I guess that would give State an "explosive" offense.
to play football, not to play trumpet
I guess that would give State an "explosive" offense.
You know it would be bombs away on every down...
...I'll just go ahead and neg myself.
I heard he's a sleeper (cell).
thread I have read on here ever.... Its not even funny. Not even because of the whole terriost thing. Just not funny oh dantonio seeks early release haa so stupid how not funny this post is
His locker will read "The Hurt"
Not a fan of the film about EOD troops, huh?
"This kid is a holy terror"
he is a threat through the air.
You two have a lot in common. Bold idea...poor execution.
can blow a game wide open. His recruitment will open a pipeline directly into the federal prison system, where Dantonio can find plenty of people who fit his program.
funny thought, I suppose, but keep a few things in mind....after all, obi ezeh hit a pole while drunk driving on a suspended license (Stonum too). Best practice is to not throw stones in a glass house.
Dantonio kicked Gilyard off the team a few yrs back and ended up leaving him homeless for a while....needless to say, he turned out pretty well. I don't know Mark Dantonio personally, but I'm guessing he learned something from that experience.
The Sparties in question hit PEOPLE. Winston did so on two separate occasions.
There are judgment errors, and then there is premeditated felonious assault. IIRC from philosophy class, Humans << Poles
...drunk drivers have upon occasion killed innocent people.
I don't mean to minimize drunk driving at all. My point was that battery is an intentional crime, whereas DUI is a reckless crime, and that unintentional damage to property is different than intentional damage to people.
there was no chance of that happening in Ezeh's case, because Ezeh never hits anyone. When there's a clear path to hit a person he'd inexplicably drive in a different direction, or he'd get blocked by a pole and wouldn't be able to get his car off the pole's block.
Winston is off the team, so is Jenrette (as they should be). Those are the two individuals who definitely "hit people". As for the others, they shouldn't have been there, but it is entirely possible none of the other players "hit" anybody. Per my previous post (on diff thread), how do you explain the fact that one person gets injured if they all "hit people"? This is not a movie, it's real life, when fights break out people usually get hurt. Plus the ski mask hoax, etc....nothing about the initial account makes any sense. Regardless of that incident, I have personally several UM & MSU football players players hit people on multiple occasions. It happens at most schools, all the time, and everyone who actually went to a large university and was involved in some type of social scene would probably agree. I am NOT saying it is OK - it is far from OK. All I am saying is that MSU football is now being viewed as a bunch of terrorists (naturally, as a result of the initial headlines), but if you dig a tad bit deeper it is quite obvious that this whole thing was blown way our of proportion. Also, even the players who did hit people aren't being charged with felonies...it's a misdemeanor offense. Also, I'm not an attorney but I think drunk driving may be a more serious offense.....not sure, though.
I don't really expect any of you guys to concede to the points i'm making, but i did make some valid points...just my shameless attempt
It is noble I suppose for you to come here into the Wolverine's den and try to support your team and defend its honor. The sad fact is that you have a douche of a coach that looks the other way when his team commits serious crimes that speak loud and clear to their character. Historically speaking, Spartans had honor but Michigan State has soiled their good name since taking the "Spartans" as their mascot.
Basically all you just did was name-call and try and talk down while providing zero substance behind anything you said...the equivalent of a prosecutor repeating how guilty the defendant is without providing any evidence. You're better than that....
If it wasn't that big of deal, why did they all lie to Dantonio about it? I mean, they were just there intimidating fellow MSU students, that's not a crime, right? Also, if they weren't doing anything wrong, why did they even go? I will tell you why, because they were going to throw a punch if they needed to. Unless you think, after Winston told them what was going to happen, they went thinking they would go to watch Winston get his ass kicked while they stood around and watched. This has major logic fail sparty. Also, MSU players are being viewed negatively because they intimidated other students gang-style, not because 15 large football players going to beat someone's ass was "blown out of proportion."
I agree with part of what you're saying, but please explain: if the 15 players went to go throw a punch "if they needed to" (which I somewhat agree with), then why didn't they? What we do know is that a fight broke out and that Winston and Jenrette (dismissed players) were involved, but why didn't the other 13 players start wrecking house like you're suggesting they planned to?
I disagree with your last statement - the perception is that 15 players went in with ski masks and started beating people up (as initial report suggest), and that's why this is viewed so negatively. Clearly this isn't the case. A one-on-one fight with the "fighters" friends surrounding is not an uncommon occurrence on college campuses. Again, NOT saying it's OK....
