Profiles In Heroism: Dan Mullen Comment Count

Brian

danmullendakprescottmississippistate-vuentkbmdsl[1]


Head Coach, Mississippi State
Age 42
Exp. 6th year
Record 46-30
Previous Jobs
OC/QB @ Florida 2005-08
QB @ Utah 2003-04
QB @ BGSU 2001-02
GA @ ND 1999-00
Playing Career
TE at Ursinus (PA) in 1992/93

These again. We're skipping Harbaugh because it's not like you need to be told about Harbaugh. In the event M does hire him, he'll get one.

These are in approximate order of personal preference.

Nationally, Dan Mullen is regarded as the best available-ish college head coach in the market this year. This admiration has not extended to all corners of the Michigan fanbase for… reasons. Foremost amongst them are:

  • "He's a one-year wonder." (Who won two national championships at Florida as the primary play-caller and has built MSU into a contender in the toughest division in the country.)
  • "He's not a cultural fit." (He's from Pennsylvania and GA'd at ND. Hell, he coached at Columbia.)
  • "He runs the spread." (You have just slashed out 80% of plausible options. Also, Chris Leak was as mobile as a plant.)
  • "He's never won for real for real." (At the Indiana of the SEC.)

Mississippi State's winning percentage before Dan Mullen arrived was… not good. In the decade before his arrivals this was their power conference peer group:

Rk Team Win % W L
84 Kentucky 0.42748 56 75
85 Rutgers 0.42308 55 75
87 Mississippi State 0.41985 55 76
90 Iowa State 0.41667 55 77
91 Illinois 0.41085 53 76

Bulldog futility goes further back than that; you have to go back to the 50s before you find a MSU head coach capable of consistently keeping the Bulldogs above .500. His winning percentage of 60.5% is in the WVU-Miami-Utah-Iowa range and is virtually unprecedented. It's also better than Michigan's over the same time frame. At Mississippi State.

So.

Reasons for hiring or not hiring a coach are not made in a vacuum, so if you'd like to make one of these arguments you have to bring along a guy who has a better resume than Dan Mullen. Gary Patterson? Sure! I'm totally down with Gary Patterson if you can crowbar him out of TCU, but you can't. Given the hires Nebraska and Florida just made I don't think anyone who could-might-kinda be available is. That leaves Dan Mullen and…

Seriously, I don't know. Mullen is the default college head coach choice. Fortunately, he seems like a pretty good one.

[After THE JUMP: the anti-Borges at QB, overblown oversigning concerns, and CEO stuff.]

Xs and Os Proficiency

Mullen came up with Urban Meyer. He was a grad assistant at ND when Meyer was the WR coach there, and then followed him through all his stops until getting the Mississippi State job. His track record as a QB coach and offensive coordinator is truly impressive. Mullen's QBs:

