Michigan State Snowflakes: The Coaching
October 30th, 2021 at 4:07 PM ^
It won't ever get us where we want to go. Not even close
October 30th, 2021 at 7:43 PM ^
Nope. I was wondering whether the MSU game or the PSU game was going to be the part where the other shoe drops and we either choke away a won game or get blown out. Now I have my answer.
People can talk about ifs and buts and close losses, but Harbaugh has had almost as many close wins, and it doesn't change any of the facts or statistics.
October 30th, 2021 at 8:54 PM ^
How are there any people in this fan base defending Harbaugh, he has proven over and over he cannot win big games. This is not even close to being disputed. He is a loser, maybe not at Stanford, maybe not at the 49ers, maybe not at his next job, but he is a loser at Michigan.
October 30th, 2021 at 10:06 PM ^
This is where I wonder if it’s not Harbaugh that is the problem, but rather Michigan itself. I mean look at it.
Harbaugh won big everywhere he went prior to Michigan and has failed here so far. He was as sure as sure could be and has still lost.
Hoke was trending up at SDSU, came here, had one good year, and plummeted every year after.
RichRod was the hot ticket item, won big at WVU, came here, and fell apart. A lot of that was his doing, but still, it makes you wonder.
Is the next guy doomed for failure as well?
October 31st, 2021 at 12:00 AM ^
RichRod has done nothing since (or even at for that matter) Michigan… doesn’t help your theory
October 31st, 2021 at 9:46 AM ^
Rich Rod did play in a conference Championship game and you can make fun of Pac-12 all you want it still further than Harbaugh or Hoke have made it at Michigan
October 31st, 2021 at 12:00 AM ^
I've been wondering this myself. One national title since 1948 is a pretty long run for a program that hauled in the kind of talent Michigan used to haul in. Outside of OSU, the talent gap has been in UM's favor for most games over the past decade, too. And yet...
It's quite possible there's something within the culture that makes this happen. I don't pretend to know what that might be, but there are a lot of examples of close but not quite, and inexplicable failures, that make it difficult to just ignore the possibility that there might be something there. It has been similar in other sports as well.
October 31st, 2021 at 12:11 AM ^
Harbaugh’s won the same number of conference titles at Michigan as he did at Stanford. 0. - I say that jokingly because I still think he’s a good coach and the right guy for the job, but I agree that maybe the problem is just our football program itself.
Seriously, it seems like every single close call goes against us or at least the big, game changing ones do.
Maybe it’s the football Gods punishing our program for making Brady split time with Henson. Hopefully the curse will end once Brady retires…assuming that he will retire someday.
October 31st, 2021 at 8:35 AM ^
Perkins, yes it is Michigan too. Look at UM not being willing to allow athletes to use the M in NIL. The administration of the AD and University’s arrogance is fully at fault as well.
October 31st, 2021 at 12:11 PM ^
You raise a good point. Look at Hoke now with SDSU.
October 31st, 2021 at 12:48 PM ^
I don’t buy this at all. I think it is far More likely that either Harbaugh’s prior success was flukey or the game has simply passed him by.
Either way, there is no reason why we shouldn’t be able to find a coach who can outperform the last 15 years of subpar football.
October 31st, 2021 at 8:52 PM ^
I feel like this is more likely true than not true.
There was NO HIRE that was more “automatic” than Harbaugh and he’s been okay-to-good here, but not at all what we thought we were getting.
I don’t see a world where firing Harbaugh right now does anything good for Michigan. The Ceiling is now 10-11 wins per season. Which is better than the 5-6 wins it was with Rodriguez or Hoke. Just hoping to go to a bowl game? Joke. At least now we know Michigan will go to a bowl game and win if they play Florida more than not, and lose to anyone else they play (and usually surprisingly close— see Florida State and Alabama bowl games)
November 20th, 2021 at 1:37 PM ^
Got Harbaugh post peak. If the AD had done his job and reeled him in 2008. Story would’ve played out somewhat better. OSU wasn’t yet the juggernaut & sparty was like a kitten.
October 30th, 2021 at 4:07 PM ^
We have no chance at winning any big ten titles, or anything or any significance for that matter, and have losing records against our only actual rivals. It's time to make a change.
October 31st, 2021 at 8:19 AM ^
The problem is not the coaching. We are trying to compete in a College football landscape where our opponents routinely neglect the rules. Additionally, our hands are tied by a rigid academic culture created by the administration. As evidenced by the Trent decommitment and several others over the last few recruiting cycles.
The change is being made. And this is Schlissel leaving the University. Hopefully the new president can be convinced to negotiate the standards so that talented players have a chance of enrolling at the school.