I don't have an explanation why they lied but keep in mind these are 18-21yr old kids. They knew they did something wrong so didn't tell coach, but it doesn't mean they are COMPLETE thugs.
I'm curious how you know that 13 of the players didn't do anything.
But even assuming, inter alia, that the scenario you described is true (that they just stood by while Winston went all Incredible Hulk on the place), these guys are still guilty of the conspiracy counts. Hell, they meet the textbook definition of conspiracy.
I don't know for fact they didn't do anything. What I'm saying is that it doesn't make sense that one person gets injured....like if a bumper is scratched it was probably a fender bender, not a high speed collision, right? And Winston didn't go "incredible hulk", he got into a fist fight.
I really think people who are reading my posts on this blog haven't read anything about the situation, which is not surprising. If I read the initial headline I would be coming after me too. Fact is, the incident was caught on a surveillance camera and there has been a thorough investigation - it is concluded that this wasn't some huge gang ambush. Nothing about the initial claims makes any sense, and the only rebuttals i am getting are reiterating the fact that it was a "gang" mentality, etc. which i am not contesting. A lot of the players on most teams usually roll together....the mistake that these players made is tagging along with winston as he sought out someone who (apparently) did something to him the night before. He will end up doing nothing with his life and i hope he never wears green and white ever again.
I agree, they are likely going to be found guilty to conspiracy charges.
The report said numerous people were treated at the hospital
i believe it was numerous "victims" but one treated at hospital and released (Brent Mitchell). Apparently went to high school with Winston and had longstanding issues.
You keep mentioning that only one person went to the hospital, and using that as evidence that the other players possibly did nothing. Do you know how serious a beating you can take before you need treatment at a hospital? When I was younger I was in more than one fist-fight (typically on the losing end, of course), including one in which I took about a dozen punches to the face. Not only did I not need hospital treatment, I went on to my next class afterward. The likely reason there were "numerous 'victims' but one treated at a hospital..." as you mentioned, is because only one of them was injured seriously enough to warrant being taken to the hospital. This in no way supports the idea of the other players just being bystanders.
I think you are the exception. I haven't been in many fights myself but have witnessed a bunch, if it's a serious fight then most of the time someone needs medical attention. If there are 15 football players fighting (as accused)? I don't think you have much of an argument here.
I don't even know why I am responding to you because it is obvious you are one of those who thinks Dantonio could have attended the beatdown himself and you would say "that video tape is inconclusive, it might be some other 50 year old white guy that attended," but I will anyway because I don't think you really realize what gang violence is. It is intimidation. Very often, if one member of a gang has a beef with someone, they will bring their friends to intimidate and scare anyone who thinks they might want to intervene. They stand around and watch while the one member of the gang beats someone's ass. Also, this isn't just some joe schmo 18-21 year old kid punching someone in a bar. These kids are in the weight room year round and are in top physical condition to play an very violent sport. That would be like me saying that toughman contestants should be able to beat boxers because they both have gloves on and fight in a ring. There is a very large difference.
I'm not sure you've read a single one of my posts, and I'm not sure you know anything about the situation. They were obviously there. They came clean to Coach D and a number have already been arraigned (turned themselves in) on assault charges. They are being punished for the "intimidation" by way of the suspensions, and players who committed battery were dismissed from the team. What I am saying is that it obviously wasn't 15 football players storming in, out for blood, because the aftermath of the incident makes that completely obvious.....because kids in a weight room all year round and play a violent sport would very likely injure somebody, right?
Oh, well if they turned themselves in to the police on assault charges it can't be that bad, right? Keep making excuses. I seem to remember the police reports of the first Winston beatdown mentioning 3 carloads of football players also.....it couldn't have been the same guys, could it have? No, we all know that the players respect Dantonio so much that they wouldn't attend 2 of them. They would only attend 1 gang beatdown. Also, are you suggesting you would be equally intimidated if 15 petite women stormed in rather than 15 football players?
"Also, are you suggesting you would be equally intimidated if 15 petite women stormed in rather than 15 football players?"
What are you talking about? Who is suggesting that?
They turned themselves in to be arraigned. I think you are misunderstanding what that means.
I think you are misunderstanding why 14 kids are either kicked off the team or suspended. It isn't because the big bad press monster made them out to be thugs, it is because 14 kids all went to the same place to kick someone's ass and were all charged with a crime. If you would like to keep trolling, I might suggest the freep or mlive.
