, 2021 at 11:59 AM ^

I'm a big Beilein fan.  I don't want to be to sound like I'm knocking the guy.  But 12 years isn't that long for a century-old program, and we were only really good for about half of that time.   He had a chance to string out a Bo-like tenure, but he left.

As for running a clean program, that's an expectation at Michigan.  For that reason, an even more accomplished coach (Fisher) was fired.  It's great that Beilein did that, but it was part of his job description.

It's interesting how fans have this need to memorialize things.  Not that long ago - during the 2018 season - there were posters seriously arguing here that Don Brown (!) should have a statue. 

If in 2029 (a decade after Beilein's departure) people are still eager to name a court after him, OK, I guess.

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