OT: Florida cutting Computer Science

Submitted by Mr. Robot on

http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevensalzberg/2012/04/22/university-of-flo…

As a graduating senior majoring in computer science, I find this almost too absurd to believe. I don't care to look into the specifics of Florida's numbers to know whether they turn a profit like we do and that the increased athletic budget would fall under it.

Either way though, how do you cut computer science? Computers aren't going away, and $1.7 million is a drop in the bucket no matter how tight your budget at a large public university, especially with an area as important as that. All you need is some computers and the faculty to run the program. Heck, most of my professors even openly admit you can get the text material you need on Wikipedia and have even considered dropping the text books in favor of it (not that the cost of the books is part of the department costs anyway).

I never had a high opinion of Florida's academics anyway, but this knocks them down a few more notches. It makes me feel good that we would never compromise our academics for athletics here at Michigan, and especially not a major as popular and important as CS.

In light of this, I feel adding this video is appropriate:

 

Wolverine Gator

April 23rd, 2012 at 12:39 PM ^

As a Gator alum with a BSBA in CIS and an MS in CS, losing the department would be crazy. In my time there the courses leaned VERY heavily toward foreign students. And foreign students brought in a lot of money. I hope they reverse course because CS is a field not going away anytime soon. Why don't they kill off classes like "Age of Dinosaurs" or the stereotypical rocks for jocks first?

Perkis-Size Me

April 23rd, 2012 at 12:40 PM ^

As someone who grew up in Florida for 19 years, I can tell you right now that the state's academics for collegiate students are a complete joke. UF has some decent grad programs, but everyone knows those schools are run by their football programs. I grew up in Tampa, but never once considered applying anywhere in-state. My parents actually told me if I stayed in-state, I'd pay my own way.

Space Coyote

April 23rd, 2012 at 12:41 PM ^

There were reports of Florida cutting this program and raising the budget for the AD, but those aren't really connected.  Like Michigan's AD, Florida's AD provides it's own budget and doesn't get any from the school.  So people really shouldn't get that up in arms about that side of things (not saying the OP is, but I've been seeing a lot of angry people on the internet because they believe the two are connected).

Still, this seems idiotic to cut one of the fundamental programs right now.  Computer science is a huge field.  Maybe there are some other issues that I am just completely oblivious to, but on the outside this doesn't make much sense if any at all.

Mr. Robot

April 23rd, 2012 at 12:46 PM ^

I posted this mainly because I felt it was absurb enough to share regardless of the reason; that article just happens to make an implication connecting the two.

I would be curious to know what the increased athletic budget is for though. The CS department may not be getting the axe to fund athletics, but if that $2 million is for somthing dumb, it could certainly be used to save the department as extra profit. That's another reason I'm proud to go to Michigan. We not only turn a profit, we usually pump at least a couple million back into the general fund every year.

PatrickBateman

April 23rd, 2012 at 2:04 PM ^

Especially since $2 million is not that much money in terms of a University's total budget, I'm SURE there are better things to cut. Just judging by Michigan's spending... there are certainly ways to cut things out of the budget without ANYONE noticing. Think anyone would notice if that (sorry I don't like "modern" art or whatever it is) giant orange pickup-sticks statue outside Angell disappeared? What about letting a few jobs of recently retired employees go unfilled for a while to see where some bureaucracy can be shed? Or take money FROM the athletic department and apply it to the academic side of the school?

 

UMGooch

April 23rd, 2012 at 12:44 PM ^

As a Florida resident and UF Grad Student, I feel like I should chime on this...

I know we're supposed to avoid politics on this board, but I have to say the funding of education (in particular higher education) by the state administration is FUBAR in Florida. Budgeting issues over the past few years have forced our department to greatly dilute the quality of education for graduate students by admitting over 90% foreign Master's students (essentially free tuition money for the department). We now share courses designed for 20 engaged graduate students tops with over 100 students, 90% of them from China and India. Not only that, but our lab resources, available projects, and time spent with advisors all must be shared further. This is a direct result of the reallocation of funding, and the cutting of the CS department might be another effect.

Wisconsin Wolverine

April 23rd, 2012 at 12:49 PM ^

I think there are two points to be made here.

  1. As Space Coyote also mentioned above, UF's athletic department is funded by a separate, non-profit organization called The University of Florida Athletic Association.  Their $2 million increase is unrelated to the university's actions involving the computer science department.
  2. The idea behind the elimination of the CS department isn't to eliminate computers from UF, but to restructure the myriad computing degrees they offer across multiple departments & even two colleges.  So they're really folding aspects of CS into other areas, like engineering.

