Bye week discussion-next years team
I know some people are instantly mad because they hate looking ahead, but it’s a bye week. If you do not want to discuss you can move on. Of course this year’s team has everything to play for still but it’s exciting to think most considered this a rebuilding year towards a better 2022 and beyond, and we are unbeaten and in the top 10. I think that if we can continue the culture change we have seen and combine that with some more and experienced talent, we could really have something moving forward. Anyway, a breakdown:
QB: I think most will predict JJ will overtake Cade by next year, but either way we should be in as good of shape as we have been in the Harbaugh era.
RBs: Corum will be back, Haskins could return if he wanted but that’s probably 50/50. But I would expect Corum and Edwards to be a dynamic duo even if Haskins moves on.
WRs: I would expect Bell would return and we will have everyone else back minus Baldwin. Could be a very exciting and experienced group.
TE/OL: All the TEs are elegible to return and the OL should be deep and experienced again. We will lose Vastardis for sure, Stueber and Hayes might move on but both could return.
DL: Obviously losing Hutch will be huge, but almost everyone else on the DL will be back. The hope is that Ojabo develops into a Hutch type monster and McGregor steps up big time.
LB: We lose Ross but will return Colson, NHG and several other young talented players.
Secondary: This might be the biggest question mark we will have moving into next season. Hawkins will be gone, and I think it’s likely Dax will be as well. Both Green and Gray are seniors, but both could return. Moten has solidified himself as a starter at safety and we have a 5 star corner coming in that hopefully can be an early impact as well.
Overall my hope is that this season is our 2015 heading into 2016 where we were an elite team. We just fell a little short. I think offensively things look very promising, and there’s a lot to like on defense as well, we will just need to replace a few stars, which is easier said than done, but I have faith McDonald can make it work.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:15 AM ^
I'm pretty sure Baldwin can come back as well.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:26 AM ^
Yes he can, and I think it's highly likely he will after just one year playing at this level. WR will be very deep next year with Sanristil possibly our 5th WR.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:31 PM ^
I think it'll take him a the full season to get used to playing at this level. He's bounced around so much, I could see him trying to get to the next level.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:46 PM ^
He will likely come back if he feels he will have a major role.
October 12th, 2021 at 2:32 PM ^
With the chemistry he already has with JJ, I certainly hope he comes back.
We've been holding the WR corp together with bandaids and steri strips, but this could be an amazing group next year.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:17 AM ^
Regarding WRs: I though Baldwin had a year of eligibility left after this one. Obviously he has the option of entering the draft, but I didn’t think that was guaranteed by any measure.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:26 AM ^
Hmm. I guess he could come back for a 6th year since last year “didn’t count”. But again it will be interesting how teams decide to manage scholarships since the rumor is that it’s back to 85 next year. A lot of guys aren’t going to get that free year.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:43 AM ^
He is a RS Junior.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:11 PM ^
I think if Baldwin wants back in, the coaches will take him. You can see he's starting to adjust to the game at this level, and he and CoJo on the outside with Bell in the slot could be lethal if Baldwin is really starting to come on late this season.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:43 PM ^
Getting Bell back next year is really going to feel like found money. The way he came out of the shoot in the opener, I was getting Desmond Howard vibes. If we are getting really good QB play by next season, Bell could have a really special season.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:18 AM ^
Next year we're going to have a team and they will play football
October 12th, 2021 at 11:25 AM ^
Flaming hot take right there
October 12th, 2021 at 1:19 PM ^
Just to cool the hawt taeks.
October 12th, 2021 at 2:35 PM ^
Yeah, I don't think it's "instantly mad" to say that we're in the middle of something good, maybe even something great and something special, so let's not interrupt the enjoyment of it too early. There's so much that can and will happen before anything in this post could come to fruition anyway.
It's a bye week in a 6–0 season with NW next. Maybe as a fan base, we just deserve to bask in current reality.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:27 AM ^
This take is so scorching hot I'm shocked the Sklar Brothers aren't involved.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:13 PM ^
I don't know, dude. I'm sure someone made that statement in 2019, and 2020 wasn't much of a team, didn't look like they were playing, and it didn't look much like football...
Also, not sure if I've ever commented on your profile pic, but I love me some NMH and really appreciate AJJ's fandom, if not their, um...singing abilities. Then again, I don't know how Jeff Mangum's lungs operate. There are lines where I need two breaths where he takes ZERO.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:31 AM ^
Still very early. With the transfer portal and the COVID year it's going to be that much harder to predict anything.
