OT - wow Aaron Hernandez kills himself
Oh my gosh, sad to see such a talented person be occupied by such demons in his life. I would have thought that his recent acquittal would have helped him somewhat even though he still faced life in prison from the first conviction.
He was still doing a life sentence. I don't know how much consolation the acquittal was
Only "natural" without parole? So, like, Zombie Aaron Hernandez could have gone free?
What's Zombie Aaron Hernandez's 40 time? I'm sure the Raiders are willing to give him a second chance.
The timing is interesting though. Acquitted only a few days ago I think.
wake up the day after a "good thing" happening for you, and then realize that your life will only still ever consist of sitting or standing in a 10 by 10 box, yeah, I could see that being a pretty difficult realization. Don't think the timing is as odd as it seems.
Yes, this. Plus, with the trial over, unless he was somehow charged with yet another crime, he was literally never going to step foot out of prison again. Sure, it's not like he was a free man on his visits to court, but it still provided interatctions with the outside world. Now that that was over, all he had left was prison life. The timing makes sense to me.
I almost immediately considered this aspect upon hearing of his suicide. Makes total sense. Maybe his relief upon hearing his not guilty verdict came from a place of knowing he booked a win in the last battle of his life.
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Timing is quite odd... Didn't he have an appeal on the way for his first case once he beat the 2nd round of double murder charges?
seems rather odd
his appeal of the first conviction would have held any water. They buried his defense with evidence. Desperate and violent man commits suicide, winking in court at his daughter one day, hanging himself the next. Wow
I thought he would've been hopeful with his new lawyer handling his appeal. Not like I would've wanted him free, but I would've thought that this would have made him a little bit more hopeful.
I'm just glad us taxpayers don't have to pony up $30k+ a year for the next 50 years to keep this murderer comfortable in prison!
This country does not build comfortable prisons; that is a very outdated notion.
Prisons have a fixed budget. His death has absolutely zero impact on your taxes.
not saying it is saving us money, but glad it's one less murderer who gets 3 decent meals, tv, and hobbies on the house for the rest of his life.
With that being said, more criminals going into prison means prisons will need their budgets increased, which will affect my taxes...
not really true, since they build new ones or hire new guards
besides, the appeal itself would've cost taxes
Demons in his life, like being a criminal and killing people. The guy was where he belonged and that was behind bars.
Demons? This from the guy who won't shut the fuck up about "Penn State and all the delusional joepa loving fans"? Jerry Sandusky had demons too. I mean, if uncontrollable perverted sexual urges don't count as "demons," what does? Or just maybe, Sandusky and Hernandez made conscious decisions to hurt other people. Or kill them, in Hernandez's case. "Demons" my ass. Fuck Hernandez - nobody should mourn his death or make excuses for his behavior.
So, I don't think you can say no one should mourn him.
Honestly, my opinion is that this is even a blessing for her. She was always going to grow up without a dad. He was lost to her long ago. Visitations and letters from prison saying "be a good girl" don't count as being a father figure. This way, I think it would be much easier to put behind her the fact that her father was a cold-blooded murderer. If anyone asks, instead of saying he's in prison for murder, she can say he's dead and leave it there. He won't be an influence on her life, which, given his influence on the lives of others, is a plus. Her mother can hopefully find for her some more positive influences and leave the memory of the cold-blooded killer behind.
I can absolutely understand this point of view, and it may end up being true.
I can also understand how it might scar a little girl if her father, terrible person though he may have been, would kill himself rather than trying to be there for her in whatever form that might have taken.
It's just a terrible situation, but all the blame for that lies with Aaron Hernandez.
Doesn't matter. Life in prison without possibility of parole. He may have finally come to the realization that he was never going to see the outside of a jail cell again.
Man was a monster and a grade A asshole. I'm not sure I care how much someone can kick ass on the football field when they are literal murderers.
A conviction for first degree murder carries an automatic life without parole sentence AND an automatic appeal. The first murder trial for the death of Odom Lloyd was such a conviction.
Part of the prosecution's case was that Lloyd was killed because Hernandez was afraid he might talk about the Suffiolk County double drive-by shooting murder. With the acquittal in the Suffolk case, the defense would be arguing that the motive in the Bristol County case was now negated.
