I suspect, even if Michigan were to be this bad for another decade, resentful jerks like Bielema would still be saying stuff like this. We have so much tradition it doesn't matter how low we get, people will still take joy in kicking us in the ribs! It's almost a consolation.
Postgame Presser Notes: Wisconsin
"Craig Roh, Mike Martin, Darryl Stonum, the list goes on. It's just one of those crazy years." He's never had this many key guys out with injury, but the backups need to step up in big spots. This team is too inexperienced to handle that.
Roh - "some kind of concussive type of symptoms." Probably the same for Vincent Smith, though RR hasn't had a chance to talk to the trainers yet.
"Didn't play well, didn't tackle well, didn't catch the ball well." You can't win games doing that against a good team.
The first half was disappointing, because they didn't make the most of their limited possessions. Potential touchdown overthrown, etc. Weren't able to get rhythm with limited possessions in the first half. In the second half, they needed one of those onside kicks in order to keep momentum.
"If everybody stays healthy, they will get a little bit better, I think" during the season, but expecting leaps and bounds of improvement from guys won't come until bowl or spring practices.
"As frustrating as it is for all the fans - which I understand their frustration - it's just as frustrating for us coaches, too" because they can't help guys age overnight.
Wisconsin's efficient offense is a combination of factors, Tolzien is good at executing the offense, makes the plays that are there. "They had some guys wide open on some middle dig routes, and I gotta see what happened with that. That was probably the most disappointing part."
Knew they needed to develop a rhythm early in the second half. Needed one big stop or one successful onside to capture momentum.
"I didn't want to screw up and make a major mistake" at the end of the first half, so he didn't want to stop clock. He wouldn't do it differently if he had the chance. "If we had not gotten the ball first in the second half, I probably would have used the clock a little bit and went on from there."
Bad tackling - "The hard part is, to work on it during the season, how do you do live tackling?" Don't want guys to get hurt - can't afford more injuries. Another reason is "sometimes you miss tackles because you're just not strong enough yet."
"They're older bigger, experienced physical teams" that have run over Michigan. He'd be more disappointed if Michigan had comparable age and experience. Not trying to make an excuse, it's reality. The young guys will be better next year because of their playing time this year. "We've gotta get those guys to that level as quickly as we can." Numbers are better now on D, but the guys are young.
They weren't thinking about the QB rushing record for Denard. He was close to breaking loose a couple times in the first half. "He just wants to win, so this day's disappointing. But we've got the big one next week."
Tate's playing time at the end was because they want to keep him in the loop, wanted to give him a few game reps on plays they think he can execute well.
Field goals: "That's been ongoing. Seth had clearly kicked better all week in practice." Never seen him miss one from the middle of the field in the past month. Gibbons's extra points weren't great, anyway.
"It's a challenge anyway, your'e playing a great team at their place. But it's Ohio State-Michigan, it's not going to be hard to get the guys fired up to prepare for it."
No injury at the end of the game, just a coaches' decision.
On the offense's poor production in the first half - "Guess we came out kind of flat. We came out real flat." Not sure why that happened.
"Got too anxious" on the overthrow to Stonum. He was excited to make a big play.
When they went on a run in the third quarter, they just played like they'd been practicing all along. "Basically we just got it together."
Everybody who plays Michigan is going to fight. Wisconsin was one of those teams. "Everybody came in here to fight us, and they fought us, too. We fought back."
On his good day running: "I felt good today, my offensive line was blocking good, and God was with me." The record - "It don't mean nothing to me right now. I mean, we're ready to play Ohio State, you know."
JJ Watt "He's a great defensive end, and hats off to him."
The team has a chance to redeem themselves in the last game and the bowl game.
Hats off to Wisconsin for slowing Michigan down first half. Low possessions because they were controlling the clock with the run.
After half there were some changes. "We just gotta go out there and play Michigan football."
Drops were due to a lack of focus. "As wide receivers you gotta catch them balls." Receivers' job is to catch the ball, so they have to.
"We were in position, we fought with 'em. But we've just gotta make those tackles."
His injury was a shoulder stinger, just needed a couple plays off.
On his interception - "Of course we're thinking about scoring" to start a comeback - there wasn't enough time to finish it.
They knew Wisconsin was going to come out and run "we fought back with them, just gotta come out and make some tackles, that's all."
They take cheap shots even after blowing us out. I can't imagine what the hate will be like once we start rolling with a team full of experience.
How do we beat them for recruits? Did you see the size and strength of their lines yesterday? I'd say with the exception of Wisky's secondary, they have bigger, stronger, faster athletes in a lot of positions than Michigan.
