Michigan Starting Defense Projections.
I think we will have a "Michigan Defense" this season and one gander at this starting lineup should be enough to convince even the most fatal of fatalists. We are stacked. Can we live up to the billing? The biggest question I have is team speed which will be revealed against ND, Ohio, Sparty and our bowl opponent. Ideally you would like your DBs (sub 4.5) LBs (sub 4.7) DEs (sub 4.9) and DTs (sub 5.1). Not sure if we are there on the Dline yet. Regardless, heres what I've got guys......
C- Blake Countess- 5ft10 180lbs (Rjr)
C- Raymon Taylor- 5ft10 184lbs (Sr)
SS- Jarod Wilson- 6ft2 205lbs (Jr)
FS- Dymonte Thomas- 6ft2 193lbs (So)
Nickel- Jabril Peppers- 6ft1 205 (Fr)
OLB- Joe Bolden- 6ft3 231 (Jr)
MLB- Jake MF Ryan- 6ft3 236lbs (Rsr)
SAM- Royce Jenkins Stone- 6ft2 234lbs (Jr)/ James Ross III- 6ft1 227lbs (Jr) Torn.....
SDE- Taco Charlton-6ft6 276lbs (So)
WDE- Frank Clark- 6ft2 277lbs (Sr)
DT- Chris Wormley- 6ft4 295 (Rso)
DT- Ondre Pipkins- 6ft3 306lbs (Jr)
Average size for Secondary= 6ft+ /193lbs
Average size for "Backers"= 6ft3 / 234lbs
Average size for DLine= 6ft4/ 289lbs
Average * rating for Defense= 3.92
Average years in program= 2
*Safety is the weakest link. Peppers can slide to safety and Hill and Clark can be of service there as well.
*Jourdan Lewis will push at both corner spots and Stribling/ TR3 should contribute.
* We have a slew of 4 star LBs on the bench (4) plus D. Morgan.
* We have 5 Four star D-Lineman on the bench not including Godin/Hurst/Henry.
* This Michigan defense is deep and talented. Fatigue should not be an issue. We have more NFL talent on this defense than we have had in 8 years. Time to get after peoples' ass.
*Charlton/Bolden/Jenkins-Stone/Clark can all run well from what I've gathered which alleviates much of my concern with team speed. Our secondary should be just fine in that dept.
With Ohio's Oline issues I don't see an offense that we can't matchup with.
K? Bye now. Good talk.
Especially about the getting after people's asses, this is the year for the defense.
If they can hold people to 20 points or less a game we will be in every one and have a chance to win them all.
I'm not saying we will win every game just saying we will have a chance to do so.
Biggs is one of our better tacklers. If RJS can supplant him then he must've worked his ass off over the spring/summer. I see RJS getting clock but Biggs being the starter.
I think we are missing some message board insider info. Still seems crazy that RJS would start over Ross.
NT- Pipkins / Henry
5T – Wormley / Hurst
WDE – Clark / Ojemudia
SDE – Beyer / Taco (I’m hoping Taco progresses to a 50/50 split as the yr goes on)
WILL – Bolden / Morgan
MIKE – Ryan / Gedeon
SAM – Ross / RJS
Nickel – Peppers / Countess
BCB – Lewis / Taylor
FCB – Countess / Taylor
FS – Wilson / Clark
SS - Thomas / Hill
If SS is a shaky spot once games get rolling I hope Peppers moves there sooner rather than later.
LOOK at the BACK-UPS!! BEASTS!
_
An offshoot of this depth chart
Most critical players - either due to impact or drop from him to next guy in depth chart
- Wilson - only established returning safety. If he goes down there is almost zilch experience in either S spot. Scary.
- JMFR - some people have forgotten how great this guy was in 2012. He was in total beast mode... injury seemed to hold him back last year even after he returned, as he has admitted (said it was mental recently)
- Clark - while Clark has not been a super hero player, Mario O IMO has not made much impact so I feel the variance between the 2 is pretty significant.
Young dudes I am most excited about
- Gedeon - Just a taste in the OSU game but other than JMFR he looked like our largest LB LAST year, and he made plays.
- Wormley - he was coming off an ACL so probably still only 85% but he made splash plays. TFLs and sacks. Size allows him to be a DT on passing playings and a DE on running plays IMO.
- Henry - another guy who made splash plays. Having an impact on the DL at this age, especially at the 3 or 5 is difficult. Both he and Wormley showed flashes of it - having 3 more years of these 2 has me happy. Seems like some issues with Henry work rate per coaches comments so thats the wildcard
- Lewis - ton of spring hype, if he wrests a starting CB job away it means only good things for depth. More physical than our 2 starting CBs despite similar size from all accounts.
I left Peppers off the 2nd list since I only listed players I have seen play CFB. Freshman secondary players tend to make errors so I will assume unless we hit a gold mine he will get exploited at times.
