OT: recently posted, but more on Prime (as way opposed to JH)

Submitted by MMBbones on April 27th, 2023 at 4:36 PM

This context was posted yesterday here, which I read, but this came across my newsfeed just now and I was still astonished in spite of the earlier post. And, no, I do not accept everything from FOX news...  But....

https://www.foxnews.com/sports/son-colorado-buffaloes-national-champion-reveals-deion-sanders-cut-him

Deion is a high-profile entity. As was Jim Harbaugh when he came here. But the contrast in (sorry if this word is too strong) integrity seems to be astonishing. Maybe Sanders is doing some necessary cleaning that will be revealed over time as the right thing. But it sure doesn't look like it now.

I would trust JH without hesitation to hold my wallet and phone while I rode a water ride at Cedar Point. Others....not so much. As has been posted here numerous times, M players are supported by their staff from the time they commit until....yeah. Until...

swn

April 27th, 2023 at 4:44 PM ^

All this moral faux-rage over what he's doing at CU is laughable. College football is officially a business. He can do whatever the fuck he wants as long as he's playing by the almost non-existent rules. Good for him for taking the Machiavellian approach. I hope he proves his doubters wrong.

BoFan

April 27th, 2023 at 9:35 PM ^

You clearly don’t understand the messages in “The Prince”. It is neither a valid or laudable approach. It’s a warning about how the best bullshitting backstabbers pretend to be honorable and beyond reproach (a prince) but behind the scenes they will “literally and physically” stab you in the back. 
 

Prime’s approach isn’t Machiavellian at all. Urban could be accused of being Machiavellian.  Prime is honest about being a tough asshole and that he doesn’t care about you.  A “Prince” on the other hand will have you believe that you are their most important person.  Like imagine a politician that tells you he is going to bring jobs back to rural America and to your town.  He is going to end your suffering.  But instead when he is in office he just lines his own family’s pockets and lies about and stabs all his enemies in the back.  That is closer to Machiavellian even if they are a bad liar. 
 

 

Eng1980

April 27th, 2023 at 7:07 PM ^

Machiavelli's The Prince warns about liars and backstabbers while promoting strong decisive action.  Machiavelli's The Prince in no way supports what is now referred to as a Machiavellian approach.  Just like Orwell's book do not support the Orwellian approach.

This my plug that everyone should read The Prince, especially parents.  (It is a short read.)

 

swn

April 27th, 2023 at 7:13 PM ^

I've read The Prince, thank you. If you would like another random quote on it:

Chapters XV to XXIII focus on the qualities of the prince himself. Broadly speaking, this discussion is guided by Machiavelli’s underlying view that lofty ideals translate into bad government. This premise is especially true with respect to personal virtue. Certain virtues may be admired for their own sake, but for a prince to act in accordance with virtue is often detrimental to the state. Similarly, certain vices may be frowned upon, but vicious actions are sometimes indispensable to the good of the state.

befuggled

April 28th, 2023 at 10:26 AM ^

Aside from this article, I haven't seen a lot of faux outrage. I have seen a lot of skepticism, which I don't think is unwarranted. The guy can clearly bring in talented players, but can he develop them and put them in position to succeed? This will be literally his first year coaching at the FBS level. Some coaches make the jump to the next level successfully, some coaches don't.

I'm looking forward to seeing how he does.

DickyWheysUM

April 27th, 2023 at 4:44 PM ^

I understand his need to make changes, but these kids don’t deserve to be treated this way. He couldn’t care less about Colorado aside from the money he makes there, whereas some of these kids (like the one mentioned in the article) have personal and family loyalty to Colorado through the good and bad. The fact that he named his son starting qb (I believe) before he was even on the Colorado football team is beyond words.

ThisGuyFawkes

April 27th, 2023 at 4:58 PM ^

I don't know if it's fair to say he cares less for Colorado than any other coach feels for the schools they coach for (obviously, we'd like to think that JH coaching at his alma mater means even more, but again who knows). 

