OT - Help me craft a sales pitch to wife for relocating to Michigan (Grand Rapids)
I am originally from the great State of Michigan (Farmington Hills), having graduated from UM in 2000. I relocated to Arizona for career reasons in 2006 and have been living in Phoenix ever since. There is, however, a decent to strong possibility that I may be offered a job in the Grand Rapids area within the next two months. If offered, it would represent an advancement in my line of work, but would be around an 8 percent pay cut (vastly different salary averages in AZ vs. MI for my profession). I absolutely hate my current job, and love the state where I was born and raised, so if all things were my decision, it would be an easy one to accept the position (if offered) and relocate to GR.
It is not solely my decision to make, however. After dating for around 3 years, I married my wife in December '14. She has lived her entire life in Texas and Arizona, and has family (including both parents) that live in the Phoenix area. In GR we would be 2 hours from my folks in SE Michigan but her family would be over 1,600 miles and three time zones (2 during winter) away. We have no kids, yet, but they are a possibility in the next few years. She also hates her job (a plus for moving) and works in a field that I'm sure she could find employment in back in GR.
Help me sell this potential relocation to my wife, or alternatively, talk me out of returning to Michigan. I'm struggling with this and really appreciate anybody's advice, guidance, or tips! You just don't realize how much more difficult decisions become once you make them for 2 (or more, with kids).......
I have some experience with this, but it's not perfectly aligned with your situation. Wife from MI, I'm from NY. We lived in MI for about 12 years after college. About 3 years ago she gets a job offer about an hour from where I grew up in NY. We take it and have lived in NY for 3 years now.
She never lived anywhere but MI within an hour of her fam before. It was a big transition- every one is basically a timezone away and although there is phone, skype, vacations, her fam visits, we meet 1/2 way, etc etc etc, she struggles with the transition. We have 2 kids, in elementary school - and that's the toughest part b/c we can't just have Grammy pick up the kids after school or drop them off. So, it's a constant battle to hand the kids off, get to/from work, etc all school year. You have no kids, which will make it an easier transtion at first, but know that if/when kids come along, she's going to feel a bit isolated. If your fam can be around for support, the occasional date night, etc, that will help a lot (especially if she gets along with your fam). Being away from friends is a big deal too, even tho we never really saw any of them all much in MI- life, kids, etc makes it tough unless they are literally across the street.
I think the botom line will be an better work environment for you both. The winters will be a huge transition (even for you - Lake effect snow is non-existant in SE MI, but a huge thing in the west). But if you plan a vaca to Tex/Zona every Jan/Feb, that might go a long way.
Good luck
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Lake Michigan has fresh water, scenic sand dunes, and beautiful sunsets.
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I don't want to talk about the specifics, but it is a government job where pay must fall within a specified range, adopted by elected officials. The public sector doesn't have the freedom to pay what a person is worth unfortunately.
March 26th, 2015 at 10:55 PM ^
First time seeing you on here. Just wanted to say hey and that the Bay Area must be a great place to live. I know people complain about the traffic, cost of living etc. in Cali but I've always wanted to live there.
March 27th, 2015 at 12:19 AM ^
shouldn't be a tough sell. Grand Rapids is only 1.5 hours from Arcadia as well, show her a picture of the 12th hole and if that doesn't turn the tide just divorce her.
are you driving?
Two words: fish ladder
My Dad recently moved back to GR for the summers from Florida after re-marrying. My wife and I dumped the kids with him and his wife and spent our anniversarry (12/29) in the Amway Grand. We had lunch at Founders and though the beer was great, the sandwiches were nothing short of nirvana. The Bad Habit was the best $14 sandwich I've ever had. Seriously I have dreams about that sandwich.
GR was also amazingly walkable and a lot of fun with the river, the shops, the ice skating and all of the other craft beer places. I haven't lived in GR since I was a kid, so the downtown was a new experience to me. The public museum was really cool and it looked like there was a decent amount of theater. I live in WNY now and despite Lake Erie and Lake Ontario, really miss Lake Michigan and all of the inland lakes. Michigan is a great place.
However, if you have kids, having relatives nearby (<30 drive) is awesome.
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And border shootings. You won't risk those living near GR. The Canadians are kept in their place.
Also water is cheap. There is that.
- Get to enjoy summer as it means something again.
- Schools are great. You are doing it for the Kids!
- Vernors is easy to get.
- As the world heats up and water becomes more scarce, you will be able to keep your family hydrated.
- Promise regular trips to her family.
- Close to Chicago and Northern Michigan.
- and close the deal with IN STATE TUITION!
Traverse City is awesome.
