i won't believe it until magnus puts a picture with his post
UM DL position changes
Because we're all tired of the subject already until we see something actually happen in the Spring?
I would say that it is pretty significant. It was all just speculation before, but this time Mattison has come out and said it himself.
I think Beyer is a more natural fit at WDE than Roh is at SDE, but Roh has a lot of time to bulk up before the season.
His coaching clinic visit. So he'll be able to confirm it (or deny it, but it seems solid).
Brian may be able to confirm this, as I believe he was at the same event with Mattison last Friday.
Does that mean Clark would rotate with Beyer at WDE? Would Black be Roh's backup?
I think it is still uncertain where Black ends up. At this point it looks like Clark, Beyer and maybe Black will battle for the starting spot at WDE.
i'd think of black as the first sub in at any of three positions - WDE, SDE and 3 tech.
My interpretation is that Clark is your leading candidate to start at WDE. The coaches wanted Black to show up to camp heavier than he did last year, and that didn't happen. I'm guessing we'll also see Black move to 5-tech or even 3-tech in 2012.
This is a rivals repost. Other notes.
Mattison really talked up Beyer as a break out prospect and that he would not allow him to switch to offense.
Cam Gordon might be switched back to offense next year.
Magnus rarely claims to have inside information, and this doesn't seem like a state secret.
I don't think this is secret info or that Magnus is stealing it. I'm just saying I got this exact update yesterday. I'm sure a bunch of people(Looks like maybe Brian got similar info and will be speculating soon.) Guess I was just pointing out this was not Magnus unearthing secret info.
I'm still hoping for more nickle and dime packages this year.
Roh, Black ,Clark with LB's Ryan, Morgan and Hawthorne faking blitzes/backing into coverage with Avery as the nickle back. I like the athleticism here on 3rd and long downs or 2 minute drill situations.
It's hard to tell how much snark (if any) people put into their posts.
It's not secret info, because it was e-mailed to me by a guy who was at the coaching clinic. There are probably hundreds of people who got this info before me, but I hadn't seen it posted elsewhere until I put it up at TTB. If the info was relayed elsewhere, I have no knowledge of it.
I am under the impression that you are a high school coach, and being a Michigan fan such as yourself, I am curious as to why you did not attend the clinic? Or, a broader question, what does it take for a high school coach to attend such a clinic? Have you ever considered attending them in the past? It seems like given the upward trajectory of your blog (which I very much enjoy) it would be a worthwhile thing to attend. Just curious.
I did not attend the clinic because I don't live in the area. If I did, I would have done my best to get there.
I'm not sure how much this particular clinic cost. Costs vary depending on how long the clinic is, where it is, etc. Luckily my school's football booster organization foots the bill for the coaches to attend one clinic per year, and I assume that's the case for many schools. We (as individuals) have to cover the cost of the hotel, food, etc. I have attended several clinics in the past and wrote up summaries of them over at TTB, but unfortunately, I haven't seen Mattison speak.
I did attend a clinic several years ago and saw Ron English and Steve Stripling speak, both of whom were still at Michigan then. Stripling was meh as a speaker, but English is a very intense guy. I really enjoyed his presentation.
I figured that may have something to do with it. I am not intimitely familiar with high school football and how those clinics work, so I was genuinely curious. Keep up the good work with TTB.
No problem. I wish I could have answered your question more specifically. And thanks for the compliments.
magnus has coaching connections. doesn't seem like something he'd lie about.
This is how I hoped things would shake out.
This move would leave us pretty thin at SAM right? I think we go after a SAM type LB pretty hard in the 2013 class. Hopefully it is Levenberry.
And I'm not sure that any of the incoming LBs projects to that position very well.
I think Bolden projects to SAM better than any of the other guys. Maybe RJS, but I think Bolden might be more ready to play right now.
There are 2 recruits that could end up at SAM, RJS and Mario. I think Mario stays at WDE because of the numbers there and because I think he is better with his hand down the majority of the time.
What this means to me is a few things. They think Roh and Black are probably not athletic enough to play weakside but can be very valuable players at the 5 tech. The added weight would and position change will probably benefit both of them. It also means they are probably happy with Clark.
I think it means two things more than anythign else though: it means they are happy with the progress of Cam; and it means that they don't think Mario will be able to contribute at WDE right away (which almost everyone agrees with due to his size). This at least gives a solid 2-deep at each position (SDE, WDE, and SAM).
I really doubt Ojemudia will play SAM. First of all, he's said all along that they want him as a WDE. But aside from that, guys don't usually move BACK in the defense. They move from S to LB or from LB to DE or from DE to DT. (I'm sure you know all this, but I'm just offering background for my thoughts.)
Ojemudia played defensive tackle in high school, so moving him to outside linebacker seems like a stretch to me.
