Only one of them seems happy about it.
Gallon (21), Avery (11), Funchess (87) get Legends Jerseys
I think that has more to do with it than anything.
Might be a bit of "mean mugging" for the camera going on there.
This is going to get confusing
I hate this all the more, the more this goes on. I never liked it from the beginning. Just a long series of endless press releases, and confusion in the minds of fans. Isn't this really the end of Michigan football players creating any new jersey-number legends?
maybe #10 was going to be the next legendary number at Michigan. Yeah, I have to say, this cannot continue to go on. It was interesting for one year but know, I mean, is Kovac the now the #11 legend? You see the problem? This is really not going to work out.
What I think they should do is make the patches permanent fixtures on their given number. For example, #21 will forever have Howard's name on it as a way to honor him but keep the number in circulation. After that, just do the numbers as they've always been done. If a freshman (or any other) reserve wants to wear #21 and no one else has it, that's fine with me. Just don't ask guys to switch numbers or make such a big deal of these things.
We have a winner.
I agree. I would really like someone to ask Hoke in a press conference about these points, and if they have given any thought to the fact that it adds an element of individualism to the game (seems to go against The Team The Team The Team).
Also I'm curious if this was actually Hoke's idea or if it was completely David Brandon. Smells a lot more Brandon to me.
I think this was 105% Brandon. I don't think Hoke had anything whatsoever to do with it. I know for a fact that Brandon was working on a plan before Hoke ever interviewed for the Michigan job.
I don't really like the legends program because of all the mid-career number switches, but I don't think they're going to force anyone to take a legends jersey. In fact, I think they're consciously avoiding giving a legends jersey to anyone who could create one of their own.
Kovacs, Gallon, and Avery are great players, but certainly aren't deserving of their own legends jersey, and Funchess would deserve his own only if he develops into the greatest TE in school history. Meanwhile, Denard set all kinds of records and was a great leader, and he never switched to a legends number. I think the legends jerseys are mostly a way to honor team leaders who wouldn't otherwise get as much attention.
Really? It seems in most WR/DB recruiting pictures, guys are wearing the #1 or #2 an awful lot. And for the guys who are more interested in creating their own legacy, who is to say that they won't be allowed to do that?
I'll bet it will have the same effect as whether we wear uniformzzzz, which is to say none.
Im fairly certain if a recruit or player said coach I don't want to wear 21 or ehatever legend # he wouldn't have to.
Probably went like this.
'Jeremy, you have been great here at Michigan and we know you are going to have a great year. You deserve the opportunity to wear 21 if you want too.'
That said I still don't really like it. Would like them to keep whatever number they are and maybe still throw on a patch of legend player.
I'm completely in agreement with this. The jerseys should have remained retired, with a Michigan Basketball-style "jersey honoring" program. Instead, we have this.
Plus, the patch remains a completely hideous piece of design work. And, really, the Block M on the back looks like something off of a Meijer rip-off replica jersey.
I will not tolerate you besmirching Meijer's good name. Shame.
Meijer can go to hell. Wy can't they have regular milk tops instead of that flavor saver crap that always rips?
I love the Legends jerseys. I know more about the Wistert brothers and Ron Kramer than I would have otherwise. The families gave Michigan permission to use the numbers, and I can't help but speculating that they realized the previous system didn't nurture any type of embracing of the past.
Confusing? It'll be confusing against CMU when Gallon wears #21, but after that, I think I can handle it. For die-hards like myself, I think I mentally process a number change. All of this railing against the Legends numbers seems like complaining for the sake of complaining. So there's more press releases .... thank frickin' god there's actually press releases about Legends numbers instead of yet another endless debate about whether Shane Morris should play in garbage time.
"Isn't this really the end of Michigan football players creating any new jersey-number legends?"
What?!? Why can't Michigan elect to make #16 a Legends jersey? Are you suggesting that Gallon or Avery were on their way to a Legends jersey? C'mon, now. This point is pure fear-mongering.
Just one man's opinion, but I can't wait to see Gallon making a diving catch on 4th and 1 wearing the #21 ... something like that will make my year. /Rant over
you have guessed that Charles Woodson was going to win the Heisman at the beginning of the 1997 season? How can you say for certain that Gallon was not on his way to a legends season? And don't you think he would liked the opportunity to try? In your enire self-titled "rant" you have left one thing completely ouf of the equation. Do you think that maybe Gallon may have liked the #10? Do you think he may have wanted to stick with the number he picked? Do you thik that maybe he wanted to do something this season that would have stirred the memories of Jeremy Gallon and not "the guy who wore Desmond Howard's jersey?" I mean you have to see the other side to this, right?
First, do you know that the players don't get the option to keep their number? Because my assumption would be that they do. And that the vast majority would be happy to accept this new number, but maybe someone wouldn't, and I'll bet they won't make that public.
Next, Charles Woodson isn't just a legend because he won the Heisman. Maybe you weren't watching Michigan football at the time, but Woodson made an immediate impact as a freshman, was known for making big plays in the most important games, and won virtually every award possible in years leading up to the Heisman season. It's not like 1997 came out of nowhere.
but yes I was watching Michigan football at the time, yes, he was a hell of a player in 95 and 96, and YES, 1997 came completely out of nowhere. If you knew Charles Woodson was going to be that good than that makes one of us, us being the collective Michigan fanbase.
was just a guy who wore Desmond's number when he won the Sugar Bowl MVP? And I am pretty sure NW will always remember that time "the guy who wore Desmond's number" in 2012 who made that crazy, bobbling catch.
Oh and our MIKE LB is a future president, and our SAM is actually a WR. And Kovacs was a offensive lineman.
