Measured, sane column on where Harbaugh is at
"Here’s Harbaugh’s record after the fifth game of his third season on the job – 24-7. Here’s Nick Saban’s record after the fifth game of his third season on the job – 23-8. Here’s Mark Dantonio’s record after the fifth game of his third season on the job – 18-13.
(I’m not including Urban Meyer during the same stretch of time at Ohio State because, quite frankly, it doesn’t fit my argument!)"
http://www.freep.com/story/sports/college/university-michigan/wolverine…
He also states: "He hasn’t yet passed MSU and he may never pass MSU."
Which I think is poppycock. We may have lost the game on Saturday, but just on the integrity of the program alone, and in recruiting, he has passed them. And once he gets his offense figured out he will begin beating them on a regular basis.
October 10th, 2017 at 12:15 PM ^
we do need help. We need MSU to lose twice. And before you tell me that there is no way MSU is going to beat either PSU and OSU I will remind you that "there was no way MSU was going to beat us" this year and "there was no way MSU was going to beat OSU" in 2015.
October 10th, 2017 at 12:29 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 10:50 PM ^
Help for what? Winning the Big Ten? We're too young and don't have a QB who's ready. And MSU will lose more than twice, they'll probably lose Saturday to Minnesota. They aren't ready yet, either.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:29 AM ^
Of those three games, Michigan had the only decisive victory. The two losses had some serious bad luck involved and we essentially lost two coin flips. Split the coin flips down the middle and Michigan is 2-1. The problem is that Michigan had serveral advantages in the coin flip games, at home and better overall personelle to name two. Michigan should have taken advantage and not had one, or both, of those games, hinge on some bad luck.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:36 AM ^
When msu lined up to block the punt with nobody back, and our coaches sitting on sideline doing nothing except being dumbfounded, and leaving our players out wide instead of coming in to block... well, they DESERVED the loss..... be clear on that. Time after time they didn't adjust to dantoni shenanigans.
October 10th, 2017 at 3:29 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 11:30 AM ^
But he isn't 3-0, he is 1-2. But he is undefeated when it comes to recruiting. I'll hang my hat on that.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:39 AM ^
I know you don't see it, but the hope and belief that we are going to be the Death Star and that State is going to be irrelevant is the primary reason that this fan base is losing their mind about this loss. This is not "Harbaugh can win in recruiting but he can't win on the field." Neither is it "they should get their shots in now because we are going to DOMINATE them soon." It is neither of those things. Whether we like it or not, in the 8 years we were f-ing around with RR and Hoke, Michigan State built a program that is going to have some staying power. This is an in-state rivalry with two good, competitive football programs that are going to be battling for years to come in really good games. They played better than us this year and got the win. There is a lot of football to be played though and we will see them again next year.
October 10th, 2017 at 8:05 PM ^
There is no way this rag tag sparty team should have come into the big house at night and beat us. The defense did play lights out in the 2nd half but they did give up an 84 yard drive to sparty in the 2nd QTR. Our offense was horrible the entire game except for a few plays in the 3rd QTR. It has happened before, the '78 sparty win, and a few times in the 80s they should not have won. They have owned us the past 12 years but during RR and Hoke years, they had better talent. Oh well, may be next season we can go up and beat them but this victory over us took their program off of life support.
October 10th, 2017 at 1:58 PM ^
Exactly. Add in last year's OSU game as one that easily could have gone our way, and the much talked about 1-4 Harbaugh rivalry record would instead be 4-1, and the narrative is radically different.
October 10th, 2017 at 10:52 AM ^
Even sniff around the Freep or Det News after a loss to MSU? It's like inviting a troll into your mind to take up residence rent free. Even Baumgardner is getting real annoying about the doom and gloom writing. Just stay away and enjoy a week before Indiana. You have all year for Sparty friends and family to rib you about this one.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:05 AM ^
It takes time to build a dynasty.. Dantonio took a while, Harbaugh won't take that long but he also won't do it as quickly as Meyer (he basically walked into an already churning program and with the perfect QB for his system in Braxton Miller). And Nick Saban has the luxury of lax academic standards and a treasure trove of talent in his backyard. Not making excuses but people pointing to what Saban or Meyer have done are using the exceptions, not the rule. Dantonio is probably a better comparison given where the program was when JH took over. Now, obviously Harbaugh has had a faster turnaround than Sparty but to be competing at an elite level year in and year out like Alabama and OSU takes more than two and a half years.