I am also interested if we'll have some stability on the coaching staff or if there will be any turnover there.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:50 AM ^
Part of the advantage of hiring young and mostly unproven guys is they will stay here for a little while longer to get experience before moving on to higher positions.
On the offensive coaching staff the only guy I could see leaving is Sherone Moore. The guy is an elite recruiter and I could see a school making him an offer we can't match. But I think that is unlikely at least for a couple years.
On the defensive side, MacDonald, Clinkscale, Nua and Bellamy are for sure staying given their youth and connection to the program in Bellamy's case. Maybe Hellow takes off? Idk. Even if he did, it wouldn't be a terrible loss if did.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:59 AM ^
Ehhh, unproven sure. But they're proving themselves. So as they do, being young makes them more likely to 1) want to climb the ladder and 2) be attractive with upside to a program making a change.
Like I could see a Sun Belt program making a run at MacDonald. He probably wouldn't do it because that's probably a paycut but the turnaround he's led is impressive enough to get interest.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:56 AM ^
Agreed. We have a lot of hungry, young coaches with NFL experience so the chances of staff turnover is relatively high - this is not a bad thing, you want staff members who are coveted across the industry. I think Harbaugh has his new formula of young coaches with either huge recruiting chops and/or NFL experience and would likely tap another similar coach, so I'm not too concerned should that happen. with exception of Shoop, Harbaugh has shown to have a good picker, and when it isn't working, he hasn't been afraid to make a change, even if it's a guy who he considers a friend (Drevno, Pep etc)
October 12th, 2021 at 12:10 PM ^
The portal has taken from Michigan more than it has delivered. My hope is that this off season that changes and there is a net inflow of experienced talent.
October 12th, 2021 at 12:18 PM ^
All things considered I think Michigan has been ok as a result of the portal - a program like Michigan (one of the better recruiting schools) is always gonna have an excess of players vs open spots. You look at the biggest winners in the portal it's smaller programs and programs fresh off a coaching change. I think as long as you can fill specific areas of needs, with the assumption that you'll lose a few younger depth guys that's all you can ask for.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:17 PM ^
I hope this will be true as well, but Michigan -- the institution -- seems to make it more difficult for non-grad transfers to come on board. Many schools make it easier, but we don't seem to.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:39 PM ^
It's always been a glaring problem getting credits to transfer, and it's likely to continue. With other teams feasting on the portal and Michigan seemingly limited to grad transfers, this is a net deficit for Michigan.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:54 PM ^
10000%
I am still salty AF about MSU. How the hell is Michigan wandering in desert for a passing game and MSU now has a more explosive passing game? Transfer portal. What Mel is doing there in 1 year only taking 10 here. F MSU and their sleazy ways and Fuggin transfer portal to cover up their recruiting. Which incidentally is now revived - they are literally right there with Michigan on this year's recruiting class. Hate it.
October 12th, 2021 at 2:02 PM ^
Sure, but which of the transfers that MSU got would you rather have over the guys we have? Maybe their CB transfers? Quavaris Couch obviously is a name that came up here in the past, but I don't think he's significantly better than our LB options. Kenneth Walker is the best RB in the country thus far, but I don't think him + the other MSU RBs is better than Haskins/Corum/Edwards, it's about equal. The only other starting transfer is their LT and I think our OL is better than theirs.
October 12th, 2021 at 2:29 PM ^
I agree but they didn't struggle to rebuild at all. Infact they just got K. Walker just like it was nothing. Scouting? luck? And this is MSU, they shouldn't be good, but are. Speaks of their coaching. M should want a down MSU to keep its hold on Michigan recruiting.
October 12th, 2021 at 2:27 PM ^
hardly their fault they are able to get ANYONE into school and Michigan deny's players every year.
fix the problem don't hate on people that use the system to their advantage.
October 12th, 2021 at 4:19 PM ^
Because high academic standards are a good thing. Michigan State has lower standards because it's a lesser school academically. See how that works?
October 12th, 2021 at 4:23 PM ^
Dude, they are only “right there” because of an extra 3 commits. Oh, and Ben VanSumeren’s traitorous ways. Under no circumstances are averages of .8820 and .8719 right next to each other in terms of quality.
In fact, the only recruit I would trade with them is maybe Denegal for Houser. No way I take Dillon instead of Will or Mangham instead of Morris. They have used the portal effectively. Full stop. Their recruiting is light years behind ours.
October 13th, 2021 at 12:18 PM ^
Man...you sound more like a Sparty fanboi than someone who is 'salty'.
UM lost its best receiver in the first 5 mins or so of the season. That would knock any teams passing game back significantly. That had nothing to do with the transfer portal. However D. Baldwin the teams #3/4 WR did come via the portal.