The last time Michigan tried to move someone back in defense (Josh Furman from rush linebacker to safety), it didn't work out so well . . . or at least it hasn't yet. Furman has yet to see the field for any significant time other than special teams.
I was just saying that those are the only two that really would even belong in the discussion for SAM. I don't think Mario ends up there and I have a feeling RJS will end up there after some time to get bigger. I like Ross and Bolden on the inside enough to think that moving RJS down may make sense (and RJS has, IMO, a pretty good build for that spot).
I agree about RJS. And having three good linebackers for three spots seems like a waste if two of them are going to be at the same position.
Wasn't Antonio Poole projected for the SAM?
I believe we're looking at five LB as future SAMs prospects right now:
1. Michael Hutchings - seems like a kid who'll stay on the West Coast
2. EJ Levenberry - We're in his top 3
3. Dorian O'Daniel - Has interest in Michigan, not sure his height is ideal.
4. Peter Kalambayi - Has Michigan in his top 3 or 4 but seems to be a Clemson lean
5. Ben Gedeon - Likes Michigan...I think this will be a UM-OSU battle with Stanford as a dark horse
SAM is going to be an important position to address in this class.
Is Dorian O'Daniel a SAM prospect? I thought he would project to WILL based on his size.
Levenberry and Kalambayi seem like SAM prospects. The other three look like WILLs to me.
So would Cam Gordon be a WR? We could use the help there....
If he is going to make a switch, I'm guessing it is a hybrid TE type.
is there real scuttlebut about cam gordon switching or us just speculating. i suspect he's staying at SAM.
Not sure just pure speculation on my part. IF he were to make a position switch that MIGHT be a possibility.
There are certain "insiders" who have hinted that Cam Gordon is a candidate to move to tight end, but I don't know that any change has been made yet.
I feel bad for Cam because he has been moved around so much since he has arrived. If Cam makes the switch who do you see as Jake Ryan's backup?
I don't really see another guy being immediately serviceable at SAM, which is why Cam Gordon moving to TE would confuse me a bit. If you move both Beyer and Gordon away from SAM, that leaves Jordan Paskorz and freshmen.
I feel like Cam doesn't really have the size to be a tight end. Isn't he only about 6-2 or so? Dude is a great athlete, hard to understand why we can't find a permanent position for him...
He's listed at 6'3", but he could play the U position, which is the guy who goes into motion or flexes out into the slot. He's probably too small to be an in-line blocker, though.
This is a cool video, but is it supposed to show us why you are skeptical?
I'm now worried about SDE.
It doesn't seem to me like Roh has to become a 300lbs beast; he will probably go up to 275 or so, which is good enough. I m pretty sure Black and Wormley get signifigant snaps at SDE too. I really like Clark at WDE on passing downs and maybe rotating Roh over to WDE for third and short. Of course, i don't think this coaching staff needs my help with third and short.
I agree. Roh doesn't need to get huge. He's already almost 270 (in his official listing) and Van Bergen was 288. If Roh can get to 275-280 lbs., I think he'll be fine. He already uses leverage pretty well.
Is Roh even capable of bulking up much more? Wasn't he eating to the brink of vomiting every day last summer? That sounds like a maxed out weight to me.
Everyone is capable of bulking up more.
Craig Roh was listed as 270 last year, and that was reportedly in the middle of his bat with mono. Even if being sick didn't affect his weight, he will still be 275-280 this fall. Plenty big for a SDE, especiially one with Roh's athleticism. It's not like we have other guys with that size to play there in his place.
To answer your question; Why would someone want to know what a random junior middle school assistant football equipment manager thinks MIGHT happen with the Michigan Football team DL positions?
Wasn't Beyer recruited as a weak-side end in the first place? How much would he have to bulk up to play there effectively?
Yeah, Beyer was introduced as a DE during last year's NSD press conference, and he played DE in high school. I think his playing SAM was just a function of a) a lack of depth and b) his lack of bulk. Someone close to him e-mailed me at one point and told me he was up to 235, and that was several months ago, so I imagine he's even bigger now.
Remember Dantonio making a jackass of himself because he didn't like Hecklinski's presentation on Michigan recruiting.
Below is a screen shot of the opening to Spartan LB Coach Mike Tressel's segment at the coaches clinic last Friday. Aside from this slide, there had to have been a dozen other pictures and clips of the MSU game vs us last year (including multiple repeats of the sack on 4th down). I realize this is what coaches do. It's part of their presentation. Unfortunately, Dantonio didn't get the memo.
Am I missing something in this picture?
OMG! This can't be true. We need to catch Saban off guard. If we lose to Bama it's your fault for leaking secrets.
Here's to never (or rarely) watching Brennan Beyer's gangliness in coverage again.