If anything, the Suffolk County acquittal would have bouyed the defense's prospects for success.
Additionally, in Massachusetts, we have a legal precept called "abatement ab initio." Because there were still outstanding appeals in the first case, it is as if Hernandez was innocent of that case. With the suicide, the Commonwealth will vacate the conviction. This creates issues with the civil case of the Lloyd family as they will not be able to use the 'beyond a reasonable doubt" conviction in the criminal case to bolster their action for monetary damages against hernandez and his estate.
(And BTW I am a former prosecutor in Massachusetts' Middlesex County.)
from one counselor to another.
I gave you an up vote just for explaining all this
But I don't understand the "automatic appeal" thing. Why does the state do that? Do they not trust their own trials? Are they trying to overturn their own convictions?
It seem like the state is trying to avoid any punishment- then why go through the expense of a trial? Why not save the taxpayers and set suspects free w/o trial? (unless its a lawyer employment thing)
Ha! Good one about employment protection for lawyers! :-D And certainly Criminal appellate work is a burgeoning specialty all its own.
There are many states that have a similar automatic appeal provision, particularly in capital punishment states. The idea being that before one does the irreparable harm of depriving someone of their life, there are safeguards in place to make sure there wasn't some gross judicial or prosecutrial misconduct.
Massachusetts does not have capital punishment. However, the same concepts are in play.
When you think about it, the Government can wield enormous power and resources in prosecuting its citizenry. Before depriving those people of their life liberty, livelihoods, etc., the Government should be able to get it right.
The same idea comes into play with the requirement the Government be able to prove its case "beyond a reasonable doubt." As a prosecutor, I often told juries that this was a burden the Commonwealth gladly took on and was convinced it had gotten it right in that particular case.
except the recent UM Law study concludes that over 4% of those who are executed would've been exonerated if only they had lived for new evidence to come forth. There was a man in ohio who spent *40 years* in jail before the coerced confession was revealed and he was released. Had he been on death row, he would've been executed long before that
And another reason why having automatic appellate rights are a good thing. Having fresh eyeballs looking a first degree murder conviction over should not be an issue if everything is done by the book. Just think how high that rate would be without it?
rights, even for misdemeanors. every murder i ever tried and all but a handful of felonies were appealed. and if the convicted criminal can't afford an appellate attorney, one is appointed for him. for guys looking at a lot of time in the joint, life in prison, or a death penalty case, it's not like they are too busy doing something else to try and appeal a conviction.
and then you come to that % of guys that are/were wrongfully convicted. the jury system is the finest system every devised by man to decide trials, but it's not perfect.
An up vote from me!
Yeah, he might've done this so his daughter or whatever would keep the $
that's what you find sad, and not what happened to his victim?
Downfall this guy had.
He had to murder himself too I guess.
He spilled a drink on himself at dinner that night and took offense.
Fucking coward. Just like that asshole from Cleveland. Can do the crime, but not willing to accept the consequences.
I don't know, man. He had accepted the consequences for years now. Just won his court case, had an appeal coming up. This was definitely not his lowest point. Something must have changed.
Doesn't really matter. The world is down one murderer. Personally, I hope his family, and the families of his victims, can find peace.
"for years now" as in 3.5 to 4. Wow. That is just such a huge amount of his lifetime sentence. Congratulations, Aaron. You really did well.
Won a court case? Big fucking deal. That was not going to change his lifetime sentence for the other murder case. I don't know why people keep referencing this other court case. He was still going to be in prison for the rest of his life.
There's some serious lightening up Francis that needs to happen here. I'm just saying that there doesn't seem to be a timing connection between his suicide and the imminent dropping of any hammer.
Not sure we can definitively say that his suicide is due to cowardice. Also not sure we should be angry about anything other than his crimes.
Easy there tough guy.
Just as a "thought experiment," let's say I've done something horrible, something for which there can be no forgiveness or "take-backs." Let's say I finally, after a long period of denial or moral equivocation, accept responsibility for my actions. Then let's say, because of this complete acceptance of responsibility, I decide I am going to end my own life as a form of contrition and self-punishment, to confront the greatest unknown to all of mankind - "what, if anything, comes next." Does that make me a coward? I really don't think so. On the contrary, I think it takes a great deal of moral courage.