  • JOSH HARRIS, BGSU. Meyer inherited Andy Sahm, a pocket guy a year older than Harris, and Mullen eventually molded him to a quality starter. He took over the full time job in 2002, with a 6.9 YPA, 737 rushing yards, and a whopping 39 touchdowns as BGSU took down Missouri and Kansas as a MAC team. Harris had a standout senior season the year after Meyer and Mullen went to Utah and got drafted.
  • ALEX SMITH, UTAH. Smith had four attempts as a true freshman; upon Meyer and Mullen's arrival he blew up, passing for 8.4 YPA as a true sophomore and 9.3 as a junior; that junior campaign also saw him complete 68% of his passes with a nutty 32:4 TD:INT ratio. Oh, and run for 600 yards. Utah went undefeated, beating Texas A&M, Arizona, North Carolina, and Pitt in the Fiesta Bowl. Smith was the top pick in the ensuing NFL Draft.
  • CHRIS LEAK, FLORIDA. Leak had already started for Florida for two years under Ron Zook; he never really fit the Meyer run/pass mold but complted 63 and 64 percent of his passes as an upperclassman with decent YPA and TD:INT ratios as Florida won a national title in 2006.
  • TIM TEBOW, FLORIDA. I probably don't have to remind you of TEBOW TEBOW TEBOW's college career. Mostly a Belldozer QB/tank as a freshman, Tebow put up insane stats as a full time starter: 9.4 YPA, 32:6 TD:INT as a sophomore, 9.2 and 30:4 as a junior, with a total of 1600 rushing yards those two years. Mullen left for Mississippi State after 2008; Scot Loeffler was brought in to turn Tebow into Tom Brady, a process that didn't seem to impact his college stats much (9.2 YPA as a senior) but also did not work. Tebow was a first round draft pick and ESPN hype factory who eventually washed out because he was a rhino masquerading as an NFL QB.
  • TYSON LEE, MSU. Mediocre inherited pocket passer. Did bump YPA from 5.8 to 6.5 as a senior in Mullen year 1.
  • CHRIS RELF, MSU. Middling inherited bulky dual-threat who once obliterated M. "One of the lowest-rated QB prospects" to start an SEC game after the rise of rankings, Mullen was very careful with his passing on team that ran almost 70% of the time at a rather decent 4.5 YPC; Relf had 8.1 YPA as a result in Mullen year two. Relf fell off significantly as a senior and was platooned with…
  • TYLER RUSSELL, MSU. Mildly touted pocket guy was recruited by Croom and kept on, had a decent junior year (59%, 7.4 YPA, 24:10 TD:INT) and then blew out his shoulder in his senior year opener; he came back sporadically when the next guy came down with his own shoulder issues.
  • DAK PRESCOTT, MSU. The first Mullen-recruited QB to play for him at MSU had a rickety redshirt sophomore campaign (7.3 YPA, 10:7 TD-INT) after being forced into the lineup by Russell's shoulder issues; did run for over 800 yards. This year Prescott blew up (61%, 8.7 YPA, 24:10 TD INT, 900 rushing yards) into a fringe Heisman candidate as the Bulldogs took it to most of the SEC that was not Alabama.

Mullen had four straight highly productive QBs before he got to MSU and then scraped average production out of a couple of iffy prospects before Prescott blew up this year. FWIW, at Florida Mullen was the primary playcaller; this is not a Chip/Brian Kelly situation where the HC is also the de-facto OC.

As far as his offenses have gone:

[2008 Mississippi State was Sylvester Croom's last team, included for comparison's sake.]

Year Team FEI S&P Plain YPP
2005 Florida N/A 23 49
2006 Florida N/A 7 24
2007 Florida 1 1 3
2008 Florida 3 1 3
2008 Miss. St. 106 106 115
2009 Miss. St. 44 71 69
2010 Miss. St. 69 56 41
2011 Miss. St. 88 63 70
2012 Miss. St. 87 51 47
2013 Miss. St. 46 56 45
2014 Miss. St. 22 5 16

Mullen walked into one of the worst possible situations and immediately made it better. He maintained improved but average-at-best performance except for 2011, when he had a pocket passer, before a true breakout 2014—the first year he had an experienced QB he recruited available. At Florida his offenses were lights-out after an adjustment year in which they figured out Chris Leak was dyslexic.

No, this isn't like Brady Hoke's one good year at Ball State. Ball State is historically a slightly above .500 MAC school and Hoke had them performing at or below that number until his annus mirabilus. Mullen was already outperforming by some distance before this year. Also…

THE MAC IS

NOT

THE SEC

and Brady Hoke didn't win multiple NCs as an offensive coordinator, because he was never one of those.

Recruiting

Life at the bottom is tough. Mississippi State is often left with a choice between guys who probably can't cut it in the SEC and guys who are questionable to qualify; as a result their classes come with significant uncertaint. Some LOIs are courtesy offers  intended as a sort of "draft and follow" as players go to JUCO and then arrive two years later. Current JUCO DB commit Donald Gray signed with MSU out of high school($) and both made good on it once Gray became eligible.

But an overview shows that concerns about oversigning and JUCOs are significantly overblown.

Year Recruits 4* JUCOs 247 Comp.
2009 27 7 6 20
2010 26 5 3 34
2011 22 1 2 34
2012 28 4 2 22
2013 21 3 (one 5*) 2 25
2014 24 2 3 35
2015 29 5 3 16

After Mullen's transitional class, he's taken two or three JUCOs per year; this is far from the Oregon State or Kansas State style of recruiting. MSU's classes are a bit bigger than average, but the maximum number of players recruited over any four-year span is 102, and with the JUCOs that's really 97 four-year players. Meanwhile MSU does not have the privilege of recruiting only guys who are definitely going to to make it. They have a natural attrition rate that does not involve axing guys on purpose.