October 12th, 2021 at 2:21 PM ^
Remember that the transfer portal isn't like free money, right now it takes away from the 25 athletes that can sign every year. So would you rather have a portal player or an incoming high school freshman?
October 12th, 2021 at 1:22 PM ^
Talking transfer portal I would not be the least bit surprised to see a wr or 2 heading somewhere else
October 12th, 2021 at 5:15 PM ^
OK, I will play along.
Which one of the scholarship wr is leaving?
Bell, Baldwin, Johnson, Wilson, Anthony, dixon outside?
Henning or sainristil in the slot?
That is only 8 wr and they are all playing.
Only Dixon hasn't hit the field and he is a true frosh.
Sure, it's possible that one or more may transfer, but there is no obvious candidate.
So either, you have insider info, which I would love to hear. Or you are talking out of your ass, which seems to be a common occurrence.
October 12th, 2021 at 3:34 PM ^
We have a lot of experience this year which we will lose next year. Next year will be the rebuilding year not this one. That is unless we take advantage of the portal.
October 12th, 2021 at 5:27 PM ^
What? They return most of their offense and defense. Yes, they lose some really key pieces, but overall Michigan returns a lot.
October 13th, 2021 at 5:43 PM ^
That’s an inaccurate generalization.
Details matter.
They lose 3 key players on the OL. That’s huge right there. Everything starts here. The extra experience of the OL this year, because of Covid, is critical to their 2021 success.
They lose the ENTIRE defensive backfield plus Hutchinson and Ross. That’s almost a complete turnover
The success this year is because of the experience that stayed from last year. We lose that.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:37 AM ^
I hate the thinking that a team can only have one main QB... that anyone else must be backup (and subsequently a transfer target). Why not have two fully capable starters and simply rotate (as in MLB pitchers)? You can rotate who starts the game, maybe who starts the half, or maybe by series... something more substantial that "Cade gets most snaps and JJ comes in for an occasional play and then mop-up duty" just as one example. If the player can't share the job due to personality, so be it... but this seems the better way for all parties in the long term (team gets better stability in case of injury, all QBs get plenty of tape for draft stock, etc.)
Edit: Yes, I am aware of the Brady/Henson example, but I believe that was a problem of not managing the QBs properly rather than a fundamental issue of having them both.
October 12th, 2021 at 12:10 PM ^
I think as transfers become more of a thing, this is a great idea to keep your team competitive even with the inevitable injuries, and something Harbaugh talked about as part of his thinking in having JJ take meaningful snaps. Even then, you'll still have an "Ace" who presumably takes the majority of the snaps. It'd be great if Cade was willing to stick around in a "reliever" type role, but I think the more likely but still goodscenario is JJ is the Ace and we get Villari/Bowman meaningful snaps to be capable backups/relievers. We have a VillariCat package that is more than 2 plays and a trick play.
Anyhow, I love this idea and think we probably will see more of it as capable QBs would understandably transfer rather than sit the bench and bide their time.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:32 PM ^
Does nobody remember that Drew Henson and Tom Brady did this same thing? Brady started, and Henson would come in at halftime. Whoever had the hot hand would finish the 4th qtr. It messed with Brady's draft prospects (dropped him to the 6th round) and sent Henson off to baseball (I mean, he looked at Steinbrenner's offer for a reason).
I don't think it actually helped the team one bit, either. Where do the practice reps come from for each QB? Answer: they each get half, because there are only so many to go around. So do you teach two offenses, or give each player half the reps?
I dunno... But I do kinda agree that both players need to keep getting meaningful snaps.
October 12th, 2021 at 2:41 PM ^
Does nobody remember that Drew Henson and Tom Brady did this same thing? Brady started, and Henson would come in at halftime. Whoever had the hot hand would finish the 4th qtr.
That is not what happened at all. Brady started and played most of the game. Henson got a couple series. The only game I remember him finishing was MSU. Looking at their stat comparison shows how little Henson actually played:
Brady
1998: 200/323 61.9% 2427 yards 14 TD 10 INT
1999: 180/295 61.0% 2217 yards 16 TD 6 INT
Henson
1998: 19/45 42.1% 233 yards 3 TD 1 INT
1999: 46/89 51.7% 546 yards 3 TD 2 INT
October 12th, 2021 at 12:14 PM ^
I mean UF did it with Leak and Tebow in 2006, and Bama has of course had a loaded QB room last few years. I think it's less that it couldn't work (though there are other years/teams where it failed), but moreso in the current age of the transfer portal it's far more likely that a QB would rather be the guy rather than one of the guys. Hell, Jimmy Garoppolo went in the 2nd round from a FCS team that went 2-9, 2-9, 7-5, 12-2 during his time there.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:10 PM ^
I think the old saying "If you have 2 quarterbacks, you don't have a quarterback" is just that, old.