Now, does this make Hernandez suddenly a "good person"? No, absolutely not. But calling him a coward is kind of, well, dumb. In my opinion, a coward would spend the next 40 years proclaiming innocence, dragging families through appeals processes, living off the taxes of honest citizens, etc.
murder an innocent, unarmed man in cold blood.
My post was replying to a post about his act of suicide, not about his earlier murders. Your post seems to imply that once someone has done something cowardly, they can never again do anything but cowardly actions. That seems wrong, to me.
dude cowardly shot and murdered an unarmed, innocent man in cold blood.
Maybe to you he had some kind of bravery taking his own life. I just happen to disagree.
And yes, he could have been brave in other aspects of his life but the cowardice and cold blooded heart of a murderer shine through much beyond any type of bravery he may have had.
It doesn't seem likely to me that a person with Hernandez's prior track record would be motivated by contrition. Maybe self punishment.....not for killing one or more people, but for putting himself in a cell instead of making millions on a football field. So from that angle I'd agree with cowardice.
He had a daughter. She now has no father. Courage would have been to get his mind right, be a Dad to the best of his ability considering his circumstances, and help make sure his daughter was better equipped than he was to make good decisions for herself.
I think this is an excellent counterpoint. I am in no way trying to say that Hernandez definitely, absolutely "acted courageously" by doing this. I just think that the "coward took the easy way out" perspective could be completely wrong; not definitely, but possibly.
A counterpoint to my counterpoint would be: maybe the best thing he could do for his daughter was remove himself from the equation completely. I could see this being true, but I have a hard time believing his thought process would go that way.
There's a case to be made that applying the "coward took the easy way out" attitude to any suicide is problematic for the stigmatizing effect on those with mental health problems.
Indeed, but internet tough guys don't care so long as they can rub dirt in the face of a dead criminal punching bag
You have to be kidding if you think he did this as an act of contrition. He was going to jail soon forever and didn't want to continue. Happens a lot, and always for selfish reasons
If it was contrition he would've done it at some earlier time, before the 1st conviction since he knew he was guilty despite it not being "proven" in court yet
Look, I know I'm going to get negged into oblivion for saying this, but after reading this thread, I need to put it out there.
I think it's wrong to celebrate someone's suicide. I recognize that Aaron Hernandez did deeply terrible things and may have been irredeemable as a human, but there's something deeply uncomfortable about celebrating this. It's a tragic end to a tragic and horrifying story.
Suggesting, as some have in this thread, that this is an optimal outcome conflates suicide with justice, which can become a very slippery slope. It isn't a solution to a problem, it doesn't help move anyone move forward or provide any sort of positivity or resolution. It just sort of is.
Saying that Aaron Hernandez's suicide was the consequence for the terrible crimes he committed creates a really sticky situation. Who else "deserves that"? Where do you draw the line in terms of the valuation of a human life? How do you measure the impact that something like this has on his kid or extended family when performing that calculation?
Look, I'm not saying Hernandez was not a terrible person and I would never dream of defening his actions. But this outpouring of performative justice from twitter eggs and message board posters doesn't help the situation. "FUCK YEAH. MOTHERFUCKER DESERVED IT. OH YEAH. ONE SUICIDE I WILL CELEBRATE." These comments are off-putting. The man leaves behind a young daughter and plenty of family and acquaintances who will carry this with them forever. Again, this isn't justice. It's just the continuation of a tragedy that's been playing out for years now.
I'm celebrating. You just spent five more paragraphs on Hernandez than he deserves. His death is not a tragedy.
What else are we supposed to do with this news? "Oh no, poor baby"?
I mean, Hernandez at least went to trial and was found guilty. It's small consolation, but at least the victims' families can point to that life conviction as a bit of justice.
Also, he's got life without parole. He wasn't going to provide any meaningful benefit to society in all likelihood, while costing people money and time keeping him alive in jail. This is probably a net-plus for society.
Heard this driving into work this morning. I thought they said Aaron Rogers. Was confused for a moment.
One less prisoner Massachusetts taxpayers has to pay for.
missed fewer for less. If you're going to police grammar, know the whole handbook ...
Actually, "has" was correct. Taxachussetts is so collectivistic and communistic, "taxpayer" is singular.
What sad situation all the way around....
