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Also...

Others that come to mind:

The 2002 "Bluegrass Miracle" - Kentucy up by 3 on Nick Saban-coached LSU with 2 seconds left when LSU completes a hail mary from THEIR OWN 25 YARD LINE. The UK students, on the other end of the stadium and assuming they won, storm the field as LSU celebrates:

https://youtu.be/VNiChtd8bBQ

2013 Georgia-Auburn - 36 seonds left, Georgia up by 1 and Auburn facing a 4th and 18 from their own 26, and then this happens:

https://youtu.be/XkpDz8YyVD8

Also, the 1997 Nebraska-Missouri kicked ball in the endzone game, which was total dumb luck (and illegal). 

I think the coin flip only

I think the coin flip only comes into play in the event the two top teams are TIED in the playoff rankings. I'm not sure this is even possible right now - I believe the selection committe is required to rank the top 25 teams in order, but the voting procedure is complicated so who knows. 

"Some schools allow their

"Some schools allow their verbal commits to visit elsewhere."

Oh, OK. I wasn't aware of this. I cant imagine any other school treats this any differently, though. With or without a "rule", if a commit is visiting another school, it seems like a given that the school he committed to will start looking at other options, too. Looks like business as usual to me.

I mean, I'm sure OSU is looking at other RBs now that Dunn visited Michigan, right?

Of course.

Maybe I'm just not understanding what the issue is here. I don't think there's a coach in the country who WANTS his commits to visit other schools. That's obvious. But the original poster mentioned that Hoke has a specific "rule" against it. Is this different from any other school? I was under the impression that this "rule" implied that if you visit, you're out. If not, what's the point of the rule?

I don't understand...

How can the coaching staff stop commits from taking visits to other schools? They have a rule that they will immeadiately rescind the commitment if a visit is taken? I find that very hard to believe. If a 4- or 5- star commits makes a visit, I doubt they'll do anything. 

IMO, until they sign, commits have every right to visit wherever and whenever they want. This is huge decision and they should make sure it's the right one. I would say it's wrong for Hoke to deny them that right. The deck is stacked against them enough as is. The recruiting period seems to be the only time college players have any kind of power in their college careers. 

Thoughts...

The BCS's problems can be fixed in 3 steps, IMO:

1) Pull a "Lean On Me".

There are 120 teams in the FBS and around half of them have no shot at winning a National Championship. Ever. They don't bring in enough revenue, compete for recruits, or have the tradition of the "top tier" teams. We all know it's true. So since none of them will graduate anyway, they are all expurgated. They are dismissed. They are out of here, forever. I wish them well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_SbkHgx6YIo

The FBS moves to five 14-team conferences. This is an easily obtainable goal. The SEC and ACC are there. The Pac 12 adds Boise and BYU. Big 10 adds Notre Dame and Rutgers. The Big 12 can add 4 of the remaining teams (Houston, SMU, Louisville, any of the Florida schools). Every other program moves to the FCS.

2) Mandate interconference games. Every team gets one FCS "warmup". The other 2 OOC games must be against FBS teams from a different conference. One home, one away.

3) 6 or 8 team playoff as Brian outlined. This will be made a lot easier because there will be a lot more data about realtive conference strength and individual team strength. Hell, I wouldn't even bother with the conference championships any more. They are unnecessary. 

I realize it's based on

I realize it's based on logic, but it's all gonna come down to the voters and it's gonna be close. ESPN was saying that something like 44 voters will have to change their 2nd place votes from Bama to Ok St. How can this guy claim to know that 44 voters will change their mind?

I don't see how anyone can

I don't see how anyone can possibly predict the BCS. 2/3 of the formula relies on human polls which are not out yet. How can he possibly claim to know how a few dozen pollsters will vote? This is the CFB equivalent of a horoscope. 

Up - we were 19 last week.

Up - we were 19 last week. Our SOS went down from 38 to 42, though. Sagarin loves the Big 12 this year. Look at Texas A&M.

From Chengelis on Twitter:

"Brad Edwards ESPN BCS analyst: "Right now my feeling is not good about Michigan getting into the top 14" (ESPN radio)"

Not looking good at all. Baylor and TCU will jump us. I believe we now need both Houston and the OK-OK St. loser to fall below us to get a bid. That's a longshot.

