UConn Depth Chart
The first and most interesting of the year.
[Walk-ons denoted with #; players not on the official two-deep in italics.]
| MICHIGAN UNOFFICIAL TWO DEEP 8/30/2010 | |||||
| OFFENSE | |||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Pos | First | Second | Third | ||
| QB | Denard Robinson OR | -- | -- | ||
| RB | Vincent Smith OR Michael Shaw | Mike Cox | 4:Fitzgerald Toussaint 5:Stephen Hopkins 6:Teric Jones | ||
| WR1 | Darryl Stonum OR Junior Hemingway | Je'Ron Stokes | Ricardo Miller | ||
| WR2 | Martavious Odoms | Jeremy Jackson | Jerald Robinson | ||
| Slot | Roy Roundtree OR | Terrance Robinson | Jeremy Gallon | ||
| TE | Kevin Koger | Martell Webb | Brandon Moore | ||
| LT | Mark Huyge | Taylor Lewan | Erik Gunderson# | ||
| LG | Steve Schilling | Quinton Washington | Elliot Mealer | ||
| C | David Molk | Rocko Khoury | Christian Pace | ||
| RG | Patrick Omameh | Ricky Barnum | John Ferrara | ||
| RT | Perry Dorrestein | Michael Schofield | Zac Ciullo# | ||
| DEFENSE | |||||
| Pos | First | Second | Third | ||
| DE | Ryan Van Bergen | Jibreel Black | Steve Watson | ||
| NT | Mike Martin | Adam Patterson | William Campbell | ||
| DE/DT | Greg Banks | Renaldo Sagesse | Terry Talbott | ||
| LB/DE | Craig Roh | Brandon Herron OR JB Fitzgerald | -- | ||
| MLB | Obi Ezeh OR Mark Moundros# | Kenny Demens | -- | ||
| WLB | Jonas Mouton | Mike Jones | Kevin Leach# | ||
| Spur | Carvin Johnson | Thomas Gordon | Floyd Simmons# | ||
| Bandit | Jordan Kovacs# | Marvin Robinson | -- | ||
| FS | Cam Gordon | Jared Van Slyke# | Vlad Emilien | ||
| CB1 | James Rogers | Terrence Talbott OR Cullen Christian | -- | ||
| CB2 | JT Floyd | Courtney Avery | -- | ||
| SPECIAL TEAMS | |||||
| Pos | First | Second | Third | ||
| P | Will Hagerup | Seth Broekhuizen# | --- | ||
| K | Brendan Gibbons OR Seth Broekhuizen# | Justin Meram# | -- | ||
| PR | Jeremy Gallon OR Martavious Odoms OR Terrance Robinson | Drew Dileo | -- | ||
| KR | Darryl Stonum | Martavious Odoms OR | Drew Dileo | ||
Items
Gardner. You've probably already been bombarded by this fact on twitter, but Rodriguez specifically stated that freshmen on the two-deep are not going to redshirt this season, which includes Devin Gardner. Grumble.
Other freshmen slotted to play in groups:
- Obvious: all three cornerbacks, Stephen Hopkins
- Encouraging sign: Jibreel Black, Carvin Johnson, Marvin Robinson.
- Surprising: Jeremy Jackson
Carvin Johnson's audition at spur in the Beanie Bowl went well enough that he is the starter, no OR, there. This site's prediction that he'd outperform his recruiting rankings more than anyone else is moving along smoothly, but the secondary just got a tiny bit less experienced… or did it? More in the secondary preview dropping later today.
James Rogers is, at least temporarily, a starting corner.
Kelvin Grady's frequent appearances on fall highlight film have evidently paid off, as with Martavious Odoms' seeming permanent move outside he moves up to co-starter with Roundtree.
Teric Jones is back at running back, his defensive experiment over. Probably for the best given his performance against DSU last year and his obvious speed.
Veterans win at tackle… so far.
Bizarre switch: 289 pound Sagesse is the primary backup at DE/DT and 276 pound Adam Patterson is the primary backup at nose. Theory: Mike Martin isn't coming off the field much and M plans to platoon Sagesse and Banks extensively.
Should we start getting worried about:
- Vlad Emilien: behind a walk-on after a year and a half (he enrolled early).
- Anthony LaLota: behind Steve Watson, also after a year and a half.
- Will Campbell: behind perpetual non-entity Adam Patterson, a guy who moved positions this spring.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:22 PM ^
What happened to him?
Also, should we read anything into Teric switching back to RB and Shaw's academic status?
August 30th, 2010 at 12:29 PM ^
Probably not
August 30th, 2010 at 12:20 PM ^
what I was hoping to see on the defensive side of the ball. I don't know what exactly I was hoping for, but I know it was not this.
