Harbaugh sees both Patterson and McCaffery playing, "redefining what a starter is"
We could end up with our first QB timeshare in quite some time. https://sports.yahoo.com/michigans-jim-harbaugh-said-q-bs-shea-patterson-dylan-mc-caffrey-could-split-time-225443475.html
This seems like competition building... I could certainly see DMac getting more PT than most backups, but Harbaugh isn't one to pull his QB for no reason. He has a long, demonstrable record of sticking with a QB, especially an experienced one.
I mean I think obviously Shea is gonna be the starter, but at the same time, having a dynamic guy like McCaffrey as the back up is too good not to take advantage of. If I had to guess, it'll be like a Tommy Stevens situation at Penn St the last few seasons were McCaffrey will come in for a play or a series sporadically
Since we’re all guessing, I’m guessing it’s going to be more than that, and certainly more than a more “wildcat” wrinkle like most teams use occasionally. DMac has a gun and within the RPO he’s going to have at least one of those talented WR’s going straight vertical on almost every play. Now, as mentioned above, if he and Shane are able to work a “two man game” with the read-option out of the back field, that opens up a give, pass option that could become an actual staple of the offense.
People always chuckle at this but the RPO will evolve into that at some point. Why only limit yourself to one passing threat (outside of the old fashioned HB pass)? It takes a specific roster set up, which Michigan just happens to have. I wanted to see it with Denard and Gardner, and we did a few times but at that point Denard was injured and wasn’t really a pass threat. Gattis seems like the kind of innovator, who now works for a guy who is seemingly very open minded, that could actually pull something like this off.
I remember reading here that plays with both Devin and Denard in averaged 8 yards a pop. I’d take that.
This doesn't mean anything negative about Shea. It can only mean that McCaffrey has taken that next step.
Exactly . I've stated that both can win 10 games for us. But I like DMAC more. He has the it factor for me. I don't see that in Shea.
And you base McCaffery having the “it” factor, and Shea not having it, off of what?
Not necessarily a criticism, but I’d really like to know. We saw McCaffery pretty sparingly last season. What we did see was good, granted. But a small sample size.
Peach saw his boy next door looks and dreams of holding Dmac in his arms late at night.
I didn't see anything special out of Patterson last year. Whether Dmac has 'it' I don't know but I definitely don't think Patterson has a firm lock on the position.
Maybe Patterson is the best QB on the roster but lets not act like he is untouchable.
Would be a very long response. I don't like to do long posts. I'll ask a question. And if would like to respond and have dialogue.... 1. Who in your opinion is the better athlete ?
Antonio Bass. Does he have any eligibility left?
Booo to this plan. If he comes in it will be a set play that everyone knows ala peppers. If there are two QBs at one time, and Shea knows he is the guy that could be dangerous
I don’t know, man. Harbaugh knows better than I do, but usually the old adage is true: if you have two QBs, you have no QB.
Mop-up duty, I get. Or if you want to have one of them lined up as a receiver for some gimmick play, whatever. But sharing meaningful snaps is usually not a great idea. Personally I don’t care who starts between the two of them. But you should have one starter, and stick behind that guy.
Good, they finally plan on being up 35 at the end of the 3rd quarter so Dylan can play the 4th quarter every game
So there's finally a high level returning QB and seemingly an offense that's actually going to try to score points and they've decided this is the year to experiment with something that almost never works?
It may not have worked in a traditional drop-back style offense, but it might work differently in a RPO system where the OC wants to use both to be a run/pass threat. Again, purely speculative, but if it works this season, Gattis would likely have it available next season with DMac and Milton next year, and then (possibly) onward.
Bryant/Lawrence
Hurts/Tua
Seems to be working a bunch lately, especially to be in the championship game.
The Bryant that transferred mid-season? You're proving my point.
And just to add the Clemson QB situation since I heard Pat Fitzgerald's interview yesterday - Hunter Johnson - former 5* QB that transferred from Clemson last year to NW. Pat asked him why he was transferring and he said "he didn't want to transfer but that he probably needed to" - in reference to how good Lawrence is. Pat said he called Dabo and Dabo said that "Hunter is a great QB and that he didn't want him to transfer either but said that Lawrence is a once in a generation QB".
You would mind if Dmac was a Lawrence/ Tua level talent and forced Shea to transfer?