Some Stanford students wrote a book, Rags to Roses, detailing their road from well rags to the Rose Bowl. As we know it all started with Harbaugh.. one of the quotes, by Harbaugh himself is especially important for us now... (emphasis mine). Hint, it takes time to build something great.
"You took yourself back to the 17th century, back when they had flywheels in mills and things, he says. Big, 2,000-pound rock flywheel. And the hard part is to get it started, to get it moving. And once you get it moving, that thing just gets faster and faster and faster and faster. And it does great work, it accomplishes what it's supposed to accomplish. But when it's at a stop, the force that it takes to get it moving is huge."
Right now we have our defensive flywheel in full motion, and it didn't take very long to do so. Unfortunately the offense isn't where anyone wants it but it does take time to get it moving, especially with positions like OL and QB. The two handpicked QB's are a RS Frosh and a true Frosh, can't expect them to be world beaters yet. And yes, the OL has had some misses and botches (Swenson/Hamilton) and a massive injury to Newsome which has had an impact far beyond just losing one key player. But the program is headed in the right direction and they will get the offense to where the defense is, reloading every year and being just as good if not better. But that might take another year or two, God forbid. But in the meantime I'll gladly take only 9/10 win seasons while we wait for the Michigan Deathstar to be fully operational.
Have we forgotten the 7 years prior to Harbaugh already? 46-40 or about 7-6 on average per year (rounding up).
October 10th, 2017 at 12:22 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 11:02 AM ^
I never got the whole "hasn't passed ___" argument. Winning or losing a game doesn't make you a better or worse team. You telling me the Jets have passed the Patriots if they somehow win on Sunday?
October 10th, 2017 at 4:57 PM ^
It's a great point. I love college football. But the fans, compared to hard core pro football fans, are very weak in the big picture department. Their moment to moment overreactions and flip flops are often hard to keep up with.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:02 AM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 11:08 AM ^
Excellent points! People are acting like we're 1-4 on the season and in a RR/Hoke-like downward spiral. SMH.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:14 AM ^
they're just 1-4 against OSU and MSU under Harbaugh.
October 10th, 2017 at 6:51 PM ^
You're right, but that doesn't mean he's a bad coach and can't/won't get it done. It sucks for sure, but sometimes that's how the cookie crumbles. Botched snap and a back-up QB away from 3-0 against MSU. Some bad officiating and a bad spot away from 1-1 vs OSU, which would have led to a Big Ten title most likely and a playoff spot. Not like he's been blown out (save for 2015) every year and hasn't even been competitive against them.
Of course we'd love to be 5-0 against them now but sometimes games are 50/50 and you end up on the wrong end of the shaft. Does it suck? Yes. Does it mean he can't turn it around? No. Sky is not falling but go ahead and think it is.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:26 AM ^
We haven't been blown out, the losses have been very close games which could have gone either way. Need some big ugly athletic OL and that will help the QB (whoever he is) get some passes off.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:37 AM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 1:37 PM ^
In some ways, I think the fact that the games have been so close has actually made it even more frustrating for fans. I am of the opinion that Harbaugh is a great coach and he is doing a fine job with this team, but close losses are the hardest to take. At least during the RR era and the end of the Hoke era, there were times where we knew that we weren't good enough to win and so nobody really cared all that much. The ways in which we have lost to MSU and OSU last year are downright painful and certainly just a bit of bad luck quite frankly. Let's hope that we find ways to win close games in the future instead of lose them otherwise Harbaugh risks the real possibility of being labeled as a John Cooper type coach. Cooper had great teams at OSU, but somehow they always seemed to come up short in the biggest of games. Nobody wants that to define Harbaugh's tenure but unfortunately it has so far.
In games decided by 7 points or less, Michigan is 3-6 under Harbaugh with wins over Minnesota (2015), Indiana (2015), and Wisconsin (2016). Those are the facts so far and they aren't pretty. Let's just hope that these stats turn around soon. Michigan is good enough to compete with just about anyone, but not so good yet to blow good teams out. This means we are going to find ourselves in a lot of close games.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:32 AM ^
Except Dantonio has 3 big ten titles, and Urban meyer has a national championship. It will take a bit more than just beating them one more time to surpass them.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:53 AM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 3:34 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 11:06 AM ^
We do that around these parts?
