Torn on O
With all of these rumors with Pep going away after this bowl game, anyone worried our O does very well and we keep him around for 19? I am never gonna root for our team to do bad, but I don’t care if we score 60 and 500+ yards. Don’t want him back next year.
Anyone else torn on offensive outcome tomorrow and what that means for Peps future if we do really well?
December 28th, 2018 at 11:41 PM ^
I thought about that but I don't think it's gonna matter. Peps route designs are ugly and terrible
December 28th, 2018 at 11:41 PM ^
For the UM fan base, Pep Hamilton is the boogey-man.
It's sad, and I think a lot of people who otherwise would consider themselves, "grown ass men" need to grow the eff up.
December 29th, 2018 at 12:05 AM ^
UM Pep = MSU Warner
December 29th, 2018 at 3:02 AM ^
Lol, why? Is it because some of us are realists?
December 29th, 2018 at 9:18 AM ^
Yes, because being torn about rooting for your team to do well is the sign of being a "realist."
Why is it the false choice? Why can't the OP and like-minded folks say/think/write that they want Michigan to blow the doors off Florida and at the same time be better on offense next season too?
Then we can have the debate about how to go about doing that, whether it be a college coach with a better track record of success in the college game, a more streamlined play-calling approach, etc.
God damn simpletons spewing nonsense and then framing it like they're the smart ones, the "realists." Give us a break.
December 29th, 2018 at 11:01 AM ^
What? You just spewed for 4 paragraphs basically saying we can have really nice things today, but find someone better next year? Or Pep will magically start throwing to all of our playmakers?
How often does someone get replaced when you finish with a bang? Once in a while, but shows you the torn mentality. Do we as fans want greatness today, so maybe mean more of Pep in 19? If you wanna be better next year, I can’t imagine you think that’s with Pep here.
December 29th, 2018 at 12:06 PM ^
No, he's right. Everyone is so convinced that Hamilton is the problem... what are you all going to say when you finally get what you're asking for but it isn't quite as sweet as you hoped?
December 29th, 2018 at 1:28 PM ^
Haha.... you write the OP, then claim what I wrote was "spewed."
Great contribution!
The problem you have is you're trying to walk back from an insanely stupid comment.
December 29th, 2018 at 4:03 AM ^
Just like Drevno right? Give me a friggin break. The offense is stale and an NFL dude who was let go by the Browns has shown no sign he knows how to fix it. Even with all the great athletes we have.
December 29th, 2018 at 9:06 AM ^
With all the hate the offense gets, you would think it played an egg in its biggest game of the year. Oh wait.....
December 29th, 2018 at 9:57 AM ^
The offense "played" an egg? BS. In the last 50 years of OSU games, ONLY ONCE did the team score more than 39 points against the buckeyes. Only MD put up more points against them this year.
December 29th, 2018 at 10:27 AM ^
I think you missed the sarcasm. The defense was clearly the egg players.
December 29th, 2018 at 1:47 PM ^
"an NFL dude who was let go by the Browns"
As part of fan base clamors for the NFL dude who was let go by the Jaguars.
Why is being fired by the Browns such a huge sticking point? That franchise fires coaches left and right. Now if he were fired by the Steelers, a franchise famous for NOT firing coaches, that'd be different.
But too many who post here are too stupid to realize this.
December 28th, 2018 at 11:44 PM ^
This is pure stupidity. How about you root for the team and let Jim Harbaugh handle who will run the offense?
This is and always will be Jim Harbaugh’s offense as long as he is the head coach. He is way more qualified to select those who will coach it than any on this blog.
December 29th, 2018 at 12:24 AM ^
It's Harbaugh's offense but Pep's designing passing plays...that's literally his job. And Shea doesn't seem to hit any receivers in stride compared to when we had Darboh, Chesson, Butt....and Jedd Fisch.
December 29th, 2018 at 12:45 AM ^
Your memory is...faulty. That offense wasn't as great as the memory of it that seems to exist in your dreams.
December 29th, 2018 at 1:20 AM ^
I call bullshit Clarence. Can you really not see a difference between that O and this one? The eye test isn't even close. Play action on 3rd and 8, snapping the ball with 2 seconds left on the play clock, with long developing routes coupled with marginal Pass Pro, down late in the 4th - PEP bread n butter. Junk.
Why do guys like you continue to give PEP a pass at $1m per year? What has he done, in your eyes, to deserve that kind of bank?
December 29th, 2018 at 1:48 AM ^
Why don't you get that it's Harbaugh's offense? We snap it with 2 seconds left because Harbaugh call plays via committee and it takes that long to get it to the qb. Your eye test is nonsense. If you don't like the O your problem is with Harbaugh since he's basically lead playcaller and this is his system.