I'm really surprised how little talk Dymonte Thomas continues to get. He was a highly touted 5* recruit. I really hope he is a big time sleeper this year. M needs to get top production from these kinds of recruits.
This is in no way a slight against anyone who has NOT put DT on their excitement level lists, btw. Just my 2 cents.
August 7th, 2014 at 10:28 AM ^
For my list I didn't see anything from Thomas last year other than the blocked punt on ST. From a defensive standpoint I listed 3 players I saw some serious flashes and 1 player who got a ton of spring hype and at least played the position last year for decent periods of each game (Lewis). Thomas may turn out to be great or average or poor - I don't know. But right now I have almost no data on him at the college level - he barely played. They all have long careers ahead of them - I am just going off what they have done in year 1 or year 2. I'd say Thomas and Gedeon had the least game action but I noticed Gedeon when he was out there.
I am past the point of getting overly hyped by stars once they sign and are on campus and get into games. Henry the 3 star impressed me more late in the year than Pipkins the 5 star early last year.
(1 small note - Thomas was a 4 star not a 5 star)
August 7th, 2014 at 10:44 AM ^
I agree with your assessment, and you are right, he was a 4*. Obviously the coaches thought there were holes in his game last year or they would have played him more, so you are spot on.
FWIW, I listened to the Hoke fall camp presser and he was name dropping Thomas at the safety position. We will see how it all shakes out in a few weeks!
if he is the starting NB that means he jumped to at least 3rd corner on the depth chart. And it looks to me like we have at least 3 solid, experienced corners. I would not call it a shame if Peppers locks down the nickel. With most teams running 3 and 4 reciever sets, Nickel is basically a 12th starter anymore anyways
Generally you want your "talented but inexperienced" dude playing nickel. That was the plan for Thomas 12 months ago at this time as well but the coaches decided to rotate him in multiple spots and from all accounts he struggled with that. Peppers is not an early enrollee so having him focus on 1 position makes sense. There are plenty of options at CB right now with more experience so I don't have an issue with it and I dont want to see him at S right now (personally others disagree) because reading the entire D from that position seems like a challenge for someone on campus for so short. I think in 12 months we'll have a better idea of where he is going to settle - right now he is a wide eyed freshman on campus for all of 8 weeks or whatever. Someone like a Watson has been there since January and they are talking about him as a backup S for this year which makes more sense from the standpoint of at least having 15 more practices in this defense and being immersed in the program for half a year more.
The Michigan coaching staff has been wanting an athletic, physical NB since they arrived. A guy that can cause havoc and make plays and set the edge like Tyrann Mathieu did at LSU a few years back. People forget that he was far from a polished product, wasn't even close to the best CB on his team, but he was super athletic and could make plays and made the LSU defense that much better.
Michigan has been forced to play guys like Countess at NB because he could do that consistently, but that's not where Countess is optimally set. Countess should be on the single receiver side optimally. But they did that because Thomas wasn't ready from a playing in space standpoint, which is fine, but Peppers has played in space throughout HS, he's a more natural immediate fit at NB and he brings that difference maker ability.
NB is not a slight for Peppers. It gives him a position where his technique can be a bit flawed but he has help all around him to make up for him, and allows him to play fast, aggressive, and make plays. There is a reason the coaches keep saying he's a NB, because he's the type of player they have wanted at NB since they arrived.
Will disagree with you. Look at the great defenses of the past 10-20 years. College or pro. They generally have a shut down elite corner to take away half the field. I have no idea what Peppers will be some day. But if he becomes that sort of corner the rest of your defense has a massive halo effect. If he just an average corner then I agree with you - go put his playmaking skills somewhere else.
He is not a proven WR so where are you going to put him on offense? There is a logjam at RB - we have 4 now who are all high recruits (1 a transfer). And look what the NFL is valuing - more and more CBs are drafted very high - there is a reason. When you find a bad ass CB it is invaluable. It changes your whole defense.
I do not like the wildcat formation. It has some strengths, but once defenses realized they could also go backward to the defenses that were used to stop that type of offense before, the wildcat has been pretty consistently below average for an offense.
August 7th, 2014 at 10:38 AM ^
@ Cobra
I have no idea if he is a lockdown corner and I am not sure how you can evaluate him either - he has played exactly 0 games in college. And even after this year we won't know if he is a lockdown corner. They don't walk in at 18 years old and be Revis.
But my larger point is I think we have difference makers on the offensive side of the ball. It is hard to judge Peppers HS film on offense - if he is Reggie Bush, sure I get it. But he looked like Reggie Bush versus HS kids. If he can do it versus Wisconsin, that's another story. But I for one want to see an elite defense. Elite defense travels. It is consistent. It doesn't have off days. We have enough young talent everywhere on offense at the skill positions. I want some difference makers on our defense again. I cant even remember the last difference maker in the secondary at UM. Someone you have to scheme around. It's been a while. And on the defense as a whole we are talking Jake Ryan, Brandon Graham, and Mike Martin over the past 7-8 years. We need multiple ones on the field at once. And CB and DE are the 2 positions that can change your entire defense. So I'd like to try him first at CB and see if he is that difference maker.