Harbaugh didn't forget how to coach. He just has several challenges that he needs to overcome to manage the program. And the fan base isn't helping.
October 31st, 2021 at 9:03 AM ^
Or maybe we (and I say we since I'm an alumnus, I try to never say we about the football team as I never played) stay the course and realize that football prowess isn't something one sells their soul for. Has the Michigan Basketball team sold their soul, nope. Sure it's easier when your only have to recruit 12-15 players, but the team hasn't done it.
If the only way to be competitive in football is to reduce academic standards then that is a bridge to far. I'm fine with the Wolverines being an also ran. I don't know if it is or not.
I believe the greater issue is the flaunting of pay rules. With NIL that should be less of a problem, and the Michigan Leadership needs to embrace that part. These young men don't need to be amateurs, that is thinking of old white dudes of the early 20th century. Allow the young men to earn what the market will bear.
October 31st, 2021 at 10:25 AM ^
We is fine to say. It is a collective experience, without the fans there is no sport. I have always hated the argument you can't say we. It's the connection between the fans and the players that make sporting events worth while.
October 31st, 2021 at 10:58 AM ^
Not here to troll, just wanted to add my take from the other side of the rivalry. In my opinion the biggest factor to winning and losing is recruiting. The midwest is not the same hotbed that it was 30 years ago. Most of the talent now comes from the south. The days of winning with Ohio and Pennsylvania talent are gone. You have to recruit nationally these days. I dont think your problem is coaching. Look as Ohio State. Once coach Meyer came and established his level of recruiting tOSU hasn't missed a beat. They are recruiting at an all time clip, and it has not slowed down with coach Day. The kids they are recruiting want to play in his prolific offense. Michigan does also recruit nationally but you are just not at the same level right now. I think once Jim Harbaugh gets over the hump and wins a big game people will take notice.
October 31st, 2021 at 3:00 PM ^
Of course recruiting is essential. But so is scheme, program culture, game plans, in-game adjustments, play calls...
The truth is that, given the fact that Michigan has been sub-par/non-elite since Carr retired, Harbaugh is recruiting close to where one could reasonably expect.
Once can reasonably argue that there are some odd roster gaps at some position groups this year that should not happen by year 7. But overall recruiting is not the reason Harbaugh has a bad record against quality opponents, has a bad record against top 10 teams, and generally tends to win only the games when Michigan is a decided favorite, and very rarely wins as even a close underdog.
The real reason for the underperformance is rooted in an outdated approach to offense, an approach that is happy with plenty of FGs and getting just 33 points out of 550+ yards, etc. It is scheme, culture, game plans, in-game play call, etc.--not recruiting--that had prevented Harbaugh from getting Michigan to the level just below Bama, OSU, Clemson... And you have to get to the level just below the consistent playoff teams to even think about getting close to their level on the recruiting trail.
October 31st, 2021 at 5:18 PM ^
Hold up hold up, are you saying Michigan isn't losing because it doesn't recruit Ohio much anymore?? BS ??
October 31st, 2021 at 8:37 PM ^
In year 7 you think "Once Harbaugh gets over the hump"
that's not trolling, it's village idiocy.
October 31st, 2021 at 9:41 AM ^
I'm curious how Michigan's academic standards lost yesterday's game to a program for the fourth time in seven years that we out recruit EVERY YEAR.
October 31st, 2021 at 10:50 AM ^
They didn’t, people are just reaching for any reason they can to explain mediocre football when they refuse to admit the obvious reason.
October 31st, 2021 at 4:08 PM ^
If you really wanted an answer, someone could point to their 37 transfers through the portal this year, which Michigan would never have allowed. Due to its academic standards.
But I'm not saying that. We have better players, even after those extra 37 bodies.
October 31st, 2021 at 9:48 AM ^
Please shut up. We just lost to fucking Michigan State, who has essentially owned us under Harbaugh. Go look up their recruiting classes on 247 and then come back and tell me our problem is recruiting and not getting the players we want. It is the dumbest mindless excuse to blame admissions when we consistently get top 10 recruiting classes. Also players like Xavier worthy didn’t flip away from Michigan because of “admissions”, and if you can’t read between the lines I feel sorry for you.
November 5th, 2021 at 2:12 PM ^
LOL, going 3-4 is not getting "essentially owned". But I dig your passion Gerald.
October 31st, 2021 at 9:48 AM ^
Please shut up. We just lost to fucking Michigan State, who has essentially owned us under Harbaugh. Go look up their recruiting classes on 247 and then come back and tell me our problem is recruiting and not getting the players we want. It is the dumbest mindless excuse to blame admissions when we consistently get top 10 recruiting classes. Also players like Xavier worthy didn’t flip away from Michigan because of “admissions”, and if you can’t read between the lines I feel sorry for you.