Not to panic eeiiiiieiiieee (or whatever), but I kind of thought of Vlad as becomming one of the mainstays of the secondary at this point, and yeah, I thought Teric Jones would at least be listed at CB. Really, I mean 5 cornerbacks, total, on the depth chart?
Also, I really thought that if there was going to be a freshman starter on the defense that it was going to be M-Rob, and I am alarmed to a certain degree that Josh Furman is not listed on this chart.
I will await the secondary preview for some additional info, but eh.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:19 PM ^
... I worry about nothing! Bring on Uconn, bitches.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:25 PM ^
Go BLUE!
August 30th, 2010 at 12:20 PM ^
I love this time of year.
Just some thoughts...
QBs - I mean, what do we really want to happen here? The obvious answer is "win games," but at what cost? I'd bet that 90% of the fan base would be more than happy with "Spring Denard runs wild all over opposing defenses, and Gardner vaults Forcier". But with this scenario, I doubt we see Tate sitting on the bench as a 3rd stringer in 2011.
RBs - So much for Cox being "the guy" and Fitz "the guy when healthy". Moon Man, you have disappointed me.
WRs - Looks like I was wrong about Grady - I still don't see him getting more than 33% of the snaps at slot to start out (and even if he plays very well - hard to put him ahead of Roundtree).
OL - I still stand by my thoughts on Quinton Washington - we got him really late in the process (in an upset over South Carolina I believe) and that's one signing that will pay off immensely. RS Frosh and he's already on the two deep? Will be nice to have him filling in after Schilling graduates. Lewan and/or Schofield will be starting by the end of the year.
DL - Big Will is starting to become worrisome. I think eventually he makes a huge contribution at DT for us - but it looks to be of the Alan Branch / Gabe Watson variety (e.g., "huge hype coming out of high school but not able to contribute until junior/senior year of college). Doubt he does much this year.
LB - Nothing new here - hopefully whoever wins the MLB spot can play it at a Big Ten level this season.
DB - Holy Carvin Johnson, batman. I think that's great - let's see what this kid can do. Here's hoping that Cam Gordon is the real deal - he has carried Spring hype all the way to a starting job (don't remember that happening last season). I think MRob overtakes Kovacs by season's end (not a knock on Kovacs, I'm just really high on Omar Robinson). Not too worried about Vlad yet, either.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:51 PM ^
often takes the longest to make a significant contribution. I wouldn't worry about Big Will. If he's not starting by junior year, we can start to worry but since it's his 2nd year of the program, I'm not. He still needs work on technique and is still raw.
The biggest difference between Watson/Branch and Big Will is Big Will isn't lazy and doesn't take plays off. I've seen that from Watson/Branch which is why they fell in the draft despite their immense talent.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:08 PM ^
While I will conceed the point that DL-types take longer to produce (because of the need to bulk up at the college level), I don't see how this applies to Campbell.
Five star talent, already big enough to play (needed to slim down actually), and not anyone particularly outstanding in front of him (not counting Martin, who could slide to the outside where Banks is, aka Ngata 2.0).
Not to say Campbell is a bust (I'll hold that off if he cannot start next season) - but how long does it take to get technique down (if he's ever going to get it)? I would think a year of practice / training would be enough - but maybe not.
(also, how can you say that Watson/Branch take plays off but Campbell doesn't? the sh*t you say makes it seem like you're watching practice every day - but I'd bet a lot of money that you're a regurgitation machine)
August 30th, 2010 at 1:28 PM ^
doesn't just happen overnight. It takes a while for a players to really get the techniques down. Big Will is used to being the biggest guy on the team and he just dominates with his size and strength alone. Now he acutally has to dominate with techniques, he has no techniques whatsover(this is coming from a former DL in high school). Getting techniques down is harder than you think because it's all muscle memory(much like being a pitcher with mechanics). You have to do it over and over until it's natural. Right now, it's not natural with Big Will. Come gametime, he'll revert to what he knows instead of doing the right way. It takes more than a year of practice/training to get it down especially when you never been coached to play with proper techniques in all of your life.
I seen Watson and Branch play on tv when they played games for Michigan. They do take plays off. How can you explain them falling in the draft? It's work ethics.
September 2nd, 2010 at 2:13 PM ^
You "seen" them? awesome.
tell me why he can't even crack the two-deeps? I agree expecting him to start might be a bit much, but 3rd on the depth chart? that's not good.