"if the 15 players went to go throw a punch 'if they needed to' (which I somewhat agree with), then why didn't they?"
Perhaps it's because the women Winston and Jenrette decided to slap around weren't fighting back.
just a law student. And you're wrong about drunk driving being more serious than assault. The law treats a first OWI and a simple assault roughly same; 3 months in jail, 500 bucks.
Of course, there are also the conspiracy charges, which kinda tip the scales, as does the fact that based on Winston's prior convictions, they could probably bump this to a felony if they wanted to.
Besides, an assault doesn't require that someone is INJURED; in fact, an assault is basically a failed battery. If they tried to beat people up, even if they failed, that's assault.
Agreed and thanks for the follow-up, but not sure this negates anything I said.
- Given priors, Winston can (and should) be charged with a felony. He was also dismissed immediately. This applies to Jenrette, also. Either way there are no felons playing for Dantonio nor is there anyone being charge with a felony.
- I spoke to an attorney about this briefly (casually, at xmas party) and from that my understanding is that assault only requires instilling "fear" of bodily harm? If this is the case, the fact they went in there as a group is enough to be charged, but doesn't necessarily mean they were throwing punches. If assault is, in fact, "failed battery", then you're suggesting that they attempted but failed to commit battery?
- I could be wrong about this, but my understanding is that Ezeh and Stonum were able to get their charges reduced to OWI, just as it is highly unlikely (from what i hear) any of the players (sans Winston/Jenrette) will serve jail time.....this is why they'll pay you the big bucks one day. Either way, it doesn't matter to me. I believe in second chances for a 19yr old who makes a mistake. If the other 13 players beat someone up, might be different. Just as if Stonum/Ezeh hit a pedestrian like Stallworth things might be different.
"Either way there are no felons playing for Dantonio nor is there anyone being charge with a felony."
Be careful with such statements. See the jinxing post above.
which jinxing post?
Why only second chances? Dantonio gave a 3rd chance to Jenrette. Why don't we approve of 5th or 6th or 7th chances?
Grady drove drunk then violated his probation and he is still on your roster. I agree this is bad policy but please don't try and be all high and mighty.
And I think Grady should have been kicked off the team. What is your point?
and i think that jenrette should never have been allowed back. My point? You tried to rip Dantonio for a 3rd chance but you guys are guilty of the same thing....
Two more things: 1) Drunk driving is also a "judgment error"....are we really debating this right now? 2) There is no felonious assault....that implies that felony charges are being filed, which they are not.
with regards to Obi, a telephone pole is much like a play action pass--hard for him to see coming.
I wanna neg summo.
But I hear he was on some pre-season "watch lists."
MSU must not look at SAT scores and GPA , apparently you just have to have a list of priors in B&E assault, or terrorism . Please daddy give me a second chance, I promise to rush for over a hundred yards and commit two felonies by halftime.
Judging from your -26 points, one can conclude that I (a die hard MSU fan) have added more value to this blog than you have. Judging from your last comment (rather ignorant), I can see why. The good thing is that most people on this blog are actually very reasonable....
His avatar alone adds more value than you do.
you're two for two in making mindless comments....you even know what that means or do you just like james cameron?
Bannhammer will be coming very soon for you. You have yet to say anything of value other than to make excuses for gang violence. Also, I have seen some people with a much higher negative point total add more value to the board than you. Again, your logic is quite flawed.
c'mon man - i can only control what i write, not what you decide to read. I never made excuses for anything, you obviously haven't read anything i wrote. Whether or not you've seen people with higher negative totals add more value, it doesn't make my logic flawed. The point total is a proxy for value you add - you get points for constructive comments and negative points for dubious comments.
I have read everything you have written and every post is an excuse, you just decide to add one line to make it look like you don't condone assault. Adding "...but that doesn't make it OK" at the end of a very long post about why Oceans 14 aren't 'that' bad and gang violence happens at every college doesn't make you seem righteous, it makes you look like an asshat.
What part of anything i wrote makes it look like i condone assault? i simply explain why the situation wasn't what it is being made out to be, based on the results (so far) of the investigation. I can just as easily accuse people here of condoning drunk driving based on their comments, but i won't because that would be absurd.
I'm new here.
But then what does -47 points mean? That if you were in the 3rd year of a 4-year trek to Nepal, that you would have contributed 47 more points worth of value to this blog?