Cant beat beers and food with the coaching staff. I enjoyed watching them practice. I will be in attendance again this year. If you aren't a coach, get with a friend who is, its well worth the inside look.
Agreed. It's not often you get a chance to sit around with a big-time college football coach while he tips back a few beers. It's a pretty cool experience to see them in a relaxed situation, rather than on the football field or giving motivational talks.
You can't get his name and number though because that is an NCAA violation. I guess you can order #57 and hope he doesn't change number before the season.
I was really hoping this move would happen. Seeing how it allows us to get our best players on the field. I see Roh playing SDE at 280lbs this season which should be fine for his frame. So, after that move I see the DL depth chart looking like this:
SDE: Roh, Brink, Wormley/Godin
DT: Q.Wash, Wilkins/Rock
NT: B.W.C, PeeWee
WDE: Black/Clark, Beyer
**-Black- Will get time both on WDE and SDE. IMO I see Black as the starting WDE and Clark coming in to relieve Black and coming in pass rush situations. I don't think Black will have the weight for the 3-tech since he couldn't put on the weight last year.
As for the linebackers and Cam Gordon
WILL: Morgan, Poole/Ross/Ringer
MIKE: Demens, Jones, Bolden/RJS
SAM: Ryan, Gordon, RJS/Bolden
This depth chart is only for the first few games or so..after that I see the freshman making moves up the depth chart. Also I think after demens leaves Morgan will move to Mike and either Ross or Poole will take the starting will spot.
what do you guys see the front 7 looking like next year? here is what i came up with
WILL- bolden / morgan
Make way for Malik McDowell!
This is good news...
1. Frank Clark
2. JiBreel Black
3. Jake Ryan
4. Brennen Beyer
1. Will Campbell
2. Richard Ash
3. Quinton Washington
4. Ondre Pipkins
1. Quinton Washington
2. Ondre Pipkins
3. Kenny Wilkins
4. Matt Godin/JiBreel Black
1. Craig Roh
2. JiBreel Black
3. Nathan Brink
4. Chris Wormley
1. Desmond Morgan
2. Brandon Hawthorne
3. James Ross
4. Kaleb Ringer
1. Kenny Demens
2. Joe Bolden
3. Mike Jones
4. Royce Jenkins Stone
1. Jake Ryan
2. Cam Gordon
3. Jordan Paskorz
4. Mike Jones
I'm a little bit surprised that so many people (not just you) are penciling Pipkins in as a 3-tech. Pipkins is more of a prototypical nose tackle than a 3-tech. I'm not ruling it out as a possibility that Pipkins plays the 3-tech, because I think the nose tackle position is more important and they might want a more experienced guy there. But Campbell hasn't really shown the ability to defeat double-teams, while he has shown the ability to destroy single blocks. It could really mess up an offense if they feel like they have to double-team the 3-tech AND the 1-tech.
I hear you, it's just personally...I think the NG position is more demanding. I'm not sure our coaches are going to leave that up to a freshman.
I DO think Pipkins will be the starting NG in 2013-14...I just think he'll get a year at DT where they'll say. Stay low and go get the football. And then he'll learn the position a little more and be able to move over when Campbell leaves.
IMO it'll be: Campbell/Ash at NG and Washington/Pipkins at DT this year...and then it'll be Pipkins/Ash at NG and Washington/(Godin, Rock, Black, maybe Wormley) at DT the following season.
How come you don't have Antonio Poole listed anywhere?
This is why I update the depth chart I post every other month or so...so I don't forget anyone.
With that said, I'd have Poole as the #4 WLB ahead of Ringer so it's not like it matters to much for this exercise.
Really I have Ringer and RJS both redshirtting and Ross and Bolden playing.
I could see Ringer missing the RS because he's already with the team, and maybe Ross would want to RS if he's just going to be on special teams. So I could see them swapping. Bolden plays. Demens job is obviously safe...but on passing downs, I wouldn't be shocked to see Demens watching and Bolden out on the field at MLB. OR depending on what happens with Cam Gordon, I wouldn't be shocked to see Ryan at WDE, Demens at SLB and Bolden at MLB on passing downs.
I think that many of you are underestimating Brennen Beyer. He has a lot of speed and athleticism. This isn't a move to bury him in the depth chart. This is a move to get him on the field in his ideal position. It will be interesting to see the battle between Clark and Beyer for WDE. He is gaining a lot of weight and Mattison seems to be very high on him as he is on Clark. The Spring practices will tell us a lot.
I agree that it's not a move to bury Beyer. I think he'll be the backup WDE, but he wouldn't start at SAM, either, so it's not bad for him...it's just a change.
#3 SAM to maybe #2 WDE depending on what happens to Black.
I just wanted to confirm the inforation provided. Mattison said Beyer would be moving to DE, and Roh would be moving to SDE.