Recruiting concerns.

Submitted by MichiganMan14 on

There is an elephant in the room. We dance around it and it's time to stop. We don't have the proper athletic talent at our 4 and 5 spots. We try and win with middling talent in the paint and stretch 4 and 5s!?!?! This is not going to work for this program in my opinion. The Center for SMU had 8 dunks tonight. 8! That's absolutely a result of inadequate recruiting and coaching in the paint. We have som great wing players but we sorely lack in the paint. We are one of the worst rebounding teams in the B1G year in and year out and have to shoot extremely well to win. Connecticut ..Xavier and SMU all featured athletic front lines and all 3 embarrassed us badly. Many will think we lost tonight because Caris shot miserably. We lost because we have guys playing in the paint that simply can't get it done. It's very similar to our line backing core down the stretch. The level of athleticism simply isn't there to compete on an elite level.

 

The Xavier game sticKS out most because that Center was from Detroit....and he manhandled us. We have 3 players at the 5 spot that are not physically able to compete on an elite level. Moritz may get there and has talent and youth on his side. He may turn out to be an exception and is very likeable. The other 2 just have not progressed and are assuredly great kids...but not effective simply put. Why does DJ Wilson not play? He's by far the best athlete and plays the least. It's a head scratcher for me because his ceiling suggests that he'd be worth the invested minutes. He gets scrap minutes...and is our best athlete in the paint. This wouldn't be as troubling if there wasn't more of the same coming down the pipe in recrutiing. We still don't have an athletic big coming in for the next 2 classes and Beilein seems to be willing to settle with this. This is simply upsettling. Webber...Howard....Baston....Taylor...Trayor......hell even Courtney Sims and J. Morgan! Where are our athletic bigs these days? It sure seems like everyone else has them. We used to have them and we've gotten completely away from it.

 

You do NOT win without athletes in the paint. Simple and plain. The notion that we can shoot our way around it or hit on one single big recruit (Mitch) in a 4 year span is absolute rubbish. Something needs to change. Michigan used have some of the most dynamic athletes in the country in the paint and until we get back to that it's just going to be hard to stomach. We need to recruit Detroit for starters and play our athletes. We can continue to avoid this elephant and make excuses as to why we are consistently losing to physical front lines...or we can adapt and change. We are not going to win without help in the middle. 8 damn dunks from one player.....that's not even pride. If Bacari is in charge of the bigs....then he needs to be held responsible because it's awful. Youth is something everyone plays with and isn't an excuse.

 

Recruit Detroit please...or at least fight like hell to do so. Tired of seeing homegrown talent go elsewhere and us running to the damn burbs to grab underrated kids who don't play with the same explosiveness and passion. Enough is enough. Your 5s don't need to be able to knock down 20 foot jumpers. That's horse crap. Get some dogs in the paint. We look straight up soft right now and thats the worst thing to look like.

bronxblue

December 9th, 2015 at 7:13 AM ^

Man, how some people survived the last couple of years of football seasons alone shocks me.

The team has a problem inside, as the players in development are struggling on the defensive side. But it's still, what, 9 games into the season? This team isn't a top 10 outfit, but it will get better. It just won't be a sweet 16 team.

Jimmyisgod

December 9th, 2015 at 7:50 AM ^

Rebounding and toughness are sorely lacking in this team. Rebounding is about the will of the team to play physical and block out. All 5 players on the floor need to start blocking out and need to start scrapping. Yeah, we lack any sort of athleticism inside, but we can overcome that if we really want to rebound. 45-20 in the glass, that is getting obliterated. Not sure if Beilein mentioned that after the game but I didn't hear him, he was more talking about how great SMU was and how they are better than us. This loss is upsetting because we got absolutely dominated inside by a team that's frankly not any bigger than us.

taistreetsmyhero

December 9th, 2015 at 8:12 AM ^

I think the tip jam near the end demonstrated that none of these guys have the instincts needed to rebound. When a shot goes up, a good rebounding team will have players who have magnetic asses and crash into the nearest opponents body to box out without a second thought. Instead, we had 3 players watching dumbfounded while the ball rims out, only to have the SMU monster run unopposed to the ball for the mega put back.



