There's Always Next Year: Basketball Comment Count

Brian

See also: hockey.

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a shruggie of a year [Bryan Fuller]

GRADUATING

Despite a lot more playing time than anyone expected, Michigan seems content to allow Max Bielfeldt to graduate and move on. As a 6'7" center it seems unlikely he can feature on a team with major aspirations.

That is all.

And this isn't graduating yet but we'd be remiss if we didn't mention that Austin Hatch may transition to a medical scholarship at some point.

NBA PIRACY AHOY

The looming unresolved question of the offseason is "wither Caris LeVert?" LeVert would be a mid-to-late first round pick if he decided to enter the draft, but chatter from Scout and Rivals holds that LeVert seems to be favoring a return. I don't have to explain how huge that would be. Fingers will be crossed until the deadline.

Other attrition is unlikely. Zak Irvin's late diversification has not piqued the interest of NBA evaluators just yet; Derrick Walton has not shown the kind of meteoric rise necessary for a guy of his stature to leave early.

INCOMING

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technically incoming is the best kind of incoming [Bryan Fuller]

Technically, nobody right now. Michigan has two guys who are functionally incoming, however. D-III transfer Duncan Robinson spent his redshirt year testing Nik Stauskas's practice marksmanship records and gathering hype:

"I texted Nik (telling him the record fell)," Beilein said of Robinson's record on WTKA 1050-AM on Thursday morning, adding that he didn't witness it personally. "(Stauskas) was happy, but he was also sad that the record went down. Duncan can really shoot the ball and as he learns the other parts of the game, he's tough to stop in practice." …

"He can help us against that zone anytime," said Beilein, who kept the record to himself, later saying, "I'm not going to disclose the numbers and maybe it will come out at some time, because I'm not sure I'm supposed to do that."

Robinson should be Just A Shooter, always a handy thing to have around. He could be something more.

Meanwhile, DJ Wilson took a redshirt after a second injury in a few months. Prior to that he'd offered hints that he could be an impact defender and skilled 4/5 man. He'd also struggled immensely in brief spurts of playing time against grown-ass men. (Not Eddie Johnson. Others.) Wilson was a solid four star recruit after an impressive senior season in California and could play either post-type position.

Michigan is also active in the spring recruiting period. Uber-prospect Jaylen Brown just took a visit, and Sam's saying there's a chance; German Moritz Wagner took a visit and seems set to choose Ann Arbor unless his pro team can convince him to change course; late-rising instate post Mike Edwards was just on campus; Seton Hall point guard transfer Jaren Sina, who Michigan recruited a bit a couple years ago, is listing Michigan amongst his options.

Edwards is 6'10" instate player who blew up as a senior, going from a lonely Akron offer to high-major offers from Nebraska and Georgia. Michigan is poking around but has not offered.

Will they? I'd be a bit surprised. Michigan has Donnal and Doyle plus 2016 7-footer Jon Teske; DJ Wilson may play the 5 for them as well. Even if you assume Wilson is a full-time 4, that would be a post per year for four straight. On the other hand, an incessant parade of senior Cs sounds okay by me.

Michigan has at least one slot from Bielfeldt's graduation and may have up to three depending on Hatch and LeVert. It seems like the most likely outcome here is Wagner, and only Wagner, comes.

USELESS BUT MANDATORY MINUTE BREAKDOWNS

After a year in which we fussed about auto-bench and a couple of walk-ons got meaningful playing time in most games, here is a happy about-face: it's difficult to find minutes for everyone if LeVert comes back.

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remember me? [Eric Upchurch]

POINT GUARD: Walton 25, Spike 15.

Hard to imagine Walton getting fewer than 30 a game even with Albrecht establishing himself a very good offensive player in trying circumstances last year, but 1) Walton only got 26 as a freshman when he was fully healthy and 2) all of the remaining minutes went to Spike.

Meanwhile Albrecht ended up playing over 30 this year and maintained a healthy 112 ORTG thanks to lots of assists and excellent shooting. There are going to be games and matchups where he may be the preferred option. When Michigan goes up against Bennie Parker or Lourawls Tum-Tum Nairn Jr, Spike's size deficiency isn't going to be, you know, deficient.