And Funchess is a tight en.......oh yeah.
but, if Gallon (or any player who wears a Legends jersey) is forced, against their will, to wear a Legends jersey, then I would feel completely different. I left this point out of my post because it's a purely speculative consideration that doesn't jive with any morsel of common sense.
I love Gallon. I think he's underrated by most national pundits, and I like it that way. I seriously think he's going to blow up this year. He may, indeed, be on his way to a legends "season." But to argue he was on his way to earning his own Legends number or patch is not a legitimate argument, IMHO. He'll need a monster year statistically to enter the Top 10 of most Michigan WR career stats. He's not a Top 3 all-time Michigan career WR.
I had to think for a second what # Gallon was anyway. Same with Funchess. I knew Avery was #5, but that's not what I remember him by. It was way worse when I saw Kovacs running around in #11.
Make us proud boys
Does anybody else find this annoying, or even understand how this works? I understand its a great honor, but ... enough. It was a cool way to unretire numbers year one, but every year? Does every legend number, have to be used every year?
Yes, yes, no, no
I agree with budz. This should not happen every year. While I think Gallon deserves it, I'm not too sure about Devin and Courtney. Don't get me wrong, as I believe Courtney and especially Devin are good players, but I don't think they should get legends jerseys. Devin was great last year and I think he will be a force throughout his entire M career, so they should have waited another year or two to give him a legends jersey. Whatever though...just win. They could trot out there with hot pink jerseys with awful helmet stickers so long as they win.
I think Avery is a reward for hard work and leadership, which is captaincy validates.
I think Funchess indicates they think he's going to be really, really outstanding
I'd say the opposite. I'd rather they go to promising young guys as incentive to "live up to the number". Maybe give open numbers as an end of season "rookie/underclassman of the year" award voted by the outgoing seniors. Gallon has already established himself an identity as #10. Changing a senior's number for his last year on campus is just confusing.
One nice thing about having your own number for 4 or 5 years means that no one else in that era (on your side of the ball) wore that jersey. Having a new guy wear 21 every year makes it hard to identify who that player was later on, and also feels like it somewhat downplays the significance. I'd rather new guys get the numbers as freshmen and get to play up to their potential in those jerseys.
In response to you and a few of the other posts above...
Doesn't that logic mean it lessens the individuality bit and strengthens the Team, the Team, the Team aspect?
If we give them to incoming players and hope they play up to it, don't we set ourselves up for the Ty Butterfield effect?
Nothing against Ty, and not really arguing in favor of / against any side here, but it seems that one can spin the issue in a way to support any position.
In the end. It's stupid. I've said it a million times. Take a page out of the Yankees playbook and build a park outside the stadium that people can visit 365 days a year. Have statues, plaques, bronze heads, etc.
Many people don't just visit Ann Arbor cause of the city. They do because of Michigan and many of those are because of Michigan football. Give the fans an attraction that they can get to whenever they're just passing through town. A true memorial park to all of the great players and team.
The thought was there for the jerseys, but it's just silly at this point. Eventually you have to honor the guys who've worn #1 and #77. With the other numbers, it's ridiculous to have guys switching in the middle of their careers for no reason.
Honestly, it's cool for them and all but I'm starting to hate it. I don't mind Funchess, but two seniors switching their numbers is really annoying. How is anyone going to make their own legacy? Guys wear a number for three years and then switch to the same number someone else wore last year.
I'm done ranting over a trivial thing but it's starting to get on my nerves.
I thought it was a cool idea initially, but I didn't know it would be switching like this every year. Won't it lose it's luster after a while? Thank goodness we still have names on the jerseys!
well what about the #1 jersey? people on the board have been complaining about that not getting handed out and recievers not switching to it. these are the same thing, its just there isnt the association with the numbers yet. If 77 was a legend number and given to the best olineman it'd be the same kind of thing.
Well, no one has earned the number one jersey since Braylon. No receiver has sniffed his production at the position, which is why no one has earned it yet.
Yeah Braylon was kind of a man child in college
So are we to consider the #1 jersey an honor above the #21? Maybe nobody has earned #1 but we've had a reciever wear #21 each of the past 3 years with no sign that it's going to stop anytime soon.
The #1 jersey is definitely a bigger honor.
The number one jersey thing has been a big deal for a long time. The legacy 21 jersey, while cool, has only been around for two years.
#21 vs #1 is essentially a battle between Desmond Howard and Anthony Carter correct? I think you could make the argument that Howard has meant more to the program than Carter. Carter may have been more talented but Desmond was not only the first Michigan player in 51 years to win the Heisman but he has been a strong advocate and ambassador for a number of years. I think it speaks volumes that his was the first number to be made into a Legends jersey. The #1 jersey was only elevated to "special" status when Braylon requested it about a decade ago, before that no player had been told they needed to do anything special to get it. All in all I don't think it's clear that #1 should be held above #21.
#1 was special waaaaay before Braylon. He just tied a scholarship to it, IIRC.
I'm going to go ahead and guess you didn't actually read my comment.
#21 was only made into a Legends jersey first because Desmond was upset that despite being our first Heisman winner in 50 years and whatnot, there was nothing being done to recognize what he did for UM football.
Had UM organized some kind of Wall of Fame with the renovations, I don't think we would have seen the Legends Jerseys rolled out
It is speculation; but speculation that I personally join in. There was a race angle as well, that the hyper-senstive U-M administration no doubt felt. All of Michigan's retired jersey numbers were retired for white players, with no retirements for African-Americans.
But it will be freaking ironic if we get to a point where the Number 1 jersey is somehow more coveted than Number 98, won't it?