Hard to understand how someone with so much talent and fame could piss it all away on gang banger lifestyle. I know he was that way before he had the money, but you'd think when he made it big he'd straighten his shit out. Get some help. The violence in that dudes heart was beyond troubling.
I think you answered your own question. He was a banger most of his life, and the things we learn in our youth are the ones that are the hardest to let go of.
Yes, he probably got what he deserved, but let's have some humility and understanding when it comes to the frailties of the human mind and spirit. His was truly a tortured soul, which can now at least be put to rest.
sure he was a tortured soul, and while im generally a compassionate person, theres a limit to understanding and humility (or at least there should be) - this dudes a murderer and a scumbag. in the end seems like win win - his tortured soul rests, tax payers off the hook, etc
Lot's of professional athletes and others are bangers in ther youth or from tough situation and grow up and may still have many difficulties in life, yet don't start/conitnue murdering as a hobby/lifestyle. His situations were not "still hanging out with the wrong crowd." He was the crowd - leader of the pack - at UF and up north. He had sociopathic tendencies and never showed remorse.
I wish I had your kindness of spirit, but I just can't bring myself to those levels of empathy considering the pain this guy caused.
You're right. Many pro athletes come from similar circumstances and rehabilitate themselves. This, the fact that Hernandez couldn't, or possibly didn't even try, tells me that his was a truly diseased mind.
I in no way condone what he did; I can't forgive what he did. But I do pray for mercy on his soul. His was a sad and tragic life.
I get the desire for compassion, but this guy killed 2 people and maybe, possibly, was involved in the death of another (being acquitted had more to do with shoddy witnesses than some clear determination of his innocence).
And lots of people overcome terrible starts in life to be successful. He had many opportunities to not kill two people and piss away a million-dollar career, and yet he didn't.
How do you know he was a "tortured soul?" One of the hardest things for good people to realize is that there are evil assholes in the world who lack any true care or concern for anyone else. They're not tortured. They're fine with the way they are. In 25 years as a cop, I've seen plenty of them. Aaron Hernandez's last decision was another example of how he lived his life. He did what he wanted to do. How it would affect others meant nothing to him.
all the time. Are we all inherently good? All inherently bad? Have the capacity for both? How does one explain a sociopath, who clearly has different biological and physiological reactions when committing violence?
In the case of Hernandez, was he a sociopath? Diseased mind? On some crazy drugs. I don't have the answers to the general questions or those specific to Hernandez, I just know that when dealing with someone who never shows remorse for the pain and suffering they cause others, I am unable to find much empathy.
In some cases the fame just seems to make things worse because so many people are willing to look the other way or make excuses. I'm not saying people knew he was a murderer and excused that, but just ignoring a whole lot of lesser things sends a message that the rules don't apply and if you mess up, somebody is going to cover it up for you (like what was going on at Baylor).
In some cases the fame just seems to make things worse because so many people are willing to look the other way or make excuses. I'm not saying people knew he was a murderer and excused that, but just ignoring a whole lot of lesser things sends a message that the rules don't apply and if you mess up, somebody is going to cover it up for you.
i have rubbed elbows, particularly when i lived in socal, with all manner of celebs, rock stars, athletes, etc. a percentage just shy of 100% have what look like 'cool' lives, but any view past the veneer shows them to be totally screwed up. amoral, dopers, divorced, kids in rehab or lost to them, depressed, alcoholics, etc.
counter-intuitive, but the correlation is nearly 1:1 on that metric. hernandez obviously had other very deep-seated issues, but his celebrity was never something that was going to make it better for him.
and one other thing, sure the guy was a gangster, murderer, etc, but the taking of one's life is a harsh, harsh penalty. easy to feel 'superior' to that guy, right? but maybe a bit of grace would be the better response.
audible "whaaaaat?!" when I first heard. But then, after thinking further I realized the dude was a lifelong assbag and came to your conclusion. Oh well indeed.
I see more value of that phrase.
Crazy because during the trial he seemed very light hearted, didnt really seem to care. Dude was off his rocker..
Right... But as soon as the verdict was announced he suddenly switched. It was like the light went on at that moment and he realized what he'd done. It was the first time he showed any emotion the entire time. Almost like he had the realization that he wasn't found guilty yet he STILL faced life in prison.
