Interesting convo I had with a prominant Chicago HS basketball coach
So, I had the opportunity to speak with a Chicago HS basketball luminary in a casual situation earlier today. I won't drop his name at this point, but he coached some of Chicago's best talent over the past 30 years at a couple well known Chicago high schools. He apparently just retired this year. I asked some very pointed questions about basketball topics, specifically regarding college recruiting, and he (thankfully) did not hold back on giving me some very candid and real answers. Thought I would share with the board:
1. College bball recruiting is extremely dirty (duh!)
2. While he thinks the NCAA does their best to monitor this, he seems to believe that college coaches are much smarter and can "stay ahead" of the NCAA. He says there are very sophisticated ways to pay players and their families without suspicion.
3. Coach K - dirty as hell (I was kinda surprised by this)
4. Coach Cal - dirty as hell (duh!)
5. Coach Pitino - dirty as hell (duh!)
5. Izzo - sends his assitants to do his dirty work. He says he was offered money from Dwayne Stephens on several recent occasions for particular recruits (although I don't know if he actually accepted the money). He thinks that Izzo is not as bad as others though. Izzo has a lot of respect in Chicago and is not normally known for playing dirty. However, his people told him that Izzo's recent recruting success is no doubt from some "below the belt" tactics.
6. The Jabari Parker recruitment was surprising clean on a relative scale.
7. As for Michigan/JB - clean, very clean, but too clean. Most promimant Chicago HS coaches stay away from Michigan because Michigan won't be part of the "recruiting machine" in Chicago. They think JB is a good coach but teaches "white boy" basketball. He basically says Michigan/JB has no respect in Chicago anymore.
I mentioned I was a Michigan fan and talked some more about our program. He has tons of respect for us becasue he had lots of interaction with Michigan many years ago. Back in the 90s, Michigan was THE school for Chicago's best talent. He says we were not a clean program then, but he says that no one was and Michigan was no different than any other major program. He seems to think we have little to no chance with big time recruits in any major city without getting a little dirty.
He had some funny things to say about Amaker, but I'll save for later.
Anyway, thought I would share with the board. What are your thoughts? Would you be OK with getting a little dirty to get better recruits? Are you OK with being a super clean program now that can't consistent compete on the big stage?
December 28th, 2015 at 9:04 AM ^
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 28th, 2015 at 9:30 AM ^
Jimmy Chitwood
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 28th, 2015 at 9:47 AM ^
Here is the "definition" in all it's derogatory glory:
"White Boy Basketball": Superior fundamentals - shooting, defense, screens, boxing out - to make up for inferior athleticism.
"Black Boy Basketball": Superior athleticism that lets you get away with inferior or lazy fundamentals.
That's what he means. We all know this.
January 22nd, 2016 at 1:48 AM ^
"white boy basketball" = running a set play
December 28th, 2015 at 12:18 AM ^
Nothing is more ironic and funny than white people crying racism especially with a term that is fairly common in basketball circles. Wah wah.
December 28th, 2015 at 12:22 AM ^
December 28th, 2015 at 3:21 AM ^
I get that you think it's funny if people question the use of "white boy" - you've mentioned it a few times in this thread actually.
But can you expain how it's "ironic"?
December 28th, 2015 at 6:47 AM ^
After all the blatant racism perpetuated against minorities that you see in the media 24/7 this election cycle and the fact that white people just tell me to stop crying about it any time I face actual racism for my skin color/apparent foreigness, I'll tell you all to stfu when you face 1% of the same shit your melanin infused cohorts experience on a daily basis.
December 28th, 2015 at 9:28 AM ^
Honestly, the only person I've ever seen on this board who is actually racist (i.e. hates another group of people because of the color of their skin) is you. You clearly hate white people and take every opportunity you can to make it known.
I think you should enjoy your minority privilege in that you haven't been kicked off the board as you likely would have had you been speaking about any other group the way you do about white people.
December 28th, 2015 at 9:55 AM ^
Rofl. Please stop hounding my posts.
You can go prove how American you are with your 1/5 Irish, German Polish ass on Stormfront.
I'll gladly take my minority privilege on this one issue if you admit your privilege in every other platform in America.