Walton could blow up a la Morris/Burke and relegate Albrecht to more bench time. The above is a best guess at a position that's relatively uncertain despite having two upperclassmen.

SHOOTING GUARD, LEVERT EDITION: LeVert 30, Spike 5, MAAR 5.

There will be some dual-point lineups. Spike's five minutes here are a representation of that. Past that, if LeVert's around he's playing a lot of minutes. Surprise!

MAAR looks like he might be the odd man out in the musical chairs of next year's lineup: his handle won't be needed to spot PG minutes, he didn't shoot anywhere near Dawkins's numbers, and he doesn't bring the rebounding others might. Ace pointed out on a podcast that MAAR showed hints that he might be a lockdown perimeter defender (D'Angelo Russell had a terrible game against him) and that this might be a ticket to playing time. That's probably his best hope for PT next year.

SHOOTING GUARD, NBA PIRACY EDITION: MAAR 20, Spike 10, Robinson 10

In the unhappy event LeVert decides on the draft, dual-point lineups increase, MAAR gets a healthy chunk of playing time, and Duncan Robinson finds more time as a floor-stretching kickout option even if that's the extent of his game.

It'll be disappointing if LeVert does enter after these positive noises, but this hypothetical SG lineup is far from ominous.

SMALL FORWARD: Dawkins 25, Robinson 15

Dawkins's late shooting surge—he shot 48% from 3 in Big Ten play as part of a larger improvement in his game has everyone hype, as does the addition of the alley-oop dunk to his arsenal late in the season. This minutes breakdown is looking at Dawkins as 3 defensively but envisions his role on offense similar to that of GRIII: shoot corner threes, cut to the basket for explosive dunks, drive off closeouts.

Meanwhile, Robinson is a wildcard. It seems like his floor is a knockdown shooter off the bench. Robinson hit 45% from three as a freshman at Williams, and if he's given similar quality shots there's no reason to expect a dropoff. Readiness won't be an issue after a redshirt year, especially since highlight videos of his year in D-III demonstrate he's running Beilein's offense down to the cut.

If Jaylen Brown does come to Michigan—knock on wood—he would suck up 30 minutes here, leaving Dawkins and Robinson in a situation similar to MAAR's.

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HELLO THIS IS ZAK [Fuller]

"POWER" FORWARD: Irvin 30, Chatman 10, Wagner?

Irvin will be the non-post most suited to bang in the paint on defense and rebound so he goes here. Michigan hopes to get the playmaking ability he demonstrated late last year. He could be the alpha dog; that could be LeVert; hopefully we get something like the Trey/Tim/Nik or Nik/Caris/Derrick teams in which the shots are spread out such that focusing on any one player just makes his assist totals go up.

Chatman struggled for most of last year. Like Irvin and Dawkins, he did come on late with a number of skilled drives to the basket and the first flashes of the passing ability he was noted for in high school. It does not seem likely he will push through anyone to field extensive playing time in year two, but if he can start giving consistently quality minutes off the bench that would set the table for a starting job as a junior if Irvin's improvement carries him to the draft.

Wagner's not even on the team yet; if he comes he will compete at the 3 and 4. He is not coming to redshirt but he's super skinny so playing time in year one might be scant.

CENTER: Doyle 24, Wilson 8, Donnal 8

Bigs develop.  Repeat this mantra until you feel good.

Either Mark Donnal takes a quantum leap forward on defense or Ricky Doyle eats up most of the minutes in the post next year, fouls permitting. Doyle has a much larger frame than other options and held his own against the posts of the Big Ten. Since Doyle is also a year younger than Donnal you would expect him to develop more quickly.

Doyle has a terrific ability to finish around the basket and actual post moves. he needs to work on his hands, mostly, and reduce the foul rate that is inherent in project freshman bigs. He hedges pretty well and he gets a lot of offensive rebounds Meanwhile I wonder what the team defensive rebounding rates are with Doyle on the floor versus other options with shinier DREB numbers. Michigan is utilizing a boxout-focused style that often results in a guard skying for the rebound as Doyle butt-shoves his man out of the way.