There is a way for Brandon to scale this back, and some in this thread have already mentioned it. Cut down on the mid-career number-switches. Now that each number (98 to come this year) has gone into the Legends Protection Program, there won't be any more dedication ceremonies, right? The luster of a big day to send a number back on to the field is erased.
To further normalized things, they could reduce the size of the patches in the future. Somebody mentioned that already.
In the end, it is all just a large-scale unretirement of uniform numbers, after two or three or more years of a splashy p.r. rollout. Each player who had a uniform retired gets a fancy pregame dedication with his family/heirs. Oh, and a patch. We honor the players like they haven't been recognized in years (who in Gen-Y knew about the Wisterts or Ron Kramer?), and then we move on with essentially no more numbers retired. Desmond Howard gets treated like all of the greats from the 40's and 50's; none of them have retired numbers. And with those more modest prameters, we can do some more modest Legend deals in the future. Woodson, Leach, Ron Johnson, Deardorf, Bump Elliott, Bob Chappuis, Mandich, etc.
actually Roy Roundtree sniffed around pretty well before the coaching change
I personally think that is the key. Let the players keep their own numbers and turn them into something we always remember. Hard to create new legacies when the guys who are good are switching uniform numbers to old guys' numbers.
Would it be less annoying if gallon and Avery changed their numbers to some random number just because they were tired of what they were before. I didn't find it annoying when Gardner went from 7 to 12.
To assume that a player can't keep their number if they want to is absurd. Or maybe Hemingway, Tree, Gallon all looked at wearing 21 as a reward for the hard work they have put in for 3+ years.
No it's not the end of any new legends #s ... Carter, Terrell, Braylon are all Michigan legends all wore the same number. Every player is going to look at it as an honor but not every player has to take the number if they don't want it.
Number switch was so he could play both wide receiver and qb. Not because he didn't like 7.
That would be dubious, as there's no rule preventing either number at either position in the NCAA. He can wear a single digit number at wide receiver, and at qb, and can wear 12 at either position.
I get that they are trying to start a new tradition honoring the program's history. That's cool. But changing guys numbers in their final year in the program just screws with me. I never got used to Roundtree in 21, and I imagine I will be wildly confused by Gallon in the number.
Not sure who you are going to confuse Gallon for. He sure ain't looking like Roundtree out there.
Not so much confusing him for anyone. It's an immediate reaction of "who the heck is 21?" I had the same problem when JT Floyd became #8.
in someone's career do they decide " I want to make my own legend number!"?
its a great honor for them, makes my life a bit more confusing. at least they are not doing it mid-season like last year.
To shadow what everyone else is saying, this is getting really annoying. I hate seniors changing their numbers.
Funchess is going to have a MONSTER year. and now that hes a legend...shiiiiiet, its ova
Are Legends jerseys forced? I always assumed they were offered to deserving players, and accepted by the player as an honor. I can't imagine Hoke would tell a kid he has no choice but to wear it.
I'm not sure I could imagine a player rejecting the honor, even if they weren't thrilled about it...
Couldn't Gallon just say, "Thanks, that's a great honor, but I've become really attached to #10 and want to make it my own legacy?"
And if he were to go that route, I really can't picture Coach Hoke holding it against him. BH is a reasonable man, I see no reason at all to think he would be anything short of completely understanding and respectful of any player's decision to turn down a legends jersey. In fact, I can picture a little twinkle in BH's eye if Gallon for instance wanted to keep his number... Coach Hoke is already proud of his players, I can't see that changing over something so small.
And to those of you that are frustrated with keeping track of the new numbers... deal with it? Doesn't really seem like a big deal. I'm pretty sure you'll get used to seeing Gallon wearing #21 after a game or two.
I assume it is like off-season conditioning. You don't have to do it, but it is highly recommended that you do.
Yeah, I imagine at least some of the players with new numbers have taken them on begrudgingly. An athlete's number becomes incredibly personal. Some wear the same number for years, and while they may not have the autonomy to pick their number at the start of their college careers, by the time they become seniors I'm sure there's a sense of ownership over their number. Hell, in my adult rec league, some 30+ men make a big deal about getting "their" number everytime the jerseys come in.
Maybe Funchess is perfectly content to ditch #19, but I bet at least a small part of Gallon and Avery wish they could simply be honored without having to change numbers.
Yup, you nailed it! Perfect analogy!!
I guarantee they would park Gallon's backside on the bench if he didn't accept, if not medical hardship him.
That's frustrating. I've always touted my #10 jersey as my Jeremy Gallon jersey. Now that he's finally getting the acclaim that he deserves, though, he switches numbers. I guess I'll just have to go with my Denard Robinson jersey this year.
Also, I was looking forward to Funchess staying with #19 so that he could get his own patch one day. Then, every other tight end strives to get that unusual number for their jersey. 87 is just another tight end number now.
Waiting for "Jerseys Are For Kids" Guy to chime. I hate that guy.
The belly-aching here is so funny.
"Oh woe is me! A football player changed numbers! Now I'm not used to them being that number! My life is so hard, Brady Hoke should be fired!"
Look, this is a way to not only honor past greats, but also reward players who the coches think deserve it.
I'm sure no one is forcing these players to change numbers, they only do so if they want to. If they want to have their own number their entire career, I'm sure they can. Denard played in two years while Hoke implemented this, but he was still 16 the entire time. Even Kovacs who changed numbers will still thought of as 32, no one will say he's 11 now. It's a small thing, stop whining.
Seriously. It might throw me off at first but by the 3rd of 4th offensive series of the season I'm used to it. I have a hard time sympathizing with the people making those complaints.
