OT: J.D. Martinez traded to Arizona
What the title says, he was traded for Dawel Lugo, Sergio Alcantar and Josh King. Do not really know that much about them.
We have had one of the worst bullpens in baseball for the last three years and we traded for position players?
Somewhere Dombrowski is cackling with glee watching his first place Red Sox. That guy knew the value of acquiring arms. Impatient fans criticized him so badly about trading Fister for Robbie Ray that he had to ship that kid to Arizona. Ray made the ASG while Fister has a +6.00 ERA.
would love to pile on avila, but dombrowski built many bullpen-less teams.
We overspent on VMart and Fielder because Ilitch wanted a ring. That money on Prince should've gone to the bullpen and Scherzer.
Somewhere Dombrowski is gutting another farm system.
On a related note, Martinez cost the Tigers nothing besides his salary. In 2014 Dombrowski picked up Martinez when Houston released him for having trouble with the curve. So maybe Big Al thinks they can again catch lighting in a bottle with one of the prospects they're receiving for Martinez.
JD is a known commodity. You trade him for other known commodities. If this was his son for those three guys, I'd take it.
Should've known better. This guy traded Cameron Maybin for a guy getting lit up in the minors. Maybin has 25 steals and is getting on base more than the three-headed monster of Mahtook, Presley and Romine. If we would've held onto Maybin, we would've gotten more than a guy to fill out a minor league roster.
That's not how baseball works. Bad teams trade good players for prospects. The Tigers need a total rebuild and they have fucked it up with this trade.
I mean, it's known that the prospects you're trading for are good. Sorry for the confusion. You don't trade All-Star players for guys that even the scouts shake their head at.
Avila has got to go.
Dombrowski got FULMER for cespedes rental. This is a pathetic deal.
I obviously don't know what the interest was from other teams, but man this is a shit trade from an outsider perspective. 3 JAG (at best) prospects, none of them close to being ready for the majors. I know JD is in a walk year and smart GMs have learned not to overpay for rentals but man, feels like there was more to be had from someone for a player of his calibre.
At least wait until the damn deadline if you're going to take shit. I'm fuming over here.
Looks like a terrible deal. I hope this isn't going to be a Randy Smith type rebuild for the Tigers.
It's going to be bad. Rookie GM, bloating aged contracts, absolutely empty farm. Goodbye, Tigers. See you in a decade or two.
Empty farm? How dare you say that when future RF Steven Moya is torching AA Erie to the tune of sub .200 after his recent demotion.
Even for Avila, that is a shockingly awful deal.
I hope JD fails his physical. If Al won't help the Tigers out, maybe JD's stiff back will.
back.
I was about to post the same thing. As a 47 year old CPA, I have seen a lot of things in the business world. One of the biggest things that I take with me is that there are people with power that have absolutely no business whatsoever to have that power. Unfortunately, it permeates many of our organizations whether it be Corporate America, Government, or all the way down to our local youth league boards.
This is a bad trade, what really did you expect the Tigers to get other than some moderate prospects? J.D. is a rental that every team knows is not going to re-sign with the Tigers in the offseason. They were severly limited in the returns with J.D.
I do not like Avila's job so far as a GM, but I really cannot fault him in getting what he got.
J.D. He's a very good hitter. But we also have blinders on as Tigers fans. He is metrically one of the worst outfielders in baseball, and he has a pretty bad history of injuries.
Maybe they could have got a bit more in return, but the people who expect a massive return do not really understand the game.
The science behind how and which prospects will succeed, and I will be on board.
I can't count how many top Tigers prospects over the years have completely flamed out, and how many of the under appreciated ones made a name.
It is like laughing at the NBA draft. You have NO idea how these kids will pan out.
Great. Another metrics guy. It's a shit deal and we don't need metrics to tell us that J.D. is good.
I thought it was pretty well-known that J.D. is one of the worst outfielders in baseball, and has a pretty bad injury history. That's just fact.
Be angry about the trade, but don't deny he has some big flaws.
