MBB Rankings
Rankings are out. If you have actually watched this team you know they are top 20 caliber. I know rankings are mostly meaningless but still can’t believe we don’t crack the top 25 after pounding UCF. This team has more depth at key positions than I’ve seen in a while and I feel Wagner and Livers are going to start dominating. Williams, Dickinson, Brown, Johns and hopefully Zeb make us 10 deep solid. I’d say even our bench has outplayed the starters.
https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/rankings
December 7th, 2020 at 1:32 PM ^
Eh, it's fair to have them where they are. They haven't beaten anyone even considered top 100. They went to OT in a game they played really badly to a team that's outside the top 300 and which is getting pounded by everyone else by 40.
I think they could be top 20 but they haven't really proven that...yet.
The voters don't exactly go on things like "I feel Wagner and Livers are going to start dominating". The fact they aren't yet (and that Franz has been quite disappointing) is exactly why it's fair to have them at 26th right now.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:41 PM ^
My point is that without them(Franz and Livers) blowing up, we have maintained an upward trajectory. So we had a bad game against Oakland, big deal we still won and gained experience. We know Franz and Livers will blow up, they have proven they will. But I appreciate the snark though and the voters actually do go based on projections...
December 7th, 2020 at 2:01 PM ^
I didn't see any snark. Just a reasoned response
December 7th, 2020 at 7:21 PM ^
My bad... one of those days.
December 7th, 2020 at 7:34 PM ^
<<redacted>> we all have those days....
December 7th, 2020 at 1:45 PM ^
Virginia LOST to a team ranked lower(by about 50 spots) on kenpom than the team we just demolished. They also haven't beaten anyone even considered top 150. They are ranked 18.
OSU and Rutgers haven't beaten anyone near the top 100, like we just did. They are both ranked.
UM deserves to be ranked in the top 25 IMO.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:46 PM ^
Franz hasn't shot the 3 well but he's been pretty good otherwise. He's shooting 52% overall which is crazy good for a wing, despite being 1-9 from 3. Probably our best rebounder (tied w/ Livers for team lead with fewer minutes). Once he starts hitting threes he'll be a force.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:47 PM ^
We have 3 KenPom top 150 double digit wins. Thats a better resume than multiple ranked teams
December 7th, 2020 at 4:02 PM ^
A lot of teams haven't proved themselves either to be in the top-25, including VA as has been pointed out, Illinois and Iowa. There's no reason why UM should be ranked behind those teams, except for the obvious, which is the preseason polls. Michigan is 16 in KenPom and 2 in realtimeRPI! ok maybe a little high but those would be more in line with the committee than the polls.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:32 PM ^
Well, we're #26, so almost there, keep winning and things will take care of themselves.
I love the depth too, keep improving!
December 8th, 2020 at 4:55 PM ^
Maybe if toledo can fall in overtime this thing can happen fast.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:34 PM ^
The fact that the AP bumped Tennessee up a spot, despite not having played a game yet this year, tells you all you need to know about rankings.
I agree with a lot of other folks. Don't give a shit about rankings as long as this team keeps getting better and keeps winning. I love the energy of these freshmen! I think Terrance Williams is rapidly becoming my new favorite player, but its tough to unseat Brandon Johns. They both bring so much energy, and they make those around them better.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:35 PM ^
We're basically #26 in each poll, I'm ok with that since 6 other B1G teams are ranked ahead of us. The underdog role fits us just fine at this point in time.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:36 PM ^
Rankings... meh. Not being ranked gives them something additional to plan for. That oakland game was not pretty.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:36 PM ^
If there are three things you can count on in life, one of them would be the basketball team being underrated at the beginning of the year and improving while the football team does just the opposite. Frankly, I like the fly under the radar nature of the basketball program. Keeping the attention in the region on Izzo then crushing his soul is as good as it gets.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:36 PM ^
once the season gets cancelled, it will officially be one in which we aren't ranked and the program isn't moving forward. Fire Howard.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:37 PM ^
The last thing they need is a "target" on their back. There are a lot of new contributors on this team and it will take time for them to gel, but by the end of the season (barring injuries), they could become a team that no one wants to face in the tournament. Go Blue!