No one ever said that. Stop trying to act all high and mighty because it doesn't bother you.
Really? No one ever said all that? Because multiple people have complained in this thread about not liking the changes because they're not used to them and how players can't make their own legacy now. The only thing no one ever said was the stuff about Hoke, but that was clearly an over-exaggeration.
I am with you, this is a great honor for these players. I thought Michigan was all about honor an tradition?
implies "over," using them both is redundant. It is like saying the sun was "brightly-bright." You don't need both.
And what he is saying is that just because your opinion is the exception to the rule does not make it insightful and eye-opening. It just makes you in the firm minority on this issue, nothing more.
I love when people start goign after grammar on this blog, because it means they can't go after the content of the post.
When did I ever say that my comment was eye-opening or insightful? I never said that, nor did I intend for it to be. I know I am firmly in the minority, that's what I wanted my comment to put forward, so I guess it succeeded.
And to take this statement;
"No one ever said that. Stop trying to act all high and mighty because it doesn't bother you. "
And turn it into;
"he is saying is that just because your opinion is the exception to the rule does not make it insightful and eye-opening."
Is a pretty damn big, and just plain dumb, leap to make. If he wanted to say what you're implying, he would have. What he meant to say, and did say, was no one ever said that, which was just wrong.
Also, I appreciate the douchey overtone to your post as well. Just because you disagree with me and can act like a dick when responding to my post doesn't make you right, it makes you an asshole.
And I know, get off your lawn.
lolwut? Like 6 guys in this thread alone have complained about this being too confusing and not something they can easily get used to.
The complaints are stockpiling even higher now. Need a napkin for that egg on your face? Watch someone complain so hard the thread gets locked.
Are you really arguing that liking the Legends Jersey Program is acting "all high and mighty," as opposed to the arguments being advanced against the program.
I don't think I'm high and mighty because I will get used to Gallon wearing the #21 after the 1st quarter against CMU ... I just think I'm a die-hard Michigan fan that will get giddy at seeing the #21 making big plays again.
It raises awareness of those players. You go up to the average fan and they most likely won't know who Al Wistert or Bennie Oosterbaan was. Or what numbers were retired and who they each belong to.
I'm just not too crazy about #98 coming out. That number is sacred and should be retired forever. Basketball does pretty much the same thing.
Only one of the five jerseys hanging in Crisler are actually retired. #33 Cazzie Russell. The rest are in circulation. They just never made a big deal about it.
Thank-you for saying what needed to be said. They don't give out the numbers for the benefit of the fans. It's a great honor for the players and draws attention to the great tradition at Michigan.
And for those complaining about players making their own legacy, they could always use the number from before the switch. If Gallon really does do enough to have #10 put into Legends circulation, then they can use that number. BUT, do you then honor Gallon or Tom Brady? I gurantee people wouldn't be screaming "get off my lawn" if Gallon had been awarded the #1.....
I know what I said above, but the was only half serious, half tongue in cheek. I understand this is a great honor, but what if Woodson had switched to 11 before his junior season? He wouldn't have created his own legends jersey, but instead added to an existing one. That's the truly frustrating part for me. I expect that Funchess will be great and now his greatness will be shared with others' greatness rather than celebrating them individually.
Dude, it's Woodson. He created his own legacy and would have in any number ... Kinda like Braylon did wearing #1. The argument you just made is the argument people make FOR a WR getting the #1 jersey.
courtney averys great great great great grandpa a pioneer of sorts for UM, like one of the first black doctors or something?
George Jewett. He was the first black college football player at Michigan.
reading an article and Courtney had no idea about it.
So will there ever be a #1 jersey again?
As soon as someone buys out Braylon's ownership stake. Might not be too long now that it appears his NFL career is over.
I don't like it right now, but I think it's possible that once this becomes normal, it's a cool thing. Always the #11 on the Michigan D is an ass-kicker or deserving team leader. Always the #87 TE and #21 WR is a player and someone that needs to be reckoned with.
In time each will carry not only the legacy of the original legend, but the accomplishments of those that wore the number immediately before. Gallon and Roundtree were friends, he's accountable (in Hoke parlance) to what Roy did in that uniform. Same with Avery and Kovacs. A TE 5 years from now is going to need to live up to Devin's (hopefully) outstanding legacy. In that way they'll carry the past with them as every Michigan player does, but this a more tangible and direct connection.
Or it will just be confusing.
Yeah, I think over time this will seem cooler, and I particularly like the idea of being accountable to the number, but right now, it feels forced.
If you compare it to the #1, that kind of evolved organically from Carter to Alexander to Terrell to Edwards. It was probably a mistake to stop awarding it, or to give Edwards control over it (it's never been clear to me how much control Braylon has, but regardless...)
As an initiative of the AD, this feels like a marketing attempt, but once we've had 5 people or so wear each legends number, fans might come to associate them with the long line of players that have worn them, and they might acquire the same feel as the #1, of a number initiated by a great that then has a bunch of memorable players wearing it, a number that current players strive to wear in the same way Braylon sought out the #1. And having prominent juniors and seniors switching jersey numbers will come to be a tradition of the program.
But for the first few years, it's going to feel awkward.
McMurtry (between Carter and Alexander and smooth as silk). Butterfield (between Alexander and Terrell).
Carter, McMurtry, Butterfield, and Terrell were given #1 from the get-go. Alexander and Edwards "earned" it after one or two years in a different number (at least I think this was the case for Alexander).
It's not like they put a legends jersey on Denard. These guys are true Michigan men who get the honor of wearing an old Michigan legends number.