In any case, I've been a bandwagon member since the start and think he will develop into a very solid option. He shot 61% this year in a finishing environment leagues tougher than that faced by any Michigan post since the Beilein effect kicked in; with more assisted buckets he could scrape Jordan Morgan efficiency levels while providing a bit more size on D.

Donnal, meanwhile, needs to spend the offseason gluing sand to his jaw and making mean faces in the mirror. (Also lifting weights but mostly the first two.) He averaged 6.4 fouls per 40 last year (Doyle and Bielfeldt were around 4), which was indicative of his overall struggles on D. Offensively he was efficient but low-usage.

Wilson could figure in at the 4; the guess here is that Michigan deploys him as a skilled, skinny 5, hoping his promising shot blocking makes up for what figures to be a rebounding deficiency.

WELL?

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FORWARD [Patrick Barron]

A major rebound beckons. This is a team that was a few points away from being 10-8, even 11-7 in the Big Ten despite not having the two guys expected to be stars before the year. If LeVert returns Michigan adds him, Walton, Robinson, Wilson, and possibly a recruit to that team. Meanwhile subtract only Bielfeldt.

Michigan also gets a year older all around. This should see them rise to approximately average in Kenpom's "experience" metric. Michigan has been hovering in Kentucky territory for a while now. It is a Beilein miracle that they've had the results they have despite that.

It'll be nice to have some guys who are a bit older. Michigan started Getting It on offense late last year as the posts realized when they should roll to the basket and the wings figured out their cuts. It wasn't just Zak Irvin knowing he should pass that helped his assist numbers go up; there were also options for him to pass to.

The LeVert version of this team can be really good, especially if Irvin is going to continue to progress and Walton regains the explosion he lost as a sophomore. They would be a Big Ten contender—and depending on what happens with the rest of the league possibly the favorite—and an easy Sweet 16 seed.

The No LeVert version of this team could still hit that ceiling but it seems more reasonable to project them as a second-tier Big Ten team that gets a seed from 5 to 9.

Comments

MichiganMAN47

March 25th, 2015 at 12:41 PM ^

Even if Robinson is just a shooter, he must be a damn good one to beat Nik Stauskas's record. When you have shooters like Dawkins, Irvin, LeVert, Albrecht and Robinson you can really stretch out a defense. A couple guys can have an off day, and we will still have talented shooters off the bench.

People are forgetting that D- III is tougher than HS, and that Robinson had mid major offers to play D-I. He was a proven commodity in D-III, so I'd expect him to at least be a solid contributor here.

umumum

March 25th, 2015 at 12:58 PM ^

Look, he will likely help us.  He may even end up being very good.  But 1st round is just hyperbole.  He can shoot--maybe even like Nik, but every indication is that he is not the athlete Nik is.  And its Nik's limitations athletically that have thusfar limited his game at the NBA level.  Less athletic ain't going to put you in round 1.

ijohnb

March 25th, 2015 at 1:25 PM ^

is still out, 100%.  He played a good game against Ohio State.  He really didn't show against Illinois.  He had a couple of nice dishes against Wisconsin.  He did seem to become more comfortable within the offense at the end of the year and showed flashes defensive.  But when he was "off," man he was really off.  He will develop, but it is hard to tell if he will develop to like a starting level impact player or a spot bench player who can give you solid minutes.  He really needs to start knocking down outside shots or Beilein will always favor other players over him.

UMfan21

March 25th, 2015 at 10:44 PM ^

I predicted last year when Stauskas left that his departure would be hardest to replace. the way he stretched defenses was unreal. The I juries obviously made things MUCH worse. If Robinson can be even just a shooter, it opens up this offense so much. It also gives one guy who can be the microwave e when the rest of the team is in a funk. we didn't have that this year. my prediction: share of the conference title and Elite 8

carlos spicywiener

March 25th, 2015 at 12:27 PM ^

Again - this year's team was supposed to have Mcgary, LeVert and Walton, but featured none of those by december. If Levert surprises and comes back, we'll finally have a season with no NBA attrition, decent-to-elite options at every position, and no players without starting experience (Robinson has played in this offense before).

