Ray Vinopal to start @ PSU?
This has been dropped on the premium boards. Apparently Vinopal to free safety in place of Cam Gordon, and Cam Gordon to replace the Carvin/Thomas Gordon spot at the spinner/safety position.
GO TO 14:07
Vinopal! Hope that the coaches see someting in him and are ready to unleash him on unsuspecting B10 offenses. Let's go Ray!!
October 24th, 2010 at 7:29 PM ^
Is Josh Furman redshirting? Why don't we try him?
October 24th, 2010 at 7:33 PM ^
Yes, he's redshirting.
Furman is not an option at FS this year. He played rush linebacker last year. Asking him to patrol the deep middle is asking for an even bigger disaster than what we've seen so far this year.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:37 PM ^
Okay, Thank you! I just remember Scout rating him as a top 10 safety last year.
October 24th, 2010 at 9:41 PM ^
If I'm not mistaken, deep safety is also known as "Hero"
October 24th, 2010 at 9:57 PM ^
I thought is was also known as "Are you f@#$ kidding me?"
October 24th, 2010 at 10:04 PM ^
Really? I thought in our defense it was called goat? \
Bazinga!
October 25th, 2010 at 8:59 AM ^
We don't have a deep safety. We play a 'not quite deep enough' safety. The responsibility is to come up at a bad angle and chase the ball carrier all the way to the endzone, diving pathetically at the five. The goal, I have to assume, is to make sure the ball carrier doesn't get to coast, therefore tiring them out.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:19 PM ^
I didn't see anything mentioned on Rivals.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:20 PM ^
October 24th, 2010 at 7:32 PM ^
Personally, I haven't been impressed by Carvin Johnson or Thomas Gordon, although Thomas Gordon seems to be a bit better than Johnson. It's not a knock on either one - they're both freshmen. But they haven't exactly stood out.
I do know that Carvin Johnson's lack of size has been a problem on a number of short yardage plays. For some reason, the coaches think they can line him between the tackles when teams come out in double tight, short yardage formations. This invariably ends with Carvin Johnson being demolished.
I don't know that Gordon will fare any better, but it might be worth a shot.
That being said...I'm not enamored with Vinopal. Hopefully he proves me wrong.
October 25th, 2010 at 9:06 AM ^
Maybe you went over this when we first recruited him, but why aren't you enamored with him? You usually are more analytical when it comes to player eval than the usual 2* white defensive back criticism, so I am curious what you have seen. I have not seen a lot of film on the kid, but he seemed to have a good measure of success at a very good program in H.S. and his measurements seem to be solid for a college safety. Unless his 40 time is questionable, or his height is exagerated, Is there something particular that you have seen in film that you are worried about, or is it just lack of PT?
October 25th, 2010 at 9:40 AM ^
Well, here are my thoughts on him from back when he committed:
http://touchthebanner.blogspot.com/2009/12/ray-vinopal-wolverine.html
October 24th, 2010 at 7:50 PM ^
I thought that was just as interesting (if not more) as the replacement of Cameron. Based on the UFRs, TGordon hasn't hurt the team too often.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:22 PM ^
STUBS! YES!
Give it a shot, can't get worse!
October 24th, 2010 at 7:26 PM ^
If you lose to Penn state, it will be worse.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:27 PM ^
I don't understand, what makes Ray Vinopal starting more terrifying than any other number of freshmen starting this year?
This defense needs to stop some people,to hit somebody,to tackle, any means to get it done is fine by me.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:47 PM ^
and he doesn't appear to have the sam mcguffie speed necessary to cover the deep ball. Someone had to say it. Then again, Cam Gordon's inability to catch a Bowling Green running back is pretty scary too. So I really don't see what all the fuss is about. Give the kid a chance.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:53 PM ^
I think it was Cam not catching Kyle Rudolph that was eye catching.
October 25th, 2010 at 9:17 AM ^
That is a fact. Vinopal is actually really fast.
I don't know anything else about him.
October 25th, 2010 at 10:06 AM ^
October 24th, 2010 at 8:16 PM ^
The elephant in the room no one wants to aknowledge. +1 to you for having the balls to say it.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:29 PM ^
Neg me later for the name I'm going to bring up, but he reminds me of Jim Leonhard (Badgers/Jets) This kid has all the intangibles -- speed, instinct, nose for the ball. He sure as hell won't hurt us!
October 24th, 2010 at 8:46 PM ^
Speed is very tangible.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:56 PM ^
according to Al Davis, talent = tangibles
October 25th, 2010 at 8:15 AM ^
I dunno ... I think he's more of a smaller John Lynch or a shorter-haired Craig Steltz.
Seriously though, Leonhard was small but pretty damn fast - still returning punts in the NFL.
October 24th, 2010 at 9:13 PM ^
Thanks for pointing out the speed thing. PLEASE, Cam would make a fine LB, but a safety needs top-end speed as well as 0-10 yard quickness. Watch the BG touchdown play again and tell me Kovacs isn't faster than Cam.
Cam is a valued member of the team, but may be better suited at OLB. He's almost got the size for it, after all. Cam could be the next Crable. Give Ray a shot...we can always go back to Cam, and he may get a motivational boost from this. GO BLUE!!!!
October 24th, 2010 at 9:43 PM ^
Wasn't Ray pretty high in the state in the 40? He has speed.
