Army Snowflakes - The Offense
September 7th, 2019 at 3:41 PM ^
Fart. Oily Sludge Fart.
September 7th, 2019 at 3:44 PM ^
Today's offense was offensive.
September 7th, 2019 at 5:08 PM ^
So...what would it look like if instead of going speed in space on offense Harbaugh decided to install the Army offense? With high D-1 talent. McCaffrey (or even Joe Milton) at the controls. Throw 15 times a game with a legit QB. We would be the only guys running it and everyone would have to get way out of their comfort zone defending us.
Idle day dream: We break it out against OSU. Bring back three yards and a cloud of ground up tires!
September 7th, 2019 at 5:28 PM ^
D1 skill players don’t want to play in the triple option. No NFL future, and anyway it mostly works against teams that don’t see it every year (Georgia Tech says hi).
September 7th, 2019 at 3:42 PM ^
Michigan should see if they can trade in Josh Gattis for Mike Locksley.
September 7th, 2019 at 3:48 PM ^
Why do QBs get worse under the supposed QB whisperer Harbaugh?
September 7th, 2019 at 3:54 PM ^
Not sure if Shea is worse yet.
But the trend isn’t good. I haven’t believed the “QB whisperer” thing for a year or two anyway. But this is concerning.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:00 PM ^
If you remember all off season I said I feared Harbaugh would wrestle back play calling when things got tight and my concern was not shared by 99% of the board. And my concerns were NOT warmly received.
I defy anyone to look at the playcalling from mid 3rd quarter to end of game and tell me what "speed in space" they saw. What I saw, which is exactly what I feared, was a return of manball-albiet from the shotgun and using a single back set.
The calls on 4th & 2 and the 3rd & 4 in regulation SCREAMED of harbaugh, not Gattis.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:07 PM ^
None of those run designs were ever Harbaugh staples.
It's not what we ran last year. It's not what Harbaugh has ever run in short yardage.
I firmly believe these are Gattis' play designs and calls.
The inexplicable thing is why the QB did not pull once all day when it was wide open and we were in very real danger of losing that game.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:19 PM ^
Inside zone. Pin and pull. Split zone. Arc bluffs. With zone reads and handoffs to the RB. These were the staple plays last year and Michigan was good at them. They are the staple plays this year so far and Michigan isn’t getting push.
The basic running game design is the responsibility of the OL coach. Warinner is still there, and the concepts are the same.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:20 PM ^
Never said they were Harbaugh's play design, I said they were Harbaugh's play calls-and 100% believe that.
From the mid 3rd quarter to the end the calls were beyond conservative-something Gattis is allegedly not and something Harbaugh definitely is.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:23 PM ^
I don't always agree with you MGO, but after what I saw today, I for one think this is a legit possibility, hell, even likely.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:27 PM ^
I don’t see he is carrying a play all sheet. But the play design could be his old ones.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:33 PM ^
Gattis has never called plays before. We don't know how conservative he is.
That said, when your interior OL is as big and talented as ours, running inside against an undersized Army DL should work.
Watching live, I felt like the bigger problem was poor pass protection, Patterson bugging out early, and dropped balls.
Army plays bend but don't break, forcing long drives, and further limiting possessions. It's complimentary football and fucking terrible to watch.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:47 PM ^
Poor pass protection? Shea had plenty of time all day, other than the blown blitz pickup by Turner. Just held on too long, maybe coverage was too good but then every time he did go deep someone was either open or had to be interfered with, so I think he just needed to throw more and quicker.
September 7th, 2019 at 10:21 PM ^
Fair point. Patterson deserves some of the blame on his 4 sacks. I'll be curious to see how guys grade out this week in the UFR. Tackles are still a weak point.
September 7th, 2019 at 10:36 PM ^
Correct! Poor pass protection was clearly not the case.
the problem is insisting on 2 and 3 TE sets that bring 8-9 into the box. No chance. Way too conservative.
