Protecting the QB
I believe that what it came down to on Saturday was Michigans inability to solve MSU's defensive line pressure and blitz packages. Part of this is on Denard for not recognizing the blitz and changing plays. But in my opinion the majority of the blame goes to the oline. They were being blown of the ball on a consitent basis. It was obvious that Worthy was able to time the snap count all day long. I don't care who we have playing quarterback if you can't give them anytime to make a play they wont be effective.
Every team we face the rest of the way will be throwing every blitz package they have at us as well as trying to time the snap count. Hopefully the coaches are spending a lot of the by week working on new protection schemes.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:22 AM ^
Yeah, protect him ten seconds after the play. I got sick of the camera flashing back to Denard on the ground after plays that he was hardly involved in. We played a dirty team with a sick old bastard for a coach. They'll get there's this year. They always do.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:27 AM ^
So your saying our oline and Denard did a good job picking up the blitz? Worthy didn't have the snap count timed? I agree state played dirty they hit late everything. But I don't think that is why we lost at all.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:33 AM ^
I don't think they were quite as effective at jumping the snap as in previous years. We drew two or three offsides calls. However, we often snapped the ball very late in the play clock, at which point it's easy to figure out when the ball's going to be snapped.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:39 AM ^
The jumping of the snap count didn't seem to me to be as big of an issue as it has been in the past. You make a good point, though, that you're obviously going to snap the ball if the playclock is at :01.
October 18th, 2011 at 10:41 AM ^
I noticed this too - no matter how good an OLine or QB are, waiting until the :01 to snap the ball gives the D an advantage as they know exactly when the snap will occur. This is not a problem that is unique to our team. Last season, the NY Giants did this as well, which led to Eli Manning taking tons of sacks and constantly throwing under pressure (which resulted in tons of picks). Same result this past week for us. Not saying that this is the entire problem - not even close - but if we are facing a tough D, why given them ANY advantage.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:52 AM ^
I don't think he said or was trying to imply anything that you're insinuating he was. The man was just making an observation that was somewhat related to the topic, and at a no time did he state that observation was the reason, or even a factor, for our loss.
October 18th, 2011 at 10:31 AM ^
October 18th, 2011 at 9:28 AM ^
1. Nobody expected this team to go 13-0 this year.
2. I think it is pretty safe to say that the coaches are doing everything possible to squeeze every drop of production out of the talent they have.
3. In the last five years, there have been four DC's, three OC's, and three HC's. Consequently, there is no "conditioned response" when the shit hits the fan, and players go back to their instincts under pressure.
4. Patience...
October 18th, 2011 at 9:32 AM ^
Why don't you go post a great thread so we can all go follow your lead in making them.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:33 AM ^
Amazing how we lose one game to a ranked opponent, on the road and in bad weather no less, and it is treated as a sign of the Michigan Football Apocalypse.
October 18th, 2011 at 10:44 AM ^
The OP is not saying anything about a football apocalypse. All he said was
"Hopefully the coaches are spending a lot of the by week working on new protection schemes" because the ones we ran this past week didn't work.
That's a pretty valid topic for discussion. He isn't saying OMG WE IS DEAD, or BENCH DENARD, or FIRE HOKE, BORGES AND EVERYONE ELSE. He is just discussing a pretty fair concern going forward. Hell, he even ended on an optimistic not about the coaches working on new protection schemes.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:38 AM ^
It seems to me that a bunch of screen passes would have solved a lot of the problems that we saw on Saturday. As always, though, I should add that I appreciate that Borges's probably dog knows more about playcalling than I do.
October 18th, 2011 at 11:07 AM ^
Vincent Smith has been lightning on the receiving end of screen passes this season. It must have something to do with his being 5'6". Of course, Brian has noted that the coaching staff seems reluctant to pull Omameh (in the context of running in Lewan's direction), so maybe the lack of screen passes is another symptom of that.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:51 AM ^
Thank you for your unique and insightful commentary on our team.
October 18th, 2011 at 9:55 AM ^
Don't think I've heard this opinion anywhere on the board since Saturday
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<br>/s/
October 18th, 2011 at 9:56 AM ^
"Every team we face the rest of the way will be throwing every blitz package they have at us as well as trying to time the snap count. Hopefully the coaches are spending a lot of the by week working on new protection schemes."
Until MSU, all of the D's were stacking the box and playing contain on Denard, not blitzing him, which obviously was not successful. I'm nervous now that MSU showed the "blueprint" to stop Denard. I'm sure Borges can adjust, but I don't think we'll see contain anymore.
October 18th, 2011 at 10:29 AM ^
I do believe that on a less windy day, Denard can stretch the field with passing. What this means is that unless there is wind like last Saturday, other teams will not succeed with the same strategy. On a still day, Denard's jump ball passes can work to Michigan's advantage.
I also believe that the only way you learn to pick up blitzes is live action against them.
Playing against a tough defense and offense teaches Michigan about toughness, blocking, and tackling, in a way that nothing else does. Honestly, I think that is is exactly the teaching tool needed to be competitive vs. Nebraska and Ohio.
Lastly, while the Nov. teams will have a good defense, especially Ohio, I don't think any of them have the same kind of aggressive defensive line we saw versus Michigan State.
I don't think we will win all our games in November, but I do believe we will win at least two, which is fine with me.
October 18th, 2011 at 10:51 AM ^
You make several great points.
First, the thing about learning toughness - Hoke can talk up MANBALL, accountability, toughness, responsibility, etc. until he is blue in the face, but nothing is going to drive that lesson home like a good old fashion physical pounding at the hands of a hated rival. Trust me, the next time Hoke talks about toughness in a team meeting, this team will now understand what he means. Over the rest of this season and going into next year, this loss will do more good than bad for this team.
