F the Alliance. Raid the PAC 12 and ACC now before the SEC.
August 24th, 2021 at 4:35 PM ^
ACC schools are tied down for like another 15 years with a ridiculous buyout.
August 24th, 2021 at 4:36 PM ^
When they dissolve after the Big 10 and SEC raid them, then there isn’t a buyout.
August 24th, 2021 at 4:42 PM ^
I'm not a lawyer but I'm pretty sure that isn't how it works.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:02 PM ^
There is no way to raid them until at least 2030. Nobody from the ACC is going anywhere any time soon.
August 24th, 2021 at 4:57 PM ^
Pay the buyout....if you pick up the major teams from those two additional leagues you will generate massive income that will more than pay for the buyout eventually.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:04 PM ^
The buyout is the least of it. Every ACC school signed a grant of rights meaning the ACC owns their media rights until 2035, so even if they left the ACC they'd have to turn over all their media revenues from their new conference back to the ACC to be divided up by their old conference mates.
Nobody is going to do that. By 2030 when you're closer to the end of the contract, it is possible you can get someone to announce they're leaving when the deal ends and try to maybe negotiate an early end to the grant of rights, but nobody is going to let you out *10 years* early.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:10 PM ^
If a majority of ACC schools agree to leave the conference by going to either the SEC or Big10, then can they not dissolve the ACC as an entity?
August 24th, 2021 at 5:55 PM ^
No. There's no scenario I've seen where the entire 14 team league ends up absorbed by Big 10/SEC, and as long as someone is stuck in the old house having to keep the lights on, they're going to insist on the grant of rights.
August 24th, 2021 at 7:14 PM ^
ND, UNC, UVA, GaTech, Pitt go Big10. Miami, FSU, Vatech, Duke, Clemson go SEC. 10 out of the 15 want to leave, but would want to dissolve the ACC before to get out of the GOR. Would a court find that the minority can overrule the majority in this situation? I would think the legal and logical solution would be for the leaving members to pay an annual fee to the those that remain the difference of their future media deal with what the projected ACC media would have been until 2036, but that a very doable deal for the one that can get picked up by either Big10/SEC.
August 24th, 2021 at 7:46 PM ^
The NCAA has a rule in place where at least 7 schools must be part of a conference for the conference to be recognized as a D1 conference. 8 to be considered FBS.
I wonder if there’s a clause somehow where if they fall below that threshold, the conference itself folds (no reason to remain a conference if you’re no longer recognized by the NCAA) and everyone is released from their grant of rights as a result.
August 24th, 2021 at 9:03 PM ^
10 out of the 15 want to leave, but would want to dissolve the ACC before to get out of the GOR. Would a court find that the minority can overrule the majority in this situation?
A court (or arbitrator) would likely say "let's look at the actual agreements." Unless shenanigans were afoot (I'll spare you the 1L examples), the terms of the operative documents should* control. If the docs say "all members must agree," well, 10/15 is not 15/15. **Buzzer** Thanks for playing.
[*I say "should," because I have seen some boneheaded rulings that disregard contract terms, uncontested claims, controlling law. I have also seen (and made) "creative" arguments that test the boundaries of Rule 11 that probably shouldn't win (if there is a God and she's listening), but do anyway.]
August 24th, 2021 at 8:01 PM ^
Ask the Big East how that worked.
August 24th, 2021 at 8:03 PM ^
Many people think that contact is unenforceable under the conscionability principle. Craig Ross has talked about this a few time.
August 25th, 2021 at 7:01 PM ^
I agree. Negotiate to buyout the existing contract using the leverage of the new Super-Conference and those media rights going into the future. If I were ESPN I would want the rights to the new, improved and arguably the best product money can buy. ESPN is in the position that if they play hardball, they could piss off the schools that could solidify their holding in the future. More importantly, their agreement becomes less valuable, the closer it gets to the contracts end (and it will end). They could find themselves out in the cold when the next media rights contract is negotiated with ABC for a billion dollars. IJS
August 24th, 2021 at 4:35 PM ^
Swap out Clemson for FSU to get the Florida market.