As a result, the Bulldogs did not appear at all in Matt Hinton's 2013 edition of the oversigning index—Michigan did, with 87. MSU has in fact cut way down on signing class size under Mullen, partially because of SEC rules.

As far as the quality of those classes go, keep in mind that they're a bit overrated since any recruit gets you points and a higher percentage of Bulldog recruits flame out. That said, Mullen immediately and significantly improved MSU recruiting from a baseline dependent on even larger classes. MSU was 50th in Sylvester Croom's last class, 30th the year before with a whopping 35(!) recruits, and 40th in 2006. Mullen has bounced around a bit but has generally outperformed even without as much of a size bias in his favor.

He's done a great job of keeping Mississippi kids at home and has found many and varied diamonds in the rough.

Unfortunately it was impossible to find much about Mullen's reputation as a recruiter while at Florida since any relevant Google search is overwhelmed by articles about Florida hiring the guy to replace Muschamp.

CEO Stuff

Manny-Diaz-588[1]

Diaz was good, and then he was not good.

Mullen helped Oregon find Chip Kelly since they were both New Hampshire bros—good call. Mullen's out of the box hire of Manny Diaz looked pretty spectacular as Diaz obliterated the Denard Robinson show in 2011, whereupon Diaz was hired by Texas.

Texas's defense did not perform and Diaz was eventually fired midseason so Greg Robinson could come in; Robinson did improve them significantly. Whether Diaz was really a problem or just a convenient scapegoat as the Mack Brown era slid to its country-club conclusion is unknown.

Mullen's current staff is a mix of guys he's known for a long time and guys plucked for no other reason than they seem like good ideas. Former Utah QB Brian Johnson is the QB coach; the OL coach is a guy who came with him from Florida; the TE coach is a former Ursinis teammate of Mullen who spent the last decade in the Ivy League. On the other hand, his DC is a guy who he hired from FIU in 2011 and he's got a few Mississippi dudes for recruiting purposes who he'd never crossed paths with before. Seems like a standard mix.

This is where a look at Mississippi State defenses goes:

[2008 again Croom.]

Year Team FEI S&P Plain YPP
2008 Miss. St. 51 92 51
2009 Miss. St. 72 38 77
2010 Miss. St. 12 22 48
2011 Miss. St. 28 33 13
2012 Miss. St. 59 43 56
2013 Miss. St. 25 14 58
2014 Miss. St. 11 6 62

This is a bit of an oddity, with the rankings that take SOS into account in high praise after year one (minus a blip in 2012) and the raw numbers less positive. This is where MSU's brutal league schedule shows up. At the very least he's done a good job to make the Bulldog defense competitive, and if you believe the advanced stats his defensive coordinator is a keeper.

Potential Catches

There are a few:

How much of his success is Meyer? It's difficult to separate Mullen's talents from Meyer's, as Urbs hasn't exactly fallen apart at OSU without him. But it's worth noting that Mullen's successor, Steve Addazio, was a disaster as Florida's OC and was canned after two years. And then you've got the six years at Mississippi State. The guy is not a Meyer creation.

Can he recruit at Michigan? Michigan fans are understandably wary after Rich Rodriguez brought in one Demar Dorsey for every Denard Robinson he acquired. I don't think this is much of a concern. Florida acts a lot like a Big Ten team in recruiting and Mullen came up through ND, BGSU, and Utah. He is a Pennsylvania native.

Rodriguez had barely left West Virginia during his career—two years each at Tulane and Clemson under Tommy Bowden—by the time he got to M and was shocked by the differences. Mullen will not be.

original[1]NCAA violations? Two things get brought up about Mullen: the Cam Newton thing and the sudden resignation of an assistant because of booster shenanigans. Newton was in the news because his father solicited money from MSU; the Bulldogs refused to deal with the go-between and reported it to the SEC.

More recently, MSU lost two scholarships in 2013 and got two years of probation when assistant coach Angelo Mirando knew about booster interference in the recruitment of a DB and did not act. In that case the NCAA directly stated that no one other than Mirando had knowledge of the wrongdoing; Mirando was fired as soon as it was known.

Neither of these is anything that would prevent Mullen's hire.

Public relations maybe not so much. There were two eyebrow-cocking events this year. In the first, Mullen vociferously defended a player of his who twice stomped on LSU players and was suspended as a result. This is par for the course for just about everyone, but it wasn't a good look.