Oh, I'm not saying we would

Oh, I'm not saying we would have lost, but the point is breaks go both ways. If you're a great team you don't need them.

We played in 4 close games this year. We won the two at home and lost the two on the road. Sounds about right.

Not to mention the OSU game

Not to mention the OSU game where Miller missed a wide open receiver for the lead with 90 seconds left...

I agree with your reasoning but...

don't follow your conclusion. How are conditions going to change? The south will always have warmer weather and, therefore, better conditioned atheletes. SEC schools will always pay for top coaches because most of those schools have rabid fanbases and bring in a ton of revenue. College football is the ONLY sport in many of these states.  

I suppose the SEC, or even NCAA, might crack down on oversigning one day, but the effect of having 4-5 extra recruits a year is minimal, IMO. Oversiging sucks, but I believe it is used as a crutch by haters. The top SEC schools gets 4- and 5-star athletes by the boatload - if oversigning stops, they'll just be more selective about who they offer.

You could make a strong case that the only thing that ever held the SEC back was institutional racism that existed into the 60s & 70s. Once recruiting opened up, it was only a matter of time before they started to dominate. I think the only way other conferences can compete on a regular basis is to outscheme them. Teams like Iowa and Minnesota can never expect to bring in the talent that Bama, Florida, Arkansas, Mississippi et al get on a regular basis.

All IMO, of course.  

From what I have read, this

From what I have read, this is wrong. Here's how CBS's guru explains it:

"If a Bowl loses a host team to the title game, then the bowl gets first choice at a replacement team. The rest of the selection order for 2012 is as follows: Fiesta, Sugar, Orange."

LINK: http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/bowls/predictions

Assuming LSU wins and it's an LSU-Bama championship, the only bowl "losing a host team" is the Sugar Bowl, so they get first pick of the at large team. They would in all likelyhood pick Michigan. The order then reverts to the above, so the Fiesta gets the next pick (presumed to be Stanford), followed by the Sugar again (Houston) and the Orange (the Big East winner, who nobody wants).

I agree with you, though - I have a feeling Georgia's gonna win on Saturday. It's been that kind of year. 

Right, but the Fiesta gets

Right, but the Fiesta gets the second at-large pick after the Sugar Bowl. So assuming the Sugar picks Michigan first, the Fiesta will have a choice of Stanford or Houston next. Everyone's assuming they take Stanford because they're in a bigger conference and would probably draw a bigger TV audience, but I don't think that's a slam dunk. Houston is a big school in a big market and the team is undefeated.

I guess we'll find out in a week.

 


Someone somewhere

 

Someone somewhere (ESPN, maybe?) mentioned that it's possible the Fiesta Bowl people take Houston over Stanford to set up a OK St-Houston shootout-to-end-all-shootouts. That would leave Michigan v. Stanford in the Sugar Bowl. This makes too much sense, though, so it probably won't happen. Not impossible, though - Houston has more that twice as many students as Stanford and isn't terribly far from Arizona.

I'm not really on board with

I'm not really on board with this reasoning. In 2007, with Mattison as DC, Florida was ranked 41st in total defense. After Mattison left and Strong took over, they finished 9th in 2008 and 4th in 2009. Then Meyer left and they were 9th in 2010. They're 10th this year.

The point is, those Florida defenses were/are great because they were/are unbelieveably talented. If he recruits and gets any halfway decent DC (which he will), they'll be very good. Same with special teams, which was always a strength for Florida (Meyer uses his best players on special teams). 

He'll recruit in Florida

The guy is practically a household name with a career 104-23 record and a history of sending players to the NFL. Recruiting will not be a problem (not that it ever is for OSU).

This is a best case scenario for OSU, IMO. They hired one of the best football coaches in the country and, unlike Tressell, Meyer has some balls and is capable of beating an SEC team and winning bowl games. You can make a strong case that the scandal was a net win for their program, actually. 

True...

But I feel like for every Hawaii, there's a Boise/Utah/West Virginia. Plus, you kind of made my point for me. What does everyone remember about the 2008 Sugar Bowl? Hawaii being exposed. That wasn't some great accomplishment for Georgia or anything. They just got stuck playing a team from the WAC.