August 24th, 2021 at 4:36 PM ^
Just swap out Florida St with ND because ND isn't coming.
August 25th, 2021 at 12:34 PM ^
Also, to hell with Norte Dame
August 24th, 2021 at 4:38 PM ^
Cool we can tear down the new football training facility and build it again with all that money.
August 24th, 2021 at 4:43 PM ^
Stanford please.
August 24th, 2021 at 4:45 PM ^
I think the math supports turnign on Florida in the last turn. Clemson has always been harmless. Its okay to steal a few territories from Stanford as well.
Oh wait...
August 24th, 2021 at 4:54 PM ^
Just leave it all. Make a new championship. Ignore them. College football has been bad for awhile and now it’s worse. (How well or poor Michigan has played doesn’t factor into this statement)
August 25th, 2021 at 10:30 AM ^
For real - college football sucks now. Never thought I would say that. But you're right - it's been getting bad for years and all this SEC shit is only going to make it even worse in the near future.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:06 PM ^
No thanks
Go back to ten teams and get off my lawn
August 24th, 2021 at 8:13 PM ^
Thank you! That way we can get rid of the ridiculous conference championship game
August 24th, 2021 at 5:15 PM ^
Remember when we thought the BCS was the worst thing that college football ever did.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:57 PM ^
We're here because of the BCS and because of the NCAA losing that supreme court case that gave schools control of their media rights.
Just think of the utopia we'd live in if the schools had done the plus 1 national title game instead of the BCS.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:17 PM ^
I agree that todays announcement was a total sham. Sitting around a room exchange handshakes and coming away with nothing concrete shows that these commissioners don't get it. The SEC is laughing at how incompetent these other three conferences looked today.
I don't know where the B1G goes from here but today's biggest winner was the SEC and they didn't even do anything. I'm getting to the point where it seems clear that the top teams are going to form basically an NFL lite type league. So Michigan and Ohio St. should just go join the SEC and get it over with.
August 24th, 2021 at 8:16 PM ^
The fact that this is just a handshake deal indicates that they do get it. Nothing contractually prevents the Big Ten from snatching ACC or PAC 12 schools
August 24th, 2021 at 8:52 PM ^
Shake with your right hand, stab them in the back with your left. Very GoT of Kevin Warren if that is what will happen, but very bad optics though.
August 25th, 2021 at 12:51 AM ^
I don't think the optics are that bad. Business is business. Anyone who thinks this is an end point is in way over their head
August 24th, 2021 at 8:24 PM ^
One end of the spectrum is what you suggest (M becomes part of NFL lite league). The other end might be M moves to a league akin to a super Ivy League (M, Stanford, Cal, Northwestern, Vandy...). Personally, I prefer the latter.
August 25th, 2021 at 9:52 AM ^
But if you follow the money, which is what Michigan will end up doing, you're option isn't actually an option.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:18 PM ^
The Alliance is a joke. It really does nothing . Just a matter of time until one conference decides they want more money . Then they will start poaching other colleges to make themselves stronger . .
August 24th, 2021 at 5:31 PM ^
Used toilet paper is actually tangible...
August 24th, 2021 at 10:01 PM ^
Pretty much!
August 25th, 2021 at 12:22 PM ^
A verbal pre-nuputial agreement might be a better analogy.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:52 PM ^
I think there's wisdom in trying to leverage the new ACC commissioner's big 10 relationships to try to get them on board with the Big 10/Pac 12, if you can pull it off. Nobody from the ACC is going anywhere any time soon because of the GOR, but they do have some unhappy campers due to how long their deal with ESPN is.
August 24th, 2021 at 7:32 PM ^
The GoR certainly looks like a dead end, but let's not be absolutist about it. It's a "contract," after all. We may get to see a GoR tested in court if TX/OK want to leave the Big XII next season. The Away games for these two schools could get so ugly (fan behavior) that a move needs to happen. TX/OK could amplify the issue by removing their teams from the field if they are targeted with thrown objects, or if the home fans abuse the visiting fans.