My mom can beat up your mom
He don't need no Virgins
Let the Ѡ ₪ Ѡ BURN
Typical Sparty in that at the critical moment he'll fumble away the opportunity and get creamed by the nearest defender.
or he could stroll into the endzone for a 26-20 OT victory...:)
This is why I love MGoBlog.
where do I get one? It would take scoping out the chicks to a whole new level.
Hopefully RayBan will be coming out with their own "portable version" soon.
internet guy seeks way to see women without their clothes on.
either he is lying about being "internet guy" or he has reached the end of the internet and seen all there is to see.
This board, like the MSU season, had so much potential. The jokes started out strong with a win over a Division II board but it went south very quickly. This board has just lost to CMU and is on its way to being .500. Let's get back to what has made this board popular in the past - pounding the jokes and winning the time of sarcasm battle.
started out strong but went south very quickly? you're lobbing this right over the plate....
Liar liar pants on fire.
Says a lot about Dantonio and the state of sparty football that he's now going to bat for boys that wear women's panties.
Green: you have taken excuse-making to heretofore unattainable levels. If everyone in EL thinks like you do, Misdemeanor State might as well open a satellite campus in Jackson so that they can recruit the prison better and visit their players while they are in "limbo."
To make things even easier, maybe they should just play their games in the prison yard and use orange jumpsuits instead of green and white.
but if you dig a tad bit deeper it is quite obvious that this whole thing was blown way our of proportion.
You mean how the Boren transfer was blown way out of proportion? Of Rodriguez shredding documents before leaving WVU was blown way out of proportion? Or "family values"? Or practice times? Or Grady's DUI? Or RR recruiting Feagin signaling a decline in standards? You'll have to excuse some of us for not cutting MSU and Dantonio any slack for this latest incident when M-haters constantly troll the message boards with the same old tired memes that when you, "dig a tad bit deeper", have little rooted in truth.
Yes, the exact same way (though i don't remember Grady DUI getting blown out of proportion). You may note that I make comments throughout my posts along the lines of (naturally, understandably, etc.) and highlight the fact that I am making a shameless (and maybe pointless) attempt at convincing you that this wasn't a "gang ambush", but I work in the markets and it is notoriously slow this time of year, so upon reading this headline I felt provoked to educate other on what we DO know about the situation, so as to prove it wasn't some massacre like it's being made out to be. It actually wasn't the headline - Dantonio let Winston and Jenrette back on the team so he/we deserve that heat, but some of the accusations are ridiculous, i.e. the ski mask jokes when it was proven there were no ski masks, etc.
15 football players showed up with bad intentions and girls got punched in the face.
Is there really anything else that needs to be added?
dude, this is my whole point: while the initial report leads you to believe this is the case, it is simply not true per the results of the investigation. There were no ski masks and no girls got punched in the face, though you love to believe this is the case, it isn't.
I am only letting you know what actually surfaced after more info was gathered about the incident. You can look it up yourself.
Yeah! There were no ski masks! There was only headgear that covers the head and neck but leaves the face open which is probably quite easy to mistake for a ski mask when 15 large men forcibly enter a potluck to beat you up! Get it right!
ONE guy had a wool hat with face visible....clearly you are being egregious here
So what would you call a wool hat that goes around the head, covers the neck, and leaves the face open? I am sure that as the 15 men came in to beat his ass, the frat guy thought to himself "what is that hat that looks like a ski mask but has an open face called? I need to figure it out so when I am talking to the cops, I don't get it wrong."
I dunno, call it what the DA called it...a wool hat with the face clearly visible.
Well that's a relief. I think we can all agree that it's not really the fact that they committed premeditated assault against innocent victims that we should be worried about, but their choice of clothing at the time. We wouldn't want them to be fashion victims!
took place at a potluck! Jesus Christ, is anything sacred anymore? Beating someone's ass at a potluck is contrary to all that we believe in as a society. If one casserole or jello dish was compromised, these men should be deported to Russia.
I don't really know why, but I agree very strongly with this.
this guy is probably the emo for the spartan websites. sarcastic, replies to all posts, hmmm... suspicious...
don't really post on MSU sites, only on here and replying to all posts on an exceptionally slow work day (given the holidays.....)
Drive through not busy today?
didn't see that one coming!
Sorry, you kind of set yourself up!
This thread is hella funny.
Nice work, guys.