I guess my point is, I don't really understand why people are falling over themselves to find a way for Michigan to sneak into a BCS game, all for the right to play...Houston. I suppose it's cool to say you played in the Sugar Bowl, but us being left out would produce a much better game, IMO. I'd rather play an SEC team then a C-USA team, and I'd rather not be Houston's "we've arrived" moment.

I'll get negged for this, but what the hell...

What are our signature wins? Nebraska and...Notre Dame? We played exactly 2 ranked teams all year - Michigan State and Nebraska. One of those was a loss, and the other got whooped at home by Northwestern. Our Sagarin Strength of Schedule ranking is 38th. K-State's is 9, Oklahoma's is 10.  

Let's be fair - the Big Ten is having an off year and we had a very easy schedule. We skipped 2 of the best teams in the conference (Penn State and Wisconsin), and caught Ohio State in the midst of a meltdown. 

Plus, do we REALLY want to face down Houston in the Sugar Bowl? They have one of the best offenses in the history of college football, and Case Keenum will not miss the wide open dudes like Braxton Miller did yesterday. Not to mention the fact that Houston is a lowly C-USA team and we're big bad Michigan, who only got in because we have a big fanbase. It's a no win situation for us.

I would presonally rather Michigan play Arkansas or Georgia in a New Year's Day bowl. It's a better match up for us and a more interesting game, IMO. Let some other bunch of poor SOBs deal with the all-time NCAA passing leader.

That, and there's also the

That, and there's also the problem of comparing 4 completely different teams. 

Anyway, my point was only to throw some water on the "our offense only moved the ball in garbage time last year" and "we couldn't do anything against Big Ten defenses" memes. Our offense was very good last year, in just about every situation except for "holding onto the ball" and "The Gator Bowl". And that was with a first year starter at QB.

Doesn't really matter much now, though.

When do they count? Only when

When do they count? Only when you want them to? 

Last year's Iowa game (the team that was ranked in the Top 15):

08:18 *TOUCHDOWN     13-75   4:41#
05:30  Punt           3-1    1:50
14:47  Interception   5-17   1:42
08:33  Missed FG     13-59   4:49#
00:33  Punt          10-48   3:58
13:15  Punt           3-4    1:45
06:54  Fumble        12-71   4:24#
04:22  Interception   3-5    0:50
13:10 *TOUCHDOWN     12-85   3:40#
10:28 *TOUCHDOWN      4-75   1:09
06:55 *TOUCHDOWN      6-69   1:13#
01:54  Interception   3--9   0:59

This year's Iowa game (the team that just lost to Minnesota):

13:30  Punt           3-5    1:30
09:23  Punt           3-5    1:06
02:14 *TOUCHDOWN     12-61   5:33
12:13  Punt           5-21   2:47
04:07  Fumble         6-0    2:51
01:02  Interception   5-40   1:09
06:19 *FIELD GOAL    10-45   5:17
01:09  Punt           6-3    3:36
07:53 *TOUCHDOWN      8-57   2:49
03:59  Punt           4-21   1:13
00:00  Downs         14-79   2:15

 

 

 

You're talking about the Iowa

You're talking about the Iowa game in which the offense gained 522 yards and scored 4 TDs, right?

Who told you we "got

Who told you we "got dominated by every decent defense we played the second half of each of the last three seasons"?

Last year, we put up 377 yards against MSU, 522 against Iowa, 423 against Penn St. 442 against Wisconsin, and 351 against OSU. Those were either seaon highs, or very close to them, for all of those teams. We had the best offense in the Big Ten last year, and one of the best in Big Ten history. We lost because of defense and turnovers.  

True, and Denard did throw

True, and Denard did throw more than that a few times under RichRod (definitely in the ND game). Plus, 4 of the passes were on the last series. It's more the overall all playcalling and balance that I have a problem with.

Denard ran the ball 12 times and I think they were all planned runs. Some (maybe half?) were options. I don't think any were scrambles or QB draws. Borges seems to have taken away all of the plays that made us so dangerous/hard to defend in 2009 & 2010 and replaced them with pocket passing and the occasional end-around, which doesn't ever seem to work.