If he's that type of talent he should just be the starter and Shea should go ahead and transfer.
Please no.
Shea will play 90%+ of meaningful snaps. This is Harbaugh motivating Shea. Nothing more.
Shea will never play a meaningful down in the NFL. Dylan will be a good starter in the NFL. Gattis knows Dylan fits his system better and this is the most politically correct (in terms of football team dynamics) way for them to auto-bench Shea for half of the game. Bravo! We are better with Dylan in the game.
Based on what? McCaffrey saw virtually no significant action last year. Only 15 passing attempts all year, and nothing special to see.
Interesting that reports made it seem there was a gap between peters at 2 and mccaffrey at 3 coming out of camp last year and an injury set peters to basically fourth. I know part of it was preparing for his transfer but still. He had the best all around arm on the roster. Before the injury was just as good a runner as Dylan. Now Dylan and Shea are kind of 1a and 1b as harbaugh says. Here’s to hoping it works and he was right to let peters go by not playing him.
I'm sorry, are you saying that Peters had the best all-around arm on the roster and was just as good a runner as Dylan? That's what your wording sounds like, and I don't want to come back too strong if I have read you incorrectly. But neither of those things are remotely true.
lol did you even watch last season? In just a few snaps McCaffrey looked infinitely more promising than anything weve seen from Peters.
HOW WAS PETERS EVER A BETTER RUNNER THAN MCCAFFREY?!?!? Peters literally has negative rushing yards.
Peters rushing stats: 1/-1, 3/-23, 1/6, 7/-7, 5/-11. Overall 17 attempts for -36 yards rushing
McCaffrey rushing stats: 3/10, 2/8, 2/23, 1/44, 2/14. Overall 10 attempts for 99 yards
If you honestly think Peters was going to become a good QB then your player evaluation is atrocious
Hold This L... You just whiffed big-time, on both.
1). Milton has the best arm on roster.
2) mccaffrey, BY FAR, is a better runner than Peters ..so much so that I think he could wr for us. McCaffrey is an ELITE runner. ELITE.
This is a hit piece on Shea with some vague quotes from Harbaugh that don't make anything like the point people want them to make*. Perhaps McCaffery gets some snaps, or some goal-line packages (Shea can run, but DCaff is fast and if Shea is your primary passer you might prefer to have McCaffery be the one taking hits in a run package on the goal line), or he gets a drive every once in a while the way Tua and Jalen rotated at Bama or something.
But people are reading way too much into this, especially the author of the linked article.
*There have been many different 2-QB rotations attempted in college football with enough different permutations that there's nothing Michigan can really do that's "new" except line both up in the backfield at the same time, which would be stupid with the existing skillsets. Michigan fans should really be at the forefront of this understanding, since 2-QB arrangements have featured prominently in our semi-recent history.
In 1997 Steve Spurrier alternated Doug Johnson and Jesse Palmer not just by drive but by individual plays and used the rotation to beat Florida State, clearing the way for Michigan to be ranked #1 on the same afternoon Charles Woodson beat Ohio State. Two years later Lloyd Carr gave his blue-chip prospect quarterback the ball in each second quarter for the first half of the season to compete with a journeyman RS senior named Tom Brady.
Elsewhere, Urban Meyer's Florida team rotated Chris Leak and Tim Tebow based on game situation packages and won a national title, and of course many have referenced Clemson and Alabama both utilizing two QBs at points last season. The only 2-QB arrangement that hasn't really been tried much is the concept of lining 2 QBs in the backfield regularly, which is only something that could theoretically be effective if both were playmaking threats with their legs, either by running or catching the ball.
I think this is just an attempt to prevent any chance of Dylan transferring after he probably doesn’t win the job out of camp. Is he going to play? Of course. Are they going to split snaps 50/50 and rotate who starts games? Probably not.
I was surprised to see the word "Heisman" tossed around with Shea Patterson's name. He is a good QB, but has reached his ceiling for the most part. He is not a game changer, transcending college football Heisman type QB. He just is not. We need to call him like he is: A good to possibly very-good college QB.
McCaffrey must have a ton of upside if Harbaugh wants him in there over Shea. Lets hope that collarbone is healed.