I'm not a UF student, & I'm also not a computer scientist or engineer, so I don't have much more specific information than that.  I know we are always ready to pounce on the SEC for being a bunch of mouth-breathing yokels, but let's just sit on this one for a bit & see what's what.

Picktown GoBlue

April 23rd, 2012 at 10:28 PM ^

UF CS will drop to non research institution status. Plenty of such schools attract profs and put out quality CS grads. It just isn't what one would expect at an AAU school.



Then again, seeing what my colleagues got grants in CS for, it would not have been a big loss for my old school. This sham plus the enslavement of TA's plus basically ignoring quality teaching of undergrads are the reasons I escaped the CS research institution long ago.



Favorite grant was one to come up with results to convince folks the Illinoos lottery was a good deal.

Born Blue

April 23rd, 2012 at 11:03 PM ^

Minor though it maybe, it is, nonetheless, simply the University Athletic Association (UAA) and has been for several decades.  

Additionally, as a former graduate student and Gainesville resident with ties and friendships still in the community, including UAA, I can tell you my visit this past summer was quite distrubing.  The problems facing the institution, infrasturcture, administration, and most of all faculty and staff is mind boggling.  Given the range of issues, too numerous to address here, it caused me raise the question, "Why are you returning to work this Fall?"

As for money, the UAA is not hurting for money, having just completed a $15 Million dollar Women's Lacrosse and Soccer facility.  Having seen it in person, sweet though it is, in light of the academic short fall, I once again scratch my head.

I am VERY glad and PROUD to be BLUE!!

mgordoblue

April 23rd, 2012 at 12:56 PM ^

I also have a BS in Computer Science, and I think it is terrible for UF to jettison it's CS program for any reason. In today's economy a Computer Science degree is very valuable and you have a relatively high chance of finding a job after graduating (note the 'relatively' qualifier).

oriental andrew

April 23rd, 2012 at 12:53 PM ^

"It makes me feel good that we would never compromise our academics for athletics here at Michigan, and especially not a major as popular and important as CS."

Misleading.  One doesn't have to do with the other.  If the article is accurate, the state legislature has been cutting their funding for years and UF is apparently making do.  Who knows how much pushback the legislature received, but tough situation for the students and faculty. 

PatrickBateman

April 23rd, 2012 at 2:16 PM ^

Classy. 

It's not like Californian schools are doing well either.  Perhaps you left-coasters should've looked into hiring this type of worker called an "accountant" who helps to manage this thing called a "budget", I hear it's a pretty useful tool to avoid this other thing called "a $20 billion dollar deficit ".   

See... mocking large groups of people makes you seem just as dumb as you insinuate they are.

Bryan

April 23rd, 2012 at 1:26 PM ^

What happens to students currently in the program? Are they SOL at the end of the current semester?

And I'm sure there's a joke about Florida's computers not having SEC speed to compete with the rest of the conference. 

SFBayAreaBlue

April 23rd, 2012 at 1:34 PM ^

I can only hope this is some kind of protest about the 30% reduction in state funding.  How can you be the flagship university in a heavily populated state and not have the one subject that is going to dominate EVERY aspect of life in the near future if it doesn't already.  Someone pointed out that the cost savings are less than the projected INCREASE in funding for their football budget.  

I loves me some football, but holy fuck! that is ass backwards. 

ZooWolverine

April 23rd, 2012 at 1:49 PM ^

In order to get tenure at Michigan in Engineering (of which CS is a part), you need to bring in way more money than you cost (literally: roughly 20% of the money from every research grant brought in goes straight to the university to use however it wants). I doubt Florida is that much worse off that the research money can't fund the faculty as well. There are obviously other costs: building, comptuers, grad student funding, etc. but I can't imagine this being a good decision for a large public university.

EDIT: After reading al ittle bit more, it looks like it's more eliminating the department than the faculty--it'll still be a "teaching unit." It looks like it's done as a cost-cutting move, however, so they're clearly eliminating some things, I just can't tell what those things are. No matter what, it looks like there's a strong de-emphasis of CS as a discipline which doesn't seem likely to draw new faculty/students in a hugely important field (in my very biased epinion).

MGlobules

April 23rd, 2012 at 2:01 PM ^

do you think they WANT to cut computer sci? They have cuts of 20% two years running. If you're an FL alumnus your ignorance about the REASONS for the changes you complain about are terrifying. Florida was ranked 15th nationally among public universities three years ago, an incredible achievement for the flagship school in a state with no income taxes.They're now dropping like the barometer in an oncoming hurricane--in fact, that's what they face. Lat Am Studies program is one of the country's three or four tops; Anthro is a top ten program. Like FSU, where my wife teaches, the school has been gutted. 