I do think coaches mostly care about winning and being absolutely as successful at their schools as possible. You may not like the methods, but coach Prime is in the business of winning and that's what he's trying to do. The results will ultimately play out, but the media's perception on how much he cares about kids won't matter 1/10th as much as his W-L record. 

Blueisgood

April 27th, 2023 at 5:14 PM ^

The "kids" wanted this. That's what happens when you want money to play. They got more freedom to move as well. It's 100% a business now with no rules. The student athlete can come and go as they want, coaches, especially Prime, are now just doing a lot more, public firm handshakes. 

With that said, I don't like his style, but it doesn't sound like he's not upfront, and at this point anyone transferring in, should be well aware they may be out a few weeks later. 

Jonesy

April 27th, 2023 at 5:26 PM ^

He's always been a narcissist. Nobody matters or exists to him except when they're making him look good (win). A lot of the kids will figure it out as they're kicked to the curb. I believe Harbaugh cares about his kids, I believe Prime would gladly, literally use his kids as a step stool to a podium.

lilwolve4

April 27th, 2023 at 4:50 PM ^

I feel like his comments to the player were fine and upfront. He didn't mince words and got straight to the point while also being somewhat encouraging.

'You’re 6-foot-8, 320 pounds. I know in my heart of hearts a school is going to pick you up in the portal when you enter. Make your weaknesses your strengths and keep progressing. I hope you have a great future, it just won’t be here at the University of Colorado.'

Could have been much harsher but also, if it were me, I wouldn't want a long drawn out conversation. Cut and dry. Say what you will about whether or not he should've kept him given the player's relationship to the school. We all know that Prime is out from Prime so he has no loyalty to the program and/or traditions/heritage. His primary goal is to win and by any means necessary it seems. Still I don't see anything wrong with the way he informed the player or handled it. If he's not your guy, he's not your guy. It will be an interesting experiment either way it goes.

1201SouthMain

April 27th, 2023 at 5:20 PM ^

That's a legit perspective. Prime is being paid to win and he can do it however he wants. Not all of those 18 that hit the portal will be picked up. Colorado should offer academic scholarships for the kids that have been essentially cut and don't get another opportunity. Small cost to the university in the big picture. In my opinion at least.

NittanyFan

April 27th, 2023 at 5:11 PM ^

Personally, I would trust Prime to hold my phone and wallet at Cedar Point.

He's not going to steal anything!  All he's going to do is use my phone to take videos and post on Instagram.

#CoachPrime #PrimeLovesRollerCoasters #LookOutBuckeyesAndWolverinesTheBuffsAreComing #ItsAllAboutPrime

nerv

April 27th, 2023 at 5:19 PM ^

From a roster and depth perspective you think it would pay off to be a little more cordial with the old staffs players. There was still some talent there and even with the portal its going to be hard to make a roster overhaul this glaring, this fast.

Probably could, and should, have struck a better balance between bringing in his guys and keeping some of what was already in the cupboard.

OldSchoolWolverine

April 27th, 2023 at 5:21 PM ^

 I didn't know you could cut players on scholarship. Unless it's implied they can stay and finish their degree without having to pay.  They have right to have tuition paid, right ?

And I wonder how many guys he will bring from Jackson St, and their level of ability.  Imagine the App St. coach going to Big Ten and bringing a bunch of players.. I would think the talent dropoff is significant.

Vasav

April 27th, 2023 at 5:44 PM ^

He's been honest about it with the players, he told them this was the culture on day 1, the university will honor their scholarships if they want to stay but if they want to play football they are being asked to leave. In the age of NIL, this is...fine? The players deserve to be paid and they are. And that means they will be treated a bit more as employees as far as the football field goes, while still being treated like students off of it. And this is happening.

Bigger question is whether this culture will work on the field. It feels different than what he did at Jackson State. But Colorado was in dire need of different.