Comparing Cade & JJ to Henson & Brady
I was thinking the other day at the end of the MSU game, the comparisons between this year and Drew Henson’s freshman year.
On one hand we have Cade who isn’t a 5th year senior like Brady was, but the starter and his backup is a 5 star phenom. Brady was the starter and Drew Henson a 5 star, respectfully as a freshman coming in to take his spot. Now we are fortunate the Yankees are not involved here breathing down on Harbaughs neck.
I wanted to know what the board thinks, is this a similar situation? Cade the starter and we know what to expect from him, or the freshmen phenom who is more aggressive and much brighter ceiling. I personally like that we sis not red shirt JJ, with the new transfer rules keeping him involved in the offense will help his growth.
What does the board think ?
November 10th, 2021 at 1:57 PM ^
Oh yeah, remember when Henson had a brighter ceiling than Brady?
November 10th, 2021 at 2:04 PM ^
Higher future, too.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:05 PM ^
Nobody, including probably Mr. and Mrs. Brady, thought Tom Brady would become anything close to TOM BRADY. Also, Cade doesn't have Brady's arm strength. The better comparison to Cade/JJ is probably the situation Georgia had with Jake Fromm/Justin Fields.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:15 PM ^
I don't know about that. I remember hearing about Brady when he was a recruit and this was before you really heard about recruits. I thought Brady was better than Greise in college and that he was going to be the next 1st/2nd round draft picks after Grbac, Collins, Greise, etc., especially after the Alabama bowl game. It was a complete surprise to me that he was a 6th round draft pick and that he was slow and doughy.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:37 PM ^
No offense to Tom, but I think he dropped so far because, by NFL standards, he was such a sad physical specimen. He was on the other side of the "omg shirtless" bell curve. So, instead of being grossly overestimated, he was grossly underestimated.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:39 PM ^
Omg shirton?
November 10th, 2021 at 3:03 PM ^
Peyton Manning was an incredible specimen as was Ryan Leaf.
November 10th, 2021 at 10:46 PM ^
Right,
and if he wouldn't have been given a shot by an injury/coach/scheme that wanted a more mobile/hit-taking (or just had a bad o-line/coach that wasn't willing to adjust), then he wouldn't have been "THE Tom Brady" either.
A lot of circumstances have to line up.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:38 PM ^
Griese, Brady, Henson.. Back then many wanted Brady to start in 97 and thought it was a done deal after 96, even Greise was ready to go. When Greise came back the noise was still loud to start Brady.
97 happens, Greise leads the team to the national title and we sign Henson. Brady was one time considered the far better qb to Griese but had to wait his turn. The season opens with loses to Syracuse and ND, Henson came in at the end of the syracuse game against a largely prevent defense but led a couple scoring drives and the call for Henson was on!
Brady / Henson, the noise was getting loud his fr year to start Henson.. Brady settled in and 98 was a solid season but the loss to osu rang loud. Still Brady had a great season and was told he better earn it every day because the week that Henson outperforms him in practice is the week Henson gets the starting job. The noise was still loud even after it became clear by late in 98 season that Brady was the starter and Henson wasn't ready.
99, Noise died down a lot but there were still people calling for Henson. Osu game and Orange Bowl cemented Brady's legacy as a Michigan QB! Henson was getting his shot in 00....
Cade and JJ. It should be obvious right now that JJ has all the ability in the world. But he isn't ready and doesn't have the entire offense yet. Is still making risky decisions and bad decisions with the ball.
Cade, his arm is better than credited for and has plenty of arm when he sets his feet. Much better than credited for. Cade, has to settle his feet, the game still has to slow down and him see the field faster and get rid of the ball on time to the open rec.
JJ, and this is where I think an issue arises but I think JJ has a better mentality. JJ has to put the work in and earn it. Not be handed to him on emotions of fans. Has to win it. When he wins it, rather its soon or not is when he will be the starting qb! Entitlement will get coaches fired so never start a player because of fan noise and a player expects it and doesn't earn it.
November 10th, 2021 at 3:50 PM ^
There was little to no clamor for Brady to start in 1997. I'd love to see a source if you disagree. Brady was buried behind both Driesbach and Griese before the 1997 August camp. Brady barely played a single meaningful snap in 1996 (I recall he was the holder on kicks). Brady redshirted in 1995.
Brady began to come on during the 1997 August camp. Stan Parrish (QB Coach) saw the promise. After camp, Brady even passed Driesbach as Griese's primary backup, but Brady got mono during 1997 which set him back.
The debate was between Griese and Driesbach. Driesbach started every single game in 1996, except the Outback Bowl (New Years 1997) against Alabama. Griese started the Outback Bowl after he led Michigan's upset of a previously undefeated OSU team at the Horseshoe. Greise didn't even start that game. He came on in relief of Driesbach after Michigan was completely ineffective in the first half. Michigan won 13-9. Huge upset at the time. This game proved to be the springboard for the 1997 season, imo.