We should pick up right where we left off from the 2014 Elite Eight.

jmblue

March 25th, 2015 at 3:06 PM ^

Guys generally say they'll come back when the season is still on.  Then it ends and they re-think things.  McGary was turning 22 in the summer and was still projected as a 1st-rounder, so I don't think it was happening.  

For me, the big regret about him is not about this year, but last year.  Imagine if he had undergone surgery at the beginning of last year, instead of trying to gut it out in December.  This was something he and the staff discussed at the time.  In the end, of course, he had surgery around New Year's and still nearly made it back to the court.  With surgery in November, he'd have definitely been able to return.  Add Mitch to last year's team and that quite possibly is a national champion.

 

matty blue

March 25th, 2015 at 12:30 PM ^

with or without levert, this team will be a wrecking crew a year from now.

a few years ago edsbs described lsu football as a gorilla with a chainsaw for a penis.  that's both funny as hell and possibly applies to um men's hoops, 2015-16

93Grad

March 25th, 2015 at 1:39 PM ^

I could see him getting more minutes than Chatman, because we already know a lot about Kam.  Chatman has miles to go before he is a legit contributor on a good team.  With Duncan, we just don't know.  He could blow by Chatman in the rotation or get buried on the bench.  Only time will tell.

turd ferguson

March 25th, 2015 at 12:40 PM ^

I wonder if Bielfeldt would be welcomed back if he pays his own way.  If that's a scholarship crunch issue and Max wants to return, then it doesn't seem out of the question.  Partly that's because Bielfeldt's family is extremely wealthy -- as in there's a Bielfeldt Athletics Administration Building at the University of Illinois.

pendingperil

March 25th, 2015 at 12:43 PM ^

After all the Donnal hype that came from practice last summer, I'm going to keep my expectations for Robinson low until we see him play.  The rest of the team is looking very promising.  Hope we get either Brown or Wagner to fill that last spot.

ypsituckyboy

March 25th, 2015 at 1:19 PM ^

Doubt it. Nike kid. Hope he has fun at Oregon along with fellow Canadian alum Dillon Brooks (who may be more obnoxious than Denzel Valentine and Bryn Forbes, which is saying something).

Also, as a former conductor of the Mark Donnal hype train, I apologize.

champswest

March 25th, 2015 at 12:53 PM ^

every since the season ended.  At this point, there are just too many variables.  Will LeVert return?  Will we get Brown?  Will we get 1 or 2 freshmen (and who will they be)?  The answers to those questions really change the rotation possibilities.  We should know a lot more in a couple of weeks.

I wonder if LeVert's return and Browns decision have any connection, like would Caris come back if Brown commits because the team would be awsome.  Or, would Brown more likely commit if LeVert leaves.  I am thinking that they don't relate, but I wonder.

JeepinBen

March 25th, 2015 at 12:52 PM ^

There's definite hope in football (HARBAUGH) and also here (Depth? Upperclassmen?).

Also, quality Futurama reference and that picture of Walton is just outstanding. Is that the face he often makes playing basketball??

BJNavarre

March 25th, 2015 at 1:02 PM ^

My guess is:

PG - Walton/Spike

SG - LeVert/Spike/Dawkins/MAAR

SF - Irvin/Dawkins/Robinson/MAAR

PF - Robinson/Irvin/Dawkins/Wagner or Brown/Chatman/Wilson

C - Wagner or Brown/Doyle/Wilson/Donnal

 

Robinson is a big kid. PF is going to be his primary position. Beilein almost always plays guys Wagner size at center.

As Brian says, guessing next years lineup is a total crapshoot, and with this much depth, a lot will depend on matchups. We're really going to have the ability to go big or small, especially if we land Wagner .

Edit - And I suck for not looking up that Brown is 6'7", not 6'10" like I thought. So my depth chart really only applies if Michigan lands Wagner.

ijohnb

March 25th, 2015 at 1:28 PM ^

that, pending Wilson's expected devlopment, Donnal will have trouble seeing the floor.  Chatman also needs to pick it up or he may not see the floor a whole lot next year.  Good god if Caris comes back AND we get Brown, there could be players who were featured this year that may not play that much.

alum96

March 26th, 2015 at 5:58 PM ^

Agree.  Either Wilson OR Donnal are going to get primary backup minutes in games there is not foul trouble.  In those games you bring in the "loser of the competition" between those 2.