I think all hope of avoiding another awkward transition is now lost. Hoke & Borges can't run a spread, and it's gonna be 2-3 seasons before they get their guys in and are able to do whatever it is they plan to do on offense. They do have the benefit of a veteran team, a weak Big Ten, and OSU doom, though, so we should be able to keep our heads above water and go to some bowl games. It's just a shame about Denard - he's clearly a square peg in this system. Hoke has effectively turned him into Steven Threet. If he wasn't such a standup guy I would be worried about a transfer.

37 pass attempts? No less

37 pass attempts? No less than 6 downfield bombs that were woefully off the mark? On the road against a bad run defense that can't handle mobile QBs? What the fuck is this? 

If you want to run POWER every once in a while, fine. But don't make Denard do something that he is clearly not capable of doing. I know we're Michigan, but our QBs do not magically turn into Tom Brady or Chad Henne or Jim Harbaugh when they put a helmet on. 

Hoke was handed the keys to a Ferrari and clearly has no fucking clue how to drive stick. I know the plan is to eventually transition into the BoMoellerCarr ProStyleManBallRock offense, but maybe he can do us all a favor and let the fastest QB in the NCAA run some option out of the shotgun so we can actually win some games? Pretty please, with sugar on top?

Stefon!

Well, it's little different

Well, it's little different when you get to plug one freshman into an experienced secondary as a spot start, as opposed to having and entire secondary of Freshman, Sophomores and walk ons. 

The safety play is so much better this year than last year it's not even funny. A lot of credit for that should go to Mattison, but all of those reps for Kovacs and Gordon last year definitely helped. 

[sorry - should be a reply to Mparadox]

This is funny to me for two

This is funny to me for two reasons:

1) The idea that we're a "protected team" would make a lot more sense if the Big Ten didn't suspend one of our players for throwing a punch TWO YEARS AGO.

2) It turns out MSU had been whining about Lewan for the entire game. Guess they're not so tough.

IMO, this is really easy - you can't throw a punch on a football field, especially after the whistle blows. The idea that this was "part of the play" and that Ghoulston "didn't intend to injure Lewan because he had a facemask on" is ridiculous on its face. As is the idea that this is some grand conpiracy by the Big Ten to return Michigan to relevancy (Ghoulston's suspension did nothing for us).

Dude lost control during a heated game and got punished. Happens all the time. Fucking deal with it, MSU. 

At this point, from what I

At this point, from what I understand, thier NBC football money is significantly less than our BTN football money, so that's not an issue. Notre Dame is looking to move to a weaker conference where they can be competitive and not stuck in the middle of the standings.

If they remain independant, the Big Ten should boycott. Carr talked about this back in the 90s. Notre Dme should not be allowed to put together their own "fantasy conference" of Mich, MSU, Purdue, Standford, USC, Army, Navy and Pitt. Enough of their bullshit exceptionalism. Their team has sucked for 20 years now - time to choose a side.

I'm a layman, but I think

I'm a layman, but I think Borges could have done a better job scheming for the pressure and punishing MSU for their agressiveness. It would have been nice to see some more screens, mis-directions, throwbacks, etc. Despite the FOOTBAW talk, we're still a finese team and I feel like, to a certain extent, Hoke is trying to jam a square peg into a round hole (a frequent critism of RichRod in his first few years). The two QB sets were interesting, but didn't really amount to much (aside from the Denard jet sweep, which worked nicely).

It also seems like the read option is completely gone, right? I'm a little confused as to why we can't keep that in the playbook as a failsafe when nothing else is working. At the very least, it's a different look, and our guys can probably run it in their sleep.

I'm encouraged with Gardner's performance, though. He had his problems, but he made a couple of nice throws. I'm confident he'll be ready to take control of the offense in 2013. That redshirt is now crucial.   

Well this just says it all...

"People are talking crap about Rodriguez not respecting Michigan's tradition at the alumni flag football game he started."

Brilliant.

I always balked when people compared Michigan fans to Yankee fans, but after all this ridiculous blathering about "tradition", can there even be a debate anymore? It is so obnoxious that it almost seems like self parody. Not even Alabama fans are this over the top.