The guy was off his rocker. His mental illness/instability was likely getting worse without treatment. Even if he felt euphoria with the acquittal, that feeling likely caused even more instability.
The mind has a fascinating, and sometimes broken, power ...
Do you know for sure that he had a mental illness? Is that documented somewhere, I mean? Because if not and you're attributing these terrible crimes/decisions to a mental illness that he doesn't actually have, that's really irresponsible.
I'm not a religious man, but if hell does exist, Hernandez has gone from one hell to the next. And there's no escape from the one he just entered.
Truly sad because he had all the talent in the world, made millions of dollars and could've had anything and everything he ever wanted. But he pissed it all away.
I know the man must've had some serious demons, but in my eyes, he'll be remembered as nothing more than a coward and a cold-blooded murderer. Good riddance. One less scumbag kept alive by Massachusetts taxpayer dollars.
Man was weak.
Hope a lot of people find some peace.
Let him slide on everything he did at Florida. Had he faced some consequences for his actions there he may have turned his life around.
I don't know who his college coach was, but he obviously is a terrible human being for letting Hernandez slide like that.
His college coach was Urbane Meyer...
Younger, more energetic Meyer?
First, you missed the joke. Second, you came up with yet another childish name for a rival. I guess I should applaud you for not throwing out "Urban Crier."
certainly didn't help turn things around
Does this mean he's no longer in the Circle of Trust?
Sad product of Urban Meyer.
Has its consequences
This is one suicide I can support.
He was too affiliated with that gang life and would have been killed soon anyways
with Hernandez; obvs. Urban didn't kill anyone. But I was living in Gainesville at the tail end of his tenure there, and the narrative definitely DID involve the young man getting away with atrocious stuff. It's not unreasonable to assume that help then, real consequences then, might have brought a different outcome. . . not just for Hernandez.
No blame, but another data point that supports the narrative that Meyer recruits, coaches and allows behavior in a certain way. As someone else said... Win at all costs.
the lawyer/firm that represented all the players that got in to trouble in Gainseville during Meyer's tenor - They called him the "defensive coordinator"
And on a day many former teammates will be going to a house that shall not be mentioned.
A white house with an orange man.
I just can't see this as something that should make my day sad. I get that our younger days clearly set the path we'll go down, but there are too many stories of people that pulled themselves out of bad situations. It's about choices. He kept making poor ones, and I don't feel bad that he made another poor one. Save on some prison expenses, anyway...
on tax day no less
Weird parallel to draw, but in point of fact he took his life on April 19th, not on "tax day"...
He was a real POS, and try as I might I'm not coming up with a better outcome to this sad, strange saga.
Maybe, if he lived to have some sort of awakening and spent his days trying to educate and help others with similar backgrounds to the possibilities of a life beyond banging?
I guess that... (shrugs)?
To know this probably isn't a suicide. No prison wants such a high profile murder on their watch.
He was in a single-person cell; and according to the reports this morning, he had evidently tried to block the door from the inside using items available within the room.
So you're saying it was the perfect prison murder?
I don't watch much TV, but it's not inconceivable that something else happened contrary to the reports. I believe things probably happen in prison that the public isn't made aware of, and this could be one of those. However, I don't particularly care what happened in this case, so I'm going to start considering my lunch options.
If there's not one in your area, start one of your own. Then you can have free Blimpie Subs whenever you want.
There used to be 2-3 in Toledo, but all of them closed about 5 years ago and had forgotten about it until now...thanks for re-opening the wound. So tasty.
the /s WAS necessary
I don't celebrate anyone's suicide, but it's not lost on my that Hernandez is hardly a sympathetic character. I could never quite tell if it was that he could not shake off the shitty "friends" of his youth and needed to "keep it real" or if he trended sociopathic.
In any event, his life story seems like a Greek tragedy. Sad for his victims, his victims' families, and his family. What a fucking waste.
Name doesn't check out in this instance.
oh, the rich irony in a dark situation.
kidding aside, your comment re: greek tragedy is spot on. very sad all the way around.
Greek tragedies are overblown, melodramatic, and distract our attention. The tragedy is that many kids who grow up with gangs and in slums never get the breaks and chances Hernandez got. Hernandez got many breaks and chances. The tragedy is that the wrong person got them, and some other kid who would have made better use of them is stuck in some shitty job in some shitty slum.
