MBB: Michigan #16 in way-too early top 25
http://www.sbnation.com/college-basketball/2015/4/6/8356739/2015-2016-c…
Other B1G teams..
#5 Maryland
#9 Indiana
#11 Michigan State
#20 Wisconsin
#21 Purdue
Get to work, Camp Sanderson. A lot to prove next year.
Thanks.
It's not the same team that missed the NIT. It's that team with another year of experience, plus Walton, possibly LeVert, Wilson, Robinson, and Wagner and minus only Bielfeldt.
This team, playing walk ons, took two Final Four teams to OT before running out of gas since their top two players are out. For God sake Albrecht needs hip surgerie(s) and he played in all but one game this season!
but it is still too high. There were plenty of moral victories after the injuries and certainly a certain display of cohesion and maturation from the players that remained, but the fact remained that at full strength the team that started the season lost to the Fighting NJITers and Eastern and got pumped pretty good by Arizona and Staee at home. I think people will be very quick to put Michigan in the Top 25 if they look sharp in the first week or two of the season but I don't think they will start the season ranked.
I think we watched the team a lot closer than the polsters did. I don't think there is going to be much thought to that one that got away at Northwestern or a loss to Wisconsin in the BTT tourney that ended up being a 10 point regulation loss. They are going to see 16-16 last year and not much more than that. If Caris comes back or Brown committs I could see a 20-25 ranking, but it would tenuous.
This was one of the youngest teams in the country. It's not surprising that it struggled in December. Incidentally, we weren't at full strength against NJIT/EMU either - Walton and Spike were both gimpy with the turf toe and hip, respectively.
we officially sound exactly like MSU fans. You can't retroactively claim injury, especially in losses to those two teams.
Nothing "retroactive" about it. We were aware at the time that they were gimpy. Walton was injured in the Villanova game.
Now, we still could/should have won those games. But it's inaccurate to say we were at "full strength" and given that we were something like the 330th most experienced team in the country, it's silly to act like guys like Dawkins and MAAR were the same players in December that they were in March.
about what I think, as a person that watched every single minute of every single Michigan game and saw the growth and improvement. I am talking about the polsters, both AP and coaches outside of the Big Ten. Michigan was not on their radar this year man. If we return essentially the same roster plus Wagner and Robinson, people are not going to be drooling over us nationally. It is not as though Aubrey Dawkins and MAAR are household names right now. To go from unranked, missing the NCAA and NIT with a 16-16 record and we are expecting a Top 25 ranking. It would be like the first time in history under these such circumstances.
You said Michigan is ranked too high in this poll. That's exactly what you think.
saying that this poll does not correctly predict where Michigan will be ranked. You have no idea what I think.
are going to make a leap, yes, but not before the season begins. You say that every season is college basketball is a fresh new creature and that differentiates from football but then you base your conclusion on who we have returning. Yes, media types know that Aubrey Dawkins showed flashes this year as did MAAR, they know that returning Walton and possibly Levert will get this team into NCAA tournament territory. But you are kind of thinking if you should be if we won 5 of our last 7, made the tourney and one a first round game. Yeah, then a ranking would be in order the next year with the same roster returning. That is not our situation.
I think Michigan is going to be very good next year but I also think that people are going to want to see it to believe it. I'm sorry, I loved our teams fortitude but a win over Rutgers, a 10 seed Ohio State team at home and Illinois on nuetral do not a Top 25 team make.
If Levert returns or Brown commits, I think you'll be wrong about the media. If neither are on the roster next season, you'll be right. It's really too early to say, or argue about, but that's what's fun about this internet thing.
I'm guessing Duke probably wasn't too far behind UM in terms of youth. They started 3 true freshmen and a true sophomore. One of the first subs off the bench for the wings was a true freshmen.
Having one-and-done superstars helps. Also, at the begining of the season they had Rasheed Sulaimon to shore up the backcourt.
So does have three 2nd/3rd year players who are "conference level stars" in Walton, LeVert, and Irvin.
Those 2 losses were inexcusable IMO. Even if you put 2 IM guys on the floor with the big 3.
Beilein's teams get better as the season goes by and next year I do not expect a slow start because for the first time in what... 4 seasons, we'll be returning most/all of the starting lineup. But it was inexcusable.
Hate to keep harping on Chatman but his peer group of similar ranked players were Melo, Russell, and Blackmon in the conference. If he averaged 14 to 17 ppg like those guys or hell 10 ppg and looked like a functional Big 10 player those 2 losses would not have happened nor would a lot of others. It was not a year for your highest ranked guy to be a total dud.
Assuming Michigan will be good just because a collection of kids who have played well individually return is a far more tenuous argument than assuming they will be good because they have proven it.
I believe UM will turn it on, but be honest, none of next years have proven the ability to lead a team akin to Trey or Nik. This collection of players, including the improved Dawkins, have barely played on the same court together.
I feel far more comfortable with MSU / Wisconsin at this ranking even considering the players the lose because of the winning culture they have established over many, many years. These programs have proven the ability to insert depth players into larger roles and succeed. Think about UM football under Carr. UM will establish that soon, but it hasn't happened yet - early season Zak, Caris and Walton losing to NJIT/EMU, getting dominated by Arizona/OSU demonstartes that - and until then other programs get way more benefit of the doubt in my mind.
I think the ranking is spot on. Michigan was excruciatingly close in a lot of games this year. A year of experience for everyone is going to turn those close losses into wins. Also, they won't be out-muscled by Wiscy or Sparty next season.
I wouldn't be surprised if Michigan made the second week of the Tournament next year. I would be more surprised if they didn't.
