Bigger loss - Herman (OSU) or Narduzzi (MSU)?
Yes. I know. Both OSU and MSU will be "fine" and we are not going to predict big steps back (although it could happen).
I am just curious who you think is the bigger loss?
Herman:
1. When Meyer lost Mullen, his Florida teams fell off soon thereafter.
2. Meyer has a proven track record of picking good coordinators (but not 100%).
3. OSU relied heavily on offense this year, but has solid talent coming back on defense.
4. OSU had more talent than MSU, so it might be able to mask any small step back made by a coaching change.
5. Herman has figured out a way to put tons of points up with a 3rd string QB.
Narduzzi:
1. Narduzzi has been Dantonio's DC for 11 seasons.
2. There is no history that Dantonio has been able to effectively replace a defensive co-ordinator.
3. Dantonio was a DC, himself, for OSU's national title team. Does that translate today?
4. Narduzzi's best defenses all came with Max Bullough on the field. Before and after Bullough, they were very good, but not dominant.
5. MSU did not rely on its defense as much as OSU relied on its offense this year.
Personally, I think the loss of Narduzzi is more likely to affect MSU than the loss of Herman at OSU. The main reason: Meyer has proven that his offenses can be elite with various coordinators. Dantonio has not proven that. Plus, it appears that Dantonio relied heavily on Narduzzi and they were "tight." He is the only DC to ever serve for Dantonio. It is harder to replace that (on and off the field) than it is a young guy who is hired by a coaching legend.
But, who knows.
January 2nd, 2015 at 11:25 AM ^
I'll say Nard-dog. Although I don't think it will hurt them that much in the immediate future, I can see MSU's D reverting back to the days of stupid penalties and playing out of position.
January 2nd, 2015 at 11:27 AM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:24 PM ^
agree
January 2nd, 2015 at 11:31 AM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 11:53 AM ^
Your question is not legitimate because it is loaded quesiton that contains an assumption that directs the answer.
Does a "successful coach" ever suffer a setback when a cooridnator leaves? Well, no, not if you are a "successful coach" right? If Dantonio's teams struggle ater replacing Narduzzi, then he wasnt a succefful coach, was he?
Your definition of successful can fluctate to whether the loss of a coordinator hurt or not. Circular logic.
There are numerous examples of great college coordinators lifting up good/not great coaches and making the HC seem more successful than he would otherwise be. People thought that about Mullen and Meyer at Florida, but Meyer found Herman (after Addazio and a break from football).
That is why it appears Meyer (a proven "successful enough coach" to weatehr a change) will be better off thant Dantonio.
Urban Meyer, Nick Saban, Pete Carrol and other multiple National Champtionship coaches might all be successful to weather any storm. But, guys below that, who look good for a period of time may not (i.e., Mack Brown, Kirk Ferentz, Brett Beliema, etc.)
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:24 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:29 PM ^
Snarkiness aside. There are lots of times that great coordinators elevate good coaches and then leave and the reality appears that it was more a coordinator than the coach.
It happens. WHile it seems hard to see that happening given Meyer's track record, it seems entirely possible with Dantonio (but not likely IMO).
January 2nd, 2015 at 9:04 PM ^
I actually think Clemson offense will be a good case study. Dabo sucked before Chad Morris showed up. Now Chad is gone and I'll be interested to see how they hold up.
January 2nd, 2015 at 2:11 PM ^
If you look at the NFL - teams have gone the route of plucking the top OC and DC from a championship team - how well has that turned out? In that league the personnel differences while still present are not as great in many cases. Have Bill Bilichek's teams suffered much when he has lost various DC and OCs? On offense of course he is fortunate to have the great Tom Brady but on defense he has managed to put together competitive teams in spite lof shifting pieces and assistant coaches. I would imagine that both Dantonio and Meyer will continue to do so.
January 2nd, 2015 at 3:26 PM ^
Bilicheck is an elite coach. That is proven by the fact that he can rotate staff and get similar results. That is how you know whether a coach is a Gene Chizik or a Nick Saban.
What makes a coach truly elite and succesful is winning everywhere and through player and coach turnover.
Saban, Carrol, Belicheck have done this. Meyer appears to have done it as well. But, even if there are great coaches their units can go up and down a bit with coordinator changes.
As for Dantonio, no one really knows. We could guess. The defense has clearly been their calling card (that and last second wins). If he can generate another elite defense without Narduzzi or Bullough, he will be fine. He has definitely built confidence in his players, but that only goes so far when push comes to shove.
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:00 PM ^
Meyer's offense wasn't as good when Addazio replaced Mullen.
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:28 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 1:11 PM ^
Scoring plummeted after Addazio replaced Mullen.
Mullen 2007 (457 yds/g) (42.5 pts/g)
Mullen 2008 (445 yds/g) (43.6 pts/g)
Addazio 2009 (458 yds/g) (35.9 pts/g)
Addazio 2010 (329 yds/g) (25.5 pts/g)
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:40 PM ^
Addazio's first OC season was Tebow's senior season where they demolished Brian Kelly's Cincy team in the Sugar Bowl.
The year after they fell off a cliff offensively.
January 2nd, 2015 at 2:50 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 11:40 AM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 11:50 AM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:41 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 11:46 AM ^
Narduzzi.
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:07 PM ^
Urban has been good everywhere he's been and Herman's only been with him 3 seasons.
Dantonio meanwhile seemed to be a good DC but has yet to be a HC without Narduzzi. These are new waters for him
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:15 PM ^
That said, I do think the loss of coordinators will create some issues at both programs. I doubt MSU's defense will run as seamlessly as it has, while losing Herman should negate some of the expected upside of nearly everyone returning on OSU's offense. Probably each team loses 1 or 2 games they would have won with the departing coordinators, but that's it.
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January 2nd, 2015 at 12:16 PM ^
as the biggest loss. However.. don't want to underestimate Dantonio and whatever their D looks like this coming year.
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:16 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:44 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 1:11 PM ^
Our rivals are already "talking about us and our awesome" head coach. A lot. Also, I am sure that when JH names coordinators, that those two other schools will talk about them.
Look, we don't have a bowl game and both MSU and OSU played yesterday. I thought it was a timely question.
January 2nd, 2015 at 12:51 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 1:05 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 1:27 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 1:33 PM ^
is a huge loss for them.
January 2nd, 2015 at 1:33 PM ^
OSU may hurt from losing Herman, but when you're able to beat Alabama with your 3rd string quarterback, clearly you've got enough talent to handle a small ripple in the coaching ranks.
January 2nd, 2015 at 1:47 PM ^
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January 2nd, 2015 at 2:39 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 2:23 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 2:29 PM ^
As many have said, tOSU will absorb Herman's loss more easily than will MSU absorb Narduzzi's. Few coaches have had the ability to coach up fair-to-middlin' players into a potent defensive unit the way Pat has done.
January 2nd, 2015 at 2:59 PM ^
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January 2nd, 2015 at 4:05 PM ^
January 2nd, 2015 at 8:53 PM ^
Bigger loss will be Narduzzi because they have been together 11 years and Mork has never had to deal with a new DC as a HC. Urban flies through OCs every 3-4 years as they go and get promoted to HC elsewhere due to his genius. I could put Bagheera as the OC for Urban and in 4 years Bagheera will be HC at the Oakland Raiders where he has plenty of sources telling him Jim Harbaugh will be the next coach.
December 3rd, 2015 at 5:26 AM ^