100. That is the true "tragedy"
Out of curiousity, when did his connection with "shitty friends of his youth" begin? I thought I read somewhere that he was fairly decent until his father died when he was like 17. Did his history with bad decision-making start before that?
At least he died doing what he loved.
Please tell me you didn't steal this line. It's brilliant!
Reminds me of Norm MacDonald's line about saying something nice about Hitler: "Well, at least he killed Hitler."
I can't believe my most upvoted comment is about suicide. It absolutely kills me.
Killing people? Lol. I'm gonna have to steal this comment.
my favorite comment that I have seen in a long, long time. I don't even care if you lifted it from somewhere, just a big thank you for making me chuckle while reading about an overall terrible situation.
+1 for you
Murderer, gang banger, ,coward, suicide...He was not a good human being. God will send him where he needs to go. Let it go. He did the least possible with the gifts that he was given. He did nothing good for anyone. He only hurt people and himself. He was selfish.
Wonder if the three who negged you are the same three who negged me. Really makes you wonder. You are spot on my man!.
of what happened to the Craigslist Killer
But can we stop with the Urban Meyer crap. I know this is a UM board but to attach blame to Urban on this is stupid. He was obviously a pycho who no-one could help. He was also on the Patroits for 2 years, So do we also blame Kraft & Belichick.
well, it was said the only reason they signed Timmy Tebow a few years ago was because he had been an influence on Hernandez while at UF and that Belicheat and company were concerned about off field behavior.
So it would seem they were aware of the smoke before the fire. And Urbs oversaw 45 arrests on his watch as HC for the gators.
not likely that anyone could have stopped the murderous thug, but seems like there was awareness of his tendency towards bad decisions and criminal leanings.
Watching ESPN this morning and they led with this story (obviously) as soon as it broke at 7:00am. They had a long interview with Schefter and if you didnt know better you'd swear Hernandez was somehow the victim in this situaion and his suicide was the sad outcome of a person who simply a product of horrible circumstances he couldnt overcome.
He described the situation as "tragic" and said (paraphrasing here) that "no matter how hard Hernandez tried to escape his demons he was always dragged back into the gang life" which is complete and utter bullshit. There is 0.0 evidence that Hernandez tried to "escape" anything associated with thug life, rather he embraced it and ran TOWARDS it, not away.
Fuck him. Sorry he's a cold-blooded killer who executed two men for the crime of spilling a drink on him (sorry jury - you got it wrong) and then killed the one man who knew about it to keep him quiet.
The fact that he is getting this much publicity makes me sick and that some of ESPN talking heads are treating this like a eulogy is frustrating.
ESPN just wants viewers. This is a dreamy controversial subject that they can flog all day.
Just makes me glad they're hemorrhaging subs
The only thing that bothers me about the whole thing is that he had a 4 year old baby girl. Otherwise, there will be no tears shed from me.
sure seems this will probably be in the 4 yr old's best interest. The whole "a child needs a father" thing is 100% true; but it has to be the right father, not just "a" father.
Hernandez may very well have killed the two men he was acquitted last week of killing, but the jury didn't "get it wrong."
The witness against him was an unreliable sociopath with a long history of violence and an admitted grudge against Hernandez. When juries start convicting people of murder based on that flimsy of evidence, look out. No telling where that stone will roll once it gets started...
"When juries start convicting people of murder based on that flimsy of evidence, look out."
Hahahaha, what? Juries have been convicting people of all sorts of crimes based on flimsy evidence for centuries.
I mean... jeebus. Seriously?
Look at the Washington Post front page. Right next to the Aaron Hernandez story, I mean RIGHT next to it, is the story of the Groveland Four Rape case, when 4 innocent black men were convicted (three of them) or killed (one, by a mob). LINK Or go look at the work of the Innocence Project. This shit happens every day in this country. Always has.
Innocent people get convicted, locked up for decades, and executed on far less evidence than the unreliable witness in Hernandez's most recent trial.
Yeah but they should have really have better access to forensic evidence now than centuries ago. If i'm on jury and there isn't such evidence, just an "eyewitness" (which are horribly unreliable to begin with) with a grudge, there's no way i'd convict
The absess of such evidence raises suspicion in itself
I agree with you and I don't want to dive into the deep end of that trial, but I followed Dan Wetzel's coverage and I know the gist.