December 7th, 2020 at 1:37 PM ^
This team has the potential to be a top 10-20 team by season’s end. Saying they are definitively in that caliber now is premature.
Ball state and BGSU are decent teams and one of them will likely make the tournament. UCF sure seems to have talent on their roster. But we have not played a team in the Kenpom top 100 yet.
I have a feeling this team will start to gain respect once Big Ten conference play starts. Plus, it always feels better to fly under the radar for a while before coming on strong.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:43 PM ^
Speaking of rankings and Kenpom, considering that every team has played so few games, I wouldn't even take much stock in Kenpom stuff right now.
I found it comical that in lasts nights game, the colorwoman, referenced UCF's dominating defense "holding teams to just 32% shooting on the season" apparently no one told her they had only played one game.
December 7th, 2020 at 4:13 PM ^
Not sure who she was, but she was almost unbearable. Possible the worst announcer I've ever heard on the B1G...which is saying alot.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:40 PM ^
The only rankings I take stock in are the kenpom rankings which use real data. We are currently #16 right now in those rankings.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:43 PM ^
Salient point!
December 7th, 2020 at 2:58 PM ^
We're #6 in RPI!!! That's the one I believe in (today).
December 7th, 2020 at 1:41 PM ^
Need the NC State game to happen this week. At least that could be a W against a decent ACC team.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:44 PM ^
Completely meaningless things that the board loves to endlessly debate:
1. Basketball rankings
2. Coaching searches
December 7th, 2020 at 2:08 PM ^
I’d like to see who would win a fight, silverback gorilla vs a grizzly bear added to the recurring debates. I’d take the bear.
December 7th, 2020 at 2:35 PM ^
that's fine and all, but wouldn't it be a better match up to have
ditka v. godzilla? who you got for that one, the lizard or ditka?
December 7th, 2020 at 2:37 PM ^
The bear outweighs the gorilla by a couple hundred pounds and has claws. I’m with you, unless it’s winter time, and then I’m going with the gorilla.
December 7th, 2020 at 3:25 PM ^
I think this was discussed on the joe Rogan podcast! Gorilla for the win!
December 7th, 2020 at 2:13 PM ^
Agree!!!
December 7th, 2020 at 1:44 PM ^
They definitely seem to be playing better, but looking at the resume as a whole I think fringe top 25 is about right for now.
They've got some really interesting pieces, and at times they seem to figure out how to put them together, but there have also been plenty of stretches of basketball where they don't look like a top 25 team.
They'll get there by the end of the year, assuming the season doesn't go down in covid flames.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:46 PM ^
Another year, another ranking where voters don't actually watch games or pay attention
There's no way Duke is the #10 team.
Michigan is 4-0 with 4 double digit wins, 3 of them being against KenPom top 150 teams. That's a better resume than a handful of ranked teams
December 7th, 2020 at 2:05 PM ^
All the wins have been by double digits the Oakland Game was 81-71, despite going to OT.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:47 PM ^
Meh, pollsters probably just caught the first 10 minutes of the UCF game, it will work itself out very soon.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:48 PM ^
Most of teams ahead of us have wins over power conference teams or started the season ranked ahead of us and haven't done anything to drop. Outside of the last 28 minutes, we haven't looked great. Had a close call with a bad team (Oakland) and the other two games were solid. I think we are not close to our potential, but I don't think we have a clear cut case to be ranked above the teams ahead of us. I think we are better than OSU, Rutgers, and maybe a few others, but it's not an open and shut case.
