SanDiegoWolverine

November 1st, 2022 at 5:45 PM ^

Dude, there a B for bold, and I for Italic, and then a chain for link. Have you ever used Outlook, or Gmail, or any email for that mater. Also, you can just post the link without telling us what you were doing on Facebook at the moment. The rush to be first around here is ridiculous. How hard is it to list the four players that were suspended?

Joined: 02/03/2009

MGoPoints: 7204

Bo Harbaugh

November 1st, 2022 at 6:23 PM ^

For those saying this is on Mel, I don't totally agree.

To some extent he was in over his head 100%...he's an unproven .500 career head coach, just given a $95mm, 10 year guaranteed contract specifically for beating UM twice.  He realized quickly that beating UM was the 1 and only priority at MSU, and quickly moved all his focus, resources and energy to that goal.

On the other hand, the antagonist, obsessive, violent lil bro approach to the rivalry and game is a product of Mork and it's his lasting legacy.  He's trash and left a trash program and culture behind.  Tucker, is in many ways, in a no win situation with regards to the "rivalry."  He is paid an absurd amount of $ to win that game, and the template left for him by the prior coach and the institution is to go full on street fight to win.

He was paid a lot of $ to beat UM, but it seems his real task will be to first clean up Mork's punk culture

Joined: 08/03/2019

MGoPoints: 38648

PopeLando

November 1st, 2022 at 6:34 PM ^

He might not get the chance. 

The conspiracy theorist in me is starting to think that the powers within MSU are setting Tucker up to take the fall for this, as a convenient way of getting out from under his contract. 

His disaster of a press conference yesterday shows that he's not getting Legal or PR support on this. He wasn't prepared. He didn't have talking points or statements for the obvious questions.

If the Tom Mars investigation/FOIA spree targets MSU the institution, it'll be fairly easy for MSU to show that there are student athlete code of conduct guidelines. Meaning that it would also be pretty easy to set Tucker up as the fall guy for the behavior of his players.

I think he's being salted and hung out to dry. Just a theory.

Joined: 08/01/2015

MGoPoints: 68488

gruden

November 1st, 2022 at 9:43 PM ^

I'll subscribe to your newsletter.

Unlike Nassar, there's lots of video proof for everyone to see the brutality of the assault.  Outside of Sparty nation, most reasonable people are horrified by it.  Plus they don't have their buddies in local law enforcement this time to help them sweep it under the rug.  Someone will have to take the fall, so a scapegoat is needed.  What better scapegoat is there than Tucker?  They'll fire him and say "See?  It's taken care of."

And for people worried about having a beatable coach in EL, who they gonna get that's good to take that job after this?  They'll get another middling coach in exchange for a big pay day.

Joined: 04/29/2016

MGoPoints: 6063

jbibiza

November 1st, 2022 at 6:42 PM ^

Nope. If this was just one thuggish player then you could excuse Tucker. But it was a whole gang of assholes, plus all of the others who stood around and let it happen. If there was a positive culture in place, then the bad apples would have been stopped by their teammates. 

The vast majority of this team never played for Mork, and many are transfers. So their feeling about what it means to be a spartan football player comes from Tucker. 

I'm not saying he's a bad guy, but he has had two and a half years to mold this this team, and clearly he was not up to the task. It begins by choosing the right kids and then teaching them how to be responsible men that represent the best of their university and their sport.

Big Fail.  No excuses.

Joined: 10/08/2009

MGoPoints: 7389

BoxLunches

November 1st, 2022 at 8:42 PM ^

yeah, no.

The word thug has been around for a loooong time.

It did and does mean a bad, violent, stupid person. Re-read your marvel comics from the 60s.

Although it has been co-opted by groups of people for their use, I still use it with it's real meaning.

The assault is an example of thuggery by a gang of thugs.