August 30th, 2010 at 5:02 PM ^
"Here's hoping that Cam Gordon is the real deal" -- no kidding on this one. If there is one guy we seem to be absolutely relying on to live up to his spring and summer props, it's Cam. For all the non-Warren CB problems we had last year, free safety is where we got absolutely killed. I can scarcely express the dread I have of a repeat from last year at this position, so Cam must be our man.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:21 PM ^
i don't know if i should be pumped that Gardner is playing so well they can't afford to redshirt him, or worried that Robinson and Tate didn't progress enough to guarantee his redshirt.
August 30th, 2010 at 2:08 PM ^
DG seems smart, he certainly has a size advantage, and he seems to be a gifted athlete. He's like TP, except with a brain and an arm.
So don't worry. It means Devin came in here well coached enough in high school, to be able to pick up the system and be a viable threat to start / fall back in the event of double disaster.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:30 PM ^
Could this still be painful for him? He does not appear to have fully recovered in terms of his speed, agility, etc. Knee injuries are scary, man.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:30 PM ^
so excited about a list of names in my life. And yes, confused and/or concerned also.
You have to think some of those unexpected drops to 3rd string are more West Virginian mindgame voodoo tactics, like the wingless helmet curse. It's really hard to believe that Big Will is taking a back seat to Patterson.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:33 PM ^
is starting for Michigan, then I come to the conclusion that he is just that good.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:32 PM ^
but I remain afraid
August 30th, 2010 at 12:34 PM ^
Was the depth chart for QB last year Forcier OR Robinson, and now it's Robinson OR Forcier (OR Gardner)? I've searched and can't find the answer.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:36 PM ^
Yes, and I feel like it was also OR Sheridan.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:50 PM ^
that's telling to me.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:47 PM ^
Sure hope the freshmen DBs can learn quickly and are natural ballers.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:43 PM ^
Rather Disappointing:
- Big Will, first and foremost. I'm now officially worried that he'll be a bust, at least on the level of Gabe Watson. People forget that Alan Branch took some time to blow up because he started out as an oversized DE - once he moved to tackle he started playing well immediately. If Will doesn't work his way into the rotation this year, that's a huge concern.
- Marvin Robinson: This one is more of a sack tap than a dong punch, but I have huge, somewhat irrational hopes for this young man. The book on Robinson was supposed to be that he was a natural athlete and an instinctive player, but lacked top-end savoriness in the speed department. Kovacs being in front of him can either mean that 1) despite M-Rob's considerable instincts, Kovacs' experience is keeping him ahead or, disastrously 2) M-Rob is basically Kovacs 2.0 - his athleticism is not significantly superior to Jordan's. This early in his career, I'd say choice 1 is more likely; I still expect Robinson to start by the OSU game.
- Vlad Emilien: This is certainly disappointing, but the writing's been on the wall for a while now. [EDIT: I'm going to hope that this is due to the knee injury, and that he'll round back into form sooner or later.]
- Devin's likely non-existent redshirt. I'm just going to tell myself this isn't going to happen until it does. Then I'm going to tell myself it's because Devin is Chad Henne with speed until he's not. Then I'll cry a little in between screaming fits.
Not So Disappointing:
- RB Depth Chart: To me, this is a position group where the nominal starter does not matter much. As long as one or two guys step up, we'll be fine. To me, it's nice to see Shaw with the ones, as his home run ability is unique in this position group - a lot of the other guys have skill sets that overlap with others.
- Anthony LaLota: Guy is heading into his third year of football at any level. While it would make me tingly to see him contribute already, there's no reason not to show some patience with his development. If he doesn't see the field at all next year, I'll start to worry.
Probably for the Best:
Young guys passing Mike Williams on the chart.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:44 PM ^
The writing has been on the wall for Vlad? Dude, he's only been here for a year and is probably still recovering from a knee injury. The fact that he's buried isn't good, but I wouldn't call him a bust yet. Kovacs was pretty decent last year. He was a solid tackler. MRob not starting over him doesn't say anything bad about him.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:53 PM ^
I'm not calling Vlad a bust yet - I'm just saying that, ever since he's been here, he's failed to live up to the (probably unfair) expectations that many of us had for him. There has been no indication, so far, that he's really a stud in waiting, or he would have been on the field more last year. Certainly the knee injury may be an explanation, and that's what I'm hoping.
Listen, I get it: Kovacs is a good tackler and a heady player. But wouldn't it be nice if Robinson was both of those things, but with better speed and athleticism? That's what their respective high school careers and recruiting rankings indicate, and that's what I'm hoping will put Robinson in as a starter by the end of the year. I'm personally a little disappointed that Robinson isn't the starter yet, but in no way to I think it's a reason to be worried about his career or his talent.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:08 PM ^
I really don't need to see any more photos from the end zone of Jordon chasing some guy. Great kid, great story, thanks for stepping up, but we have to be fielding the type of athlete that can match up with the athleticism across from us on the field.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:12 PM ^
RVB admitted that was his fault.
