OT: The NFL, NBA, MLS, and every major international soccer league all playing...
September 12th, 2020 at 3:41 PM ^
How many of these threads do we need each week?
September 12th, 2020 at 3:42 PM ^
It's an important topic of conversation if you don't want to participate you don't have to click the thread.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:48 PM ^
It is a topic that has been discussed ad nauseum here the past few weeks (especially the last week). What does this thread bring that changes the conversation?
September 12th, 2020 at 4:03 PM ^
It’s been discussed too many times. That’s his point. And in this case it is immediately obvious that the OP mentions “all pro leagues” to start out as the OP’s main point. Many of the previous threads on this topic have had much more in depth points of view on both sides than “hey the pro leagues are playing, why not us”.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:42 PM ^
It really is hard to understand how this comes up on the Saturday when half the country is playing college football and we haven't even practiced with pads on. Amazing, truly.
September 12th, 2020 at 8:15 PM ^
If it makes you feel any better, we'll likely have a half-dozen tomorrow referring to the same "I hear there's a vote to play at some point" posts on Twitter.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:41 PM ^
It's still early for knowing how it will end up working out but man it's so frustrating to see all these sports being played but not the B1G or Pac 12.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:44 PM ^
They know that their players are employees and are monetarily compensated for their time. Which does not include interacting with a campus full of 10's of thousands of people. They also understand that their limited resources are more important being used to support the main function of a university, which is education. Athletics are rightly taking a backseat to that mission.
It doesn't matter how many times you ask this question, the answer will continue to be the same.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:56 PM ^
So playing football is detrimental to the university function? Playing football while under close watch at the University of Michigan subjects students to more Covid exposure than not?
This argument is emotional in nature and not at all fact driven.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:31 PM ^
You can disagree with the choice, but your last sentence doesn't make any sense. If there's any argument that's subject to emotion, it's the one that mirrors "Kills me not seeing Michigan play football".
September 12th, 2020 at 3:59 PM ^
U of M students testing positive for COVID are being quarantined in empty apartments with no food or supplies.
Those resources are really being used to support the main function of the university eh?
September 12th, 2020 at 5:07 PM ^
My son is a junior engineering student and from my perspective it’s a total shit show.
Where did you hear about students being quarantined in empty apartments? This bothers me a lot considering I had to fire off this semester’s OOS tuition payment a couple weeks ago.
September 12th, 2020 at 6:08 PM ^
Students have posted videos online showing their apartments and talking about the living conditions.
September 13th, 2020 at 1:47 AM ^
Thanks for the response. Posts like yours are why I lurk this board.
September 12th, 2020 at 5:49 PM ^
Those precious resources are still being used so the team can practice, a risk with zero reward.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:44 PM ^
Maybe if this country took this as seriously as it should have been, like our neighbors to the North who had 0 deaths yesterday as opposed to our 1,200+ (population difference would put us at 140), we could actually have nice things and not a mirage like we do. MLB has had several games cancelled, the NFL will to, as will the college football conferences (edit: forgot, some games have already been cancelled/postponed) that have decided to go ahead with their seasons.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:01 PM ^
Dude, we have had 180,000 deaths with people infected with Covid out of a population of 328,000,000. That is way way less than 1% of the population.
If all of this wasn’t politicized (by both sides), and one simply looked at three data, there is a ridiculously low chance of anything serious happening to anyone getting infected under the age of 55 and without any mitigating health factors.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:15 PM ^
You do realize there are many times that number of people that have suffered serious mid/long term health complications from this virus aside from death, right? This is also hitting those younger than 55, including people without preexisting health conditions.
True, the rates will be lower than the 55+ population - that does not mean it is "acceptable".
September 12th, 2020 at 4:26 PM ^
You say that there are “many times” that a “number of people” have had health complications. So please tell me “how many” and what is the “number”.
Don’t watch CNN or Fox News to get your info. Look at the actual data of people that were infected and died or those with serious complications from being infected and you will find that of the data know today, your risk of death or serious complications are Ridiculously low and well well below 1% of the population.
September 12th, 2020 at 5:47 PM ^
Why don't you share with us the data that you've studied so closely?