Alexander Bradley says he was driving and Hernandez shot the victims. The defense said, no, Bradley's the one who shot them.
Doesn't that make them both the murderer and an accessory regardless of who pulled trigger? Can't you just give Hernandez a default accessory conviction and shoot for the murder from there?
They never argued he was in the car with Bradley when those guys were murdered. They found the car stashed in a Hernandez residence. Oh, and not to mention Hernandez shot Alexander Bradley in the fucking face after the fact because he was afraid he was talking too much.
How the hell does a court let that guy walk away from this incident scot free?
(And these are all rhetorical. I don't need MGoLawyers to tell me about the procedure. I don't really care. I just laugh at our system sometimes.)
that is simply an agreement to commit a crime between two or more people, and an act in furtherance. also, the act in furtherance does not have to be the ultimate act, such as shooting someone.
simple example: assume it is illegal to possess pizza, but you and i would like some. you ask me for the phone book because we want to order some, and i hand the book to you. you don't even have to call the pizza place as we would technically have committed the crime of 'conspiracy to possess pizza'. of course in real life it'll take more than that, but that is the law in an antiseptic form. lastly, the penalty for the conspiracy is usually the same as if the underlyiing crime had been committed.
bottom line is that the jury must have had different evidence, or much weaker evidence than what many here think existed.
To all the incredulous posters who replied, I merely said the jury didn't get it wrong *in this case*.
To me that means absolutely the prosecution did. No list of unjust verdicts through the history of American jurisprudence would have made a conviction in this case, on this evidence, a correct one.
I had tried to edit my comment to include the Bradley back story, to clarify the post I originally replied to saying Hernandez "killed the one person who knew" about the drive-by double murders. The site wouldn't let me add that tidbit.
I do believe that Bradley got immunity to testify against Hernandez, therefore they couldn't try them both as conspirators. That's why they had to go forward with the testimony of someone who admitted he held a death grudge against the defendant, and has himself been convicted of gun violence.
You can point to a thousand terrible, unjust verdicts, and a million unreliable accusers, but a conviction in this case would never have stood. I guess the point is those other poor saps probably didn't have millions of dollars or ESPN reporting every detail of their cases.
I knew immediately what you meant regarding the jury not "getting it wrong" and agree with you. Terrible prosecution that was dead in the water once their star witness's text messages were read to the jury. I was simply trying to head off the "but he was aquitted in the double homicide" responses.
ESPN needs to get out of their own way on this. But they won't because they are ESPN.
What took him so long?
especially in maximum security
Right? Could have saved a whole lot of tax dollars if he had done it before his latest trial.
Too bad he didn't kill himself before he chose to kill others.
Don't have anything to say about Hernandez, but I did watch Louis CK's dark new special on Netflix last night and he talked about suicide and how, if you don't believe in any after life, it's the perfect escape plan. Said he couldn't understand how some people hadn't done it already.
I admit I have to plead ignorance on this, but I would think modern maximum security prison cells would be relatively suicide-proof, especially with regards to things you could hang yourself from.
I doubt he was in a suicide cell. I have no idea why he was in a one man cell unless he was a management problem. All you need is a t-shirt and the end of the bed to tie it to. You cut off the flow of blood to brain and when you slump down that is when you choke yourself to death. In reality you die in your sleep. I am all but positive that is what he did.
Surprised this hasn't ended up locked. It can't be that the MGoCommunity is mellowing out, can it?...
I feel bad for his daughter. Hopefully there was something set up to where she's taken care of financially.
This man was flat out evil. He had zero conscience. No empathy and no sympathy for anyone. As a CO of some twenty years and working security at the clubs in and around Detroit I have seen my share of violence. I have always looked at inmates with gang mentality as the biggest cowards aside from the tree jumpers. Hernandez even had to call his boys to come help him kill one guy. It was his insecurities that made him violent and so goes the gang mentality. It is understandble that good people try to understand evil, but make no mistake you never will.
Aaron Hernandez is in no way, shape or form a sympathetic figure and rightly so, but as someone said above, I am also not going to celebrate anyone's suicide. It's a sad ending to what seemed like an unfortunately wasted life and wasted talent, and perhaps we'll never really know if that was Hernandez being clinically sociopathic or simply being unable to overcome problems which began in his youth or if it is a dynamic combination of these.