JT Floyd was also trying to catch the kid.
Come on people, Kovacs is good at football. How about people lay off the kid?
August 30th, 2010 at 1:16 PM ^
He just isn't supposed to be good.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:19 PM ^
And 5*s aren't supposed to be bad, but it happens. Maybe we should all stop worrying about what should be and enjoy what is?
August 30th, 2010 at 1:19 PM ^
...I am so tired of the Kovacs bashing that goes on here. The kid just makes plays. There's a reason he was the second leading tackler last year. He has a nose for the ball and he's not afraid to hit someone when he finds it.
August 30th, 2010 at 2:08 PM ^
Thank you very much. Guys need to stop dogging Kovacs. If he is a liability, he won't play. It isn't just about recruiting ratings, it is about heart and effort and tackles. And IIRC, Kovacs was injured in HS and he had that freshman walkon issue . . . otherwise, he would have been better coming in.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:45 PM ^
1. Big Will
- He is slightly out of shape since he didn't participate with the Michigan team instead he went with his hs teammate to do their own conditioning. He still did enough to pass the test thus earning the wings. He still needs work on techniques.
2. Marvin
- Jordan is ahead because he can tackle especially in open space. He hasn't relinquish his starting job. Marvin had a good off-season to put himself into the 2 deep conversation. You're expecting too much of Marvin. He's a better athlete than Kovacs(who is no slouch in that department).
August 30th, 2010 at 1:02 PM ^
Just curious here - are you providing us with "inside" or "semi-inside" info here, or are you just regurgitating what you hear on MGoBlog? I feel like it is the latter, but you are trying to make it seem like the former.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:21 PM ^
on the team. They told me that Big Will is with his hs buddies to work out. He done enough to pass the conditioning test.
August 30th, 2010 at 5:11 PM ^
Big Will needs to stop 'training' with his buddies - he's gotta bite the fucking bullet and work out with his teammates using Barwis' program.
August 30th, 2010 at 5:50 PM ^
Teric Jones, Thomas Gordon and other Michigan from Cass Tech on their own. They did enough to pass the test but you can see Thomas Gordon went from possible starter to backup role. The coaches are sending the message to Cass Tech people that they should be on their program, not Cass Tech program.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:46 PM ^
that you are disappointed in Campbell but not LaLota. Not that you're necessarily wrong but it's simply interesting in that you have patience for the development of one but not the other. And I'm not sure Campbell playing an extra year or two of High School ball is a real difference, if anything in his case, it's a hinderance. He's had to relearn technique as he relied simply on strength.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:58 PM ^
But even with some of the shoddy techniques Campbell picked up at Cass Tech, it would seem that just having years of playing football at any level is an edge over someone who only picked up the game for one year in high school (and played multiple positions in that year.)
Also, Will's massive size and strength should compensate for lack of technique at NT more than LaLota's quickness and athleticism would help him cover the cracks at DE. Maybe I'm over-simplifying what needs to be done at the position, but it seems like there's less to worry about in terms of "occupy blockers" than there is in terms of "keep run contain/get around the edge/read screens/funnel QB toward middle of field."
August 30th, 2010 at 12:39 PM ^
Dear Brian,
Maybe we should wait until a player has been with the program for more than a year before we put the BUST tag on them. This is LaLota's like 3rd year of organized football. Emilien did suffer a severe knee injury. And Campbell may still be working out the kinks. It's still early.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:48 PM ^
I don't completely disagree with you, but if someone with Campbell's size, strength, and purported athleticism can't get on the field in his second year, I think a revision of original five-star expectations are in order. If his place on the depth chart is because he's simply not as effective as Adam Patterson - and not because the coaches are attempting to light a fire under his significant posterior - that's really troubling.
It's not to say he won't ever contribute, or that he won't be a starter someday. But he might be the next Gabe Watson: able to show flashes of talent without ever being able to sustain it. We all want a dominating DT a la senior year Alan Branch, and right now Will ain't on that track. (As I say in another post, Branch's slow development was largely due to his playing out of position at the beginning of his career.)
August 30th, 2010 at 12:54 PM ^
We all want a dominating DT a la senior year Alan Branch, and right now Will ain't on that track.
Kind of a high bar. I just figure I'll wait until the first game before I put a ton of stock in the first depth chart released.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:05 PM ^
You might be right. But Will is the highest rated DT Michigan has recruited since ... I really don't know, since Watson's five-star rating was largely due to his potential on the OL, IIRC. Might be unfair to Big Will, but he was the consensus best DT in the country as a senior, no?