I'm a proud alumni and I can honestly say that I don't give a shit how involved the former players are with the program. It's nice to see them trotted out every 5-10 years, and the Gerald Ford pre-Ohio State 1997 speech was sweet, but the coaches run the team. This is not a democracy, it's a fucking brutal football dictatorship. Or at least it was...

 

A few weeks ago, Katie Baker

A few weeks ago, Katie Baker wrote a very personal piece for Deadspin detailing her high school years, which were mostly spent on hockey usenet newsgroups (seriously). It was very well done and everyone loved it.

I guess A.J. has now decided that everyone on the staff needs to write some kind of personal vignette, in an attempt to convince the world that they are not just a bunch of cynical assholes.

This just seemed forced and out of context to me. And, though I know is was a joke, there was no need to bash our school at the end. 

Well the Islanders thought

Well the Islanders thought the Talbot hit was dirty, and that's really all that matters.

 

I think this game was a long time coming for the Islanders, who have generally been disrespected and looked down upon by the rest of the league for years now. The last Pens game was the final straw in a long line of indignities. Seeing their franchise goalie have his face broken in the final moments of a game and the Pens bench laugh and whop it up is what caused last night's mele. The message sent last night is "We might not be a playoff team but if you disrespect us we will fuck you up." I think it worked.

He also pretty much invented

He also pretty much invented Sports Talk Radio, along with the Maddog. That being said, he knows nothing about college football. His opinion on the subject is worthless. I can guaranty he said the exact same thing about Charlie Weis. He loved the guy. I guess fat white guys stick together.

And "he doesn't say shit just to stir things up" does not apply to anything regarding the Mets. 

WINNER
Can't have one without the other...
...

It's never the wrong thread for the Alaska hockey intro.

Does anyone know if Mattison

Does anyone know if Mattison was involved in recruiting Charles Woodson, or was that before his time?

Also, was he fired after 1996 or did he leave?

Love this hire - this guy was coaching Ray Lewis a week ago and that has to mean something to recruits.  My only reservation is that he has coached very talented defenses for pretty much his entire DC career, so I'm not sure how he'll do in a more, um, "challenging" situation.  That is splitting hairs, though - he looks like he knows what he's doing.

Not to mention the fact the

Not to mention the fact the we currently have exactly TWO commits on the offensive side of the ball, one of whom is a lineman who is on the fence.  I know defense is an area of need, but teams always need WRs and QBs.  We currently have none.  Zero.  Why would we be turning anyone away?

I'd like to think that Hoke will be able to turn this around in two weeks, but how can this possibly end well?  We have 10 commits right now. 10.  And that's assuming nobody else jumps ship.

So...less than 3 weeks before

So...less than 3 weeks before signing day and we are down to 13 commits, none of whom play QB or WR. And that's assuming Goudis remains committed, which is up in the air.

Wow.

Eh.  I don't buy that. 

Eh.  I don't buy that.  RichRod's failings had nothing to do with enthusiam or scheme, in my opinion.  They had everything to do with personnel.  He simply couldn't get his guys installed in time to win enough games.  Three first year starting QBs in a row led to three years of ridiculous turnover ratios, and attrition and injuries on D killed any hope that we could be compotent on that side of the ball.  That, coupled with the disasterous GERG hiring, sunk his ship.

I really believe it would have turned around next season.  Which is why this is so frustrating.  Because Michigan will never try that again.  The Bo bloodline has been restored and I don't think it will ever be broken again.

And many us us were/are on

And many us us were/are on board with that.  We saw the "Michigan way" lose to Appilachian State with half of an NFL team.  We saw Oregon literally run circles around us, and afterwards feed quotes to the media like "we knew exactly what they were going to do before they did it".  After 35 years, we were tired of calling rock, and wanted a real strategist at the helm.

The "Michigan way" did pretty well in the 70s, 80s and 90s.  It had a great run, but I believe those days are over.  Football is a game of innovation.  It is dynamic and rewards those with the courage to take chances.  That is why you see teams like Oregon, Auburn and Florida in the national championship game.  Very few programs can get away with calling rock and winning it all these days.  I really don't think it will work anymore. 

This is why so many of us were behind RichRod and are dissppointed now. 