December 29th, 2018 at 1:58 AM ^
Clarence, speak the truth brother. This should not be hard to understand but it is for many in the fan base. This is 100% Harbaugh's offense and he dictates the overall strategy, tempo, game plan, etc. Warriner and Pep full in the details. If you don't like the offense take Harbaugh to task.
December 29th, 2018 at 11:01 AM ^
Ok, so let's take this breakdown and go with it... Michigan wins a lot of games, but struggles against top notch competition in games of national significance. As exhibit A, simply take our OSU+Bowl records over the last decade or so, including Harbaugh's tenure. The options are: (1) change something at the coaching level, or (2) don't. As a fan/alumnus I'm surely entitled to an opinion on this regardless of my expertise. As a mgoblog reader, I'm also entitled to voice that opinion (Thanks Brian, Seth, et al.!) You don't like the "get rid of Pep" opinions, so let's hear yours!
Is it your opinion that a coaching change should be made at some level? Do you think a coaching change on the offensive side should be made? Do you think a change in the "overall strategy, tempo, game plan, etc" coaching domain should be made... or a change in the "details" of the running or passing game?
If you don't believe a coaching change is appropriate or necessary, do you believe that there is anything that can be done to enable the team to "break through" the glass ceiling of OSU and other nationally significant contests, or is our recent history of lots of wins, but perennial also-ran status the new status quo?
For me, Don Brown got eaten alive at Indiana and OSU, and I'm concerned a bit... but still confident that Brown knows what went wrong and has ideas on how to fix it, and will make those adjustments moving forward. On the offensive side, I don't think Michigan's point total against OSU is all that revealing... (1) Purdue scored a ton on them, and look what just happened to Purdue--so it's not like it's hard to score on OSU. (2) The real problem to my eye was that the offense couldn't stay on the field (that is, keep the defense off the field) when it really could have helped. And (3), though 39 is a lot, it was nearly enough to keep up, so it's not like the offense was covering itself in glory.
In the end, I believe the running game and overall offensive line play improved *dramatically* with Warriner appearing on the scene. This highlights, to me, the importance of Asst coaching *within* Harbaugh's offense. In comparison, I see little effective use of our highly touted WRs, I feel that the TE usage is weak compared with years past, and I see very little creativity in route design to confuse or take advantage of defenses. This last point, to me, is striking, as watching the running game develop this year it is easy to identify *a host* of little play design elements that go a long way to defeating defenses even before the mano-a-mano battles begin. It's exactly this creativity in details, as you put it, that is my argument for why Pep Hamilton is a weak link in the Michigan coaching attack.
Bottom line: I believe we can break through the OSU/Bowl/top competition glass ceiling, but it will require continued adjustment by Don Brown (I feel pretty confident he can and will), and it will require the kind of step forward the running game saw this year in the passing game... and I do not see evidence that Pep Hamilton is the Asst Coach best equipped to enable this improvement.
December 29th, 2018 at 12:26 PM ^
Personally, I think Harbaugh should find a more modern thinking OC and hand him the reins. I do not like Harbaugh's conservative approach to the offense nor his play calling by committee. It's Harbaugh that learned the gospel of three yards and a cloud of dust from Bo, not Pep. The point that Clarence and I are making is that firing Pep and bringing in someone else to be in the exact same role as Pep (i.e. executing what Harbaugh wants) won't change things. We are stuck with this offense either until Harbaugh leaves or he has a change in philosophy and modernizes his approach.
December 29th, 2018 at 2:58 AM ^
Why don't you get that Pep was hired to design passing plays which seem to be distinctly different than what we saw when Fisch was here? Of course it's Harbaugh's offense, that doesn't make him in charge of designing all the plays. We have pass game coordinators and run game coordinators for a reason.
December 29th, 2018 at 8:11 AM ^
Well Harbaugh might also be a problem on offense but he's not going to fire himself. Therefore he should hire a bright young mind to help him see the light. To do that Pep needs to go.
December 29th, 2018 at 9:52 AM ^
Are you serious ? Harbaugh's going to hire a "bright young mind" to show him the way ? Good luck with that.
December 29th, 2018 at 9:28 AM ^
I get what you're saying and I agree adjustments need to be made; this offense should be more efficient against better teams. It works just fine against teams with less talent but with a team with better or equal talent, not so much. Personally, I like the offensive philosophy but the pass game could use a few tweaks. Heck, toss some into the run game too. I think we should make the opposing D have to prepare to defend the whole field and the I don't think we do that right now.
December 29th, 2018 at 2:53 AM ^
That offense wasn't that great because we had no running game to compliment the passing game. Take a look at that year's numbers:
Darboh: 57 catches for 862 yards
Chesson: 35 catches for 500 yards
Butt: 46 catches for 546 yards
And that's with a mediocre QB. It was even better the year before with a pretty decent QB in Rudock.
Our highest catch total this year was 39 by DPJ. He would have 60+ in the right offense, and if he doesnt next year it will be a crime.
