Updated ESPN "Way-Too-Early Top 25" - Michigan #3
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/15994654/alabama-crimson…
8. ND
9. OSU
15. MSU
Baylor dropped out completely.
Yes I'm aware they just make minor changes to get people like me to click on it. And yes I will still inhale the whole thing.
And what's the constant for the past 8 years? We have a different coach and probably the best team we've had since 2006. Meanwhile OSU lost a historic number of players to the draft, and MSU loses a lot of talent including the best QB in school history. Neither team will suffer a huge stepback, but teams don't just replace the kind of talent that they lost without missing a beat. So I don't see what the past has to do with the present, or what losses sustained last year with completely different teams (or even more absurd, losses from 8 frickin years ago) have to do with this year. Yes, we will have to beat them during the season, but that has nothing to do with preseason rankings.
The constants?
Our coaching staffs are the same. No player on the entire Ohio State roster has ever lost to Michigan. In fact, no player for the Michigan Wolverines has ever beaten either of the two rivals besides a handful of 5th year seniors that beat a 6-6 MSU team by 2 points. So there are definitely constants here.
They both beat us with our current staff on our home field last year and now we have to go play them in tough environments. One of which even very strong 2004 and 2006 teams couldn't win in. Jim Harbaugh is 0-2 against rivals.
Listen, I think we are the favorites for the 2016 season in the Big Ten. If we don't win it this year, I will be very disappointed because we have all the pieces in place and other teams have lost talent. We should beat MSU this year and should have a good shot at the Buckeyes.
But the point is, I understand Spartan and Buckeye fans who scoff not at the "Michigan is the new favorite to defeat everyone." And people like you seem to be getting way too ahead of ourselves.
I'm just more of a walk the walk before you talk the talk kind of guy
This meshes with the general picture we're getting of preseason rankings: Michigan is ranked somewhere between 3 and 7. Our major questions is QB, with some concern at LB as well. People expect the offense to be pretty good at the baseline; the QB question could depress things slightly (in the unlikely event of a disaster) or, if we get someone like late-season Rudock, elevate the offense to terrific. The defense is expected to be dominant, and that drives the ranking.
Michigan was a top ten team (or nearly top ten) last season that finished with an impressive bowl win and returns almost everybody except Rudock. Nationally, there is a belief that Harbaugh is an excellent coach. This will naturally lead to high preseason rankings. Anyone delving further into the season by looking at schedules and matchups will notice that it will take a serious upset for Michigan not to start the season 7-0 (Wisconsin and Penn State, each at home, are the only games that are even threatening) heading into a late October tilt in EL.
Barring disaster, we are going to be in the thick of the playoff conversation into November. A high ranking seems like a no-brainer, even if a voter doesn't think we are close to a team like Bama or Clemson.
PSU is breaking in two new coordinators and a lot of new pieces, but they've still got some talent at WR and RB, and their defense should be at least respectable. But Wisconsin will be a stiff early season test if they're not beat to hell after games against LSU and MSU. If Clement is fully healthy, he's a dangerous runner. He'll be a solid measuring stick for seeing how good the DL really is.
Not saying Michigan shouldn't win that game, but Wisconsin will not be a pushover either.
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It's a good measuring stick game and it's fair to say that Wisconsin has some quality that could be threatening. Of course, things change during the season--a Wisconsin team with wins over LSU and MSU would draw Gameday to Ann Arbor. A Wisconsin team that has lost to both by 30 would be a 3-TD dog.
This is so true.
The Wisconsin-MSU game in East Lansing will be super interesting on September 24th. Will tell a lot about how our games with both of those teams will go.
Gosh that Wisconsin schedule though. I wonder if any team has ever had to go to Spartan Stadium and The Big House in back to back weeks when both Michigan teams were good. That'll be tough.
Is a win at MSU and a win at OSU. If we do this, then that should be pretty much where we should be.
I BELIEVE!
This ranking doens't matter. Just win the conference and be top 4 at the end of the regular season.
Until you guys consistently beat your in-state rival, I would hold off on the celebration of how highly you are ranked. Harbaugh needs to start kicking some Sparty Ass before he thinks about competing with Urban or being a consistent Top 5 power.
I know you don't want to hear this but the truth hurts sometimes. First beat MSU, then OSU, and THEN you are relevant.
understand what that has to do with a "just for the hell of it," preseason rankiing.
beating MSU and OSU. This is a preseason ranking done for one of two reasons; 1) click bait as many suggest or 2) to get fans talking college football. It has nothing to do with recent Ws and Ls. Its based on last season, returners for all teams, respective success of all staffs and whether or not they think we're going to move forward from there. Beating two of cfb's most successful programs over the past 8-9 years, and in OSU, even longer than that,is a tall order for any new coach and staff.
OSU certainly has the talent to be one hell of an out, but that is true every year. The only real experience they have coming back on offense is our only real ?, although the play of that position goes a hell of a long way in determing how the team will do. Remember though, the players that surround him, just as was the case two seasons ago, after a season opening loss, must prove they are as good as those they're replacing. So how well does this group have to play in order to give him the needed support the departing group did? That group just set a modern era record with 12 first four round draft picks. MSU, in addition to losing 8 offensive starters, counts among those to be replaced the all time leader in wins at that school and many like to argue, the best qb in school history. Both of those are facing far bigger obstacles in my opinion, than MI does in beating one or both.
Your opinion, I believe, is that of a lot of M fans who really don't believe it, but want to say, "we haven't proven a thing until we beat MSU and OSU. I understand that inasmuch as being equal to or better than OSU has always been our goal, and MSU being the instate nuiscance it always has been, has increased the hatred there due to its recent run of success. Although both of those has to do with this "just for the hell of it ranking," he's saying UM, based on last season's results, returning starters, recent recruiting, strength of coaching, et. al., is going to be better than both this season. That, imo, is not a stretch although the QB position, even with Harbaugh in charge, leaves ?s for me. For otthers, they say, "It's the one position where I have no concern due to Harbaugh." That is quite a divide.
As with any ranking, be it a "Far too early one for the hell of it," or a mid season ranking where the season ending playoff start to enter the discussion, coaching is always a consideration. So as of today, he believes Harbaugh is equal to the task of beating both MSU and OSU this season, not last season or future seasons, just this one. And I believe, like he does, if you want a coach to reverse a trend, take Harbaugh. Although his time in cfb has not been long, he has proven he can do one thing, turn a program, any program around. Prior to his first upset of USC, the Cardinal had been on the losing end of the score 27 times in the prior 35 games along with a tie. Just 7 wins prior to Harbaugh coming to town in that span. Since? They are 7-3 and that wasn't just any team. That was the "Bama of the first decade of this century." Although he coached only 2 of those victories, the team, following his blue print has as many wins against the Trojans since his arrival as they did the preceding 35 years prior to.
I agree with your premise that we, as Michigan fans, will not be satisfied until we prove it on the field and only then will we have a measure of enjoyment. But in a preseason ranking where you're dealing only with this season and based on the history of the three staffs, not the ones preceding them, I don't think it's a stretch at all to predict UM will beat them both this season.
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