October 10th, 2017 at 11:41 AM ^
Like a Jemele Hill tweet.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:06 AM ^
We do that around these parts?
October 10th, 2017 at 11:08 AM ^
You can't really include OSU and Meyer because that lucky bastard walked into a loaded dynasty and did not have the task to rebuild ANYTHING. Literally anything. I don't give a shit that OSU had a poor 2011 season. That team was loaded and Meyer knew it.
EDIT: I'm also done saying Harbaugh will beat MSU on a regular basis so long as Dantonio is there. That guy has Michigan figured out. It seems it will be a lot of back and forth until that douchebag retires.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:09 AM ^
"He hasn't passed MSU yet."
That's interesting. I always thought 10-3 was better than 3-9.
October 10th, 2017 at 7:34 PM ^
In reality that is what it is all about. Let's see how this season play's out. I think Michigan will finish with a better record. I more than anyone was writing Michigan off, but I am willing to see how they respond. If state continues with there style there tactics will cost them. There may only be one crew who watches an o-lineman hammer a lb with his fist and then throw the flag on the lb.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:12 AM ^
Dantonio started a 6 year stretch of dominance (65 wins, 3 big ten titles, and a 3-2 record against OSU) in year 4. I hope Harbaugh does the same.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:20 AM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 11:21 AM ^
but it wasn't terrible. The point is valid, fans get caught up in hype and then implode, and we are tremendously lucky to have Harbaugh. I'll cosign any appreciation thread.
Dantonio is the closest thing Sparty has to Bo Schembechler; legendary in terms of how he motivated people. I give Dantonio that although I don't think he's half the man Bo was, he knows how to motivate his players very effectively. and No I'm not condoning his on field deliberate dirty plays - I do wonder what the anwer is though?
October 10th, 2017 at 11:28 AM ^
Yes...I'm new. So, please cut me some slack.
I haven't seen this fact mentioned anywhere, but I find it interesting (if not a bit alarming) when I looked at our record in 1-score games (with Jim).
Our record is 21-1 in games decided by more than 1 score (OSU 2015 - ugh!!). That makes our record a dismal 3-6 when it's a 1-score game.
It goes without saying, but we need to get better in close games.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:32 AM ^
mean, in most of those games where the score isn't close we have been beating somebody senseless, so of course we don't have a bad record in those games. I think it goes without saying that you have a better chance of losing a close game than a game where you blow somebody out so it does not surprise me that we have losses in close games than in games where we are blowing a team out. This would not seem to be surprising.
October 10th, 2017 at 12:44 PM ^
Damn Peppers and his two point return last year. If not for that we'd be 4-6 in 1-score games.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:34 AM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 12:59 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 11:35 AM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 12:06 PM ^
Was Tyrone looking for a bigger role? Possible OC?
October 10th, 2017 at 12:30 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 12:55 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 2:00 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 11:38 AM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 12:40 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 12:52 PM ^
October 10th, 2017 at 5:33 PM ^
I was thinking the same thing. I really hoped the o line would be coming together more quickly. We absolutely need a bonafide RB coach, like say someone who has actually played the position. With the talent and depth we have at the position we should be averaging at least 150 yards per game.
October 10th, 2017 at 11:48 AM ^
blah, blah, blah
He hasn't passed MSU yet and probably never will. Except when he did last year blowing them out on their field and winning 7 more games than them.....But, but, but.....
Bottom line on all this: Pointless noise as deep as the leftover toothpaste spit at the bottom of the bathroom sink.
These MSM click bait takes comparing things on the most fatuous level possible, are best left not clicked. Time wasters which only enrich the the low brows who cooked up the takes.
Let's face it, we dread another year of dealing with dorky State fans at family gatherings or the office. So we act like weenies over losing this game. Let's also face it, we got bored within a a couple days of kicking their ass last year. We would have been the same this year if we pulled a lucky TD out at the end.
The game (when Michigan loses) has always been for State people and the media to stoke clicks and "Michigan football is dying" memes. It's a big nothing when Michigan wins. Even for Michigan fans.
If we rattle off 5 out of 6 here coming up, our pulse will barely raise and State fans will do what they always do after the game: vanish and surface in early January ready to talk hoops.