The Heisman often goes to the QB on the best team. If Michigan is considered on of the top teams with a pretty good Sr. QB, I am not surprised to see on the pre-season lists. With the new offense, maybe he shines a lot more than he did last year. And I thought he was pretty good last year. And unfortunately, there have been many Heisman QB winners that have not been game changing, transcending players. Just off the top of my head: Gino Torretta, Eric Crouch, Jason White, Sam Bradford, Troy Smith. I'm sure there are others too.
All of those players, with the exception of Gino transcended the game their Heisman winning season and were impact players. In Gino's case, the team did well and no one really stood out that year to beat him for the award other than Marshall Faulk, who was penalized for playing for a smaller school.
Shea is above average.
Our definitions of "transcended" are much different.
Shea is better than above average. What are there...132 starting D1 QB's? Where does Shea rank on your list and how does that compare to "above average".
Again, a pretty good QB on a team predicted to win the B1G and be a playoff team is not at all a reason to be surprised to have said QB on the pre-season Heisman list.
Don't pass judgement on Shea as he isn't playing in Peps O, now. By midseason we will know if your take is accurate.
Well Shea isn’t that good so anything to get McCaffery on the field more the better.
This just may be well McCaffery is more talented, but Shea is the senior and Harbaugh is loyal to that but also needs to win.
I dunno.
I personally think Dylan is the real deal...seemed to pop off the screen every time he was in there.
Didn’t Patterson, in his one year of learning the offense and starting at QB, have stats that were better than any season Henne played?
I mean I understand the love for DMac cause he’s a great talent, but I don’t understand those saying Shea hasn’t looked good.
The kid is finally playing in an offense suited for him this year.
You guys saying Shea isn’t that good are in for a surprise. Last year was totally a square peg trying to be jammed into a round hole. He had his moments, but Pep did not use him effectively. I can 100% guarantee that will not be the case this year. Is he going to with the Heisman? Who knows. I doubt he will, but I wouldn’t be surprised to see him in the conversation and maybe be a finalist.
I agree that DMac’s ceiling is higher, which is why this season is so important for him and why he’s going to get a lot of run along side Shea. You’ve got two elite QB’s, why not use them both? Like coach said, “redefine what it means to be a starter.” But saying, Shea isn’t good (especially before we see what Gattis van do with him) is asinine.
Talk less, Make some plays.
They should post that on a sign in the locker room...
It will be interesting to see how this unfolds in summer camp. If Dylan outplays Shea, I think Dylan will get a lot of playing time. I think Shea will be the starter but I like the idea that Dylan needs to play more in case Shea gets injured, It is nice having two QBs capable of starting, so the offense will not miss a beat this season if the starter is injured.
I don't like this idea. I already HATE Harbaughs "Running back committee". This isn't what fans meant when we cried for Harbaugh to modernize his offense
I feel like players thrive off momentum and when you pull a RB or QB you kill their momentum. Id also prefer for the job to be JUST Shea's (Or Dcafs). Let him know his job is secure so he doesn't do anything stupid on the field trying to show that he is surefire best QB on the team
RB by committee is pretty much the way it’s done now unless you’ve got a really talent and durable RB — which we’re not sure what we have yet. Higdon was the bell cow ... so what’s your beef?
Hate all you want but no RB wants to be ground to dust in college — they need a spell and a change of pace RB is essential.
"I don't like this idea. I already HATE Harbaughs "Running back committee".
Yeah, it really sucked back in 1980 when Bo alternated between Butch Woolfolk (196 carries), Stan Edwards (192 carries), and Lawrence Ricks (167 carries). Terrible results all season, amirite?
They’ve lostvto South Carolina that year because of it.
This is beneficial on many fronts...
1. It means that McCaffrey is ready to play now.
2. It'll make a smooth transition after this season, and will help if Patterson gets hurt.
3. It'll help with top QB recruits who want to see field earlier.
4. It'll keep Patterson fresher, but this benefit is debatable.
Just what we need, something that never works.
Ed Warriner probably came up with this gem.
I think it’s great. You can’t keep McCaffery on the bench any longer he has clear talent and I don’t think is far off from Shea, which isn’t a slight to him.
If we beat OSU and win the conference, it will be hailed as a genius move. If we don't, people will blame Harbaugh for a hairbrained idea that killed our chances.