Second, the wind. Again, I totally agree. Denard can actually throw the ball. We have all seen it. Maybe he is struggling in learning the mechanics of a new offense and new routes, but he has the ability to throw the ball fine. But, he is not a good enough thrower to account for both the wind and MSU attempting to end his life with dirty hits. Unless we face an equally aggressive front in a garbage wind storm again, I do not expect Denard to struggle to this level again this season. (Will he struggle at times against our remaining opponents other than Purdue? Sure, but not to this level).
Finally, the remaining schedule - I totally agree that we can win 2 of our 4 November games. Assuming a Purdue win, winning 2 November games means a 9 win season going into the Bowl Game. Pretty fine by me, given that this is a true transition year.
October 18th, 2011 at 11:56 AM ^
To me, a 9-win season is an outstanding result, even if the losses include MSU and OSU. I'll admit that this loss to Sparty was a tough one to swallow (if only because watching it was painful for numerous reasons), but I'll be able to get past it and past a loss to OSU to finish with 9 wins. Just like you say, 9 wins is great especially given the "turmoil" of the past 12 months and the schematic changes made on both sides of the ball.
October 18th, 2011 at 12:37 PM ^
I think I may have realized something this weekend - while people have noted for a while that Denard can make just about any throw when he sets his feet, I'm not sure I've ever seen him make an accurate pass on the run. The QB Oh Noes are perhaps an exception, but those are a bit unique in that Denard is moving almost entirely toward.his target when the ball is thrown (and even then, his accuracy on those plays is not entirely consistent.)
My concern is that throwing on the run may be something difficult to coach - it seems to me, though I may be wrong here - that by a QBs junior year in college he either has the ability to do this well or not. For an obvious comparison, look at how much more comfortable Devin is when rolling out.
The question, then, is what to do about this. First and foremost, this is more evidence that any and all rollout pass plays should be thrown in a bonfire. I really don't think that, much as we might want to believe otherwise, jump balls are a viable strategy against above-average secondaries. Is the best solution to simply coach Denard to pull it and run, no matter what, if there isn't a functioning pocket? I'd much, much rather he improvise strictly with his feet than try to Tate it up with his arm.
Thoughts?
October 18th, 2011 at 12:55 PM ^
Hoke's problem is that he has a roster full of RR's Big East/MAC type of players.
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<br>Hoke's put together a good 2012 class, but you won't see a significant impact from these guys until their 2nd and most likely 3rd year in the program.
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<br>Everyone here can look forward to the Fall 2014.
October 18th, 2011 at 11:13 AM ^
I was going to leave a comment noting that, aside from the wind, Michigan State has particularly good cornerbacks that allow their defense to commit more guys to the blitz. But, sadly, so do Nebraska and Ohio State.
October 18th, 2011 at 10:42 AM ^
Like Hoke said in the presser, on the fourth and 1, everyone was accounted for. So that means someone blew an assignment. If you watch how many times V. Smith missed picking up the blitzer, you'll see why Denard was sacked and hurried so many times.
October 18th, 2011 at 12:51 PM ^
Vinny, blame piss poor play calling
October 18th, 2011 at 11:11 AM ^
It's over.
October 18th, 2011 at 11:23 AM ^
Live to play another down.
October 18th, 2011 at 12:14 PM ^
Our lines were just absolute disasters in general. MSU's supposedly weak OLine punished our supposedly decent DLine all day
October 18th, 2011 at 1:32 PM ^
Both our lines did get pounded but the game was still a lot closer then some are now making it out. If Denard has 1-2 seconds more on that 4th and 1 Koger was wide open down the middle in the end zone and it's 21-21. I didn't like the call but hey, if it works, and it could have, it's brilliant.
Going into the season we knew it wouldn't be perfect. Hopefully we learn from it and move on.
October 18th, 2011 at 1:50 PM ^
We handed the ball off 6 times on our last 11 possessions (despite both backs averaging over 4 ypc for the game). Any offensive line is going to struggle if the other team only has to worry about one thing. The guys didn't have their best day, but it was exacerbated by a predictable and difficult to execute gameplan.
If the coaches make it a priority to at least attempt to establish a non-Denard running game, the offense will be much more successful going forward.
October 18th, 2011 at 5:10 PM ^
Looking back at several plays, we were probably a second or two from Denard looking much better in that game. It seems to me that we don't quite have the physical offensive line that will withstand the sort of pressure and the blitzes that a defensive line like State's will bring, but these are issues resolved with practice, conditioning and recruiting. We're putting last year's personnel into a situation that they aren't quite as familiar with, and it shows, but this is first year for this staff and they have a top recruiting class and some returning personnel who will be well-versed in the new system next year.
I like our future - it seems to be the fact that it takes time to get here that has some disturbed.
October 18th, 2011 at 5:36 PM ^
We had our chances to win the game! We forced 2 turnovers in enemy territory. We called play action on 4th and inches (when a clear QB sneak would have done the trick), Devin missed a wide open hopkins in the middle of the field. We dominated field position the whole game, yet could do nothing about it.
Borges called a crap game. Yes it was windy, but what happened to the play where DRob rolls out left and throws a screen to Smith across the field, you know the one that capped the ND game and used on a TD against Minnesota? Why is Denard throwing bombs down teh sideline? Why didn't we run more traps or draws (kinda like how the bears used Forte against the Lions on MNF).
MSU has a good defense. Their offense is OK. We really should have beaten them in their own house and we played like crap. Sucks it had to happen vs SOS but hopefully Borges learns from it and we can start playing Michigan football again.