December 28th, 2015 at 9:59 AM ^
Again, what is your background? If I'm remembering correctly and you are Indian/SE Asian, by just about every metric you are a part of one of the most privileged groups in this country (and thus the world). Any form of "racism" you might face is so superficial in nature its almost laughable.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:52 AM ^
Yeah the guy who held up my mother at gunpoint because she happened to look Muslim was acting superficially.
The guy who refused services from my dad post-9/11 due to our skin color was acting superficially.
My school teachers who didn't expect me to perform well on sports and only on academics only acted superficially when it came to pigeon holing me due to my ethnicity.
Man being white and ignorant must be a great way to live.
LOL
December 28th, 2015 at 11:11 AM ^
See, but now you're just talking about the general pitfalls of multiculturalism (and the first just sounds like something that happens to some people in any large city). Stuff like 9/11 and San Bernardino are going to make some people act irrationally. Happens.
And really, if the biggest complaint in YOUR life is that you were stereotyped (like white kids don't get stereotyped at being bad at sports and good at school? Come on.) as being a scholar, then I rest my case.
December 28th, 2015 at 12:04 PM ^
You have no case. You picked an argument with me after I pushed your shit in about a couple of months ago about similar racial posts.
My point is exactly that. Crying about "white boy basketball" when your ilk won't face the same, even trivial as you claim, problems that my people, or even worse that black people face day to day is funny to me.
Then you marginalizing my experiences is even funnier as you are white.
Please don't talk about multiculturalism to me when people like you are fine with the rhetoric in this country that villifies minority groups as a whole, and then turn around and talk about isolated consequences of multiculturalism when shit actually happens.
December 28th, 2015 at 9:29 AM ^
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 28th, 2015 at 9:32 AM ^
This attitude is why we won't move forward. You are a huge part of the problem, and you won't even entertain the possibility.
December 28th, 2015 at 9:52 AM ^
Nope.
White people might face racism the 1% of the time they find themselves in an American city ghetto.
The 99% of the time us minorities will face the same bullshit in every other walk of life that are run by majority white policymakers/funders in the US.
When we say something, we're told to shut up and that it's a fable of our imagination. So please, give yourself that piece of advice first.
December 28th, 2015 at 9:56 AM ^
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 28th, 2015 at 10:01 AM ^
"Us minorities".
There it is. As if the plight of black Americans coming from the slave era/Jim Crow south or Native Americans is the same as every other minority in the United States.
I think I've got you pretty well pegged.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:48 AM ^
I don't put my plight anywhere near the realm of black Americans. I do say "us minorities" when it comes to comparisons to white people tho.
I think I've got you pegged right on Stormfront since for some reason you think I'm a tea drinking rich immigrant kid from a billionaire family who came here on lottery visa.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:58 AM ^
Pretty sure I said "enjoy the fruits of your parents labors" implying they worked hard to get what they had and then you benefited from it :).
When it comes to "comparisons to white people" if I'm remembering your background correctly, by all kind of positive metrics, your ethnic group would score similar or higher than whites. Since we use these to prove that white privilege is real, its pretty easy to say you come from a privileged background. You also don't have to deal with the negative connotations (i.e. biased policing) that black Americans deal with. Your only real complaint might be someone saying something mean to you because of your appearance, which again, if that's your biggest issue, you don't have issues.
December 28th, 2015 at 11:04 AM ^
Wait... but you're the guy who hates it when I group up all white people in one group don't you?
Today I learned I don't have racial issues in my life because a white guy told me.
This is hitting fun levels of trolling at this point.
I have to give credit.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:01 AM ^
December 28th, 2015 at 10:07 AM ^
BornSinner has a chip on his shoulder that would make dantonio jealous.
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 28th, 2015 at 10:13 AM ^
Whose playing the victim? People are just pointing out the obvious hypocrisy in referring to something as "white" in a derogatory way. That's not claiming victimhood, its just reality. I'm not offended, I'm just noting it.