I also have Dawkins more as the 4 rather than Irvin.  He is less bulky but an inch taller and with more hops.  Just like GR3 - who was playing 4.  On offense it doesnt matter, 2 3 and 4 in UM system is more of a defensive thing.

And then I think a guy like MAAR v Robinson (if Caris comes back) is another battle although Robinson has more position flexibility due to height.  In theory he could be 2 thru 4 but we were told Chatman could be 2 to 4 as well.

I expect Caris and Irvin to get 35 minutes a night (more some nights).  Beilein rides those horses hard - he doesnt do 30 minutes for his star players.   Doyle gets his 25, Walton gets 27, Spike gets 20ish.  Dawkins get 25ish.

If Caris returns those are the main players and everyone else is fighting for scraps for the 7 thru 9th spot in the rotation - Chatman, MAAR, Robinson [2 of these 3 will play], Donnal, Wilson [1 of these 2 will play].  2 of those guys wont be playing much on a night to night basis unless foul trouble.  These are first world problems to have - competition is good.  And automatic benching won't be an issue in this scenario.

Truthfully I am pretty comfortable in both scenarios (Caris goes or leaves) as I have a higher opinion of MAAR than Brian at this point.  I could be wrong.  I love his defense, and I love his ability to drive the lane.  He needs to get stronger and will.  Will help finishing at the hole.  His wildcard is outside shooting - if he adds that to his game he will really be a dynamic player IMO.  If not, he will be a nice slasher type and a very different player than is typical for UM who is more of  go to the hole player with  limited outside game.

poppinfresh

March 25th, 2015 at 1:12 PM ^

what caris said or didn't say to brown as he was the host on his visit.

 
caris stays, brown and/or wagner come (wagner following brown on twitter--could decisions be interlinked, brown commits and putting um that much better a situation for wagner) this team is 2 deep and basically booked for a final four.

one concern i have is saying doyle gets hurt (injuries happen) you miss wagner and brown, you really hope max doesn't transfer out. and who would blame him as he basically an after thought.

just hope we don't aim for the clouds (brown and or wagner) and in reality lose caris, brown, wagner and max and bring in edwards.  That worse case scenario is probably an 8-10 seed next year

Blueverine

March 25th, 2015 at 1:18 PM ^

were just so much fluff and he'd never get close to that with B10 hands in his face and arms in his back. Wrong there. Thinking the same about Robinson, so I hope I'm wrong again.

Much more skeptical about Wilson's contribution next year. Saw a few flashes of his length, but man, is he a rail. Got pushed around quite a bit, so would like to see 15 more lbs. on him to hang with the conference heavyweights.

Overall, either Caris scenario will show a great improvement over this year and this time next year I will still be "into" the tournament instead of just watching it.

alum96

March 26th, 2015 at 6:06 PM ^

Agree on Wilson.  He looked overwhelmed against not that good non conf competition.  Maybe he was just lost - he looked like he didnt know where to go a lot.  I am not going to judge him as harshly as Chatman thought because I am sure MAAR and Dawkins were likewise lost early - they were just not on the court as much.  In fact they mostly were benched the same time Wilson was playing.  And they looked like completely different players by February - so who knows if Wilson would have.

So I'd  like to see him with time on the court and with more strength. 

WMU81

March 25th, 2015 at 1:25 PM ^

Donnal looks like he hasnt hit the weight room since his arrival... He also looks lost when hes on the court which is odd since he had a RS year under his belt.

alum96

March 26th, 2015 at 6:02 PM ^

Dawkins was our 2nd best player at times in March - no way he redshirts.  MAAR is already 20? 21?  Guy is not going to the NBA - he wants to get thru college, enjoy ilfe, and begin life - he is not going to want to be mid 20s by the time he graduates.

Chatman honestly probably should have redshirted last year.  Not sure if you can do it next year - for all we know he might just say I'd rather spend the year and transfer to where I can get playing time and be closer to home.  Oregon is a long ways away.