August 25th, 2021 at 12:16 PM ^
If the last 30 years of business has taught me anything, contracts are useful negotiating tools, and not a lot more. I've even had courts completely disregard what's on paper just to get to a compromise where everyone is unhappy. Especially if a government, or quasi-government entity is involved.
I can't imagine that GoR is any more ironclad than any of the 50 other contracts I've had canceled on me, or have canceled to get a better deal.
August 24th, 2021 at 5:57 PM ^
The power schools in the ACC signing that GOR was idiotic.
August 24th, 2021 at 7:00 PM ^
Clemson/FSU had nowhere else to go and signing the GOR got them more money from ESPN. SEC has never shown any reciprocating interesting in them, for all the talk about how Clemson/FSU to SEC is "a forgone conclusion," I would think someone would have to tell the people in Hoover, Alabama that first.
The schools who could absolutely leave tomorrow for the Big 10 and be accepted (UNC/UVA) don't want to leave the ACC because they founded it, and have compliant hanger on schools like Virginia Tech/NC State/Wake/Duke that vote their way on all ACC issues which means they exert a lot of control over the league. They're happy in a basketball centric league that pays a little bit less but where they get to be boss hog.
So the decision isn't as insane as you'd think.
August 24th, 2021 at 8:38 PM ^
I'll argue the other side of this issue. Not because I think you're wrong, I believe you are more likely right than I am. But there is a wake-up call coming for the ACC. They will be desperately motivated to find a way out of that GoR.
The conversation online is always about the $30 million discrepancy for the next fifteen years. That's the way the message boards present it. But the university leaders know that the discrepancy is going to far exceed that $30 million. And it will happen soon. For any leader of an ACC university to stand pat and leave $40~$50 million per year on the table is fiscal malpractice. That is especially true for Clemson and Florida State who have very modest endowment funds relative to the rest of the conference members. And those two schools need successful football in order to keep attracting donations. Even Virginia and UNC, wealthy as they are, would be negligent to just stand by as that opportunity rolled by.
I don't know what kind of legal Armageddon would ensue, but I expect the ACC schools who have realignment value to engage ESPN, SEC, B1G and their lesser conference mates in negotiations, threats, lawsuits, and subversion rather than just sit back and Take It.
August 24th, 2021 at 6:01 PM ^
What if all the remaining non-sec blue bloods agreed to go independent in football, wouldn’t that maximize they’re potential revenue? I mean Michigan could just play trophy/rivalry games, some other high profile games that increase their appeal nationally like in California, Texas and the south.
August 24th, 2021 at 6:10 PM ^
But having a guy in NYC pay their cable company for a package that includes the Big Ten network may be more profitable that have Michigan by itself in a world where everyone’ independent. Then no one gets a NBC national deal because their isn’t enough NBC’s for every team.
August 24th, 2021 at 6:29 PM ^
I think that model is out the window pretty soon. Also if you look at which teams have the highest viewed games, I believe Michigan, despite not being elite in a couple decades is top five with highest ranked games. I bet Michigan, OSU and PSU are carrying the conference.
August 24th, 2021 at 6:06 PM ^
The ACC isn't going anywhere for a while; it's why you haven't seen teams like Miami and FSU on the move throughout all the reorg talk.
I think the conference will add a couple of teams but the idea that one conference would have teams in every timezone feels like a tough thing to keep up.
August 24th, 2021 at 6:11 PM ^
This will do squat. Just makes people feel better they did something.
August 24th, 2021 at 6:22 PM ^
The Pac-12 TV contract is expiring in 2024, there isn't much time left on that. So the process should begin with the B1G poaching the four California schools (UCLA, USC, Cal, Stanford), Washington and Colorado. Prime demographics and markets, and all six are AAU schools.
At this point, it would be obvious the end of the existing conferences is happening, and every school is fair game.
Then go get UNC, Duke, Virginia and BC from the ACC and possibly Kansas (if you think basketball is worth it). Notably BC isn't AAU.
Would Georgia Tech and Arizona be worthwhile? Both are AAU. ASU is not, but maybe that market is worth it.
They need to think a step ahead and where this process is going. Not just react to the SEC.
August 24th, 2021 at 6:31 PM ^
Snowflake.jpeg