September 13th, 2020 at 12:36 AM ^
If not numbers, just look around. This doesn’t pass the sniff test. I can count on one hand...actually 2 fingers how many people I know that have gotten it during this “pandemic” that has been “raging” for 6 months now. I feel like I’m in the twilight zone...or have been unplugged from the matrix while the mindless sheep drone on and on parroting the latest fear porn from major news outlets. Insanity.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:20 PM ^
Its 190,000 deaths, and that is by no means a small number.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:31 PM ^
190,000 looks like a big number until you compare it in context with a population of 328,000,000 people.
190,000 deaths with a population of 328,000,000 still means less than 1 person out of 100 people has died from COVID. That is an undisputed fact.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:39 PM ^
That's a really shitty fact to base any kind of argument around.
"Less than 1% of America dies in car accidents every year, so we shouldn't take any kinds of precautions like seatbelts, insurance, or even driver's licenses!"
See how stupid that sounds?
September 12th, 2020 at 4:47 PM ^
LOL. I’m not saying take no precautions. I haven’t said such a thing. What I am saying is that taking all known precautions...such as what every college football team that is playing are doing....is not irresponsible based on the data we know as if today.
September 12th, 2020 at 5:00 PM ^
Oh no, you made the "guys it's not so deadly; less than 1% of America is dead" argument to try to justify why football should be played.
You don't get to retcon your own argument.
There are real, good, and valid points to be made in a debate regarding why Michigan football could be played, but you haven't made them. You said that not enough people have died for you to take this seriously.
If you ever wonder why your input into future discussions isn't welcome...this is it.
September 12th, 2020 at 5:07 PM ^
You can put words in my mouth all you want. The point I am trying to make is that, considering the risk that COVID proposes, playing college football with the precautions these other programs are implementing is not irresponsible and I don’t see why Michigan doesn’t play.
Furthermore, you can take things seriously regarding the virus and play football. They aren’t mutually exclusive.
Also, Look at the news that just dropped off a certain conference voting in the next 72 hours to play football I am assuming you will not watch or attend a game so as not to be a hypocrite
September 12th, 2020 at 5:33 PM ^
a hypocrite if he watches games if they're played? you're just not processing the argument
September 12th, 2020 at 5:52 PM ^
One of my favorite quotes, from 12 Angry Men:
"He can't hear you, and he never will."
Dude is not processing what anyone else is saying. He knows what he wants but can't quite articulate why or how. So every time his own logic errors are pointed out, he moves the goalposts.
You could copy/paste his own comment to him and he'd just say you were putting words in his mouth (see above). I appreciate your comment, thanks!
September 12th, 2020 at 7:02 PM ^
I like Bob Weir/John Barlow's take on those words - You ain"t gonna learn what you don"t want to know.
September 12th, 2020 at 6:16 PM ^
If you think football shouldn't be played then why would you watch?
September 12th, 2020 at 5:01 PM ^
Tell that to the 190,00 people who have passed away, and their families.
September 12th, 2020 at 5:39 PM ^
We have had about 6.5 million confirmed cases and 190k deaths. That's a fatality rate of around 3%.
Which would mean about 10 million dead if all 328 million Americans were infected.
Even at a 1% death rate it would be over 3 million dead.
Apparently those numbers are just fine for some people.
September 12th, 2020 at 7:22 PM ^
Naysayers get hung up on folks like you using the case fatality rate since the real death rate is lower (due to uncounted asymptomatic or mild cases that never get tested). Of course they also love to take the absolute lowest bound possible of estimates of IFR - 0.3% - as proof.
But not many people think about this perspective: every new count of positive cases ensures 3% of them will die, on average . So each and every day we have 20-50K new cases nationally means that each and every day we have signed the death certificates for another 600-1500 people. Every. Damn. Day. People are not processing the magnitude of how fucked up it is, and I cannot fucking believe that there are *any* crowds at stadiums right now, let alone football being played at all by any schools. IT. IS. NOT. ESSENTIAL.
I have absolutely no interest in watching this year. None. It's like we as a country are pretending everything is fine, and it's fucking not. We're that dog sitting in his house while it's on fire. We're just gonna have fun no matter what CuZ tHiS iS AmErIcA dAnGiT.