November 10th, 2021 at 8:58 PM ^
Absolutely no one knew who Brady was in 1997. The only people in ‘99 who wanted Brady to start over Henson I knew where girls who had classes with Brady and thought he was hot. Literally no one else. At least Cade had some dudes who want him to start.
November 11th, 2021 at 6:36 AM ^
I recall 1999 very clearly bc it was a real discussion. My personal opinion at the time was that Henson could be great in the future but that the offense seemed to produce better results when Brady was on the field. And I recall quite a few other Michigan fans sharing that view.
November 11th, 2021 at 1:26 PM ^
After Henson opened with a couple td drives the cries for Henson got loud in 98, and the 0-2 start didn’t help.
Brady, out of spring in 97 there was word Brady was the better passer, insiders were talking about Brady as the starter. As for proof, yeah because that’s all readily available and a foolish thing to ask over two decades later and none of it available. There was talk of it, and enough for it to be mentioned in broadcasts as well as Griese saying he wasn’t sure if he wanted to come back for his 5th year and Lloyd not promising the starting job.
Driesbach, was expected to be the starter but we all know what happened there. Basically done after his injury. Driesbach wasn’t mentioned much after 96 that I recall.
November 11th, 2021 at 11:13 PM ^
Agree it seemed like no public clamor. The team knew that Brady was pushing Griese though and rumored that many thought he should start. All my research (besides being at the games in 1997 myself) from the Brady 6:
https://youtu.be/o5fdhfVrg1I?t=204
Also, one website said that Brady had an appendectomy in Oct 1997 and out indefinitely. Did he have mono also?
November 12th, 2021 at 10:44 AM ^
https://mgoblog.com/mgoboard/how-drew-henson-ended-yankees
November 10th, 2021 at 5:14 PM ^
PSU game too! 20+ years later, 7 SB's, 5 SB MVP's, 3 NFL MVP, I'll argue that the biggest game Brady quarterbacked was the 98 Sparty game. Lose that game, would've been 3 in September, we would never have heard from him again and he would've been running dad's insurance agency. Turned out ok for him!!!!
November 11th, 2021 at 7:57 AM ^
Sloughy
November 10th, 2021 at 4:55 PM ^
The closest comparison I can think of was at Texas in 1999.
Major Applewhite was a Sophomore who had played a lot his Freshman year in 1998. In comes stud Freshman Chris Simms, son of former NY Giants QB. Simms had a helluva a cannon. Applewhite was a gamer who didn't have great physical traits but he won. He was also surrounded with ridiculous talent. Everyone wanted to see Simms start because the talent was easy to see, but like McCarthy, the learning curve was needed also. This was prior to the transfer portal so both stuck around. Mack Brown didn't mind playing two QB's.
November 10th, 2021 at 4:27 PM ^
If Drew would've committed full-time to football, he would've been an All-Pro. Until we win again in Columbus, he'll always be an answer to the bar trivia question of "Who's the last Michigan QB to win in Columbus?"
November 10th, 2021 at 5:13 PM ^
There is simply no proof he would've been an All-Pro. That's just wishful revisionism.
November 10th, 2021 at 5:24 PM ^
Had Henson stayed for his senior year he would have been a 1st round draft pick. All-pro is hard to predict but he probably would have had an extended run at trying to get there.
November 10th, 2021 at 8:29 PM ^
I believe Casserly said they tried to talk him out of signing the MLB deal and that Houston would have taken him with the #1 pick.
November 10th, 2021 at 1:58 PM ^
does JJ play baseball?
November 10th, 2021 at 2:00 PM ^
Was Cade drafted by the Expos? Oops! A few years late I suppose.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:41 PM ^
ugh, thankfully no but that brings up nightmares.. Also why Henson failed in both when he could have been a star. Wrong organization and that was solely steinbrenner throwing money to ruin him and he admitted it. Put him in aa columbus and don't develop him, the order was specific
November 10th, 2021 at 3:43 PM ^
How well does your aluminum-foil hat fit?
Also why Henson failed in both when he could have been a star.
You should go Occam's Razor here. Henson was good enough to get to the big leagues in two professional sports (a rare achievement that is underappreciated by many). He just wasn't good enough to go farther than that. Would concentrating on one sport have helped? Of course. But it's not like he didn't have a decent amount of time in both sports. There are numerous cases of guys who starred at lower levels and couldn't make the adjustment once they moved up a level.
Wrong organization and that was solely steinbrenner throwing money to ruin him and he admitted it.
Have a resource? A quote? I doubt it.
Put him in aa columbus and don't develop him, the order was specific
This is even better. The Yankees are going to throw a 3rd-round pick out the window and devote some resources to sham-training Henson just so Steinbrenner can fuck with his U of M nemesis? He was piece of work, but without evidence you're really reaching here.