October 24th, 2010 at 11:22 PM ^
Thanks Ray!
October 25th, 2010 at 8:23 AM ^
and fast. We're in agreement...sorry if I wasn't clear, or maybe you were responding to someone else.
October 28th, 2010 at 7:09 PM ^
Not only is he quick and fast, but he is also speedy.
October 25th, 2010 at 1:16 AM ^
I never foresaw the day when M would start two white safeties. Best of luck to Ray. Let's turn this D around.
October 25th, 2010 at 10:09 AM ^
October 24th, 2010 at 7:30 PM ^
I think it'll be exciting to see Gordon's potential in the box, and I think Vinopal is a better cover safety than Gordon. Let's be honest here, we're either playing against a True FR QB or someone who lost the starting QB position to a true freshmen; Penn State is going to be relying on the run. If Gordon can work with Demens and make an impact in shutting down their run, Vinopal could have a pretty easy job.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:33 PM ^
Great post, thank you sir!
October 24th, 2010 at 7:31 PM ^
Maybe this is an effort to get our best tacklers out there. Cam is a great kid, but he needs to wrap up on big hits too.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:40 PM ^
Considering our other safety is a walk-on, and is one of the better defensive players we currently have, I suppose giving Vinopal playing time against a weak opponent couldn't hurt. I'm crossing my fingers that he is Demens-esque and makes an impact out there.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:45 PM ^
I find the move with Cam to be confusing. He's had a major problem with tackling, so now he's put in a spot to do more tackling? I'd be happier with Thomas Gordon starting still. He seems to be pretty fast, blitzes pretty well, and doesn't seem to make any huge mistakes.
However I'm all for Vinopal starting. Even if he doesn't do well, letting Cam see the game from another angle(either another position or from the bench) might help him get more perspective on what he does wrong. Maybe that can really help him.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:01 PM ^
Maybe it's just me, but I think tackling from the S position and from a LB position will be much different for Cam Gordon.
At safety, he ALWAYS tried to get a running start and just obliterate TEs, WRs, and RBs, hoping that his full speed run at them would be enough momentum to get the ballcarrier down.
At a linebacker position, I think that instinct to make ballcarriers explode will be tempered somewhat because he won't be running full speed and trying to make someone die. He'll be forced to wrap up from that position.
In summary...I'm not too concerned with that aspect of his game from a LB position. I think he'll be fine.
October 25th, 2010 at 3:51 AM ^
October 24th, 2010 at 7:48 PM ^
I'm very excited to see Gordon at spur. I always felt that is where he belongs.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:50 PM ^
I like this move if it gets Cam Gordon closer to the LOI and he actually wraps up when he tackles. It will not do any good if he continues to just throw his shoulder in a tackle and try to knock the guy out. The guy he tries to tackle bounces backward, stays on his feet and keeps going. Cam Gordon needs to drive through his tackles! I guess its like Rich Rod said, the team has fundamental problems because they are all FRESHMEN! However, haven't they played football before they came to Michigan?????
As far as Ray Vinopal at Deep safety, I have no idea....seems like a smart, small player.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:28 PM ^
that was against high school players, usually about their own age, not against the Big Boys (particularly the Big Ten Boys) often a year or three older and more experienced.
But whether the impetus is to get Vinopal on the field or Cam into a position more suitable to his skills, the coaches know what's been going on in practice, and maybe something they tried looked promising. And whatever skills the freshmen started out with, maybe some are improving/catching on more than others. Then it's the old "let's see what they do under game pressure." If it ain't broke, don't fix it. If it's not entirely broke but more than worrisome, some tinkering is welcome.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:53 PM ^
I don't like the idea of Cam starting at a new position that has been competent so far.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:53 PM ^
of the game if I'm a PSU defensive coach I'm looking in my playbook for something to exploit his youth. That said I hope young Mr. Vinapol is ready, ready indeed.
October 24th, 2010 at 7:56 PM ^
Next time some of you want to rip recruits in the "Hello:" threads, keep stuff like this in mind.
The staff recruits players they want for their system, and they know more then we do.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:04 PM ^
No offense, but the ascension of Vinopal from 4th string FS to starter doesn't mean anything about his abilities. For all we know at this point, he could be the worst football player to ever set foot on the field at Michigan.
While I don't think that's true, it's a possibility.
Gordon has been bad.
One backup, Vlad Emilien, transferred.
Another backup, Jared Van Slyke, is out for the season with an injury.
Vinopal might just be another guy they're throwing in there to see if maybe, just maybe, he can do something good.
It doesn't prove anyone wrong or right. All it proves is that our defensive backfield has been atrocious, and we knew that already.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:20 PM ^
Worse than Obi Ezeh?? I don't think that is possible sir.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:29 PM ^
I for one do not try to pick out the "worst Michigan player ever", particularly when they are a 5th year senior who toughed it out when many other players left and put in more blood, sweat and tears for the University than I ever will.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:24 PM ^
But that's not my point.
I was speaking more towards the people who said he was garabge and a complete waste of a scholarship that should have gone elsewhere. My point is thank god the staff did offer him because we wouldn't even have this option if they didn't.
October 24th, 2010 at 8:32 PM ^
By your logic Demens shouldn't see the field b/c he was in the back of the depth chart to start the season