September 13th, 2020 at 12:25 AM ^
But did you share your “never forget” picture of 9/11 on social media recently? Only 2,997 people died in that so by your logic it is wholly insignificant, far less significant than COVID-19. Only 0.0009% of the population was affected after all.
September 12th, 2020 at 5:43 PM ^
If the US were performing as well as Canada 100,000 fewer people would have died and the difference continues to grow. The US is performing poorly compared to all peer nations. All of the other points about preconditions are just ignoring the fact that we’re performing so badly. Obesity and diabetes are preexisting conditions which make up a huge percentage of the population. People don’t just die from obesity every year.
Politics are not the primary reason that people are wary of COVID. Countries around the world with different political situations are taking more drastic steps because 1% death rate (and 10-20% hospitalization rate) are debilitating to any modern, effective healthcare system.
September 12th, 2020 at 10:35 PM ^
My mother is a nurse. One of the guys she works with was on the vent for a long time. He's 30. He recovered, thank God, but he has lingering neurological damage. Many more people on the staff of the hospital have been infected and not all of them have made a full recovery.
I mean, great for you that you don't know anybody who's having a problem, but this thing scares the hell out of me and I'm well under 55.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:46 PM ^
You can't compare to PRO leagues.
Most of those are in a true bubble.
As for the B1G, their standards are different than other CFB conferences. Whether we like it or not.
The B1G won't play until they can get reliable rapid testing and have enough to test daily.
We know the bar. Again, we don't have to like it, but it's different from other leagues who are okay with testing once or twice a week.
I want to see Michigan as well, it pains me. At the same time, I'm not going to question medical professionals.
It's the B1G, we know they operate independent of everyone else. We also know the league is located in a region of the country that is different than the say, the SEC. Same with the Pac-12. The tolerance in those regions is different than Alabama and Texas and Florida. It just is.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:47 PM ^
I have a hunch you’re being intentionally disingenuous, but I’ll bite.
The NBA and NHL both bubbled their athletes and have been rigid in their regulations. A team just lost one of their rotiation guys for unapproved contact in his hotel room.
MLB and MLS aren’t bubbling and we’ve already seen baseball have major issues with cancellations for teams with positive COVID tests. These are professional athletes getting paid to play.
There have already been several CFB games postponed or cancelled because of COVID tests. And more will come.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:49 PM ^
So find a team to root for, build a bridge and get the fuck over it.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:50 PM ^
I am torn. I respect science. I respect Fauci. Seeing ND, Pitt , Syracuse and Iowa State play though makes me question a lot.
September 12th, 2020 at 3:53 PM ^
Literally every Iowa State fan is begging for the season to be canceled right now
September 12th, 2020 at 4:04 PM ^
Literally? Like 100% of them? Insert Owen Wilson “wow “…
September 12th, 2020 at 9:21 PM ^
Florida st too
September 12th, 2020 at 4:06 PM ^
After today, maybe the whole Big 12 wishes they'd at least waited awhile. ISU and K State go down.
Sincerely, I wonder if they just weren't prepared/ready to play.
These games sure seem weird to watch...
September 12th, 2020 at 3:52 PM ^
Ibid.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:01 PM ^
Nothing. They feel the risk to playing isn’t high enough to not play. Simple as that. Nothing more nothing less
September 12th, 2020 at 4:02 PM ^
If you don’t know the difference between what professional leagues are/can do, differences between the US and other countries, I’m not sure this is going to be a productive conversation.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:09 PM ^
Yes, today absolutely sucks without UM football. We are all fucking bummed about it.
The SCHOOL and conference made the best decision they could at the time based on available information. Yes, let's remember that it is an institution of higher learning - a top 25 US university in fact. - Not a professional sports league with paid participants or a football factory.
Many of the leagues you cited have already had to cancel or reschedule games. The stress and pressure this will put on universities that actually try to execute a season transparently and responsibly will be incredible. Pulling off 5 games (legitimately - not fudging #'s or hiding cases) before Christmas will be nearly impossible.
The reports around heart and other residual cardiovascular and circulatory effects of the disease clearly scared the shit out of university presidents - as they should have.
September 12th, 2020 at 4:10 PM ^
Can't speak for the entire conference, but U-M is staring down the barrel of major monetary repercussions for Dr. Anderson. You're crazy if you think Schlissel isn't anything but risk averse right now.