The second and more recent event was Mullen asking a QB who had been committed to Mississippi State for months was asked to grayshirt. This caused his high school coach to go off on twitter about it. It's an issue, but Mullen is prohibited from telling his side of the story by NCAA rules, and this is much better than signing the kid and then going "whoops, we have no spot for you." Michigan has done it in the past; Ohio State just had a TE flip to Kansas without any idea of who the head coach even is. Sometimes you make a call on a kid and it's wrong and it's in everyone's best interest to part ways.

It is not having a kid get through summer school and then saying "whoops," as Les Miles did. Anyone advocating Miles is advocating much worse behavior in this department. Meanwhile the numbers above show MSU is not making a habit of cutting guys loose willy-nilly.

Does his wife pass the "THAT WOMAN" test? IE, would my mother refer to his wife as THAT WOMAN or regard her as a pal and a confidant? If she threw a party and invited everyone she knew, would she see that the biggest gift was from my mom and the card read "thank you for being a friend?"

I have initiated this test after Rita Rodriguez, who by all reports is a sweetheart, symbolized unbridgeable cultural differences between Rodriguez and Michigan, i.e. my mom, through no fault of her own.

I report that Dan Mullen's wife passes the test.

Would He Take The Job?

Mullen has to know that success at Mississippi State is a fragile thing and he would be well served to strike while the iron's hot. MSU remains the poorest athletic department in his division and will never, ever be able to compete in recruiting with most of the SEC. This is a situation much different than any of the other attractive sitting head coaches. He'd go.

Overall Attractiveness

Unless you're telling me guys who were apparently unavailable for Florida (Gundy, Stoops, Patterson, Shaw, etc.) are on the board for Michigan, Mullen is the strongest non-Harbaugh candidate by a mile.

The only guy who is even debatable is Les Miles, who I am leery of because of his age, his skeezy recruiting practices, the evident split in the alumni base about his suitability, and the lingering fear that he would run out of his batty Mad Hatter luck the instant he stepped on campus—because of course that would happen to us.

I get arguments in favor of Miles even if I don't agree with them; there is no reasonable argument that any other feasible option is more attractive than Mullen.

Comments

NFG

December 4th, 2014 at 4:53 PM ^

Brian, this article still doesn't help me. Mullen is my fourth choice. I'm still scarred from RR because he reminds me of him in so many ways. Plus this year his best win was against an LSU team which is Miles' weakest to date. Or maybe auburn...



Sent from MGoBlog HD for iPhone & iPad

ShadowStorm33

December 4th, 2014 at 5:27 PM ^

Perhaps the closest comparison to RR is the wins/losses; similar to RR, Mullen has seemed to beat the cupcakes but fall flat against any of the better teams on the schedule. That really worries me; as alum96 has pointed out, if he was such a good coach you'd think he'd have beaten somebody in 5-6 years...

JFW

December 4th, 2014 at 5:08 PM ^

I hate the fact that we are on our third coaching search in 7 years.

 

But I love the Profiles in Heroism posts.

 

That said; entirely from the gut: I would be... okay with Mullen. WHomever it is I'm going to be pulling for them like crazy. The one question I have with Mullen is can he beat Meyer? Can he beat Dantonio?

If Stoops comes here, with his NC and his win over 'Bama, I think he can.

If Harbaugh comes here, with his record, not only do I think he can but I think he starts an immensely entertaining rivalry instantly as he and Dantonio start to hate each other openly; and he and Meyer start to hate each other privately. Can you imagine Harbaugh reacting to the 'Where's the threat' comment? I love the idea if only because we'd have a guy with fire, and the skill to back it up. (Even if that fire burns us occasionally).

If Miles came here, I think he could do it. Though Brian's points are valid and worry me.

Everyone else, Mullen included? I don't know. Mullen is probably the best after that but it doesn't fill me with oceans of confidence.

 

ShadowStorm33

December 4th, 2014 at 5:21 PM ^

Completely agree. Mullen's record fine as compared with historical norms, but looking at the teams he beat, and didn't beat, doesn't exactly instill much confidence. He may turn out to be the best (on paper) of the available coaches, but he's far from a home run hire.

BlueHills

December 4th, 2014 at 5:27 PM ^

I'd be happy with Harbaugh, Miles, Mullen, Stoops or any other coach who's a proven winner in a power conference.