Aside from forcing a defense to prepare for two quarterbacks, it allows the coaches to provide extended feedback on the sideline to the starter and make in-game changes to the gameplan.
October 12th, 2021 at 3:46 PM ^
Leak and Tebow had decidedly different skill sets / ran different plays. Tebow wasn't "taking plays" from Leak so much as he was a complementary piece of the offense.
If your 2 QBs are clones style wise, with just slightly different stats, I don't think the QB rotation strategy helps and it might hurt.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:48 PM ^
Stamina is the constraint in baseball. If you could pitch your best pitcher every day without his arm falling off, teams would.
That's not an issue in football. You play once a week. So you play your best one as much as possible. Your second best is your backup. Pretty simple. The exception is if you have a specialist, aka Taysom Hill / Tim Tebow (to Chris Leak) that is better in certain situations/downs/distances. I think that's the way they're using JJ right now because he's better at the option game so he adds something to the run game. Even then, defenses start to figure out what the specialist is doing pretty quickly.
October 12th, 2021 at 1:51 PM ^
But baseball teams don't use pitcher A, then pitcher B, then back to A, then back to B.
People who throw or shoot a ball need to get warmed up and into a rhythm. Constantly rotating your QBs just means neither one is allowed to establish any kind of throwing rhythm. We saw this with Brady/Henson. Brady would spend the first quarter trying to get into a groove, just in time for a completely cold Henson to come in. Then Brady would start the 2nd half, usually with Michigan trailing, and throw for 250 yards in the 2nd half to pull out a win.
I am of the opinion that you have to find your "guy" and go with him. Yes it would be great to give meaningful snaps to two guys, but you kinda need to pick your horse and ride him.
October 12th, 2021 at 11:45 AM ^
Baldwin isn't leaving after this year, he still has 2 years.
Shocked if he would
October 12th, 2021 at 11:51 AM ^
I think most will predict JJ will overtake Cade by next year
That is really premature. If Michigan does well in the second half, no reason to think JJ would "overtake" Cade.
If Michigan falters, then maybe, especially if it is because of Cade.
Cade just lead the team to a comeback victory in the most hostile environment any Harbaugh team has ever won.
October 12th, 2021 at 12:14 PM ^
This isn’t an anti-Cade comment but there is very little chance JJ doesn’t have every opportunity to pass him going into 2022.
The comments from camp this year were that JJ was making it very difficult to keep him off the field - pure better talent - but at the end of the day he was more erratic than Cade and didn’t know the offense nearly as well.
Coaches knew they needed to win this year and couldn’t be sure the Defense would be really good so Cade is/was a much better fit than JJ. (I personally see nothing yet from Cade that would lead me to make a change in-season 2021.)
on the CBs - I expect both Johnson and Jackson (if flipped) to have a great chance to start or rotate heavily. As EEs they would have that extra time to learn the system, both seem college-ready athletically even if not finished products, and DBs can translate quickly to the college level at least in man to man coverage.
October 12th, 2021 at 12:44 PM ^
I don't think its that close. They bring in JJ to have a running option. That's it. (He throws to keep defense honest or in garbage time).
The comments from camp this year were that JJ was making it very difficult to keep him off the field - pure better talent - but at the end of the day he was more erratic than Cade and didn’t know the offense nearly as well.
Coaches knew they needed to win this year and couldn’t be sure the Defense would be really good so Cade is/was a much better fit than JJ. (I personally see nothing yet from Cade that would lead me to make a change in-season 2021.)
Comments from camp that encouraged competition and talked up a freshman generically should be considered routine coach-speak signifying nothing, in my opinion.
Michigan named Cade the starter in spring. He gets constantly talked up as a leader and smart with good enough physical skills. That sounds like almost every great QB. JJ may be good too, but its mostly athletic potential at this point.
There is no indication that JJ is close to taking over other than his athletic potential. Compare that with a guy who came in and sparked the team in games last year, almost never turns the ball over, is 6-0 this year and has won in two hostile environments with run stopping defenses that forced Michigan to win through the air. The UNL game included him bouncing back from his first interception to convert two huge 3rd and long situations to win the game.
JJ McCarthy isnt close to "overtaking" McNamara anytime in the future unless Cade falls apart somehow.