OT: Milwaukee's Fiserv Forum
Given that last game, I have decided to post about something else entirely. And it is: Milwaukee's incredible venue for basketball (and other events), Fiserv Forum:
This is an INCREDIBLE arena, and easily the best place I've ever seen a basketball game. There is a ton of glass and natural lighting, the food vendors are quite varied and good, there is a bar at the top (see the green area upper right above), the luxury boxes are wonderfully integrated into the seating, and the actual viewing area for the game is great - lots of great seats.
On top of all of that, they actually try to keep the game (and breaks from the game) fun: constant T-shirt give aways, trivia, random funny stuff on the big screen, all fairly entertaining.
While it is "corporate" and all that, I think a lot of venues could learn something from this place.
We went for a late game the other night and had a blast.
What are other great arenas around the country?
February 11th, 2023 at 10:37 PM ^
The architecture at least looks nice, although you could also convince me that is an airport terminal in Japan.
February 12th, 2023 at 8:03 AM ^
You may be on to something
February 11th, 2023 at 10:43 PM ^
I don’t understand the fascination with stadiums and arenas. As long as I have an uninstructed view, my experience attending is the same. I go to watch a game not look at architecture. I arrive early so I have never had an issue with concessions. I may be an outlier, but unless a place is just dirty they are all the same to me. The people in the stadium and the environment they create makes the difference, for example attending Xavier and Dayton basketball games is 10x better than Michigan games just on the atmosphere alone.
February 11th, 2023 at 10:58 PM ^
You’ve never been to Fenway, have you?
February 12th, 2023 at 12:31 AM ^
I have been to these MLB stadiums:
Detroit, Cleveland, Cincinnati, Pittsburgh, both Chicagos, Boston, both New York, Philly, Baltimore and DC.
I will give you MLB is a little different because the pace of the game is slow enough where I can go to the concessions mid game. In basketball and football I have yet to find a stadium I can get food and not miss action during a regular stoppage.
February 12th, 2023 at 1:43 AM ^
Fenway? Only place I've ever been where, depending on your seats, you have to turn your torso to watch the game. And the green monster plays like Jai alai. Ugh.
(Edit/add: only stadium I've ever been to in MI is the Big House)
February 12th, 2023 at 8:40 AM ^
Tiger stadium you had to adjust quite a bit to see around support pillars along the base lines. Since I was young and it was what I could afford with my new HS job and first car it was a big deal taking a buddy either way (1977). Rooting for Chuck Scrivener to get in and getting others to do it also late in the game was fun. Little used infielder if memory serves.
February 12th, 2023 at 10:08 AM ^
Everyone talks about the poles at Tiger Stadium, but any seat that wasn’t obstructed was a good seat, whether it was in the lower or upper deck. And you had a roof over your head in all but the very first rows.
In most of the obstructed seats, it wasn’t that bad - you could see 95% of the field without an issue. There were maybe 5,000 seats (out of the 52,000 capacity) that were seriously obstructed, and they would sell those seats last. They could have just removed them and brought capacity down a bit, since it was already large by MLB standards.
Compare that with Comerica where the entire upper deck is a mile away from the action, you’re not protected from the elements at all, and a big chunk of the the stadium is blinded by the evening sun because Ilitch wanted it to face south (so you could look at the skyline instead of watching the game). It’s absolutely a worse place to watch a game than Tiger Stadium. All the merry-go-rounds and tiger statues are an attempt to cover that up.
February 12th, 2023 at 10:36 AM ^
When I was in high school, bleacher seats were still $4. The view was still great and the best value in all stadiums (pro or college) IMO. The only negative were the lack of concessions. You needed an usher to open a gate so you could get to all the different food/beverage offerings.
February 12th, 2023 at 11:15 AM ^
The Palace >> LCA
Tiger Stadium > Comerica
Joe Louis ≥ LCA
Ford Field > Silverdome
February 12th, 2023 at 11:26 AM ^
May I ask why the hate for LCA? I went for the first time the other night (I live in Chicago) and really liked it. The disclaimer, as noted above, is that my primary purpose was to watch the game and the ice sheet and sight lines don't vary that much from arena to arena. But it's pretty and was easy in and out with plenty of drink/food options both in and around the place.
February 15th, 2023 at 11:49 AM ^
I wouldn't say it's hate for LCA as much as fondness for the Palace and JLA. I'm 50 so have many fond sports and entertainment memories of both. I still don't understand the decision to move from the Palace... it was still a modern, functional building with great sight lines and acoustics.