This assumes each guy will abide by Michigan's unwritten rules of conduct.

rdh007

December 4th, 2014 at 5:27 PM ^

Then I'd prefer Mullen over Miles. But if they pull the trigger on Miles, I won't complain. A guy who won a national championship is kind of hard to argue with after the last hire was .500

OlafThe5Star

December 4th, 2014 at 5:47 PM ^

The conversation here seems to have a logical fallacy in it -- everyone seems to think Mullen's options are to stay at Miss St or come to UM. I think the critical piece of analysis that is missing is what other options he may have if he waits a year. 

I'm not sure what might open up next year, and I bet something opens up between now and then that we can't predict (I bet not a lot of people would have bet on Pelini being out at Nebraska a year ago.) Does Mullen have such a bad setup at Miss St that he feels he needs to leave RIGHT NOW? It doesn't appear so. As long as he doesn't have a terrible season next year, he will still be the most sought after coach in college football that is likely to leave his current institution. 

I'd love to have him. If I were him, though, I would weigh a Michigan offer now against the potential for someplace where there is a higher probability of near-term success in a year... and I obviously have no clue where he would come out on that deliberation.

UMgradMSUdad

December 4th, 2014 at 5:58 PM ^

Mike Gundy might be available, but I'm not sure how anybody would know.  He had a bizarre press conference this week that had everybody scratching their heads and made it seem he's not at all happy in his current situation, but then a well respected local journalist, Berry Tramel said (on a local sports radio broadcast) that he asked Gundy if he currently has an agent, to which Gundy replied "no," and did to every euphemism for agent that Tramel could think of. So, most observers think Gundy is unhappy in his current position, but in this day and age, with a game yet to play and nobody representing him, how would an AD or search firm even go about ascertaining his desire to go somewhere else?  

Edit: Here's a link with some of Tramel's thoughts about Gundy's strained relationships with others connected to OSU, including the AD and Boone Pickens.  

http://newsok.com/boone-pickens-mike-gundy-feud-strained-relationships-seem-to-be-the-norm-for-gundy-these-days/article/5371523/?page=1

 

Dorothy_ Mantooth

December 4th, 2014 at 5:53 PM ^

I suspect Harbaugh is going to use UM as leverage to negotiate a bigger/better contract with SF or some other NFL team - Les Miles' last two raises/extensions followed that playbook.

Mullen would be a great hire for UM...if he'd come

Space Coyote

December 4th, 2014 at 6:04 PM ^

It's not a spread/pro-style thing (there are spread guys I'd prefer over Mullen), but Mullen clearly isn't in the Rich Rod catergory (as far as what he brings to the table with an offensive system) as far as what he brings to the table with regards to a spread coach. Here is Mullen's advanced stats on offense (along with 2008 Miss St and Urban Meyer OSU).

    OFEI S&P
2005 Florida   23
2006 Florida   7
2007 Florida 1 1
2008 Florida 3 1
2008 Miss St 106 106
2009 Miss St 44 71
2010 Miss St 69 56
2011 Miss St 88 63
2012 Miss St 87 51
2013 Miss St 46 56
2014 Miss St 22 5

2012

Ohio St 10 16
2013 Ohio St 3 2
2014 Ohio St 11 1

He's had one good year at Miss St and a bunch of poor-to-mediocre years as an offensive coach with schedule adjusted stats. His teams have largely been mediocre, as stated elsewhere. Yes, I know it's Miss St, but his strength is supposed to be he's a great offensive guy. Instead, his number without Meyer look "meh" until this year when he had a senior-laden squad with a ton of experience (it's not Brady Hoke at Ball St, but there are similarities in that regard).

Now, for a more in-depth scope of why I'm not a huge fan.

I don't think he's a great fit with the culture. This isn't a Rich Rod doesn't fit with Michigan culture thing. Michigan was awful in that scenario, but with all schools there is some form of "fit" given recent circumstances and everything. It's that way at MSU (Dantonio was the perfect fit at the perfect time), it's that way at Wisconsin, and PSU, and OSU, and etc, etc. It just is. Not to the degree Michigan was with RR, and hopefully Michigan isn't to that degree again, but I don't get the feeling Mullen fits well, for whatever that's worth.