October 31st, 2021 at 10:52 AM ^
I came to respond something along these lines, thanks for taking care of that for me. Some of the people will spew out any bullshit they can to make themselves feel better about this piss poor coaching. Michigan routinely plays before their talent level and there is no argument to counter that.
October 31st, 2021 at 10:54 AM ^
Michigan has the same academic admission standards for its athletes as every other big ten school. get off this shit. You can keep repeating it but it wont become true
October 31st, 2021 at 12:00 PM ^
To whom? Matt Campbell? 5-3 with much of his team returning? Can't win his in-state rivalry? Shit, be constructive at least. Neg me to Bolivia, you toxic Tammies, I've heard nice things about it ?
October 31st, 2021 at 12:23 PM ^
A downvote with no response! Ballsy
October 30th, 2021 at 4:10 PM ^
After 1.5 years MSU is a better program than UM. FIRE HARBAUGH! Don’t let that fucking loser on the bus. He’s never going to win shit.
October 30th, 2021 at 4:10 PM ^
Falls short once again
October 30th, 2021 at 4:17 PM ^
You are the f-ing loser.
October 30th, 2021 at 6:54 PM ^
No, Michigan football is. Being a fan of this program is terrible. I thought I grew numb to being disappointed but this program alwayS finds a new way to disappoint.
Why I still watch and care ? I don’t know
October 30th, 2021 at 8:20 PM ^
My give a damn about the program is gone for the remainder of this year now. It happened a bit later in the year than usual, but I’m not gonna waste anymore Saturdays supporting mediocrity. They have the players, it’s 100% coaching that’s holding them back.
October 31st, 2021 at 2:06 PM ^
bye, dickhead.
October 31st, 2021 at 12:38 PM ^
Then quit watching and caring. I won't miss you
October 30th, 2021 at 6:59 PM ^
I would spend most of my points downvoting this comment if I could. Are you old enough to be on the interwebs?
October 30th, 2021 at 7:45 PM ^
Well if we go by conference title wins and appearances, records against our rivals, and playoff wins and appearances, I would definitely say the football program is the fucking loser.
October 30th, 2021 at 6:45 PM ^
Winning one close (4pt) game at home (and with some help by the officials) makes them a "better" program? Get some perspective. Neither team is "good" this year and both will likely finish with 2 losses or more this season.
October 30th, 2021 at 6:49 PM ^
Msu will lose to which 2 teams? Osu maybe, who else? Psu sucks and they get them at home to end the season. They’ll be 11-1 at least.
October 30th, 2021 at 7:13 PM ^
This is the same msu that trailed most of the game today (and *should* have still lost had we not shot ourselves in the foot frequently), should have lost to Neb if it wasn't for a botched punt direction by them, nearly lost to an Indiana with a busted Penix. They could absolutely lose to psu (especially if the get Clifford and Mustipher back by then), no doubt lose to osu, and wouldn't be a shock to drop @ Purdue next week.
If you think they are going 11-1 or better you should reexamine the details.
October 30th, 2021 at 8:17 PM ^
If “if’s” and “but’s”.... so on and so forth.
October 30th, 2021 at 8:35 PM ^
Very sound rhetorical counter arguement you have.
My comment was in response to the person claiming that msu would go 11-1 at least this year.
Yes, they are currently 8-0... which only means as much as the quality of competition they have faced (and how they got that record matters when trying to predict performance in the near future - and they have *not* looked the part of an 11-1 team).
October 30th, 2021 at 8:45 PM ^
They just punked us with a second year coach. I get that you love our team, but you are being dishonest if you continue to make excuses. Our coach just got embarrassed in a game that everyone was watching nationally. It hurts the program every time this happens (it has happened a lot). You can neg my posts all you want. One of us needs to start being real
October 31st, 2021 at 2:40 PM ^
They won by 4 (only taking the lead late) at their own stadium...
How exactly is that "punking" us? They pulled off a close upset - that's it.
October 30th, 2021 at 8:57 PM ^
By the way, I love your posts on this blog and respect your opinion. I just disagree with you on this one.
October 30th, 2021 at 7:08 PM ^
I don’t know about the whole “better program” thing, but they really took it to us in the second half. The future looks good for that team with Tucker (go ahead LSU). Their second year coach is 2-0 against us and that sounds better than our seventh year coach that just can’t win the biggest games.
edit: Also, they are 8-0 after beating their biggest rival a year removed from losing their best coach in decades and winning only a couple of games.