OT: "Untold: Malice at the Palace" is out on Netflix
Overall, I thought it was solid.
Certainly biased or from the lens of the players perspective (produced by Jermaine O'Neal).
You forget how good Indiana was around that time, I always think of the Pistons and ruining the end of the Shaq/Kobe dynasty. But the rivalry with the Pacers was intense.
Also, fans suck, the entitlement drove me crazy then and drives me crazy now. If you think you can throw beer or popcorn at someone or come down into their workspace uninvited...I have ZERO sympathy if you get your ass whooped, thrown in jail, or both. Screw a lawsuit. Stay in the stands. Just MY opinion. Sorry, there's just just a social dynamic that doesn't sit right with me.
Link is below, but check it out on Netflix! Worth a watch.
https://youtu.be/EP7xRieiZm0
August 11th, 2021 at 6:23 AM ^
I agree the fans sucked, BUT the Pistons in that era did such a good job connecting with their fans. The fans, including myself, felt like we were really a part of what was happening, part of the team. Those guys on the court were an extension of the City of Detroit and the State of Michigan. I do not condone the actions of the fans on that night but it was sort of a culmination of the relationship we all felt we had with the players on the court. Chauncy, Rip, Prince, Sheed, Big Ben, Human Victory Cigar formerly known as Darko! So many great memories!
August 11th, 2021 at 6:32 AM ^
As a Wayne County resident, I don't miss its location, but I miss The Palace as a venue.
August 11th, 2021 at 8:58 AM ^
100% agree. I wish they would just moved the Palace downtown. It’s still the gold standard for basketball arenas imo
August 11th, 2021 at 9:28 AM ^
The Palace building alongside ample parking and easy access to the freeways would be amazing. LCA isn't horrible and has awesome concourses but the seats are a little steep for my liking.
August 11th, 2021 at 10:46 AM ^
I like LCA but the seats aren’t tall people friendly…guess I’ll have to get floor seats?
August 11th, 2021 at 7:49 AM ^
Just ask the guy who tumbled into the penalty box with Tie Domi.....
Pretty sure he was regretting his decision when that piece of glass let loose.
August 11th, 2021 at 7:55 AM ^
Well if someone throws something at me at my job and I “whoop their ass” as you say. I’m going to get fired and possibly arrested. But you know different rules for athletes. And yes those ”fans” did suck but it’s called self control.
August 11th, 2021 at 8:33 AM ^
exactly - both sides are wrong. Just because you're a millionaire athlete, it doesnt give you the right to do what Artest and Jackson did. They should have been kicked out of the NBA, plain and simple.
*also the fans involved should have been banned - and as far as I remember, they were.
** Metta World Peace not Ron Artest
August 11th, 2021 at 10:22 AM ^
Meh. It didn't really bother me. Sometimes, an idiot needs a good asskicking.
August 11th, 2021 at 3:41 PM ^
You don’t mind that Artest attacked the wrong guy? The fan he went after hadn’t done anything. It was a different fan who had thrown the cup.
August 11th, 2021 at 9:21 AM ^
That's why I'm going to quit my job and be a bouncer. I'm tired of getting shit thrown at me. Sometimes I just wanna kick some ass.
August 11th, 2021 at 5:05 PM ^
Those guys get arrested all the time. I did that for a few years in my youth, pay isn’t great but there sure were some great fringe benefits.
August 11th, 2021 at 10:50 AM ^
Apples and Oranges. It's different to be attacked by fans in a hostile environment with tens of thousands of people. Artest and Jackson were the primary players who crossed the line, but fans were coming onto the court and menacingly approaching the Pacers' players who criminal courts later ruled were in the right to defend themselves.
I don't want this to sound demeaning, but the different rules for athletes make sense. They get paid at a level more akin to your CEO than you (and based on the amount of revenue the league brings in and the number of employees in their organization, makes sense) and I almost guarantee that your CEO would be excused in a similar situation if it were to occur at your place of work.