Avery already changed his number from 9 to 5, Funchal is a sophomore who looks much better in 87 than 19 and gallon worked his ass off for 4 years already. If he wants to wear 21 (probably been idolizing Desmond for quite some time, remember he started on kick returns as RS fr) than let him.
And man Avery looks like such a bad ass in 11 I love it.
There has got to be a better way to reward high achievement.
$ and tattoos?
Still one more change to come...98 for the ND game right? I like this Legends program, but at the same time I hate it. I think my head is gonna explode.
Playing musical chairs with jersey numbers is a stupid idea and, frankly, an insult to the original men who had the honor of having their jersey "retired".
Clearly, an old tradition means nothing at Michigan when a whiz-bang AD can scrap it for a new "tradition".
it's a nice way to keep the numbers in circulation while still honoring the greats who wore it before. i dont think having one of the team captains, the top wide reciever and top tight end wearing the jerseys would be insulting to anybody.
be true if these guys were picking these numbers when they came in. They are picking the numbers they want and then being given these numbers. It was said above, give these numbers to who wants them with a patch commemorating the legend.
He came in and Hemmingway had it. Roy Roundtree (a Senior, who put up huge numbers as a sophomore) took it over last year, now Gallon has had his first chance at it. How do you know he didn't want to be 21 when he got here, but couldn't due to it being in use?
"...having one of the team captains, the top wide reciever and top tight end wearing the jerseys would be insulting to anybody."
We're talking about men who went to their graves believing that Michigan was honoring them by retiring the number from circulation but now that they're dead we ask their grandkids for permission and then put the number back in circulation with a girl scout patch on it. That is insulting.
And is there any other team in all of sports that has engaged in such idiocy? Or is this unique to our AD genius?
I don't like it. It's great to honor them, but it should be shown in the stadium some where. In front of the suites? Desmond is "21" Tripp is "3" gallon should be "10". This is how you remember players, I still talk to my cousins about our favorite players. Going by the numbers, I love woodson#2 but then we name the other players that wore #2 Walter smith, Vincent smith, that we love. Who is going to be old 98?
I'd love to see 98 go to Michigan's top RB.
Unless, of course, Gallon didnt want to be "10"
Let the anti-legend people gather and rant.
Seriously, I'm sure the kids wanted these numbers. Heck I would want the same number as Desmond Howard and or the Wistert brothers! I'm sure there's bigger issues with the football team than players changing numbers like getting ready season.
Billy Ray: What is something that Jordan Kovacs never said.
Trebeck: Correct, Billy Ray! Your next selection.
Billy Ray: I'll stay in that same category and take "Michigan fans complaining for the sake of complaining" for $1000.
Gallon should have gotten the number 1!
people have always worn the same number....
do you remember oh that number 77 was great for us that season oh what was his name. no you remember jake long or taylor lewan or whoever else wore it before them.
Are you going to get confused with chesson and manningham confused because they both are/were #86
Does tom brady, steven threet and jeremy gallon not each have their own legacy in the #10?
each player makes the jersey his own,
Your point is unfounded. My point is these are 20 something year olds and if they want to change the number of their jersey they should be allowed to without a backlash from a fan base. People will remember Gallon by Gallon not by "10 ... Errr ... 21 ... or something like that." How do you know they aren't sticking with a new number they chose?
I'd like to see it, please.
This is dumb. Hate you Brandon.
would have been to incorporate their name and number in the architecture of the new additions facing the field. I've never been in favor of giving somebody a different number simply to honor some player who's long been retired, and it doesn't have anything to do with being confused.
Players should make their own legacy with the number they come in with, or are changed to for logistical team reasons. I don't think that Gallon or Funchess will equal or honor the accomplishments of Howard or Kramer with their play on the field, and that's not a knock on Jeremy or Devin. They need to be recognized in their own right for their own accomplishments, whatever they are.
I suspect this is just another tactic to get UM fans to buy jerseys and other memorabilia.
I know I'm an outsider here but I love the idea of legends jerseys. I feel it's a great way to honor seniors. 10 and 19 looked off for a WR and TE.
I can guarantee you that all three of these players were thrilled to be offered the opportunity to wear these numbers, and certainly would have had the opportunity to turn it down if they didn't want to wear it. Isn't the players opinion the only thing that matters?
I actually like the idea and agree its an honor, I just wish we'd give more to guys like Funchess and Jake Ryan, who can make it their identity over a couple years, and less to guys like Gallon and Kovacs, who, while obviously earning the honor, are already established as something else and will only wear it for a year (or less). What if we'd changed Denard to a Legends jersey for his senior year?
Also, the patch is wordy and ugly.
This is all Braylon Edwards' fault. He dropped the ball with this number 1 jersey "rewarding" garbage. Now the disease is spreading.
Except Carr is the one who told him he needed to earn the number.
Looks like a large group of folks need to some FOOTBAW to start soon! C'mon...it's an honor for the kids.
Let's just fast forward to 4 days from now when this griping is forgotten and these young men have been recognized with a new Michigan honor.
Does anyone think that the players themselves asked to wear the numbers?
I highly doubt anyone made them switch numbers.
I seriously, seriously doubt "confusing the crowd" is high on the list of priorities for these guys. Even if they didn't ask for these, they still accepted the offers. Anyone who thinks they were forced upon specific players is kidding themselves.
Bring back the neg bomb...
Don't like those quotation marks around the word "honored."
Curse you for making me use them here.
Because Hemingway then Roundtree both wore #21 so he couldn't pick it?
So i think my answer is yes but...do these guys wear these numbers all season ?
"I feel it's a great way to honor seniors."