Both the Palace and JLA had character and proud championship history, LCA is sterile and fairly boring. It was probably time for JLA but Palace was only 30'ish years old, I hope that's not the new shelf life for stadiums.
February 12th, 2023 at 11:30 AM ^
I'm down with all your picks except The Palace. Not a bad stadium, but LCA is very cool and most importantly a Detroit sporting stadium should be IN Detroit not an hour north. They aren't the Oakland Pistons.
February 12th, 2023 at 12:02 PM ^
Yep.
I'll grant that it's better for the Pistons to be downtown. But as a venue, the Palace was fine.
Ford Field is the one improvement. Of course it's still lame that the Lions play indoors (and arguably even a competitive disadvantage) - but if you've got to play indoors, Ford Field is a lot nicer than the Silverdome.
February 12th, 2023 at 2:43 PM ^
Last time I was at Comerica, I had pretty good seats along the third base line in direct sunlight on a hot day. Saw a woman collapse due to heat stroke two rows in front of me and have to get hauled away by paramedics. The lack of cover in the stands is a serious issue.
February 12th, 2023 at 3:30 PM ^
Literally the same thing happened at a game I went to in 2021. Also down the third baseline. And I’m guessing we were not at the same game sitting next to each other, but it is a regular occurrence. I love Comerica, but on hot days afternoon games get HOT. I can deal with it, but I end up waking around the concourse with my kids because they cannot.
February 12th, 2023 at 4:02 PM ^
Been to two games on true 100 degree days at Comerica. One with customers where my coworker and I let the customers stay in the shade section one row in front of us. Upper deck third base line. The customers choice to still go to this and frozen lemonades saved my life. Good game that Tigers won.
Next game was a a planned Verlander outing for $100 for the family of 4. Once again upper deck third base line. Day before Tigers announce Verlander has a blister or something and they put in a 6th starter level guy in his place. Already the wife and I don't want to go and when we see game day weather we really don't want to go. Being frugal and money spent we persevere. Their starter is like a Cy Young candidate (Mark Buerle?) and the Tigers got like 1 run. Meanwhile Jermaine Dye had a game at the plate and the rest of the Chicago team did as well. Dye hits a triple first inning. He had been hot coming in so I was the lone "walk him" voice for that run producing hit. Next time he comes up a few more were chirping the same and he homers. Next time after that our whole section is screaming to walk him and he hits a three run shot. Game ends like 10-1 for the bad guys and we leave by the 7th. Horrible day and game.
No one wants to go back now. Traumatized our 10 and 11 year olds I guess.
February 11th, 2023 at 11:08 PM ^
derp.
February 11th, 2023 at 11:10 PM ^
You're definitely an outlier. Not to be unkind about it but a big part of the excitement of attending a game in-person is how that experience is so rich in comparison to television, and a big part of that is the venue itself.
How many people on this board rememember what it was like entering Michigan Stadium for a game when it was a novelty? Your first time as a kid, or when you were enrolled as a student? How many remember what it was like to be at something like the 21 OSU game or UTL? Or the 2002 hockey regional? The in-person made a huge part of the experience, and the venue is a huge part of that.
It's the fans, yes. But also the shape of the facility. The architecture.
And there are many times we go and the game itself isn't quite as memorable as 97 UM-OSU, and the rest of the experience matters. Part of the experience is the hot dog, and that means part of the experience is the trip to the concession stand. Part of the experience is the approach to the stadium, with concourses and the exterior building excitement. Part of the experience is just sitting and relishing in the moment, in a huge facility that seats thousands upon thousands.
February 12th, 2023 at 12:25 AM ^
I agree going to the big house for the first time is a unique experience, but I don’t think it translates since it is such an outlier being the biggest stadium in North America. Maybe it just tainted my view and I am just not impressed with other venues. As far as concessions and walking the concourse etc, any game I go to I am there as soon as the stadium opens and get my food and head to my seat as fast as possible to watch warmups. For me yes the great moments are always going to be better in person, but for a mundane game being there to watch warmups is what sets it apart.
February 12th, 2023 at 9:05 AM ^
Yeah, you have to be there for warmups. It's pretty fun to watch the players all doing their thing while the coaches walk around and talk to everyone. Visits and hello's with the opponents they know, balls flying around everywhere, trying to spot your favorite players or the psuedo-injured ones to see if they might play...