My wife is from Grandville, but the whole area is full of natural attractions, low cost of living, excellent schools, and enough people to have a meaningful economy. Sailing on Grand Traverse Bay was an incredible way to spend summers.
This is only my opinion, so I am not saying other places suck. Just my two cents.
March 27th, 2015 at 10:31 AM ^
In State Tuition... now that's a joke. Out of State in Arizona is cheaper or at a similar cost to In State at Michigan.
Position it as an experiment. You both hate your jobs and this represents an opporunity to shake things up and do something different. Check potential job listings for your wife and present some possibilities. You are not tied down to being close to family due to kids, so you should be enjoying your mobility. Appeal to other passions in her life that align to what MI has to offer (outdoors, beer, sailing, beaches, etc.). Use it as an opportunity to share some of YOUR passions more fully with her (Michigan obvsly, but other stuff, too) and for her and your family to get to know each other a bit better.
It's a great opportunity for you to strike out on your own as a couple and learn to live as a husband and wife without (overly) leaning on her family. It will change the dynamic, and you could make the case that it's for the better.
I'll be frank - if she's pretty tied to family, then it's a tough sell, but not nearly as tough if you had kids. I moved to Chicago away from my family because we had a kid and another on the way and she wanted to be near HER support system. Fortunately for me, I really like Chicago and my company is HQed there.
That said, some of the points chunkums mentions are grey. Holland and GH are more like an hour away and have become swamped destinations versus quiet retreats. Suburbs like Forest Hills, Kentwood and Rockford have very explicit plus minuses and the housing closer to downtown is skyrocketing. Add in some personality components of GR and some political components outside of GR, it's not a fixall. I grew up outside GR with family south of it and I'd still pick it as a third or fourth option for me as someone who currently lives in the state
I've been keeping an eye peeled for jobs around here for a while, however my field is quite small and the opportunities haven't been present. I don't think it was selfish to proceed through the interview process - it would be selfish if I demanded we move, which I will not do.
Cite for the economy statement other than "everybody says Michigan is bankrupt"?
I moved from GR to Phoenix about 8 years ago for a job and have been trying to convince my wife to move back. No luck so far, hopefully it goes better for you. Grand Rapids is a great city.
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If she is from AZ and TX, has she ever spent any significant time in cold weather? If she is a sun person, you are making a huge mistake moving her to MI. The difference in weather will literally driver he insane.....it did for my wife who grew up in MI but then moved someplace sunny all year round and couldn't be in Chicago for more than two winters. And that was only having lived outside of midwest for two years or so.....forget taking a lifer out of a sunny state.
Also, pay cut plus higher taxes plus one income earner and no family help when you have kids = divorce. Do not do this if you love your wife.
Good luck!
March 26th, 2015 at 11:32 PM ^
saying it will = divorce may be harsh, but a lot of the points in this post are accurate. Anyone who is a warm climate person is going to have problems with Michigan. I moved my wife back to Michigan after she had lived in LA for 20 years (after she grew up in Boston) and she HATED the winters. I mean HATED them. She thought she was going to be fine given that she grew up with snow, but she had gotten soft from 20 years in SoCal.
Truth be told, I had been away from snow for about 15 years myself and I hated them too. Every year you spend away from cold weather I think you grow to hate it more. You just somehow get soft when you don't live it every year.
Needless to say, combining the cold winters with the underpaying job market for my profession and we only lasted 2 years in Michigan before we moved somewhere else. It was disappointing to me but it was best for my family. And at least I can always say my firstborn was born in AA.
You sir are nuts. You ain't never takin' me back.
I hope I never have to move again.
well, considering I would like to buy a house that is less than 500k and has more than 2 bedrooms and 1 bath, yeah, I'm over the Bay Area. I'm also sick of commuting and being stuck in traffic every time I want to go anywhere that is not within walking distance.
"If the Harbaughs can do it, we can do it..."
I'm sure Colonel Angus could convince a woman to do just about anything.
I'm sure Colonel Angus could convince a woman to do just about anything.
if you REALLY like cold and snow then Grand Rapids could work for you. If you don't really have an opinion one way or another, it'll be great for a few years, but it'll eventually wear on you. If you don't like cold, don't bother.
Other than that, GR and the surrounding area is not exotic but very functional. With just a bit of effort/energy, you can find something that suits you, be it schools, mildly urban->super-rural, outdoor hobbies, etc.
I took a pay cut to move back to Michigan and it was honestly the worst mistake of my life. Remeber if the job doesn't work out you have lowered your pay for the next job. If you don't like the current job look up not down. I love Michigan it is my home but pay cuts just don't seem to work out.