Joined: 11/28/2015

MGoPoints: 911

Communist Football

November 1st, 2022 at 11:45 PM ^

Surprising that the educated MGoCommune doesn’t know this, but “thug” is actually a Sanskrit word meaning “a member of a group or organization of robbers and assassins in India who waylaid and strangled their victims, usually travelers, and stole their belongings.” The word was exported to the West via British imperialists. 

Joined: 09/18/2010

MGoPoints: 18944

kehnonymous

November 2nd, 2022 at 10:59 AM ^

I did know that, and that is a really interesting case of a word taking on additional context multiple times, in both cases involving fraught racial dynamics, on both sides of the Atlantic. 

While there is a credible argument for a neutral dictionary definition of the word and its use isn't a cancelable offense for me(for lack of a better term :p), at this point in time you really should be aware of its context because we don't live in a vaccuum and I try to avoid using it in my vocabulary.

 

Joined: 11/25/2011

MGoPoints: 32999

jsquigg

November 1st, 2022 at 9:09 PM ^

Perhaps this is an unpopular take, but the attack happened very quickly. I don't know if it was planned ahead of time or briefly or if there was a minor exchange, but I'm not ready to hold everyone responsible who seemed to do "nothing." Anyone who has ever witnessed something so shocking may go into "fight or flight" response. It's easy with modern technology to play out how people should have responded in a 20 second attack when watching it back several times. The players who decided to join in on the mob mentality should not play football again and should face serious consequences. Mel should be held to a zero tolerance standard in regard to his team(s) maintaining emotional composure outside the lines. Trying to go overboard in holding everyone responsible who didn't act heroically in opposition to their brain and body chemistry serves no purpose. 

Joined: 09/06/2009

MGoPoints: 9621

Kilgore Trout

November 1st, 2022 at 10:30 PM ^

I agree with jsquigg on this one. We've all seen a lot of slow motion, but this all happened very quickly (at least the extreme violence part of it). The staffer who ran away looks ridiculous, but I think a lot of the State players probably had a one or two second moment of "wtf is happening" since it's so unprecedented and by then it was pretty much over. 

Joined: 02/20/2009

MGoPoints: 13178

tybert

November 2nd, 2022 at 12:17 AM ^

Mel is a relatively new HC. One year at Colorado and then the unexpected promotion at MSU as Fickell nixed them. Mork got 8 wins vs. UM vs. 5 losses and received pagan god status among the fan base. Never mind he was 2-4 vs. real coaches (LC and JH) which ties him with Perles 4-8 vs. Bo and Mo. 

He walked into a program that had three crappy years out of four (only a 10 win season in 2017 capped by a win vs. a so=so WSU team) and MD was clearly on his bottom feeder endings.

The gang at MSU, especially the fricking fans at RCMB, have deluded themselves that they are UM's "master" when the records say otherwise. I graduated from UM in 1985, when Sparty fans accepted winning a game vs. UM once every 3 or 4 years was "success" - sadly we suffered through RR followed by Hoke who went 1-6 when a better coach would have been 5-2.

The players are a Mork creation - unless Mel can turn them into the bunch who can win 1 of every 3 or 4 games going forward, someone will pay the 60 MM to kick him to the curb.

 

Joined: 11/17/2008

MGoPoints: 8467

Team 101

November 1st, 2022 at 6:46 PM ^

Bo Harbaugh, I couldn't agree more.  It's important to Mel to win the game as it should be.  It should be important to Harbs as well.  I haven't seen or heard anything from Mel to suggest he is responsible for this.  I do agree that this is Deeantonie's legacy and the prior regime would have tried to brush this under the rug.  Just like I think that stunt of bringing Mel to Crisler to act like a bouncer was part of that legacy.

Joined: 04/15/2013

MGoPoints: 38153

BoMo

November 1st, 2022 at 7:03 PM ^

I agree wholeheartedly that the MSU football culture and what occurred are a direct vestige of Mork;  the dumbass interlocked arms march down the field, a-hole behavior stepping off bus at Big House (same as Ben Who slapping at the camera prior to Saturday's game).  Whether Mel continues to espouse that or not remains to be seen.  But this remains Mork's shit culture.