November 12th, 2021 at 10:35 AM ^
November 10th, 2021 at 1:58 PM ^
Cade is the starter. JJ is the backup. It will continue to be this way until something changes.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:21 PM ^
infallible logic
November 10th, 2021 at 2:42 PM ^
I’m very nervous that Cade is playing through injury (signs of that in last game) and won’t make it healthy to the OSU game. JJ has huge upside but I don’t think I want his first career start to be vs the Buckeyes potentially with a ton riding on the game.
November 10th, 2021 at 3:04 PM ^
This is Michigan fergodsakes! Having a banged up QB/starting the backup versus OSU is tradition.
November 10th, 2021 at 6:39 PM ^
It'll be fine, Seth said, on the podcast, he was peeing in the injury tent or something.
November 10th, 2021 at 8:08 PM ^
QBs play injured all the time. Everybody that starts is injured by this point in the season.
There is NO WAY JJ McCarthy is starting ANY game this season. You did see him play four days ago?
The only way McCarthy could become starter is if McNamara gets injured to where he is unable to play.
November 11th, 2021 at 1:21 PM ^
Should he start Saturday? Should he start against Maryland?
November 10th, 2021 at 1:59 PM ^
If we have Cade fake an injury to have JJ come in and run transcontinental and then Cade leads a 4th quarter comeback form 10 down against PSU I will say it is similar to Brady/Henson.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:00 PM ^
Bright ceilings are nice. What do JJ's opposite field power numbers look like? Short porch in right at Yankee Stadium.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:09 PM ^
JJ and Henson both have professionally fatal inabilities to hit MLB breaking stuff.
[fake edit: I'm assuming JJ can't hit MLB curves and sliders because, well, most of the known universe also have the same problem.]
November 10th, 2021 at 2:19 PM ^
You trying to say [J.J. McCarthy] can't hit a curve ball?
November 10th, 2021 at 2:28 PM ^
Curveball, bats are afraid.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:01 PM ^
I'm hoping Cade starts next year and with JJ also playing a few series. If not, he will leave and burn our ass.
November 10th, 2021 at 2:56 PM ^
If Cade wins the starting job after next season which is pretty much a lock, it's hard to foresee a scenario where JJ can stay until Cade graduates to get a chance to start. Cade is technically a junior but he's really a RS sophomore with not much of a NFL future which means he's likely will be a 3 year starter.
November 10th, 2021 at 3:16 PM ^
This is pretty much the conundrum. This isn't the 90's, wait your turn generation, so one will most likely transfer. All of this polarization between which QB should be the starter has only begun.
November 10th, 2021 at 3:41 PM ^
I do believe that Cade has freshman eligibility.
1st year: Did not play (redshirt)
2nd year: Free Covid year
3rd year: Is this year.
So, technically, he and J.J. have the same eligibility! What will this mean for the future?
November 10th, 2021 at 4:11 PM ^
With CoVid year, Cade actually has redshirt freshman eligibility.
November 10th, 2021 at 5:48 PM ^
I’m cool either way, we either get like 4 years of Cade who seems very smart and will likely be reading defenses and picking them apart like a sieve if he starts for 3 or 4 years, or JJ wins the job next year because he is “that good!”, and we get two great years out of him, likely….Cade likely transfers which would be a bummer, but who could blame him….
and who knows maybe Cade, if JJ beat him out, would still stick around for one year as the back up before a transfer (say JJ wins the job in the fall camp of 2022) and this would give time to bring in another great QB recruit or 2 while having a very solid backup if JJ goes down with an injury or if JJ ends up sucking and doing high school garbage all the time while taking sacks and turning the ball over.
November 10th, 2021 at 3:58 PM ^
I think the next few games will play a big role in who is the starter next year. If Cade somehow leads us to wins against PSU and OSU and into the playoffs, you probably don’t bench that guy next year. If we stumble against PSU (especially) and OSU (most likely) we probably have an honest qb controversy going into next season. I think JJ is self aware enough to see he’s not ready just yet but by next season that line should be less clear. If cade honestly keeps him on the bench next season then…yeah he probably transfers. Need to recruit top qb talent so you have more than 2 viable options
November 10th, 2021 at 2:02 PM ^
F*CK George Steinbrenner!!
November 10th, 2021 at 3:41 PM ^
Man the change in momentum in the rivalry may very well be traced back to that moment. No doubt Michigan beats OSU in Ann Arbor in 2001 if Henson is the QB, unraveling Tressel's prediction. Could that have had any effect longterm? Who knows?
It may have made no difference or maybe it would have made all the difference.
November 10th, 2021 at 5:53 PM ^
I was thinking the same thing. Poor damn John Navarre couldn’t handle pressure for his life in 2001