August 11th, 2021 at 1:51 PM ^
Uh, "how it is" and "makes sense" are quite often not the same thing. CEOs get away with all sorts of dogshit, but that doesn't mean it "makes sense."
August 11th, 2021 at 2:12 PM ^
At first there was just one fan instigating things, throwing a cup at Artest from several rows up. That was certainly wrong but all Artest had to do was let stadium security take care of it.
Artest dramatically escalated the situation by charging into the stands. Only after that did it became a general madhouse scene and fans started going on the court.
August 11th, 2021 at 4:59 PM ^
How elite of you…ps I don’t have a CEO, and there are situations I’ve been in that I’ve been in a crowd of hostile people.
August 11th, 2021 at 8:11 AM ^
For similar content, just search for any school board meeting on YouTube.
August 11th, 2021 at 8:12 AM ^
The most interesting part of the show to me was when O’Neal confirmed he tried to beat up Artest in the locker room after the Malice because Artest had the audacity to ask Stephen Jackson if they were going to get in trouble. Nothing about the situation is overtly funny but that made me crack up just picturing Artest saying that after what took place.
August 11th, 2021 at 8:31 AM ^
Past co-worker was one of the fans heavily involved. Charges filed. Probation. Lifetime Palace ban. It was no joke.
August 11th, 2021 at 2:31 PM ^
You have my attention
August 11th, 2021 at 8:34 AM ^
Watched it yesterday.
Really good job of capturing the intensity of the moment within the context of the rivalry.
Also Artest was dealing with a lot of demons...
It is amazing how long the Pistons were able to string together physically imposing teams..from Isiah, Mahorn, Lambeer., Rodman.to Big Ben, Sheed, and co...
And kind of felt for Reggie for not getting a ring. Always loved his game..
August 11th, 2021 at 9:25 AM ^
Sounds like it was a very persuasive documentary…
August 11th, 2021 at 9:37 AM ^
It was okay. O'Neal definetly went out of his way to make himself look good. The best part to me was the Oakland County prosecutor explaining everything. The fans were 100% wrong. Period. Artest didn't need to run into the stands at all. It just got out of control. That night really was the perfect storm for something to happen. And of course Jammal Tinsley told Artest to get a foul. That team was really good but it was like the lite version of the Trailblazers that had Sheed. It was an interesting mix of players. I will say I have always been a Stephen Jackson fan. Can't stand Reggie Miller at all.
August 11th, 2021 at 10:28 AM ^
Tinsley was close to getting a permanent ban from the NBA. I don't know if they showed it on the documentary, but ESPN showed a shot near the locker room where he picked a tall, ten foot pole and was about to head back to the court until a coach stopped him.
August 11th, 2021 at 10:16 AM ^
I enjoyed it too. Ron Artest really reminded me of Rodman the way he spoke. I actually feel bad for him. I don’t think he is right mentally and he needed help. He just looked and sounded lost. Not excusing him, I did not like him and think he was wrong, but he was a pile of dynamite waiting to explode. However, he was also a great bball player so no one cared
August 11th, 2021 at 6:40 PM ^
He has been very open about his serious mental health issues. Back then he was also drinking bottles of Hennessy during half times.
August 11th, 2021 at 10:31 AM ^
Not surprised it was slanted towards the Pacers perspective, but honestly, what were the Pistons going to say? That night sucked for the Pacers, but the Pistons basically were basically given the division title that night and homecourt advantage when they met in the playoffs.
August 11th, 2021 at 11:02 AM ^
Cool story bro moment:
That was the last game I saw at the Palace - was in one of the suites, and security came up and gave us a choice of leaving immediately, or staying there in lock-down until the various police/sheriff/state police agencies could get there in force.
Ended up sitting up top, plenty of food and drinks and watched the shitshow happening on the floor. By the time we left, there were what felt like several hundered officers outside and they were all really concerned that it would become a riot with all of the fans outside....but by the time I was coming out, it was fairly calm and orderly.