But if you're not taking in the atmosphere around you, you're missing half of the experience. The half that still makes attending worth the hassle. I was in the Big House for Bo's last game against OSU, and the air was just a little more electric than it is when Illinois is in town. I was at the '97 PSU game in PSU's steel erector set - and the atmosphere was off the charts cool! I was at the UMD game two years ago, in the concrete monstrosity they call a stadium, and there was no character whatsoever. It literally could not have been more bland. UMD tried to make it fun outside the game, but the facility just wouldn't allow it, it's that bad!
Dude, don't get so wrapped up in the game itself that you miss everything around it that makes the whole thing a great experience!
February 12th, 2023 at 11:32 AM ^
I'm going to be abused for this, but other than just being HUGE, the Big House is a terrible place to go to a game. The views are all really good, but it is very hard to get to your seats and unless you are 5'4" 100# woman the seat width and leg room make it very uncomfortable to sit.
February 12th, 2023 at 3:41 PM ^
Not a problem. You just stand all game.
February 12th, 2023 at 8:58 AM ^
And who can forget the trough or running water sloughs UM stadium. As a little kid that blew my mind.
I attended first back when it wasn't a full stadium. 1967 homecoming. Still massive and a lot of folks. Mud Bowl was the most memorable for a 7 year old. Couldn't believe what looked like adults were purposefully getting muddy like that. Also, strangely, most of the adults at my Buddys' Dad's frat house had cups to drink out of that we weren't offered.
I seem to remember people bringing in coolers also. Not sure.
February 12th, 2023 at 9:30 AM ^
Were they from Ohio?
February 12th, 2023 at 10:47 AM ^
Indiana (the opponent) and they had opposable thumbs so...no.
February 12th, 2023 at 6:07 PM ^
we absolutely brought in coolers when i was an undergrad.
February 12th, 2023 at 4:11 PM ^
I sort of get where you are coming from.
To me, arenas are mostly all like each other. Indoors, climate-controlled, overpriced concessions, luxury boxes that are out of my price range, generally good sight lines. But not much in differentiation.
Stadiums, however --- there's usually a lot of diversity here and I appreciate the differences.
February 12th, 2023 at 4:58 PM ^
Just one man's epinion, but I think you have a partially uninstructed view. You get that the most important thing is the crowd, and the culture that accompanies a particular team. Your appreciation for architecture--or the way that this may contribute to reception of the game--as you note, is limited. A number of teams (for example) are putting in less seats when they modernize stadiums, realizing that by having the seating rise less gradual, better views, you can improve the experience and the sense of accompanying intensity.
February 11th, 2023 at 10:47 PM ^
On top of all of that, they actually try to keep the game (and breaks from the game) fun: constant T-shirt give aways, trivia, random funny stuff on the big screen, all fairly entertaining.
Eh. I like when there is actual down time during breaks so that you can talk to the person seated next to you. I don't need to be entertained constantly, like a 2-year-old.
February 11th, 2023 at 11:12 PM ^
Don't most arenas do things during breaks? The ones I attend do.
February 12th, 2023 at 7:51 AM ^
Upvote here.
Why does there have to be constant noise?
I've gotta run. Some kids are on my lawn.
February 12th, 2023 at 9:32 AM ^
The worst trend in the modern NBA fan experience is the constant beats coming during play as teams are bringing the ball up or setting up half court. I wonder if it's as distracting to the players as it is to the viewers.
February 12th, 2023 at 7:59 AM ^
I pretty much agree with this, though I'll admit to enjoying watching random students racing across the field or trying to catch footballs from the JUGS machine.
February 12th, 2023 at 11:30 AM ^
They absolutely need to stop the JUGS bullshit unless they can figure out how to actually make the damn thing work. It's frustrating to eveyone to see a kid standing on the 40 try to catch a punt that lands on the 18. He/she then stands on the 25 and watches it sail over their head to the 45. They never seem to have a legitimate chance.
February 12th, 2023 at 10:41 AM ^
I had to come back in from yelling at kids on my lawn to upvote this. Late 90s games at Michigan Stadium were so great because I could catch up with my buddies during timeouts while yelling at TV Timeout Guy. I don't want constant music blaring in my ears and dogs throwing footballs during every break.
February 11th, 2023 at 10:47 PM ^
What’s interesting about these venues is the “coopertition” between them. One puts in Wi-Fi 6 and send’s out a “we are the first…” press release. Then, they share their findings with other venues in their league.
State Farm Arena here in Atlanta, for example, has an extremely efficient recycling/compostable waste disposal process - something like 95% of all trash gets put to another use. Will be cool to see this spread to other venues.
February 11th, 2023 at 10:56 PM ^
“Given that last game”? You mean the one with the AMAZING finish!?