Funchess is in no way a Senior.
What happens if these guys become "legends" in their own right? If Gallon puts up the monster year everyone is predicting of him, shouldn't he be honored at some point? Will they use #21 (a number that should forever be tied to Desmond) or #10 (a number that he won't have worn his senior year)? I think the idea here is fine, but it's a little short-sighted.
I figure at some point there will be a wall of fame listing everyone who wore each number as a "legend". That would be a nice way to honor guys who make their own legacy.
I like it. The people complaining "I hate players changing their number their senior year now I have to buy a new jersey" boo hoo. If they were a senior you'd have to buy one soon anyways. Honoring Michigan legends is more favorable than a man complaining about having to learn a new number. Are half these comments even serious?
depending on what position you really root for, you can buy a legends jersey, and the current star player will always be in it.
No longer is it a crap shoot that you jersey will become irrelevant when the current star player graduates.
Saying "I don't like this because I already had this guy's number memorized" is a bit selfish. Not a great reason not to like this idea. There are others. Namely, it hinders someone from creating their own legacy with a #. And also it would be nice to see a standard reason for these jerseys - I assumed they were upper end type skill but it appears with Avery its leadership (and being a senior who maybe went through a lot of things) and with Funchess, well I don't see any specific reason. We can wax poetic for his future but he was a guy who had a few nice games in non conference and then was swallowed up (not surprisingly) by the physical Big 10 season. Maybe he has shown great leadership this past offseason - but the point is we don't know why it was awarded. Gallon I get on skill at least. So is this a reward for leadership? For skill set? For having a great nickname? For potential at TE? It is confusing as there is no parameters set. Personally I'd rather see the #1 for WR and I'd add #2 for the best DB go forward to honor Charles W.
Did it ever occur to people that either: A) maybe they want to wear these jersey numbers because they want to honor the past; or B) maybe they simply want to be that number? Maybe Funchess just wanted #87 and the legend patch came along with it. People are making way too big of a deal out of this.
I like the Legend jerseys. As long as we aren't forcing players to switch numbers I'm cool with it.
They should just add All Americans who wore a Legands number to the locker in smaller letters under the Legand players name.
Man you guys complain a lot!
Personally, I love this new tradition and love that these numbers (and the histories of the players that made them famous) are being reintroduced to the Michigan fanbase. I am not quite sure why you guys feel the need to complain about EVERYTHING!
/complains about too much complaining by complaining
These jerseys aren't forced on players. They're an honor to wear. Someday down the line we'll fondly remember the best 11s, or 21s to wear the jersey just like
WRs cover the #1 or 2. If a guy wants to keep an original number and pursue his own legend jersey then he has the right to maintain that goal. That's a goal that's very difficult to achieve and wearing legends number is big accomplishment in itself. Or at least it should be (and is becoming)
These guys earned it. Congrats to them, though I will miss 10 Gallon.
I'm going to need to put aside some time to explain this to the blue-hair'd behind me
I have to print out the rosted on Friday (not earlier, in case things change) and refer to it during the game to know who's who.
Seems like popular opinion has swung around on these. I'm glad, I've hated this idea from the start. Don't even want to think about #98 coming out. It's just not right!
The patches themselves are really ugly. Might work on a Domino's pizza box but not the Michigan jersey.
I think it's an honor and great for fans. Go blue! Please bring back the number one jersey soon.
I think they should just give it to a freshman WR next year.
That's exactly what they did with Anthony Carter, Greg McMurtry & David Terrell.
Bo gave it to Carter because he was a prized recruit and a made a point of it to give the #1 to A.C.
This whole earning it thing started when Braylon wasn't doing too well and he asked to switch to #1. Lloyd told him he has to earn it, and the rest is history.
Doug Dutch may have been the greatest spring practice player in Michigan history, if you believed Lloyd's pressers every year. That has to be worth something...
Who'd a thunk this thread would have Doug Dutch sighting?
Not sure Braylon would be in a position to cast stones at Stonum...
Or David Terrell recently.
Dont' forget Tyrone Butterfield!
stop changing all of the best players numbers. Jeremy Gallon is 10 and Funchess is 19.
In 2033, we're going to look back and say "Damn. Every single great WR we've had for the last 20 years all wore #21". Isn't Mario Manningham synonymous with 86? Why screw with that?
Yeah! And Braylon Edwards is 80!!! Right?
Michigan really needs to get back away from the idea that a player's uniform number describes any of his characteristics--e.g., skill, leadership, etc.--other than his position on the field. The uniform number is for identification purposes only. It is not a "reward," it is not a rating system so you can tell who is good and who isn't. At least it wasn't any of those things until one person a decade or so ago in a fit of skilled self-promotion insisted that it was.
But, in the end it is about the players, not us. How do we know that Gallon hasn't wanted that number from day one? Hemingway had it his first three years and Roundtree was given the honor last year. Gallon was #5 in high school and had no previous ties to #10. I won't argue that his lack of smile may come from the fact that he may view the #1 jersey as an even bigger prize. Would we be upset if he was awarded #1 as most seem to be about #21? Doubt it...
The players know who the greats are and strive to achieve as they did. We are not Team 134; they are. And the fact that they seem to embrace the legends numbers being given out as an honor is all that should matter. Congratulations to them.
Is that really true, though? The players don't look at each other's numbers on the field, do they? They know who is who. The fans are 100+ feet away from the action, and they are the ones looking at the numbers.
If Gallon wanted #21 (aside: why wouldn't somebody named Gallon want to be #10?), he should have been given it from day one after the uniform was put into circulation. If an incoming Freshman wants #21 next year, give it to him. Even if he is a punter. It is bothersome that there is an implicit message being put out that only some of our players are "good enough" to wear certain numbers.