August 11th, 2021 at 11:54 AM ^
It was insane for Artest to charge into the crowd. He got hit by a cup. Yeah it sucks, and yeah he should have involved security to get that guy thrown out and banned.
By charging into the crowd to pummel people he incited a riot.
August 11th, 2021 at 12:51 PM ^
"I have ZERO sympathy if you get your ass whooped."
Reminded me (on a much, MUCH smaller scale of course) of that story about OSU fans coming into Blue Lep or Brown Jug the night after the 2013 game and running their mouths to fans, somehow Taylor Lewan getting involved, and the guys getting put in their place. Not sure if they actually got beat up or what, but whatever happened to them, they deserved it all.
If you've got the stupidity to run into a rival bar, completely outnumbered, and start running your mouth, short of getting sent to the hospital or killed you deserve whatever you have coming to you.
I'd say the same thing about any Michigan fan who walks into any bar on High St in Columbus after beating OSU and starts running their mouth.
August 11th, 2021 at 5:51 PM ^
Only if you walk in to a bar on High St. today and start running your mouth you get laughed at out of pity instead of beat up.
And I'm not being funny here.
August 11th, 2021 at 1:03 PM ^
Mike Hart and Chad Henne were freshman going into Columbus the day after Malice. I drove down with a buddy only to be stupidly defeated by a bad Suckye team. Last time I will ever go to Colombus.
August 11th, 2021 at 1:31 PM ^
I've been to Michigan games all over the country. Columbus was the only place where I felt someone might assault me just for having Michigan gear on. The worst I got was things being thrown at me, but the level of vitriol was unmatched.
August 11th, 2021 at 3:07 PM ^
I went to the game in 2014 and was never so much as heckled. Granted, I think that came from two things:
1) We sat in the club section (father in law didn't want to go and just gave the tix away to my wife and I), so I think we were sitting around a generally more reserved group of people.
2) Michigan was in the midst of an absolutely miserable season, so I'm assuming most fans there didn't hate Michigan so much as they just pitied it.
The couple I sat in front of, who were both admittedly nice people, said they used to have so much fun going to the Michigan/OSU games but it lost so much luster for them because Michigan started stinking up the joint and the game really had no implications for anyone other than Michigan fighting for its pride and OSU tuning itself up for the postseason. They really wanted Michigan to be coming into each of these games 11-0 or 10-1 at worst so the game would finally mean something again.
August 11th, 2021 at 2:25 PM ^
Also, fans suck, the entitlement drove me crazy then and drives me crazy now. If you think you can throw beer or popcorn at someone or come down into their workspace uninvited...I have ZERO sympathy if you get your ass whooped, thrown in jail, or both.
I don't think anyone's going to defend the guy who threw the cup, but it was utterly insane for Artest to run into the stands and try to fight him (and he went after the wrong guy!). If this documentary is saying he was justified in doing that, I'll pass.
August 11th, 2021 at 4:09 PM ^
As others have said Artest's actions cannot be justified and also he didn't even go after the right fan on top of it. A hard foul that late in a game already decided was also a dick move and his laying on scorers table after was also dumb. Doesn't excuse the fans who acted badly and they were punished accordingly from what I understand, but Artest was just an unhinged person.
August 11th, 2021 at 4:48 PM ^
Boring 'Doc." I didn't learn anything I didn't already know.What in this Indiana-Centric show was 'told' that hasn't already been told?
August 12th, 2021 at 2:05 AM ^
It's grating that I am seeing people on other sites parrot this notion that the Pacers were destined to win the title that year or something. Yes they were playing better at that early junction in the season but by the end of the year even if the Malice didn't happen the Pistons and Spurs were both great teams. Could the Pacers have beat them, not impossible, but thinking they were destined or something is absurd. Those Piston teams back then got disrespected and are still getting disrespected now. They were a 5 min run in game 7 of the finals or Sheed covering Horry in game 5 away from winning back to back titles for god sakes. So screw O'neil and this Indiana propaganda produced bullshit.