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beedub93

December 9th, 2015 at 8:17 AM ^

You lost me at Courtney Sims. I will always remember the ohio state at Crisler when he missed the dunk at the end of the game that would have won it and likely sealed a tournament slot.



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Lakeyale13

December 9th, 2015 at 8:24 AM ^

Beilin has done a pretty amazing job with kids who aren't uber elite recruits. I just don't know why he cant seem to land the true difference maker. He is such a brilliant basketball mind that it is such a shame he hasn't been able to put it to use with Elite players.

Brian Griese

December 9th, 2015 at 8:42 AM ^

that lost 4x before Christmas to Iowa State, Charlotte, Duke and Arizona and then on December 27th, announced Sporting News, Pre-Season All American, Mitch McGary was out for the season.  What happened to the team after that? I seem to forget.

Coach Carr Camp

December 9th, 2015 at 10:30 AM ^

I don't think its fair to compare every year we have a bad start to the 2013 sesason.That year we lost on the road in close games top 10 Duke and ISU, and by 2 to #1 Arizona. The Charlotte loss felt like an outlier even at the time. That team also had 3 NBA players on it and a center who is better than anyone we have now. This team has 1 player who will go pro, and no one else who will even get a sniff, and has been blown out by the three good teams they have played. We may get things going in the right direction and put together just enough to get into tourny, but to compare this team to 2013 is to complpetely ignore a lot of factors as well as just a plain old eye test. 

jblaze

December 9th, 2015 at 8:54 AM ^

Out of maybe ~150 to 200 NBA starters, who has Beilein recruited? Which NBA starters/ major contributors can JB say he recruited and developed?

Guys like Stauskas, Mitch, Tre... Are in the league, but are not starters.

Recruiting isn't the issue as we have never had top talent.

bronxblue

December 9th, 2015 at 11:09 AM ^

He had the national player of the year and then followed that up with the conference player of the year. The point of college basketball is to win college basketball games, not make pros. And Beilein had shown a great ability to do that.

MichiganMan14

December 9th, 2015 at 3:10 PM ^

If I was in charge of recruiting, our roster would look different. Michigan doesn't need a bag man. They need someone on tune with the area and willing to recruit like it means everything to them. Bagman lmao. I guess everyone else has bagmen lol. We're the only clean program in the world. That type of mentality is also crippling. This staff just struggles with recruting. They're conversely good at converting wing talent so it balances us into competitive. You call it meltdown...I call it like it is. I know what athletes are needed to win and we don't have enough of them on our basketball team. As you've seen in 3 blowouts this past month.

samdrussBLUE

December 9th, 2015 at 9:08 AM ^

Why the fuck do so many people hit their brakes when making a turn in their fucking car? I mean, you are making a right turn from a stand still or slow speed after a light, you don't need to be on the brake in the midst of the turn. People suck at life more and more.



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Hotel Putingrad

December 9th, 2015 at 9:12 AM ^

we're not going to get any quicker on the outside nor tougher on the inside by January. A .500 conference season should get us a high seed in the NIT though. I'm not sure how we could make the NCAA since we'll see the same results against the top B1G teams that we've already seen against Xavier, UConn, and SMU.

SharkyRVA

December 9th, 2015 at 9:12 AM ^

Relax.  Beilein will adjust, coach, and get the ship going in the right direction just like he always does.  This team will continue to improve all season.  That is what makes Beilein a great coach.

cazzie

December 9th, 2015 at 9:29 AM ^

you don't need to be a big time recruit to be able to block out. our bigs are not coached to take a guy, put their butt into them and face the basket and stay with him. my old coach would tell us, you can block out anyone for the rebound, no matter how big or athletic they are. just stay in front of them. i don't even see our guys moving in front of players to attempt to block out.

blocking out and getting the defensive rebounds is a coaching, not a recruiting, problem. it's pathetic what we saw last night.

anyone can block out anybody, or be fouled.