I'll always support the team, but I think our school retreated when they fired RichRod.  They admitted defeat.  It is a sign of weakness, in my eyes, and it is deeply disappointing.  

That was encouraging.  I'm

That was encouraging.  I'm glad he's likable and the alumni are behind him, because he's gonna need the help.  This is a very high risk hire. 

I keep hearing that Hoke is a "defensive minded" coach, but looking at his teams reveals that prior to this year, none had a better than average D-I defense.  Here are the Total Defense rankings of his 8 teams:

2003 - Ball State - 71st

2004 - Ball State - 112th

2005 - Ball State - 111th

2006 - Ball State - 115th

2007 - Ball State - 96th

2008 - Ball State - 69th

2009 - SDSU - 74th

2010 - SDSU - 44th

I know these were not top tier programs, but that is eyebrow raising.  Looks to me like the guy has succeeded more with offense than anything (Ball State's Total Offense was 17th in 2008;  SDSU's finished 16th this season).

I'm also not buying into the "he turned around Ball State" meme.  Ball State's SOS in 2008 was 125th.  They had the easiest schedule in I-A.  With the exception of Navy, Central and Western Michigan,  every team they beat had a losing record and a Sagarin rating of 96th or lower (many of them MUCH lower).  Then they got killed by Buffalo and Tulsa.  They didn't play a single ranked team all season and the only AQ opponent was 3-9 Indiana.  They had a nice season, but let's not go crazy; In 2008 Ball State was a "pretty good" MAC team, nothing more.    

I really don't mean to blow up your optimistic thread.  I like rooting for the underdog, and I'll be in Hoke's corner.  But this really is the shakiest hire I can remember at a top tier program.     

 

Here's a quick story about a

Here's a quick story about a college basketball coach.  In the early 80s, he took over a once great program - a founding member of the ACC with 4 final four appearances and 10 conference championships under its belt - that had fallen on hard times.  This is what the team did in his first three seaons as coach:

1980-81: 17-13 overall, 6-8 in conference (T-5th)

1981-82: 10-17 overall, 4-10 in conference (T-6th)

1982-83: 11-17 overall, 3-11 in conference (7th)

In those three years, his team went 1-6 against their hated rival, often losing by 10-20 points.  By the end of season three, the alumni were FLIPPING OUT and many wanted him gone asap. Instead cooler heads prevailed and he kept his job.

It was a good decision - I am describing Mike Krzyzewski, one of the most successful coaches in the history of organized sports.  If he had been fired after 3 seasons, the story would have gone much differently - for both the coach and the school.

I will support who ever David Brandon brings in, but you will never convince me that he made a good decision firing Rich Rodriguez, after 3 seasons, with 18-20 starters set to return.  I believe it was enormous mistake influenced by a petulant, impatient and spoiled fanbase.



 

So who meets your criteria? 

So who meets your criteria?  You're basically saying you want a coach who has never made a mistake or done anything wrong in his life. 

The opposite.  It's a dodge

The opposite.  It's a dodge and pretty much means he's leaving, or at least seriously considering it (IMO).

The guy is one 7-8 win season from being run out of the state of Louisiana.  I can't see him staying there.  He went 11-2 this year and took a ridiculous amount of shit. 

+1.

College football coaches are all sketchy, to some degree.  Les Miles didn't rob a bank - he did something just about every other coach in the SEC does.  He won't be oversigning here.

I think the NCAA is gonna tackle the issue, anyway. 

Well that's constructive.

Anything in particular that you disagree with, or are you just being an ass?

I can deal with Les.  It's

I can deal with Les.  It's not a perfect fit, but it can definitely work.  For all of his faults, the guy just wins.  5-1 in bowl games with a national championship under his belt.  Harbaugh can't come close to that.  Les can recruit, sends kids to the NFL, and I think we'd have a good shot at retaining our current players and commits with him.  As crazy as it sounds, I think Les Miles would stabilize the program. 

If Les is the guy, I think it's important to bring in a strong OC who can run the spread.  I also think it is necessary that we start grooming either the OC or DC to be "coach-in-waiting".  Les is getting old and I doubt he would be here for very long.  We can't go through this bullshit again.