Bady Hoke - Special Teams
Next to abysmal defense, the next worst area of performance for Michigan football teams has come from Special Teams. This is not just a recent phenomenon; special teams debacles have haunted Michigan for years. Will Brady Hoke change this tradition?
Year Team Phil Steel ST rank
2010 San Diego State 109
2009 San Diego State 94
2008 Ball State 48
2008 Ball State 17
2007 Ball State 50
2006 Ball State 28
2005 Ball State 65
2004 Ball State 114
2003 Ball State 97
This seems to be lot like the Brady Hoke resume - a couple of good years among a sea of mediocrity (or worse). Hopefully, there will be more of an emphasis on special teams, but then again, hope is not a strategy.
January 15th, 2011 at 8:30 PM ^
2008 Ball State is kind of confusing right now; I'm gonna be honest.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:03 PM ^
They had the most talent a MAC team has ever seen on offense. Nate Davis, Dante Love, Miquale Lewis, Darius Hill, and Robert Brewster among others.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:17 PM ^
I don't believe you can accurately evaluate or project a coaches success. So much of it has to do with the level of talent that he is working with. People get this concept that year-to-year should get better and better and never retract. That is just not realistic. I think dips and spikes in team records are most often reflective of the recruiting classes of those who started that year, not necessarily the coach (they typically coach the same every year).
This is not very encouraging when you consider the bulk of Michigan's recruits are 3 star players.
January 15th, 2011 at 11:28 PM ^
Maybe the reason there was so much talent there was because of Hoke and his staff "touching" these guys and molding them in to good players.
There is talent that produces, and talent that goes to waste. The former has a lot to do with coaching.
January 16th, 2011 at 12:05 AM ^
Maybe they had that talent there in '08 because Hoke brought them in. I would think since he had been at BSU that long that those players were his. Maybe he has a nice eye for talent.
January 16th, 2011 at 12:55 AM ^
Apparently there wasn't much talent though considering the next year they went 2-10
January 16th, 2011 at 2:09 PM ^
Those guys were mostly seniors. Without Nate Davis the entire operation fell apart.
January 16th, 2011 at 8:52 AM ^
Maybe we should try and get back there.
No more "sleepers"
January 15th, 2011 at 8:31 PM ^
There's a lot of variables to those numbers rather than blindly blaming it on one person or another. Personnel? ST coaches? Etc etc...
January 15th, 2011 at 9:21 PM ^
None of that stuff matters. Got a million freshmen? That's not a good excuse. Got a highly-rated kicker who decided he was never going to make another field in a game? Too bad. You should have recruited three highly-rated kickers. You should know by now that here at Michigan, all ST blame falls directly on the coaching staff regardless of circumstance.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:46 PM ^
Got enough excuses? Then it's never your fault.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:55 PM ^
Reasons aren't necessarily excuses. There's a difference.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:49 PM ^
does the RR crowd actually believe that none of the ST blame falls on RR? that's crazy...didn't the guy make more than one comment about not wasting practice time on ST?
January 16th, 2011 at 10:19 AM ^
But there's a percentage between 0% and 100% that RR rightfully deserves.
January 16th, 2011 at 10:49 AM ^
exactly.
all I'm saying is that it isn't entirely one persons fault.
January 15th, 2011 at 8:31 PM ^
January 15th, 2011 at 8:32 PM ^
Our special teams should be much better when injuries don't plague our depth chart, forcing us to start the freshmen and sophomores that should be redshirting and playing special teams. We actually had one of the best special teams units in the B10 in 09. It will get back there with more depth.
January 15th, 2011 at 8:34 PM ^
If we can kick field goals, punt and get 10 yards on punt returns i'll be happy
January 15th, 2011 at 8:51 PM ^
If we can make extra points and HOLD ON TO THE DAMN BALL! I will be happy.
January 15th, 2011 at 8:52 PM ^
January 15th, 2011 at 8:35 PM ^
I prefer Goody Hoke.
January 15th, 2011 at 8:39 PM ^
Yeah, but neither one can hold a candle to Greaty Hoke
January 15th, 2011 at 9:58 PM ^
Bady Hoke gets offended when you try to mess with Bady Hoke's name and try to give Bady Hoke nicknames, ya dig?
January 15th, 2011 at 8:38 PM ^
......you know, like actually making a field goal from, oh, 30 yards? We can hope, right?
January 15th, 2011 at 8:48 PM ^
A comparison from 2008 onward. I'm not sure where he got the 2007 or earlier data from. I think Zoltan skews the results pretty significantly. As a reminder, these are Phil Steele rankings...
Michigan | Ball State/SDSU | |
2010 | 96 | 109 |
2009 | 5 | 94 |
2008 | 16 | 17 |
January 15th, 2011 at 8:53 PM ^
Per request
Year Phil Steele ST rank
2010 96
2009 5
2008 16
2007 95
2006 60
2005 15
2004 26 (DeBord/Breaston)
2003 94
Here's detail for the 2009 Phil Steele Special Teams Ratings:
http://www.philsteele.com/fbsinfo/2009speciateams.html
Just a bit frightening to think that San Diego State was rated worse on Special Teams than Michigan last year...a lot of that
January 15th, 2011 at 8:54 PM ^
The team seemed to get better with coverage and returns when healthy...kicking was horrible. Wouldn't be surprised if Gibbons is a few adjustments away from getting confidence and becoming the kicker we think he can be next year...