I believe many of the justified things Brian writes can easily be twisted or seen the other way. In the end it's all twisting to make it seem as you want it to seem. The Greyshirt thing could easily be just as bad as it sounds. Miss St could have turned in Cam Newton because they lost out on Cam Newton (they would have played ball had they been the favorite to land him maybe). Oversigning and attrition gets white washed because it's Miss St and "he has to", to a degree that may be true, it also may be just what it looks like. Iowa has to take a ton of borderline kids, but they haven't done the same thing as Miss St has and Ferentz gets ragged here because he's a "Dinosaur" doing much the same or similar as Mullen has. His "midwest" roots are actually the East Coast, then a little bit at ND, before getting out of dodge. He has no history in Michigan's most important recruiting beds: Ohio and Michigan. He does have just one good year and has beat very few good teams and has padded his stats with beating a lot of bad teams. 

And then there is the heart of my argument. In every way, Mullen gives Michigan the same or a lesser version of Urban Meyer. You want to beat rivals, but in no way are you giving yourself an advantage over OSU. Urban is from Ohio, GA'd at OSU, had roots at OSU, Illinois St, ND, and Bowling Green; aka much of the midwest. He had good coaches lined up from the midwest like Fickell and now Larry Johnson (and was helped getting set up by the whole interem staff). So recruiting against Meyer when he is at OSU and already established and winning, for a very similar offensive system,  that has performed as well without Mullen as with him, and better now than how Mullen is doing, with much better roots in the area, highly, highly favors Meyer in basically every regard.

The National Championships that Mullen gets to brag about, Meyer was the head coach for those. No advantage there. He doesn't have a leg up on offense or on defense over Meyer and OSU. A hire of Mullen is a hire to not compete with OSU. And I know people are basically like "I just want to compete with anyone right now", but it doesn't take Michigan to where Michigan wants to be. Maybe they compete a bit better with MSU, but Dantonio and Co now have the history and roots in the area for recruiting, and have an established scheme that can work well against Mullen's offense. It's low upside territory we're looking at. And I get the game decisions he makes are great now because people don't watch him all the time, but you watch up close and he makes questionable decisions too. People outside Nebraska liked Tim Beck, Nebraska fans didn't. It's the better on the other side of the fence argument a bit in this situation.

You want to compete for B1G titles, division titles, etc, Mullen is not the answer. I get a bit of the feeling that Mullen is a good coach for Miss St and then he'd get similar results regardless of where he went as a HC. He's an above .500 coach that hopes to hit a homerun with a lot of seniors and a horseshoe up his butt (to give the backhanded compliment that is sometimes given). But he doesn't give an advantage for Michigan over Michigan's current competition. He's likely Franklin, but at least Franklin had roots and momentum at PSU with BOB leaving. Mullen doesn't have that advantage. In fact, there is no built in advantage for Mullen to get the snowball rolling the other way. Immediately, everything is stacked against him other than "this is Michigan, fergodsake". And in my opinion, that's too much and Mullen is not enough to not be going through this process a few years down the road again. Despite the lack of other great options, this would be a very low-upside hire.

michelin

December 4th, 2014 at 6:20 PM ^

he did spend two years at Bowling Green, so he does have some familiarity with midwest recruiting.  I am not sure how useful his southern recruiting ties would be for UM, except perhaps for Fla. But his east coast ties are not entirely irrelevant, as the B1G has now expanded to that region.  (and recently, our two highest rated recruits, Peppers and Green came from the east).

FWIW, Mullen also met his wife while she was a sportcaster in Toledo.  Although she broadcast for the Golf Channel--which seems a far cry from FB-- she herself may still have some midwest media ties, which could be useful.

Space Coyote

December 4th, 2014 at 6:27 PM ^

But it's 2 years as a ND GA and two as a QB Coach at Bowling Green. Compare to Urban, who is from Toledo, played and UC, coached HS football in Ohio, was a GA and WR coach at OSU for two years, at Illinois St for two years, was at ND for five years, was a HC at Bowling Green for two years, and came back a decade later.