December 7th, 2020 at 1:48 PM ^
This is said all the time, but rankings mean jack shit, most of all in college basketball where there's a huge fuckin tournament to decide the champion
AP geniuses had Kentucky as a top ten team going into the year. They're 1-3 and look to be the worst Kentucky team Calipari has had (including their NIT team). And this isn't basketball, but the AP also had LSU as a top 6 team preseason. They must not have realized they lost their entire program to the draft and coaching changes
Vast majority of voters haven't watched a Michigan game this year, so just let them sleep. Plenty of games ahead of us to get the respect we deserve
December 7th, 2020 at 1:56 PM ^
I just looked at our BB recruiting rankings on 247 and realized that next season, we should have 8 of the highest 25 players that Michigan has ever signed (in the modern age of rankings) on our roster. This includes Houstan (#1), Diabate (#2), Dickinson (#11), Bufkin (#14), Collins (#15), Johns (#17), Jackson (#20), and Williams (#22). Livers will be in the NBA, and perhaps Wagner as well, but the 2021-2022 season looks like a dream team!
December 7th, 2020 at 4:09 PM ^
I hope so, but I think Johns could be our only player with more than 1 yr experience (no, Nunez doesn't count). I'm sure JH is a much better coach than Calipari, but sometimes having an entire team of Freshman studs doesn't always work out so well. I sure hope Dunkenson comes back.
December 7th, 2020 at 2:08 PM ^
I see ASU is ranked in the top-25. Has anyone watched Christopher yet? How has he looked?
December 7th, 2020 at 3:41 PM ^
He's a very good player, but I think he made the right decision for himself. ASU has like 4 good players and they just iso with one them every possession. There's no team ball played. Christopher is getting a good chance to show off for the NBA though. Obviously Christopher is a great talent, but it's definitely questionable how he would've fit in on this Michigan team. Between him and Chaundee, I think we actually ended up with the better fit for our team
December 7th, 2020 at 3:59 PM ^
I saw them play and would say it looked like quasi-organized streetball.
December 7th, 2020 at 6:04 PM ^
You just pretty much described the Pac 12 in basketball. They like to call it West Coast style. Remember a few years ago when Lamelo (I think) was at UCLA and all they did was run up and down the court and try to score without defense. It looked like the NBA Allstar game.
December 7th, 2020 at 2:26 PM ^
This team is raw and doesnt have its identity yet. Playing time and more games will really help them.
December 7th, 2020 at 2:32 PM ^
I'm not worried about it. Keep playing well for the next few weeks and things will shake themselves out. I'd rather sneak up the rankings than fall in them. Too much noise early in the season - there's too much gravity built in.
MSU is going to get a bump from beating Duke more than dinged for struggling against UD and even yesterday until the last few minutes too.
The good news in basketball is that we're going to play a ton of tough teams and settle it mostly on the court. I think about #25-30 is about right for now.
December 7th, 2020 at 2:34 PM ^
Just win baby win!!! The boys know they aren’t ranked which is perfect.
December 7th, 2020 at 2:46 PM ^
Rankings are sort of irrelevant most years, but especially this season where teams have such weird schedules. Michigan just needs to play well and if there's a tourney they'll be in it.
December 7th, 2020 at 2:46 PM ^
Eh. We went to OT with Oakland. I know other teams have bad losses and/or bad wins but it'll sort itself out over time. If we fare well in-conference, we'll have nothing to worry about
December 7th, 2020 at 2:51 PM ^
Its the same shit every year, Michigan always has to prove itself all season long. Every preseason they pick a player or two we lost and talk about how it'll be hard to replace them while UK and others can lose their whole team and be right back in the top 5. It took UK to lose 3 games before they dropped out of the top 25 and they still got 1 vote in the coaches poll lol. Outside of a couple years I always felt Michigan gets lowballed when it comes to tourney seeding as well and yet we march right on through the tourney. Heaven forbid should we actually entertain to the coaches and media that Michigan might perhaps have an outstanding basketball program.
December 7th, 2020 at 4:36 PM ^
I’m not saying you’re wrong and I believe UK is not anything special this season. But previous to yesterday they lost to Richmond who is a pretty high mid major and Kansas who is a top 10 team. In contrast we have beaten teams who are a combined 4-11 right now and have yet to leave out of the friendly confines of Crisler Center. Do I think this squad is good? Yes!!! But I understand why others may be skeptical of the team.