Should have also has to wear a cowboy hat vs a helmet. It's an over-sized hat, it's funny.
"We are not Team 134; they are. And the fact that they seem to embrace the legends numbers being given out as an honor is all that should matter. Congratulations to them."
Well said Gary. Hoke has made honoring Michigan's storied history a point of emphasis, and this, IMO, is a great manifestation of that focus. The players seem to love it, and it is their team.
Although I'm not sure I want them all awarded every single year. It's a great concept and I'm glad players can be rewarded for their hard work yet held to the standards and expectations that come with the jersey.
We're in deep shit if Gallon is only held up to Roy Roundtree's standard.
I'm pretty sure another guy's name is on that jersey patch and that is probably the standard Gallon will hold hiimself to, which is the whole point of handing these numbers out.
21 has been worn by Roundtree and Hemmingway now, that's part of the number's legacy.
Someone needs to update 360 rosters and then report back when there is a finished product. Oh, and I want the legends patches on the jerseys as well.
how do you decide how to merit the award of certain jersey numbers by judging the contribution of the current and former wearer? I can see the argument on both sides, and I agree that certain numbers haven't gained legendary status yet only because the players who wore them haven't become eligible for HOF honors, either by the school, conference or nationally.
I mean we know certain Nos. are practically inviolate like 98 while No. 77 is already on its own path to legendary status, and is now only worn by the most deserving players who play a specific position.
No. 2 hasn't achieved that status because the player who is most remembered for wearing it, is still active and not eligible for post-career honors --yet.
No. 1, however, remains less mythical than No. 98 but with a history of its own and a certain standard applied for the player who earns the right to wear it.
In the same way that Anthony Carter made No. 1 special, Denard made No. 16 special. But you could say the same for a lot of guys through the years, No. 4 worn by Jim Harbaugh, No. 10 worn by both Gallon and Brady. Even No. 20 worn by Mike Hart.
There are certain Michigan greats on the Oline who are in the NFL HOF, and their numbers aren't given legendary status at Michigan. I'm thinking of Dan Dierdorf, Reggie McKenzie and others from Bo's teams.
I mean will there come a time when certain alums are remembered as legends not so much for what they did while at Michigan but for what they did afterward in the pros? I'm thinking of Brady and Harbaugh. Does honoring them as Michigan legends impinge on the use of their former number by current players, just because we have a nostalgic recollection about past performers?
I love the legends jerseys idea, hate the implementation. They should be given to incoming players, not given to guys mid career or worst during their last season. At least they did it at the beginning of the season instead of onesie twosie like last year. I guess the silverlining is I can just squint real hard and imagine Jordan Kovacs is still our safety and bask in the warmth and comfort of that thought.
It's worth noting that #2 isn't currently assigned to any player on the roster. If they were going to make #2 a new legends jersey, this would be a good year to do it.
Fearless rumormongering: the Oakland Raiders have a bye October 20, and Michigan has a home game against Indiana on October 19. I'm sure Dave Brandon would love to spice up an otherwise middling matchup by making it Woodson legends day...
So much MGoBitching... Does it really matter what numbers the players wear? Honestly, I couldn't care less as long as they WIN. The primary reason behind this is to teach the Michigan fan base and players about the schools' history and those that came before them; something that was practically forgotten during the Rich Rod era.
It also helps in selling the program to new recruits which is something Hoke is adamant about. We remind these young men about the greats who came before them and did it FIRST, and it's an honor to wear their numbers so they can carry on that legacy.
New legends will be made, sure, but it's okay to remind them of the Giants in Maize 'n Blue who fought before them and made it all possible.
I'm no fan of this for the simple reason that it prevents players from forging their own identity and instead mashes them into someone elses. 10 years from now NOBODY is going to remember who wore the legends patch but every Michigan fan worth a damn can name their favorite #7 QB (mine is Leach), their favorite #1 WR (Carter for me) or their favorite #2 DB (well obviously).
I dont think it's fair to the current players - honor or no honor. And the pressure on a 20 year old kid to accept this "honor", whether they like it or not, must be enormous. They would come off as increadibly selfish if they turned it down.
This all started with JR Hemmingway who was already wearing the number 21 to begin with. I was really hoping Gallon was going to stay 10 this year. I guess that's not the case.
MDen starts selling #10 jerseys and 2-3 weeks later he's wearing #21. ...why don't they think these things through?
Didn't Hoke say the players don't have to accept the numbers? Much easier said than done I'm sure. Especially when Hoke is standing there with the jersey in hand looking you in the eye about to shake your hand.
I loved #19 on Funchess. Now that will never be a legends uni. I hated this from the start. If they're going to do the whole Legends thing, have them wear it for one game or something. It's not fair to the players and it's not fair to me!
"it's not fair to me!"
LOL. What? Explain how it isn't fair to YOU.
It doesn't bother me as much as others are bothered by it. But I do think it clearly hurts the development of future legends numbers. Would like to see them only do this for one game a year where all the specific players wear those jerseys.
For religious types, they say the Apocalypse will come when present tribulations lead to the ending of this age and the coming of God's Kingdom. That the discord inherent within human nature will eventually lead to catastrophic events, and that finally God will show up to save every good person and judge away the bad. Well this little thread here is a pretty clear Sign of the Apocalypse. How so many of you can take something as benign as Michigan’s effort to honor past players in a unique way for their great contributions, and shit all over it, really opens a little window into just how pathetic we are as a species.