December 29th, 2018 at 8:43 AM ^
So you're complaining about the offense not being good at running, and then crowing about how many catches the WRs had. WTF? You can't rip it apart and praise it at the same time. The whole cake eating thing...
Basically, all you're doing is complaining about shit you don't like. Whining like a little bitch.
December 29th, 2018 at 9:51 AM ^
Yeah that's exactly it...I was complaining that we had no run game in 2016. Not that our offense would have been damn near unstoppable that year with a running game to compliment the passing game which was great. Instead of relying on trying to jam it down everyone's throat this year which clearly didn't work.
December 29th, 2018 at 1:17 AM ^
I'll have what you're smoking.
December 29th, 2018 at 5:01 AM ^
I’m not sure we recall the same offense... Rudock was terrible at hitting his receivers in stride downfield, and Speight was no better...
I’ll give you that the playcalling seemed a bit better and the passing routes made sense and didn’t take too long to develop, but Shea is no worse (id actually call him better) than Rudock/Speight at hitting guys in stride, especially throwing the ball downfield.
December 29th, 2018 at 6:21 AM ^
The last 4 or 5 games in 15, Rudock was lights out. Late in season he threw some of the best timing passes we have seen under Harbaugh. I can recall him throwing to receivers before they were in their break and throwing them open. Early in season, he missed a ton of open receivers. It takes timing to develop a downfield passing game. One more season with Harbaugh will pay huge dividends for Shea and Michigan offense.
December 29th, 2018 at 4:06 AM ^
The coaches always know best. Bold take. /s
December 29th, 2018 at 8:28 AM ^
The fans always know best. Genius take.
/s
December 29th, 2018 at 11:24 AM ^
Nice straw man. 2/10 for originality
December 29th, 2018 at 12:32 PM ^
Nice straw man. 2/10 for intelligence.
December 28th, 2018 at 11:44 PM ^
Other than Yoder, are there credible rumors floating around about Pep leaving? What's the source?
I want us to win tomorrow and to look good. If Pep lights it up with what is essentially the 2019 offense, maybe he deserves to stay.
December 28th, 2018 at 11:47 PM ^
Wondering the same?
December 29th, 2018 at 12:25 AM ^
First I've heard of it as well. Besides some wishes from some of the fanbase of course. Pep Hamilton is the OC version of Harbaugh, Stoops, Gruden.
December 29th, 2018 at 8:47 AM ^
This comes from nothing more than Pep having been a 'finalist' for the MD job, whatever that means. There are no other rumors I've heard, other than some 'fans' hoping he gets fired.
December 29th, 2018 at 9:32 AM ^
Speaking of Yoder, he apparently said yesterday that Harbaugh is looking at interviewing as many as 10 (?!) coaches whose primary job would be play-calling.
I'm seriously hoping today looks a lot like New Year's Day 2008 when a Michigan offense that seemed dormant much of the season came out with new looks and utilized the offensive talent it had.
Of course, if that happens a lot of us will be uber excited going into the 2019 season, and a bunch more seemingly will just bitch about why it wasn't there all season.
December 28th, 2018 at 11:48 PM ^
Should we do a pep prediction thread
December 29th, 2018 at 12:22 AM ^
No...I think we need another half dozen "how to fix the playoffs" threads before we move to Pep prediction threads.
December 29th, 2018 at 9:27 AM ^
Then put up a few more players sitting out/bowls are meaningless threads.
December 28th, 2018 at 11:52 PM ^
Few of the guys on here pretty connected have mentioned it a few times in random topics. Guys who have provided inside scoop before. Plus, Yoder lol. He’s the voice of Michigan Sports HAHA.
December 29th, 2018 at 11:14 AM ^
Not sure why this guy is getting down voted. He’s right, at least about the part where insiders have said pep is looking. Take it for what it’s worth.
Also, OP worrying about being too good is some rich irony.
December 28th, 2018 at 11:52 PM ^
We’re going to look amazing tomorrow because the defense was embarrassed by Ohio State. They’ve had a month to get pissed, cycle through the stages of grief, and return back to fierce anger. Florida will have -14 yards and 0 first downs at halftime. The M offense will be on the field all day to tinker around with different combinations.
December 28th, 2018 at 11:55 PM ^
Michigan is going to look like crap. That is what I expect considering what has gone on since OSU.
December 29th, 2018 at 1:07 AM ^
December 29th, 2018 at 4:38 AM ^
Losing Devin is huge, we aren't going to replace his production with 'Other Devin'. Losing Karan is probably the other loss that can't truly be replaced, but with respect to the other departures the 'next man up' will do fine. The rest of the team that won 10 straight games before meeting up with a talented Ohio State team in the Horseshoe, is there. The Peach Bowl isn't the 'shoe and the Gators aren't the Buckeyes. We might not look quite as good as we did during the streak, but I don't think we're going to look like crap.