February 11th, 2023 at 11:11 PM ^
Maybe seeing UM and MSU play an exciting game in Little Caesar's Arena has him thinking about other dual sport arenas and how fun it is to attend games in them?
February 11th, 2023 at 11:19 PM ^
I'd rather watch a basketball game at a venue like Mackey Arena than one of these modern places.
February 11th, 2023 at 11:22 PM ^
Weird topic, but ok. It's a slow season and I like attending games.
I haven't been to as many places recently. My budget and time for live sports is... diminished.
But I enjoy seeing different places. I've been to a few places here in Minnesota, and of course I've been to all the places in the Detroit area, albeit in some cases it has been quite a while.
My tastes vary depending on what kind of event I've gone to. When I go to a Michigan football game I care mostly about the football, and thus I've enjoyed TCF Bank Stadium just fine for what it is, a mid-sized college football venue that's fine but unspectacular. I've been to Mariucci when it was half full and when it was packed; half-full is better when I have a kid with me. It was packed for the B1G hockey championship game last year and my MN hockey fan friend took me and it was great, but my kids wouldn't have enjoyed it as much (except, you know, the part where we won on their ice).
Places with old charm have real value. Yost is obviously one of those places, and I miss it; Windsor Arena was an absolute dump, and also a fantastic place to see playoff hockey when the fans were crammed in there and buzzing.
But new can be good, too. Places that consider sightlines and comfort and give you spacious enough concourses to get around without having to push through people. Places with larger lobby areas that feel big and give you a place to mill about somewhat.
But, of course, the best places are the ones you love. Michigan Stadium. Yost. Yes, I even love Comerica Park and I manage to get there every few years. Our local arena here, Amsoil arena, is good too, and it's near home, but it was really only *great* when Michigan came for two wonderful days last season and we got to watch them play every minute.
February 11th, 2023 at 11:25 PM ^
IIRC, that stadium was built by taxpayer $ because the Bucks' owners were cozy with the former governor. Sounds like a great venue at least.
February 11th, 2023 at 11:51 PM ^
Nice arena, unfortunately you have to physically be in Wisconsin's shit hole to go here.
February 11th, 2023 at 11:57 PM ^
Dude, it’s Milwaukee
February 12th, 2023 at 1:27 AM ^
Assuming we are only talking about NBA/NHL arenas:
Best Pro Arenas I Have Visited
- Overall:
- FedExForum, Memphis Grizzlies
- Affordable tickets, good seats cheap parking, a solid team store, good food, and a good team that now has an actual homecourt advantage with its loud fans. Its the jack of all trades arena that is easily a top 2-3 arena in every category for me. Truly a hidden gem that has been renovated and improved multiple times in its brief now-19 seasons.
- FedExForum, Memphis Grizzlies
- Pricing/Bang For Your Buck:
- Golden 1 Center, Sacramento Kings
- Despite being close to the bay area, this arena is affordably priced for games (Kings usually suck) and the food options are solidly priced. Parking is a bit expensive, but you are parking downtown, so I can let it slide a bit.
- Golden 1 Center, Sacramento Kings
- Atmosphere:
- Amalie Arena, Tampa Bay Lightning
- This may not be fair since I have only been here for playoff games, but man they do it big here. The fans are rabid (and not just rabid because its filled with Florida men) and the energy is cranked to a 10 every game.
- Amalie Arena, Tampa Bay Lightning
- Seat Views:
- FedExForum, Memphis Grizzlies
- As a basketball-only arena, you are right on top of the action. You can make out everything just fine since even the nosebleed seats are right there, and the scoreboard too is massive.
- FedExForum, Memphis Grizzlies
- Arena Location:
- Verizon Venter, Washington Wizards
- Literally in the heart of china town - though the arena actually meant DC had to eminent domain an entire square block of the old china town - eek. Still a super fun area with tons of dining options, and the arena also doubles as a massive subway station which gets you anywhere you want quickly.
- Verizon Venter, Washington Wizards
- Concourses:
- Little Caesars Arena, Detroit Pistons
- Massive, wide-open concourses with natural light in areas and cool wall art. You can navigate easily and get to your seat in a breeze.
- Little Caesars Arena, Detroit Pistons
- Team Store:
- Fiserv Forum, Milwaukee Bucks
- Huge team store that is well maintained and has plenty of options. Very friendly staff as well - even on game days. In addition, they have multiple smaller (but still large) stores throughout the concourses.