AlwaysBlue

December 9th, 2015 at 10:53 AM ^

true. Mills, on the radio last night, said he sat in on the team meetings and was at walk through. The team did not perform. And you can see it, they are too often out of position or have bad angles on rebounds. Morgan was effective because of his brain. The current bigs don't show that.

Jimmyisgod

December 9th, 2015 at 9:30 AM ^

I have got a shocking fact for people.  WE WERE THE BIGGER TEAM LAST NIGHT!  We have more size, SMU without Kennedy does not have a single player on their roster over 6-8, and one of those players didn't play and the other is a 205 lb wing.  That Tolbert was 6-7 and 240.  

SMU without Kennedy is quite a small team.  They only played 1 player last night after Kennedy went out a few seconds into the game that was over 205 lbs.  We got outrebounded 45-20 by a team that is much smaller than we are.  Purdue, Iowa, MSU, and Maryland might hold our team to under 15 rebounds.

Wettin 3's

December 9th, 2015 at 9:40 AM ^

Amen, preach brotha. I feel the EXACT same way you do. Youth is not an excuse, and we look super soft. Time to start picking up guys who demonstrate that explosiveness.

marc27

December 9th, 2015 at 11:25 AM ^

...look, I agree right now the Big Man situation for UM isn't responding, and doesn't look good enough to have the inside presence they need for BIG 10 play.  But, it is still early in the season, and several of their "key" guys are either injured, or coming back and not all the way back from it, such as Spike and Irvin in particular.  The flow of the game in college basketball is and virtually always has been controlled by good quality point guards.  Right now, there is no flow with Walton completely out, and Spike not healthy yet to be effective.  I'm definitely not saying the big man thing isn't an issue, but as the above guys get back, and get healthier, I do believe the big men will also benefit from it, probably on both sides of the ball.  Remember too, that the team had average big men, at best(yep even McGary was just average maybe a tick above most of that season)while both having a great regular season, and then making the run to the championship game just a few years ago.  The key is finding big men who can rebound and at least put a body on someone inside defensively.  They absolutely can continue to do what they've done recruiting wise and compete.  Beilein has done it before, and will again in his way.  They need another big man with some presence, no question.  I'm also in agreement with those that say DJ Wilson needs more minutes to see what they have.

Caris-matic

December 9th, 2015 at 12:06 PM ^

For us to win a national championship under Beilein something will happen that has never happened:

(1) A team wins with a Kenpom adjusted defensive efficiency ranked outside the top 21

(2) A Beilein team has an adjusted defensive efficiency ranked in the top 21

Kenpom's data goes back to 2002.  In that timeframe, here are the Adjusted D's of the national champions:

7, 14, 5, 12, 6, 17, 1, 21, 8, 13, 8, 3, 10, 12

Here are Beilein's adjusted D's in that timeframe:

34 (last season at Richmond), 112, 92, 102, 70, 90 (last season at WV), 100, 69, 58, 37, 61, 48, 109, 107

Which is more likely: Beilein figures out a way to get our guys in the top 21 in adjusted defensive efficiency?  Or we win the title outside that top 21?  If the odds of both of these are low, then we are essentially employing a strategy THAT HAS LOW ODDS OF EVER WINNING IT ALL.  Personally, I would rather take a chance on a completely different system that may be worse than ours as long as it has a chance of putting us in that top 21 adjusted D.

 

MGoStrength

December 9th, 2015 at 2:54 PM ^

Nothing against basketball, but I assume everything is football unless otherwise stated.  I was thinking this was a football recruiting concern only to find out it was basketball.  No biggie, but I follow basketball much less closely.