Joined: 12/31/2013

MGoPoints: 2884

Twitch

November 1st, 2022 at 8:22 PM ^

Sorry, hes on his 3rd season...  no excuse now.  That's plenty of time to weed out assholes that don't fit your desired mindset qualities and to also bring in guys who do fit that mold.  He's used the portal enough to get the second part accomplished twice over... He's doing nothing but continuing (and perhaps enhancing) this shit.

Joined: 01/01/2019

MGoPoints: 3832

gruden

November 1st, 2022 at 9:59 PM ^

Well, problem is when you rely on the transfer portal for so much of your talent, it's like the box-of-chocolates analogy, you never really know what you're going to get.  Some of these guys have to transfer because of behavioral issues.  You have so many players who aren't around long, every year players shuffle in and out after short stints a good culture is really hard to build.  What you really need to do is recruit quality players and develop them over the course of their college career, with transfers merely plugging certain holes in the roster and no more.

After almost 3 years, what Tucker has proven is that he can't recruit very well.  I expect the MSU AD will probably cut him loose, and this tunnel event simply provides them a pretext for doing so.  They'll settle out of court with the players and move on, nothing learned.   Sorry, I'm a bit cynical.

Joined: 04/29/2016

MGoPoints: 6063

MMBbones

November 2nd, 2022 at 9:49 AM ^

I'm probably oversimplifying this, but I can't help contrasting Mel's situation with JH. While much of our fanbase was livid with Harbaugh before last year's beatdown of OSU, it seems the institution was fine with the way Jim has been leading the program. Of course we want to beat our (one real) rival, but the program was being run the way we want and need it to be run, so most of us were patiently waiting and trusting things would work out. 

The institution at MSU doesn't seem to have the same patient philosophy. And a response to this post probably should be: "LOL, do you really think we are morally superior?" And, as individuals, no. But as far as the ethos the institution has created for decades, yes. The Michigan approach to athletics is morally better than that of MSU. They (MSU authorities) need to recognize this and reboot. And maybe they could do it even better than we are now if they tried, which would make us up our game. "Iron sharpens iron," but they are tinfoil now.

Joined: 08/28/2008

MGoPoints: 9916

aa_squared

November 1st, 2022 at 6:47 PM ^

"Ben Mathers had big boy energy before the game," Howard said. "But when the fight broke out, he ran away from the fight and scurried into the locker room. He is an authority figure for Michigan State football, and he ran away. All of the adults in the hallway should be held accountable for their actions or lack thereof. They should have run in there and broken up the fight. I think Michigan State should give him a chance to go behind the mic and explain his behavior."

https://247sports.com/Article/Michigan-alum-Desmond-Howard-slams-Michigan-State-authority-figures-in-fight-aftermath-196631135/

 

(Edited: FYI - Ben Mathers is the MSU Director of Football Operations.)

Joined: 07/19/2019

MGoPoints: 8126

BleedThatBlue

November 1st, 2022 at 8:24 PM ^

Sorry, not sorry. Yes, I want to see the program burn or spiral out of control. How many more players are you wanting to see get injured based off a meaningless game in the grand scheme of things? Or the fact that half of MSUs fan base was either A. Saying green got what he deserved or B. Victimizing Green? Should we elaborate on  the fact that half the damn team just sat idol and didn’t help out a defenseless kid? Maybe after all that we can discuss about them trying to destroy D-Rob years past or the issue at hand, an 8 on 1 beatdown. Oh, and someone trying to kill Green by hammering him with a concussion. 
 

Sorry to you holier than thou guys, but it’s nonsensical to not want to see them burn down the program and start new with something called morals. Neg all you want but to see a person get destroyed by 8 other people and not get any help except for 1 strikes a chord. But, “burn em all” is where we draw the line? Haha okay. 

Joined: 03/17/2015

MGoPoints: 7955