This team is a solid top 20 team if Caris stays and everyone is healthy. Doyle is Doyle and Dawkins and RAAK came on strong at the end. I'm hoping Robinson is at least a shooting assassin.
Michigan can win Battle 4 Atlantis. The tournament field is Michigan, UConn, Syracuse, Texas Texas A&M, Gonzaga, Washington and UNC-Charlotte.
Excuse me for laughing at Texas being ranked higher than Michigan in that way-too-early.
Texas is a top 15 team. Since they fired Barnes so they don't have coaching to drag the team down. Smart will know how to utilize them and I expect Texas to play much better than expected.
Without Myles Turner, I'm not sure they're a top 15 team.
Him and his stupid looking haircut.
is Joey? Must be another assclown.
11 seed and in a play in game.
#16 is way high. This poll is the first I have seen us in the top 25. Some other guy from ESPN had one and we weren't listed.
16 is about right. A ton of talent returning. IF healthy and Caris returns its a top 10 team. Also if we get Jaylen Brown to commit it will put Michigan preseason top 5
sorry but I actually laughed out loud right there. Dude, there is no way we are going to be a preseason Top 5 team.
According to BR the football team is going to be playing for the NC this year, so a top 5 ranking for the basketball team seams pretty reasonable.
/s
A lot of that depends on if LeVert comes back and if, somehow, Brown decides to commit. If both happen, I can see #16 being reasonable. A lot of guys are coming back with a ton of experience, ready to make the Beilein leap. But there's still a lot to prove.
This will be a better team next year, one way or another, but there's still question marks.
still in a walking boot and most of the mocks have him in the second round. That does not sound like a recipe for an early departure.
Brown does not need to come here for UM to be ranked #16. If only LeVert returns you have a team finally full of upperclassmen whose main weakness is the 4/5. Aside from the UK and Duke (depending on what stars they get) there should be no team better at the 1 thru 3 (maybe Iowa State and 1 or 2 others) in the country then UM next year with Walton, Caris, and Irvin. People forget around here how valuable it is to have "above average" upperclassmen since we rarely keep them. Look at Denzel Valentine who is a good - not great - college player. He and Nik were identical in ratings out of HS. One went to the NBA, the 3rd is a key cog for a good - not great - college basketball team. A top 20 team. We'll have 3 equivalents of that in those 3 with Caris being better than Valentine and IMO Irvin started to expand his game big time in the last 6-7 games of the year.
Then you throw in Dawkins who was UM's 2nd best player the last 5 weeks of the year and then just pray you get something out of the 5 and you have a good top 20 team. People overestimate how much talent there is out there - does Purdue have a boatload of greatness on it? No - but that's a top 20 team in 2014. After you get past 6-7 teams the talent drops off a lot in MBB. Everyone from about 8 to 30 is very similar on any given night.
This team playing walk ons still managed to beat OSU, too.
Lol...no way Indiana and MSU should be that high. I'd have MSU ahead of Indiana at around #18 and Indiana at #20. Tom Crean has a lot to prove. Plus, they may have signed a McD's AA at center but he's still a freshman. The Wisky/Kentucky and Wisky/Duke games showed just how easily a veteran big man can abuse freshman at that position.
WAY overranked. Crean has firmly established himself as a mediocre (at best) coach at a bigtime basketball school. It's beyond me how he keeps attracting such good players too. You'd think his assclown personality would frighten off most kids or their parents. The people I've talked to in Indiana can't wait until he gets the boot.
probably right. Izzo tends to favor upperclassmen over freshmen. Harris is one of only a few that I can rememeber who got starter minutes right off. But, they still have some decent talent without Davis. What they need is a point guard. I don't think they can keep getting by with the undersized Narin unless he learns how to score.
I dont get Indiana that high - but Yogi being a SR, Blackmon returning as a guy who will take a freshman to sophomore leap (yes guys it happens at colleges all over the country), and Troy Williams makes for a good top 3. They also landed a 4 star big man - who knows what he will be as a freshman but that's a good top 3 anyhow and I am sure with all their type of recruits they can find 1-2 other guys to contribute. I see them more around #20.
MSU I see 15ish as well. Trice goes, replaced by Eron Harris who is a better scorer and has 2 inches on Trice. Costello and Schilling come back a year older, Valentine is a senior, and Nairn is a SO rather than FR PG. Bess was their most highly touted recruit last year and was injured most of the year so didnt really get a chance to show. And I like Marvin Clark's game for a freshman. The question is Deyonta Davis and what impact he can make - he and Clark together should be able to replace Dawson's scoring. Rebounding and defense is the question for those 2 at the 4. But they will again be a very experienced team as they are every year with SR center, SR SF, JR SG. And guys like Schilling and Forbes as upperclassmen in backup roles. They dont need their freshman to do much - just Davis really.
Looks good.
#16 sounds about right for us as a preseason ranking based on our current roster that includes LeVert. We can be a top 10 team with LeVert back, but I would rather prove it on the court than have it handed to us before the seaon starts.
But Maryland at #5? Based on what?
seems accurate for them, assuming Layman doesn't leave. Trimble, Layman, Stone is a nice group to build around'
Wells and Smots from the team that finished second in the B1G and they had a top recruiting class last year. Five seems high, but I don't know that much about all the other teams in the country.
Plus, way too early.
Every Big Ten team on that list is ranked too high.
even in a down year we sent two teams to the final four, and 6 different Big Ten teams have played in the title game since 2000. I think we're all getting a (deserved) bump for the league we're in