September 8th, 2019 at 9:09 AM ^
He categorically did NOT have plenty of time all day, they had four sacks and several pressures.Having said that he did appear to also hold the ball too long
September 8th, 2019 at 1:51 PM ^
How many sacks/pressures were quick pressure / OL getting beat vs him scrambling around and then eating it like 5 seconds after the snap?
Army was blitzing like crazy, not beating OL one on one... eventually some of those blitzes are going to get through, Shea has to be able to punish them by hitting the vacated zones.
September 8th, 2019 at 2:59 PM ^
that was punishing them?
September 8th, 2019 at 12:29 AM ^
I actually didnt mind the playcalling on the last two drives until we tried to convert on 4th down. I would have preferred to pin them deep as I didnt think they had enough time to march down the field.
There is so.ething very wrong with our Read Option though.
September 7th, 2019 at 9:06 PM ^
Shea doesn't want to run. Shea doesn't want contact . Shea wants to play 7 on 7 ..
September 7th, 2019 at 10:30 PM ^
These are not RPO’s but more of a zone read. Maybe after fumbling on the first two plays of the first two games Shea butter was told to hand off? Looked atrocious at every measure and so far the qb whisperer appears to be doing more harm than good.
September 8th, 2019 at 9:48 PM ^
I would consider that they were protecting Shea's injury...maybe?
Seemed like he slid down on scrambles earlier than normal, throws were way off
I just dont know why Dylan wasn't put in
September 7th, 2019 at 8:53 PM ^
If it was Harbaugh there would have been a fullback on there which probably we needed.
September 7th, 2019 at 10:35 PM ^
Or injured qb
September 7th, 2019 at 4:01 PM ^
Wilton was never the same after he got hurt (also changed coordinators to Pep Hamilton for his last year) and Shea appears to be hurt now. I think it has more to do with injuries than anything else.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:14 PM ^
If Shea was hurt, why would they dial up a designed run for him w no lead blocker?
September 7th, 2019 at 5:00 PM ^
Because they planned to run that play. That Shea may have been limited by an injury never entered their thinking.
September 7th, 2019 at 6:15 PM ^
Logged in just to agree with you
September 7th, 2019 at 6:53 PM ^
This feels better than I thought it would!
September 7th, 2019 at 6:38 PM ^
I am unfortunately getting "Wilton after he was hurt" vibes from Patterson right now
September 7th, 2019 at 9:53 PM ^
Why not run a read option series w Joe Milton? Would’ve been way harder to tee off on Charbonnet. Instead we run half an offense with a likely wounded QB.
September 7th, 2019 at 10:59 PM ^
Ujh, why with Milton and not McCaffrey?
September 8th, 2019 at 12:46 AM ^
Ehhh, ya but Wilton should have been the same after the offseason. The summer leading into his final season he definitely changed his throwing mechanics, presumably to get into the NFL, and it backfired. Look at the tape. Wilton had a weird wind up, almost a flamboyant throwing motion and it changed in the offseason his senior year.
Shea has a mediocre ceiling and composure issues. He is good at stuff until he sucks, then he kinda sucks.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:14 PM ^
I expressed the same concerns, before and after Gattis was hired.
Its unclear what the story is with the late shell today. But there was a clear intent not to pass late in regulation. When they threw in the second OT, Shea clearly missed twice and his other pass was marginal at best.
If Harbaugh did throttle things himself, that’s bad. But the Shea situation is just bizarre. He clearly, clearly is choosing to give on ZR handoffs, to the point that the coaches brought DCaff in last week specifically to execute ZR runs. But they won’t put DCaff in permanently and won’t throw the ball with him in.