Maybe he was just a bad guy, without excuses.
Wasted life, wasted talent, terrible role model to some, unsympathetic murderer, and on and on...
overused but fitting.
is that by all accounts, he grew up solidly middle-class in a good two-parent household with no gang activity whatsoever, just a normal suburban upbringing. He fell in love with the gangsta lifestyle only as an adult. When does that ever happen except in Breaking Bad?
By adult do you mean after high school, like 18+? I know he was in trouble in college, but I'm not sure about his high school activities.
He didn't have a bunch of childhood friends who pulled him into the "life", he evidently started de novo gangbanging after getting to Gainesville and then in earnest after the NFL money started rolling in and he could bankroll a full-fledged posse.
We know a kid who's 17, and he pretty much blew a potential D1 scholarship because he got in with the wrong crowd as a freshman and ended up in rehab because he was taking pills. He was one of the most natural athletes I've ever seen. He nearly broke a state record in track, played basketball and football. Now a junior, he just can't get his shit together. His most recent escapade was he got stopped while driving without a license. Took the car out after his mom went to bed and was cruising around with other kids in the car. He doesn't even have a permit because his parents were smart enough not to let him get one. He has maybe a 1.7 GPA. I could have told you this kid would end up this way when he was 6. He bucked authority back then and was a big risk taker. The only negative about his parents is they're divorced. But so were mine. Some people just have a propensity for high stakes trouble.
If you're actually interested you'll have to Google it, but I'm pretty sure your impression of his upbringing isn't accurate. I recall reading his father, or perhaps other relatives, had known criminal ties. I believe there may have been some dealing and loan sharking, but I'm not 100 on this.
It wasn't the Brady Bunch, or even the Gronkowskis, I'm pretty sure of that.
According to this Boston Globe article in 2013. His mother was running numbers, declaring bankruptcy twice. Aaron was certainly hanging out and emulating gangs while in high school.
Thanks, I'm just not skilled at linking, embedding, giffing, all those modern things people do!
It's not just ESPN though. And sadly there are many,many more really mentally unstable people running around society. They just don't happen to be talented athletes. Maybe the only good out of this is to have more discussions on how we as society deal with these people with obvious mental illnesses.
He misunderstood what his attorney meant when he said, "hang in their bro"
I don't want to be this callous, but this guy killed two people because they spilled a drink on him. I'm not going to shed a tear for him no longer being around.
They were unable to convict him of that crime, so you're going on the testimony of another scumbag.
In fact the entire "drink spilling" narrative is courtesy of a person serving time for firing a weapon in a nightclub.
A person who testified he was shot in the face by the defendant and lost an eye. And then admitted on cross he doesn't even remember the night he was shot, but had sworn to kill the defendant nonetheless.
Listen, got no love of Aaron Hernandez here - but I pray I never find myself on trial for murder based on that guy's word.
I can't help but think about how many men had the opportunity as coaches/mentors to reach Hernandez while he was young, but instead took advantage of his athletic ability like Urban Meyer while allowing him to get away with breaking rules. Aaron Hernandez is responsible for his actions (which I have to state because some clowns will take this as excusing him).
As a coach, it's frustrating that so many "coaches" ignore their responsibility to be mentors and role models.
You showed the internet !!
I find it odd some on here seem to though.
I have no sympathy for him whatsoever. I do have sympathy for his family and the families whose lives he's ruined.
I guess he could take or leave it if he pleased.
Nice M.A.S.H. reference.
Typical Urban Meyer product.
Urbans must be mourning his favorite protege today.
Ok, this guy really needs to stop killing people.
I'm either committing internet suicide or killing the game with this comment, either way I slay myself.
I'll bet my bank account that he didn't hang himself. Which is about $32.50. But no way he hung himself.
User name checks out.
Why this? Why that? Why everything in his life? Why work so hard just to kill several people over a spilled drink?
One word - RespeKt!
One abbreviation - PCP
Alright, save that taxpayer money!
After review, he did not get both feet down. Incomplete pass, turnover on downs.
wrong tru wrong
for his final murder.
...don't fuck it up.
He never got his life together after his father died.