"I never liked FL's academics anyway. . ." not a real learned statement. At least TRY to figure out what's going on. 

allezbleu

April 23rd, 2012 at 7:46 PM ^

but isn't it fair to ask - if the CS department is in the green (as articles are saying), then why would you cut this program and not others?

the computer industry is becoming hugely important. couldn't they have cut another engineering program or say like geology or contemporary carribean literature?

budget cuts are probably to blame - but from my limited information im baffled by the choice of CS over other programs.

WolverineRage

April 23rd, 2012 at 2:56 PM ^

This is interesting to me and will probably get me "Cool Story Bro"'ed but, a couple years ago the University of Florida brought forward a "Digital Arts" program for review as a program whose students could be admitted to Tau Beta Pi which is the Engineering Honor Society.

The Digital Arts program was run out of their CS department I believe and it was a hybrid program between an arts degree & a CS degree.  The impression given during the presentation was that it was aimed at Disney and making students marketable to them for working in the entertainment industry in general.

They really seemed high on this program and the potential benefit for a big employer and so its interesting to me that two years later they would cut the deparment administering it.

---

Aside: For those who care, the program was shot down for admission into TBP as not being a true "engineering" program.

bronxblue

April 23rd, 2012 at 3:03 PM ^

I know that the article points out that the "field" will be woven into other departments (mostly engineering), but losing CS is, symbolically, a major black eye to UF.  I know that schools need to tighten their belts as state budgets shrink, but CS is a thriving field that will only become more essential in the future.  And from a business perspective, CS departments produce a fair bit of IP that a university can later leverage either through the patent system, fostering start-ups, etc.  There is real value in keeping these department around, and to cut the program and reorganize as parts of other departments is another myopic step from a state education department that appears to be hell-bent on wasting all of the intellectual capital it has.

ixcuincle

April 23rd, 2012 at 3:18 PM ^

Absolutely stupid. Computers are becoming important in this day and age, and they're just going to cut that program out to add money for footbawl? Ridiculous. 

allezbleu

April 23rd, 2012 at 4:57 PM ^

since it seems that a lot of people are misinformed - 

 

- They are NOT eliminating the CS department. They are killing the research arm of it.

- All faculty will be converted into teaching-only positions

- All TA's will be eliminated

 

However this doesn't change the fact that this is mind-bogglingly stupid. 

They might as well kill the entire program because all the faculty will leave for positions elsewhere, and the reputation of the program has been irreparably downgraded.

I work for a big silicon valley computer company that hires lots of capable UF grads and this is just stunning to me.

Those reponsible from the school admins to the politicians involved with the budget should hang their heads in shame.

southern_yankee

April 23rd, 2012 at 7:48 PM ^

Here's a good article that gives an overview of what's going on (state legislature constraints, budget cuts, and AD as an independent entity).

 

http://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/04/college-vs-college-…

 

However, what's striking to me is it seems the UF probably doesnt have well respected faculty in CS.  I say this because at our beloved UM, EECS (and other engineering faculty) are regularly only supported between 0.1 - 0.2 by the university.  The rest of their salary is research grants.  Engineering depts in general operate that way as government & industry alike regularly rely on academia to solve some of the tougher problems -- so there is plenty of $$$ to go around in those fields.  Clearly, the UF faculty stuggled to ataian such funding.  I wonder why....

Sarasota13

April 23rd, 2012 at 8:05 PM ^

is one of the top public universities. Other than Vanderbilt, it is the only university in the SEC to be a member of the Association of American Universities.  Its graduate programs are also top notch. 

The university does not “compromise academics for athletics” as both programs are independent of each other.

The computer science program is not being eliminated, nor is the research division being cut.    However, there is a reorganization plan that will be implemented thanks to our governor.  The response of the university is attached.  Also the legislature and governor has passed legislation to permit UF to raise its tuition rates as it is a member of AAU.  With the bright futures dwindling and tuition rates rising, prospective students may choose to attend college out of the state.  http://www.forbes.com/sites/danbigman/2012/04/23/university-of-florida-responds-to-post-about-plans-for-computer-science-department/ 

lhglrkwg

April 23rd, 2012 at 9:36 PM ^

Hmmm stupid. Everyone knows CSE and CE are hugely important and useful majors. I could think of 20 majors I'd cut before I'd ever cut CSE

Old_Guys_Rule

April 24th, 2012 at 11:50 AM ^

RT UT FB team had GPA of 2.06 last fall, 1.9 among scholarship players. 30 players on academic probation.

University of Tennessee and Coach Derek Dooley are having their problems.  Not only all of the turmoil with assistant coaches leaving, team chemistry, star players transferring, but now this...