Mullen hasn't touched the midwest (his limited touch there) in the a dozen years, and hasn't been out east for since 1998 (other than being raised there, he has little extended history out that way as far as coaching). Again, he doesn't really give any leg up on Meyer, and I don't think he adds a ton of benefit on the East Coast either. He won't have a hot bed, he'll be forced to still take lesser FL players (similar to Rich Rod but without the recent Michigan success and WVU type success), and nothing to really hang his hat on. It's just a bad foundation to start to rebuild the program.

michelin

December 4th, 2014 at 6:57 PM ^

My first thought had been: well, Bo also played seccond fiddle to an Ohio HC before coming to UM. But I don't think that answers the importatnt questions you raise.  Why?  Bo was no ordinary coach.  He had an incredibly persuasive and strong character.  I suspect that you could tell that even while he still was an assistant.  When people like him enter a room, you know they are there.

As for Mullen, I really have no basis for judging his personal qualities.  I think that most will agree: we need to look for a very strong leader now. 

Brodie

December 4th, 2014 at 7:07 PM ^

if you read through the thread, while Mullen was technically a GA (ie. unpaid), in reality he was coaching ND's quarterbacks in those two seasons. It's my understanding that this is a common way to get around staff limits and generally what it means when you see guys like Mullen with multiple GA tenures without having actually ever earned a graduate degree from those schools

Njia

December 4th, 2014 at 8:05 PM ^

By the time he was hired at Michigan, Bo had already been coaching at Miami (NTM). As a result, he knew the territory (literally) and all of the coaches who had kids coming up through the high schools who might be targets.

And U-M when Bo took over was very mediocre, but still had some good players that provided a solid foundation for the new staff to develop.

Of course, Bo's offensive and defensive schemes were 100% all-natural Woody Hayes. However, in the era in which Bo started at Michigan, having a "3 yards and a cloud of dust" offense was considered an advantage.

Space Coyote

December 4th, 2014 at 8:22 PM ^

I think the biggest thing is that it was a very different era. You had the money to recruit a lot of players; and have the facilities to be better than all but OSU (of which you're even)? You had a program that still has an environment of success? You have very recent history in the recruiting hotbed that will feed your program? At that time, for those things, it was Michigan, OSU, ND, and everyone else. MSU had it's run, partially because they weren't afraid to take very gifted black players. A lot of other teams had their years, but by the late-60s, it was OSU-Michigan.

And now there is so much more media, recruiting sites, win now, succeed now, national media, the internet, there is so much more working against it now. Multiple teams win national titles, more region game, etc. It was just something that was a lot more probable than it is now, especially because I don't believe Mullen has sold himself as someone seperate from Meyer.

Space Coyote

December 4th, 2014 at 8:16 PM ^

And most of those aren't very realistic. But you don't necessarily need a Harbaugh/Meyer level hire to be successful. But you need some sort of advantage. Some connections in the area, a different style, a different mentality, something to differentiate yourself rather than simply being the lesser-version of your rival's coach.

Say what you will about Rich Rod, but he had something that differed from Tressel and Dantonio, in the way he ran his program, in his style of offense, in his style of defense. Often times those teams didn't even recruit the same guys.

Say what you will about Hoke, but he created a very different environment than Meyer and ran a different style of offense and defense (Meyer's D at OSU anyway; obviously it was similar at UF).

Neither of those guys were successful, but they at least gave themselves a chance to be successful. Hoke's DC was Meyer's DC. Hoke ran a pro-style scheme. Hoke had more of a family atmosphere. 

I'm not saying Michigan needs to be pro-style, but being a guy directly in Meyer's shadow is asking for trouble. Rich Rod's spread is different enough from Meyer's that you could make an argument that schemes could cover a broad enough ground. You could use a spread-to-pass. You can differentiate your defense. You can grab someone with ties to the area.

You can find a lot of coaches that could at least give you that shot to differentiate yourself and build something out of the OSU shadow. They may be more risky from a stability program, but Michigan isn't about going 7-5. 

Brian

December 5th, 2014 at 1:36 AM ^

Most of your objections about spinning things are flat out false. Oversigning concerns were not downplayed--Mississippi State does not oversign. The Cam Newton accusation is totally unfounded and contradicted by ESPN accounts. And then you make a bunch of arguments that are not in context of available players. 

Again, sure, if a Patterson or Shaw or whoever is available they would be serious considerations. Nebraska just hired Mike Riley and Florida hired Jim McElwain. I am operating under the assumption that those guys are not in play. You offer no reasonable alternative who is achievable. You just say "no," which is useless. Instead of Mullen you want...?