I also find it hilarious when people who/whose ancestors chose to come here whine about white people and try to pretend like their situation is the same as black/Native Americans. And its especially hilarious (if I'm right about BornSinner, which I believe I am), when the group they come from, by almost any real metric you want to use (not superficial nonsense like "I don't see people like me on TV!!!") is as or even more privileged than the white people they rail against.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:29 AM ^
Today I learned that because my parents chose to escape a 3rd world country has been scarred by British coloniliasm, I have no right to point out the flaws of the country that I am a current proud citizen of.
You are the worst type of person.
How exactly am I more privileged than a white person? I want you to explain this one to me right here.
And no I don't bitch about representation on TV. I can understand in a 70% white country that most representation will be white and minority representation will tend to be stereotypical.
Crazy right Mr. Stormfront?
December 28th, 2015 at 10:35 AM ^
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 28th, 2015 at 10:44 AM ^
Why did your parents pick one oppressive society for another? Just curious.
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 28th, 2015 at 3:27 PM ^
In all honesty, no one learned anything of value today, in any shape, form, or fashion. Dare I say, nor does anyone, ever, in politically charged message board rants.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:27 AM ^
Who the fuck is "clinging to victimhood"? Nobody here that I see, in any way whatsoever. Your argument is ridiculous, and you should feel bad. I'm not going any further, because this is not the forum for this discussion.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:39 AM ^
...basketball" is somehow equivalent to a hypothetical derogatory term used against people of color. And it's behaving as if small slights against whites here and there are equivalent to what people of color - as a group - face.
White people as a group - and again, I am white - have things relatively easy compared to people of color as a group (please note the use of the word relatively). I wouldn't trade places with a person of color for that reason. The "downside" of this for me is that I don't get to whine too much when someone says something like "white boy basketball." Poor me.
EDIT: I'll add this anecdote: I've heard former NBA players who played against Larry Bird say that Bird would tell their coaches they shouldn't dare try to guard him (Bird) with a white guy. So people should be offended by Larry Bird too.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:40 AM ^
You're the one who made that leap.
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 28th, 2015 at 10:48 AM ^
Dude, I don't know what to say.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:56 AM ^
I honestly have no idea where you're coming from. Is your position that people of color and whites are equally situated in the U.S.? Are you offended by "white boy basketball" even though it's something Larry Bird might have said? You're offended? You're not offended but want others to be offended? You want to be offended without admitting you're offended because being offended is a sign of weakness? I don't get it.
December 28th, 2015 at 3:03 PM ^
I just don't have the will to delve in to this right now. Maybe remind me later if you want a serious answer. There is just too much here to unpack, and this really isn't the place.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:48 AM ^
Is anyone actually offended though? I think people are just pointing out the hypocrisy.
And beyond that BornSinner comes from a group who has it relatively easy compared to just about every other group in the U.S. if we use the same metrics we use to measure white privilege against actual oppressed groups such as blacks/Native Americans. Even more so than white people I might add. So his obvious dislike of white people while clinging to his "us minorities" mantra is also hypocritical and pretty funny.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:54 AM ^
You. Don't. Know. Me.
How is my family who raised me in Jersey City more privileged than white people?
Please tell. me. this. because apparently my family missed the memo.
Your are a fucking disgrace.
December 28th, 2015 at 10:55 AM ^
Where did he say that? He just said we have things easier overall. I agree, and I certainly don't dislike white people. I am a white people!
And it's not hypocrisy when things are not equivalent. People are born equal but then have different life experiences. People of color - generally speaking - have different life experiences than whites do. It's okay to acknowledge that.
December 28th, 2015 at 11:03 AM ^
His posting history suggests it. He's more hostile towards white people than any white perrson here is toward any other group. If someone white on here spoke the way he did about any other group, they would be booted in about 5 minutes. I don't really care, I just find people like him who come from a privileged background and try to tie themselves to the plight of others (like you did with the people of color reference) interesting.
December 28th, 2015 at 11:07 AM ^
My posting history suggests I call out people who get offended over stupid shit like "white boy basketball"
Your posting history suggests you hate minorities in capable positions pointing out flaws with the American system.
You also hate people who may not be directly affected by certain policies helping others or creating awareness for others who are.
Again, I'm sorry about your beef with this board's posting rules.