Something is really off.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:22 PM ^
Seems like last year where they're intent on keeping Shea healthy as deep into the season as possible, so he's been told to always give. That or Shea himself is just afraid to be smashed so he's giving it off. Based on last year, I'd say it's intentional in the gameplan, but if that's the case, why not have Dylan get some run and keep Shea from being banged up.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:38 PM ^
Shea didn’t give last week, and Harbaugh said specifically that part of what DCaff came in for was to run that part of the offense. So they knew then and they knew this week that Shea wouldn’t give on these reads.
So that’s one hand tied behind the back for two games. Less important games against less talented opponents, yes. But they almost lost today.
The coaches consider this an acceptable cost. If they didn’t, McCaffrey would play. But McCaffrey isn’t really asked to pass, not yet.
This is something the coaches know, that works against the design of the offense and their play calls, that they consider the best option. No idea why. But it is.
September 7th, 2019 at 9:50 PM ^
I still can’t wrap my head around the play calling and execution I wonder well ever get an honest answer from Harbaugh or Gattis as to what exactly their plan was and why McCaffery didn’t come in when it was clear Shea couldn’t effectively handle the zone read type plays. I didn’t see one RPO, but could have missed one.
September 7th, 2019 at 10:03 PM ^
I've never understood the idea of playing conservative against supposedly inferior opponents. I can see going into a shell if you get a big lead, but that wasn't the case. And, how are you supposed to get good at plays if you don't practice them in the games? Is there really that little of tweaks you can make to these plays that we are going to purposefully follow a tendency even if the defense is begging you to do something else? I feel like other schools don't do this. I don't see Fields not running the ball because Day doesn't want to tip his hand. And, OSU has less QB depth than we do.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:53 PM ^
What’s crazy was that pass in 2OT to Nico was absolutely there, and it’s hard to see how it wouldn’t have been there all day. Should have tried that once a drive at least. Arc read, RPO, deep bomb all day with just a sprinkling of counters to keep them honest. Instead we get HB dives and plain old shotgun play action all day.
On the other hand, I liked going 4 minute offense in the last drive, knowing that Army couldn’t score fast, just don’t know why they didn’t use the real read option game that made the 4 minute offense really successful last season.
#freegattis
September 7th, 2019 at 5:05 PM ^
Yeah it doesn't seem as though Shea is even remotely comfortable in this offense which seems odd considering this is the type of offense he is supposed to like so maybe it is injury's
September 7th, 2019 at 7:54 PM ^
Agreed; my Brother-in-Law (Texas fan down in DFW area) started watching just after the half. At some point I got a text from him asking if we ever passed the ball this year.
September 7th, 2019 at 11:11 PM ^
You also have to look at the possibility that the reason they didn't throw the ball as much in the second half may have had something to do with needing to give the defense a breather. Army wears down a defense.
September 8th, 2019 at 8:52 AM ^
Sure, use a QB who can't throw. That worked like a charm last year with MSU. The difference, of course, is we have another quality QB. If Shea is hurt, then that in on the coaches. McCaffrey can play, and it's Army. If we're afraid to put McCaffrey in against Army, something is wrong.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:11 PM ^
Good question. I'm beginning to wonder if the "QB whisperer" reputation has more to do with Luck and less to do with Harbaugh himself.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:14 PM ^
It most certainly is Luck, but not Andrew...
September 7th, 2019 at 4:14 PM ^
It most certainly is luck, but not Andrew...
September 7th, 2019 at 10:41 PM ^
Dave Shaw and the PAC10. Thats why they were successful.
September 7th, 2019 at 4:27 PM ^
That's the crux of the problem. Rudock transferred in and was incredible, then everything fell apart. We had so many quarterbacks on the roster they were switching positions and transferring, we even had a freshmen all American on the roster, yet we mysteriously couldn't find a single one that could stand up straight and execute a successful forward pass. Everybody called for Bench him, play OKorn, bench OKorn play Peters, Peters sucks play Patterson, bench Patterson play McCaffrey! The quarterback isn't the problem, we have shitty coaches who can't call a simple effective offense, or manage to coax remotely serviceable play out of top national recruits.