He'll be able to make plays on offense eventually, but his potential and skill level are much higher on defense. You don't just move kids around willy nilly from year to year when you expect them to hit that learning curve hard and make an impact on his eventual position almost immediately.
Peppers was probably a top 10 RB and a top 10 WR in the country for a HS prospect last year. He was the #1 CB or #1 Safety coming it. That's the difference. You take a guy that's really good, or you take a guy that is a rare potential player on that side of the field. That's why he's on defense. The coaches can figure out S or CB next year, for now, you limit his role and let him make plays on that side of the ball. Many of the skills translate, so it isn't simply a wasted year, they will translate to his eventual position and make him that much closer to his potential for going forward.
August 7th, 2014 at 11:08 AM ^
I like that you have a very colorful, unique advatar, as it makes scanning through comments to find your insight much easier. Thanks.
August 7th, 2014 at 11:11 AM ^
Peppers will spend plenty of time on offense from all his interceptions and fumble recoveries from huge hits.
Actually, if you have seen film of Peppers, the much more logical use of his talents is at corner because, at least in the film that is available, he's pretty much everywhere the ball is. I rather like the idea - if it happens to be the case - that Peppers would become the starting NB because having a true freshman as your #3 corner says much that is positive about his ability. Peppers on offense? I know they've hinted that he might find himself in certain situations on offense, but more one-off type stuff and not every down.
August 7th, 2014 at 12:11 PM ^
I feel you in the sense that we want to put the ball in his hands at some point, but I believe they are going to try him out in the return game this year so he should get some touches.
THIS is the worst comment ever.
August 7th, 2014 at 11:12 AM ^
all day
Not to be that guy, but even Charles Woodson didn't start right away at the boundary or field CB if I'm not mistaken?
August 7th, 2014 at 11:15 AM ^
Peppers has suited up once in pads at Michigan? I think he's doing pretty well already if he is considered the starting NB by the first game.
August 7th, 2014 at 11:03 AM ^
Where is all this RJS hype coming from? He hasn't gotten any meaningful snaps. I don't see him passing Ross.
August 7th, 2014 at 11:28 AM ^
Various reports out of spring practice said that RJS has improved a lot. Recall that he came in pretty thin, and if memory serves, he didn't gain a lot his first year. He's still not huge, but in the acceptable range now. Meanwhile reports out of spring had it that "the light turned on" for him. Adding it together, and many have reported that he and Ross are neck and neck.
Whether RJS starts, I like to think that he could. I've bought in and have gone all Marcus Hall on other Big 10 fans I know claiming that our 2nd string linebackers are better than their first team.
August 7th, 2014 at 12:58 PM ^
That's good to hear. The depth at LB is great to see.
It seems like it because you're avoiding/ignoring everything that's been reported thus far.
Beyer's going to start, period.
Morgan and Ross are your likely starters at OLB as well.
Dymonte is a SS, so you'd flip he and Wilson since Wilson is a FS.
August 7th, 2014 at 11:19 AM ^
Week 1 projected lineup
SDE- Beyer
NT- Pipkins
DT- Wormley
WDE- F. Clark
SAM- Ross
MIKE- Ryan
WILL- Morgan
CB- Countess
CB- R. Taylor/Lewis
FS- Wilson
SS- Watson
Nickel- Peppers
There are some holes on special teams we may need to focus on. Glanda is gone. Felt like he was the LS here for 20 years.
A new holder? Dileo was the holder virtually his whole career, and probably the most famous holder ever after the win over NW.
A new punt returner? Norfleet.....I hope he's figured out how to catch/field/call punts off. Hopefully he's like Gallon.
From "DAMN IT GALLON DON'T DROP THE PUNT" to what he later became.
August 7th, 2014 at 11:29 AM ^
Watson starting at SS? Almost no chance that happens. Even if Hill can't go right away they'd go Dymonte for sure and probably Clark over true frosh Watson.
August 7th, 2014 at 11:43 AM ^
Who knows.
For Peppers to be at Nickel, that means they must have someone in mind.
Wasn't Watson generating rave reviews in spring?
August 7th, 2014 at 11:42 AM ^
August 7th, 2014 at 12:20 PM ^
To start Pepper out at NB! By next year or year 3 he will be a lock down DB! I see him taking punt returns as well as playing wide-out at times on offense. He's got the speed! I hope he develops into a Woodson but Woodson's are usually once in every 50 year type dominating players!
August 7th, 2014 at 12:25 PM ^
I love it that NONE of the national guys are even talking about how good these defense should be....although I can sort of understand that after last years' poor season.