January 15th, 2011 at 9:19 PM ^
I wouldn't count on it. Obviously he has confidence problems but he also has terrible form. Someone will have to completely rework his technique if he's ever going to be able to get any height on the ball. He's even worse than Broekhuizen.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:10 PM ^
Isn't he running a top notch kicking school?
January 15th, 2011 at 9:10 PM ^
according to Rivals, which has him ranked one place higher than Goudis for their position. I remembered Stanford as being one of our rivals for his services, since he's a brilliant student and looking for academics, but though Stanford is on his list, he doesn't have a Stanford offer. It was Harvard that offered (with many others, including Boise State!). But he was thrilled with the Michigan offer, and can't imagine change in coaching philosophy would affect kickers. (Except for the philosophy of NOT kicking because you don't trust anybody can kick.) Rivals doesn't list any visits, so maybe he can be brought in for the mega-recruiting weekend(s) coming up.
The only negative could be that Hoke doesn't want to use a scholarship for a kicker, since Gibbons already has one.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:26 PM ^
we can afford a scholly for a kicker.
January 16th, 2011 at 2:15 PM ^
We can offer a FG kicker, Kick-off specialist, another punter, a holder and an effing long snapper at this rate
January 15th, 2011 at 9:11 PM ^
He did pretty well at Ball State. Obviously at San Diego State, his special teams have been a disaster.
I don't know how much punting distance and field goal accuracy factors into those numbers. Coaches can be held responsible for punt coverage/returns and kick off coverage/returns, but not so much punting distance or field goal kicking.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:16 PM ^
we have to do is hit every field goal inside of 40 yards,keep the ball inbounds on the kickoffs and hold on to the ball on the returns.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:54 PM ^
there were games this year when kicking the ball out of bounds on kickoffs would've been a wise strategy to adopt.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:22 PM ^
Think about how big difference a field goal kicker would have made this year...
There was that missed field goal at the end of the 1st half against state and the fact that we had to go for it on every 4th down
January 15th, 2011 at 10:14 PM ^
But it could have even made a difference against OSU....9 points off of field goals, pressure taken off the offense could have kept the game in reach.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:26 PM ^
5th. Are you serious? I don't care how godly zoltan was.....Thats only part of special teams. Our special teams was NOT good. Our returning was terrible, it was so bad that it far outweighs zoltans space ownage.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:37 PM ^
that Stonum set a Michigan record for Kick Return yardage. We all remember that right?
To borrow from Mike McD in Rounders, people hardly recall their big wins, but they remember with great detail their bad beats.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:55 PM ^
Yes stonum was good. I vividly remember his return against ND. With that said, do you remember our punt returns? Even with stonum setting the record our kick returns weren't amazing.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:31 PM ^
I will be happy if they could find someone to kick field goals.
January 15th, 2011 at 9:57 PM ^
San diego states kicker was 54/56 on extra points and 17/22 on field goals with a 53 yard long. There punter has a 45.4 yard average. There kick off guy has a 67.4 yard average(kicks it to the 3 yard line) and a 44 yard net (opponents start on the 26 yard line). It appear that there punt and kick return games are not good with a 6 and 19.3 yard average but does that cause you to be ranked 109?
http://goaztecs.cstv.com/sports/m-footbl/stats/2010-2011/teamcume.html
January 15th, 2011 at 10:00 PM ^
This past season clearly illustrated the importance of special teams. Still, most teams assign coaching responsibilities for special teams to one of the position coaches as a secondary responsibility; and seldom does that coach have any expertise in coaching kicking technique. So less than 1/18th of coaching resources are dedicated to special teams.
I would think that it would be worth hiring a dedicated and qualified special teams coach. That still leaves 4 full time assistants each on offense and defense, none of whom would have to be distracted with moonlighting as a special teams coach. Have any colleges tried this approach and has it paid off?
January 15th, 2011 at 10:17 PM ^
1/3 of the game...didn't we have an ST coach under Carr? Perhaps combined duties as a recruiting coordinator - name escapes me now.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:20 PM ^
I kinda found the answer to my own question via the following link:
http://www.annarbor.com/sports/michigan-manages-special-teams-the-best-it-can-without-a-coordinator/
It's a little dated (from a time when Michigan special teams were good), but it claims 11 of 120 FBS teams have dedicated special teams coordinators. One additional benefit I hadn't considered is that having a kicking coach could help a lot with recruiting the best kicking prospects.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:29 PM ^
None other than John L. Smith.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:10 PM ^
Most colleges don't have to.
January 15th, 2011 at 10:35 PM ^
It seems to me that Broekhuizen has decent form but zero confidence. Maybe we'll receive a miracle and he'll have some sort of breakthrough. That's wishful thinking, of course. It'll take an even bigger miracle for Gibbons to ever be good, though.
I don't see why Hagerup never got a shot at kicking field goals. He surely kicked them in high school. It's not like we had much to lose by putting him in there.
January 16th, 2011 at 12:43 AM ^
Dave Bandon's first hire
January 16th, 2011 at 8:36 AM ^