December 28th, 2015 at 11:15 AM ^
Is anyone really offended though? And do you really think the way that you called people out was at all mature?
I'm just measuring you against the general tenor of the board: No one is as hostile towards any other group (except perhaps OSU/Sparty fans) as you are towards white people. You seem like an angry individual. You should learn to enjoy your parent's hard work and rest easy knowing you have only the most minor of problems.
Anyway, I'm out. Should have stopped a while ago, but like I said, your whole schtick is fascinating.
December 28th, 2015 at 11:54 AM ^
Sorry my blunt approach offends your sense of proper well behaved minorities.
Deal with it.
December 28th, 2015 at 4:09 PM ^
I would call it more stupid, than blunt. But that's just me.
December 27th, 2015 at 11:23 PM ^
Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad
December 27th, 2015 at 11:34 PM ^
I hate when "clean" and "dirty" are used interchangibly with "follows the rules" and "doesn't follow the rules."
Okay - I'll break the seal and say it. I do not care if any of our players are taking cash payments to play sports at Michigan. At all. I consider the prohibition on player payment to be unethical, so I don't equate joining the ranks of teams that violate that prohibition to be unethical. So I don't call that dirty, and I don't mind seeing a day when it happens here whether or not the NCAA says we can.
Let's contrast that with what I would call "dirty." The Pitino stuff with strippers was dirty. The Miami football stories about paying for abortions and hooking players up with drug connects is dirty. Paying mom to sell her kid's signature is dirty. I would be ashamed if I heard Michigan was going in on this.
But if I locked eyes with Jabrill Peppers as he took a thousand dollar handshake from a Traverse City entrepreneur, I'd say "get it, brother. You earned it." And I'd do the same if it was, say, Connor Cook in a Jeep Wrangler or Joey Bosa with Google stock.
Just one man's opinion. But I've come to this conclusion after years of soul searching.
December 27th, 2015 at 11:50 PM ^
I'm with ya mang.
December 28th, 2015 at 12:00 AM ^
I also agree players should get paid and have nothing against any player who takes some cash or any boosters that provide it.
However, the programs that are complicit with this, in my opinion, are still "dirty"/unethical. The product they are selling is amateur athletics. No one in any of the programs would admit that they are funneling payments to players. That is dishonest--it isn't like Coach K, the UK AD, etc. is standing up and saying "We believe players should be paid and will do so despite the rules because it is right". Many of them problem defend the "student-athlete" model and don't want to outbid peer schools for players.
December 28th, 2015 at 3:24 AM ^
You soul searched yourself onto a very slippery slope Superstar, where it seems only your opinions of right and wrong can be used to deem whether a program is "clean" or not... and man it takes some pretty shady shit to get on your "dirty" list!
I think I speak for not just myself when I say, Yes it is time to figure out a more equitable way to distrubute some of these billions to the people actually playing on the fields and courts representing the schools, and Yes, I do want anything we win to be clean of the taint of rules violations (not just LSA Superstar code violations) until the day when that more equitable distribution happens.
It does matter to me that we're "clean", and when the line slides, and payments are allowed, I'll slide my definition with it. Unitl that day, if I saw Jabrill taking an envelope full of cash I'd find a way to quietly make sure Coach knows and let him deal with it.
December 28th, 2015 at 7:55 AM ^
I did not come down from a mountain with a list of LSA Superstar violations on a tablet. I've used the same moral compass that I use to determine right from wrong in everyday life to evaluate right from wrong in sports.
If you're the one asserting that straight cash payments are unethical, show your work. The die is not yet cast with finality for me. Why is paying an athlete cash "dirty?"
December 28th, 2015 at 8:55 AM ^
Taking cash may not be "wrong" in your opinion, but it is "dirty" because it leads to sanctions & penalties.
Ultimately, that hurts our sports programs in a way that I wouldn't stand by and tacitly condone.
As I said, it's time to change the system in some way, but until then I want a clean (sanctions free) athletic dept. We might have to accept a more Bo Ryan style of "white boy" basketball if cheating is the only way to get the highest rated recruits, because I don't think UM is going to become a 1 & done factory anytime soon.
Brian will have to deal with it...