Of course, this whole discussion is related to the implications of the depth chart, since that's what we have to talk about at this juncture. It's flimsy, but still more concrete at this point than what hypothetically might happen in the first game.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:01 PM ^
Senior year Alan Branch never happened because he left after Junior year.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:06 PM ^
-1 cocktail for me for getting that wrong, but it supports my notion that Branch was no late bloomer.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:02 PM ^
I agree with you on the other two (LaLota, Emilien), although I don't really think Brian was labeling them busts, just that there is reason for concern. Emilien was laying some fucking lumber on the big ten preview and if he can hit and is engaged with the coaching staff, he can learn to cover. His hip explosion on tackles is very encouraging and I can't imagine he couldn't be a productive weakside linebacker if he can't learn zone. LaLota I didn't see, so I'll withold judgment.
However, Campbell is well on his way to becoming a bust. He was clearly overweight and his technique was total horseshit. In one-on-one drills he would immediately stand up from his three point as he was getting into his pass rush. This is retarded. Anyone who has played football knows that on the interior line, the low man wins. He was getting routinely driven off the ball and made several attempts at a swim move, something his coaches should run him for doing every time his dumb ass tries it. Lifting up your arm gives the o-lineman a perfect place to park his hands and drive you to the ground. It also puts you in a position where it is next to impossible to be balanced (try that sometime, lift your arm, have someone get under it and then try to hold a 2x2 gap).
He is either poorly coached or doesn't give a shit. I'm guessing coaching isn't the issue because Mike Martin has phenomenal technique and understands leverage very well. This might just be from his experience wrestling (i.e. not coaching at the college level), but I doubt it. Either way, Campbell is going to struggle until he loses some weight, gets his ass down, explodes out of his stance, low and tight, and gives up attempting swim moves that work against 220 lb high school lineman but will get your ass pancaked by a beefeater from Wisconsin who actually knows what he's doing.
Campbell has a long, long way to go from both a conditioning and technique standpoint before he can be anything more than a 325 lb. speedbump (and he's not even great at that, in the preview when he got driven back, he didnt even bother to create a pile, he just ended up 5 yards down field, e.g. a totally fucking useless creator of cutback lanes and gaping holes in the line).
August 30th, 2010 at 1:14 PM ^
From what saw in the practice video, Will looked pretty bad, but my hope was just that he was too tired to be worth much. The most worrying thing for me was one play where he actually managed to get through the line and then looked absolutely ponderous in his attempt to get to the QB. Michigan's got some mobile dudes back there, so I didn't expect him to chase one down from behind, but lumbering would be a generous term. I know he's a NT, but I thought that 5-star rating was based in part on his athleticism and quickness for his size.
It's bad news that the best case scenario is that he was too lazy to get in shape in the offseason.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:38 PM ^
league does not have really good coaching. Players from that league often takes the longest to develop because they have never been properly coached especially on the technique aspect.
Mike Martin is different because he went to a private high school and the coaching is considerably better than PSL. So comparing Martin to Big Will is laughable at best because both came from a vastly different background. Just because they're from detroit area doesn't mean that it's the same.
August 30th, 2010 at 2:41 PM ^
I don't disagree with you, I'm just saying that Martin understands what he needs to do to be successful in the big ten while Campbell's conditioning and technique won't get the job done. I also agree that Campbell could turn it around, but especially the conditioning aspect is worrisome. Also, the coaches are either not getting the message to him that his technique is atrocious or the coaches are telling him and he does not care enough to fix it. Over a year in a program should be enough time to at least see improvement on that front, but he is literally standing straight up out of his three-point. No doubt the potential is there, but right now (sophomore year) he's not even close to being useful.
August 30th, 2010 at 1:26 PM ^
I had a feeling that was the case with Will. If he can't be "reprogrammed", and drop whatever bad habits he brought from high school, he'll never contribute. Mike Martin understands pad level, and staying low because he went to CC and they teach those types of things at schools like that with quality/winning football programs. Not so much at the PSL schools. It explains why you never see Detroit teams winning state championships. When I was in school, we won every time we played a PSL even though many times they were superior talent athletes, because they lacked technique and discipline.
I think it's especially tough for OL/DL. They get exposed real quick. A guy who is big can get by with bad habits in HS, but like you said, when that guy meets someone just as big, with good techinque...they become a human blocking sled.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:40 PM ^
How can I tell which ones are walk-ons?
This information is critical.
August 30th, 2010 at 12:43 PM ^
for stubbiness.
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