.300 with 30 homers and 100 RBI potential says you're wrong but whatever. Agree to disagree. You're right about the fielding. The injury history? Eh, I'm not so sure it is something that can be predicted. Remember when after two injuries everyone around Detroit was panicking about Matthew Stafford? He's been an ironman ever since. So you never know.
But I will take a bad fielder who hits .300 with 30/100 who is iffy in right field every damn day
But yeah, WEIRD
Freaking picture into account.
There is a VERY LIMITED market for a power hitter right now. Not a lot of teams need one.
J.D. is going to be a 75-80 game rental at best.
The Tigers are bent over a barrel with him, because teams know that they cannot resign.
Fielding is a HUGE PART of the game. He's a complete trainwreck out there.
Don't just be a complete Tigers slap and assume every team is going to throw out their #1 and #2 prospects for him. And you have NO IDEA how these prospects will turn out. If Keith Law or Olney said, "Yeah, these are good prospects", would you suddenly feel better??
I think your first point is the biggest one. The market for a corner outfield bat is very limited so a Cespedes type haul is unrealistic. However, I am disappointed this deal happend with so much time before the deadline.
If you (not you, anyone) researches teams that actually need a corner outfielder with power, you are going to struggle big time.
That is a fair point. Maybe they could have got a LITTLE more, but I doubt it. I understood going into the deadline that J.D. was not going to fetch a lot. People just look at his hitting numbers and say, "Yeah, that should be worth a TON!"
Trust me, I am not an Avila fan. But the market is just not there for a player like him CURRENTLY.
And both sides can be seen with the timing. As it gets closer and closer to the deadline, maybe those teams interested in him say, "Nah, not worth it."
Washington
broken foot
Nationals could have used JD along with J. Wilson
To return this season.
I expect Justin Wilson to go.
we'll get some used baseballs in return
For a guy like Justin Wilson. He's a rare bird.
J.D. is a really good hitter, but there is just not a big market on corner outfielders with power who can't field and get hurt often.
There is definitely a market for someone like JD. Otherwise, experts and other baseball people wouldn't be laughing at the poor return that the Tigers got for JD. It might not be as big as some Tigers fans think, but the market was definitely better than what we got for him. Again, no reason to sell JD over a week before the deadline when he's a wanted commodity.
The return we got for him would have been the worst case scenario at deadline day. If that's all we got for him at the deadline because we just needed to move him, it's one thing. But over a week before? Pitiful.
He's a .300/30 guy and those cats don't grow on trees. His bat more than makes up for his defensive weaknesses. Most of the contenders would love his bat in the middle of their lineups. There was no reason to pull the trigger on this now for what the Tigers got in return. They could have gotten the same shitty deal during Winter meetings.
keep him and take the draft pick! these guys won't even sniff the majors.
At least the top prospect in someone's system. One guy. Instead of three who are just guys at positions that are already young on our squad.
Little power, no speed, horrible OBP. He will never start for a good team. He might be a backup.
He could start for losing teams. Which I guess is what the Tigers are aiming to be, so he will fit right in.
just like Scherzer and Cespedes did
First, let's unpack "rental." In JD's case that means a guy hitting for power and average who is a competent fielder (i.e. he is not going to give back all the runs he contributes from the plate). Think there might be a pennant contender with a black hole in a corner outfield position who could use that for a half season (and playoffs)? No one is saying he's worth a big free agent contract or that the team that trades for him will have a leg up in getting one. But, just what JD can do for you in the next four months is worth more than the #8 prospect from one of the worst minor league systems in baseball (and two scrubs who play the same position).
Second, these guys fit the profile of every position player the Tigers' minor league system produced in the bad, old days of the 90s--a light hitting utility player. Hey, this guy can suck at the plate from 3 different positions! Woop-de-frickin'-doo. The fact that we traded for them (and THREE of them) suggests that our front office has learned precisely nothing in the last 20 years. Also, it's comic irony that they are prospects for SS and 3B; we already have a veteran and a promising youngerster at the former, and a cost controlled young player at the latter.