- Fiserv Forum, Milwaukee Bucks
- Concessions:
- Prudential Center, New Jersey Devils
- Totally wanted to go with the Chase Center...or the FedEx Forum because they offer so many BBQ options, but Prudential Center has by far the best quality "standard" food options I have ever had - chicken tenders, fries, burgers, etc. are all great and affordably priced.
- Prudential Center, New Jersey Devils
Worst Arenas I Have Visited
- Overall:
- Honda Center, Anaheim Ducks
- I am a bit biased because I lived right down the street (5 minute walk to games) from this arena, so I went to it the most. Its overpriced, has awful seat views despite being close to the action because they have massively thick metal rails everywhere blocking your view combined with a bad angle for seats, has bad food choices that are all obscenely expensive, and has nothing to do in the area since its basically sandwiched between a dried up riverbed, apartments, and the Angels Stadium parking lot. The Ducks fans are always outnumbered here too - which is great for Red Wings away games, though.
- Honda Center, Anaheim Ducks
- Pricing/Bang For Your Buck:
- Staples Center/Crypto.com Arena, Los Angeles Lakers
- I wanted to say the Chase Center in San Francisco since its by far the most expensive arena for tickets - and food/drinks is pretty expensive there too. however, The Chase Center has amazing food choices and serves some great brews. The Staples Center, on the other hand, serves poor quality standard food choices and prices them near the top of the league. The tickets and parking for a Lakers game are horrible too. In fact, its so outrageous what the Lakers charge, that I will gladly wait for my Grizzlies to take on the Clippers instead. Despite being the same arena, Clippers price everything much better.
- Staples Center/Crypto.com Arena, Los Angeles Lakers
- Atmosphere:
- Honda Center, Anaheim Ducks
- Tossup between this and the Lakers' arena. However, despite being very quiet for its size when you got to a Lakers game, you will see Lakers fans. When you go to a Ducks game at the Honda Center, the stadium becomes a home ice advantage for the visiting team. The only time I have seen a numerical advantage for the Ducks fans here was when they played the Seattle Kraken last year - a team that has no fans yet.
- Honda Center, Anaheim Ducks
- Seat Views:
- Madison Square Garden, New York Knicks
- Seating angle sucks and the massive bowl layout makes for the need of binoculars to see anything. Its better now, but it is still awful.
- Madison Square Garden, New York Knicks
- Arena Location:
- Wells Fargo Center, Philadelphia 76ers
- Located in a massive parking lot and miles from downtown or anything all that exciting. Also right next to the highway and airport, which makes for nightmares if you ever want to go to games on weekday evenings.
- Wells Fargo Center, Philadelphia 76ers
- Concourses:
- Honda Center, Anaheim Ducks
- No escalators and only 2 stairwells make this a pain of an arena if you have to sit in the upper deck. And entire sections of the very narrow concourses are blocked off - making them more like horseshoes than circles in that you have to backtrack all the way to your seat once you reach the end.
- Honda Center, Anaheim Ducks
- Team Store:
- Wells Fargo Center, Philadelphia 76ers
- Probably <1000 square feet of disorganized chaos. Every time I have been here, there are hundreds of shirts on the floor being stepped on, and everything has been picked over - even when I am one of the first people in the store. Need anything in a specific size? Good luck.
- Wells Fargo Center, Philadelphia 76ers
- Concessions:
- Honda Center, Anaheim Ducks
- This arena has the worst food selection I have ever seen, combined with obscene prices. Hope you like $18 for a 16 ounce Bud Light, and $20+ for anything decent. Food choices are pretty much limited to pre-made boxed pizzas, super pretzels, and hot dogs.
- Honda Center, Anaheim Ducks
February 12th, 2023 at 8:41 AM ^
But how do you really feel about the Honda Center and the Anaheim Ducks?
February 12th, 2023 at 9:34 AM ^
Holy formatting, Batman!
February 12th, 2023 at 9:37 AM ^
Diary
February 12th, 2023 at 10:25 AM ^
I know it’s not an arena, but Augusta National is hard to beat for a sports venue.
Beautiful scenery. You can get a beer and a sandwich for under ten bucks. No cellphones allowed.
February 12th, 2023 at 12:33 PM ^
I don’t follow golf very closely, but isn’t Augusta one of if not the hardest sporting venue to get into in the country, possibly the world?
I thought you could only buy tickets for the practice round of the Masters, but for the actual event you need to either win them through the lottery system or get corporate tickets through your company (probably means you have to be a bigwig or be good buddies with someone who is). That was always my impression.