Yeah telling a kid that if he kicks ass for Michigan then 20 or 30 years later Michigan will honor him not just with a couple hours of ceremony but with an entire season’s worth of having a young star wear his number really will have a massive negative impact on recruiting….
Yeah egocentrism is king and everyone needs their own identity and number. God forbid two Michigan greats past and present share the honor of the same number, so that when it is dedicated 20 years later they can both be honored…
Football can’t get here soon enough. Even as Michigan has enjoyed probably the highest improvement trajectory in terms of “program building” under Hoke over the last 3 years, still, the negativity on this board has reached epic proportions the last several months with endless snide comments and calls for Brian to return the neg posbang to satiate you little devils.
Man. Take a look in the mirror. Realize most of the people you are negging, be they players, coaches, A.D.s, or fellow fans on this site – ARE YOUR BROTHERS. They love the same things you love and are happy to see the same things you are happy to see. AND THAT INCLUDES LEGENDS JERSEYS!
Go Blue and live and let live you cretins!
I'd keep the program, since it is a great way to honor the past, but I'd tweak it so that the number switch is for one game only. Give each number its own home game, do the same production you do now during the game, and then next week the player gets his number back.
I really like this idea! then there would be a limit to the #'s...6-7-8, depending on how many home games there are!
Bleh. I don't mind so much, but there should be a lot fewer numbers as part of this program. It should be the three Heisman trophy winners, the #1, and the former President of the United States. And that's it. If you add in record breakers and Heisman finalists, then you come to guys like Mike Hart, Denard Robinson, and Jim Harbaugh. There are only 99 numbers to begin with. And what about a guy who has won Super Bowls like Tom Brady? Not every one can be special, and the essence of college football is that every generation of players makes a new set of stories with their numbers. Almost every team has a legend of some sort.
Gallon was not going to make #10 a Legend's Jersey....ever heard of Tom Brady, Avery is not going to make the #5 a Legend's Jersey! The only # that I'm a little sad about is the Funchise! I don't know of any other 19's in history that are at his level.....but its alright!
As to the Legend's program, I think its a creative way to honor great athletes! The standard at Michigan is so high, we gotta remember that even Kovacs was the baseline of expectation for Michigan defensive players! Mandich, Dierdorf, Wheatley, Brady, Mike Hart, Cannavino ... guys who are legendary, havn't been classified as Legends......
A legend is one who transcends the program, the only guy in this era to fit that model is Denard, maybe.
Other possible Legends
- Carter (1) - obvs [give them a few years to help us all forget Braylon]
- Woodson (2) - obvs
- Mandich (88)
- Leach (7)
- Diedorf (72)
but not a legend (IMHO).
Why should we forget Braylon again?
1.) I doubt they were forced into changing numbers.
2.) To be able to be mentioned in the same sentence with these players that are honord is a legacy in its own.
3.) If a player had great year why cant they combine names on the jersey. Example: The Edwards Carter jersey for #1.
4.) Maybe wearing a legands jersey is just a part of a guys legacy.
19 is my fave #. Now Funch has a boring regular TE #.
Pointless? Tom Brady's number is pointless?
Serious? I like Gallon and all but people aren't going to think of Gallon when they see #10, they're going to think of Brady.
Did anyone throw a fit when we deprived Braylon Edwards and Mario Manningham from making #17 and #86 "legendary"?
Is pretty fuckin legendary.
I am completely fine with this the same as I was last year. Raises awareness of the past players and I think players are excited at the chance to wear them. Hoke has clearly shown a willingness to give it to a wide range of players from seniors who've worked hard (Avery, Moore) to seniors who've produced well on the field (Kovacs, Gallon, Roundtree) to younger players that show great potential (Ryan and Funchess) and Morgan got one who is a solid contributor but not quite the hype of the other guys.
The hand wringing over this is pretty funny at this point. Your number 10 jersey can still be your Gallon jersey. He did wear that number when you bought the damn thing.
Who will get the 98 jersey when it is rolled out at UTL 2?
I am guessing Beyer.
That would be...legendary!
Ok these are lame now. Last year it was okay for some reason (except it wasn't, Kovacs to 11 was, weird) but now it's getting old. Gallon is No. 10 dammit.
Bitch, bitch, bitch is all that goes on here. At least on Saturday you'll have football to bitch about.
You're not just now realizing this?! Heh. It's gotta be a passion thing, right? Football, though, is near and thank the Lord for that; I think we can all agree, we need some football to bitch about.
Of people that don't like it. I don't like the way the patches look and I don't like switching numbers. There has to be a better way to honor these past players.
Put me down for hating how the patches look. The idea is cool and there's nothing bad about it, but the idea of new numbers becoming just as lengendary as the current crop of offically sanctioned legend numbers is one reason we all watch Michigan football. This program doesn't mean that won't happen, but it does seem to make it a little less likely.
I don't like it, I don't understand it, and it's really put a damper on my Tuesday.
"They stank, and I hate em"
If I were these young men I would be honored to be chosen to wear a MICHIGAN legends jersey. Congratulations to all 3 of them!!! I love the fact they honor the former players by honoring the current players.
If I were a current player who had had a good career like Gallon or Kovacs, I wouldn't want a legends number. I know they're trying to play off of the #1 mystique, but it is not the same. It's just not. I didn't get it when it started, and I sure don't get it now. Actually, come to think of it, Gallon should have said, "I'll switch, but only if its #1."
Yeah screw that number worn by the smaller wide receiver who won a Heisman and later a Super Bowl MVP. No way Gallon should think that's cool.
Maybe opponents will also forget that #10 is NOT Jeremy Gallon & #19 is NOT Funchess.