And frankly the assertion that a 42-year-old who just did *that* in *that* SEC West is "low upside" is ludicrous. 

pescadero

December 5th, 2014 at 1:39 PM ^

In every way, Mullen gives Michigan the same or a lesser version of Urban Meyer.

 

Other than Harbaugh, every single coach that has been mentioned as a possibility for Michigan is lesser than Urban Meyer.

 

If your criteria is "better than Urban Meyer" - you're completely on the "Harbaugh or Bust" bandwagon.

 

 

acnumber1

December 4th, 2014 at 6:28 PM ^

Better get these profiles published quickly.  I heard a guy on the radio say we'd know this weekend and that it will be someone nobody has thought of.  

 

And that we'd all be happy.

Madonna

December 4th, 2014 at 6:28 PM ^

Strong analysis with both erudite and humerous low-brow references.  I mean how many people can work in a Latin phrase and reference the Golden Girl's theme song in one article, on any topic. Well done.

Although i just joined for this latest search, I have been a dutiful reader back to the post-Lloyd search.

 

bronxblue

December 4th, 2014 at 7:21 PM ^

I know what Brian is getting at regarding the one year wonder argument, but I do wonder if he would be #2 on this list of he had gone 8-5 again like he has historically. And winning two titles at Florida is great, but that was the Meyer show as much as anything Mullen has done. that said, I would welcome him here. Seems like a decent upside, and he knows how to use a sub optimal situation and not crater.

bronxblue

December 4th, 2014 at 8:43 PM ^

I guess that is what scares me about him; it feels like people are buying high on him because his teams beat a couple of 4- and 5-loss teams in October when we all thought they were much better.  He might be better than I'm giving him credit for, but this feels a bit like Hoke's 2011 season a year early.

I'm fine with Mullen because I do like what he's done at MSU and do tend to believe that some of the issues regarding grayshirts and roster attrition/"management" aren't terribly relevant at Michigan because of different circumstances.  But to me, he's a HC who has to come with some good coordinators because I'm not sold he's going to take over one-half of the team and mold it into his signature piece.  As I've said other places, I'd pretty Michigan go after an up-and-coming coordinator, but if they have to go with current/former HCs by all means give Mullen a look.  His SEC-ness is way less onerous than Miles's, so he's got that going for him.

JBLPSYCHED

December 4th, 2014 at 8:20 PM ^

Dan Mullen may have done a great job building a program at the Indiana of the SEC West but he can't do the same at Michigan and give us the momentum we need to be Urban at his own game. It's terrible that we're in this position but we're in semi-desperate need of a splash hire, head coach with a proven track record who can genuinely project a no-BS "we're taking back what's rightfully ours" confidence to us fans. That's why we all want Jim Harbaugh to come home (more so than the fact that he was a successful U-M QB in the '80's). If we can't get him then let's go get someone like him in the next generation. If Bob Bowlsby could find Jim at the Univ. of San Diego then Jim Hackett can do the equivalent!!! Go Blue!

smwilliams

December 4th, 2014 at 8:38 PM ^

Stanford's all-time winning %: .555%

Jim Harbaugh's winning % while HC at Stanford: .580% with one season over 10 wins (his last)

Miss. St's all-time winning %: .506%

Dan Mullen's winning % while HC at Miss. St.: .605% with one season over 10 wins (his last)

Obviously, Harbaugh has spent 4 years succeeding at the NFL level in an extremely high pressure environment so it's not entirely the same, but if we're using their FBS stops as a barometer, um, there's not much of a difference.

uminks

December 4th, 2014 at 9:18 PM ^

to get Jim Harbaugh here!  If he decides to stay in the NFL. I would look to take another successful coach like Bob Stoops. Otherwise, I would go with Miles since he is a good coach and recruiter plus he bleeds blue, he will work his ass off to get Michigan into the playoffs. Mullen would be at my 2nd level a good coach who will probably be successful here over time. I'm not sure if Mullen would be willing to put the effort in this job like Miles would.

Danwillhor

December 4th, 2014 at 9:32 PM ^

but I'd support his hire. This school, program and all that are involved with it need to give no less than total support to the next HC. Don't want but I'd live, get behind him and hope for the best. I'd support a coach I have in my low 2nd-tier. Taking a 3 day break from the blog for sanity sake. If questioned (your right and no offense taken) I'll happily give my list when I come back. Go Blue!