Don't forget, Bielema went for 2 with seven minutes left in the 4th quarter against Minny while Wisky was up 41-16.
Bielema is and always has been a jerk, but whatever. On to OSU.
Of note, wait until next year, when all those seniors are gone and he has to win with a first-year QB and a smattering of new starters on both defense and offense. Two years ago they were 7-6, 3-5 in the B10 with a young team, and people were calling for his head. Let's see how good this UM team is in 2 years with all those upperclassmen against the same Wiscy team.
horrid Spiderman III with the huge sandman figure swatting at the fleet but small spiderman. Spiderman never beat him - he just went away.
Every man on the UW team seemed to be 100lbs heavier and 6" taller than the Michigan player.
Is there stats for the biggest college football team? This year's UW team looked like the largest college football team ever assembled.
JJ Watt was a nightmare - almost Brandon Graham scary.
I wish somebody had a screen shot of the first pass bat-down that Watt made where Vince Smith was blocking him. When Watt rose up to deflect the pass and Vince went low to undercut him, Vince looked like Little Mac against Bald Bull.
Tough loss, but it's painfully obvious we got caught looking ahead to Ohio State*.
* Star dot thingy denotes presence of sarcasm
I think it's over. I think Rich Rodriguez will have success as a big time FBS coach, but I think he will be fired at the end of this season.
Dave Brandon has repeatedly said he will evaluate many factors when making his decision and at this point I think the totality of it all points to the end of this era. This team is simply not competitive against the top tier of the Big Ten. UM is pretty clearly looking at a 7-5 season where 3 wins were decided in the last minute of the game and all four losses were blowouts, with three of them at home. Of the seven wins, at most two of those teams will be bowl eligible and will top out at a record of 7-5 (maybe, Illinois). The defense is an absolute disaster.
The offense is starting to feel like a mirage against top level competition. In the four losses to the point, the offense has scored 10, 7, 10, and 0 in the first halves leading to halftime or third quarter deficits of 21, 21, 21, and 24 points. The offense made some plays in all four games after falling into big holes, but it was significantly too little, too late in every occasion.
Perhaps most importantly, perception is reality. Perception drives recruiting, donations, and media coverage. There are valid explanations for a lot of the issues this team has (decimated defense and all), but in the grand scheme of things, that doesn't really matter. The above failings are what the world at large sees, and that is what they take in. Mgoblog is a wonderful website for all of us hardcore Wolverines, but I don't think we realize how insulated we become from the perception of this program in general. Rich Rodriguez's tenure at UM is a joke to 95% of the world, and that is a huge problem. As I drove out of AA this afternoon and lost 1050's range, I shifted over to 97.1. No one wanted to call in and talk about State's dramatic comeback win to keep their Rose Bowl hopes alive. They all wanted to call in and talk about the disaster that is Michigan and Rich Rodriguez. That matters. UM is still clearly number one in this state, but that can change. That can change very quickly. Just look at UM and MSU's respective basketball programs for evidence.
There are a lot of reasons that this team should be considerably better next season. We've been over that. The one thing that isn't going to get magically better is how this team is seen as long as Rich Rodriguez is in charge. It's not fair to Rodriguez, but the best way for this team to get better faster is for the pieces that Rodriguez has put in place to be taken to the next level by a new coach that has positive capital in perception in the media, on the recruiting trail, and in the big donors pocket books.
Dave Brandon already has said RR will be back next year.
As much as it disappoints me to hear the Big House boo, this defense is horrible. There are no excuses, there are no moral victories. The defense is just plain horrible. Wisky threw once (and the secondary is supposed to be the weak point) the entire second half.
Like the announcers were saying today, Michigan is a major university; there's no reason not to have talent on defense. The youth excuse is played out one game shy of 3 seasons into this program.
Where and when did Brandon say that RR would be back?
In a press conference after the weekend they beat Illinois/the NCAA final report came out.
A quote or it doesn't exist. Brandon has said numerous times that he will evaluate the program at the end of the season. He also said the Illinois week was a good week for the head coach, but I don't remember him saying definitively that RR will be back. I am not saying RR won't be back. I am saying Brandon hasn't said that RR will be back as of yet.
Is this new? I don't think this has been said.
You can't really say in one breath that MGoBlog represents an insular mindset of fandom, them point to 97.1 radio show and note that the only people who called in wanted to diss RR. Both are selective audiences, though I tend to think Brandon falls more on the MGoBlog-informed side than Bill in Royal Oak or whatever.
Yes, the perception of UM as an elite program has taken a hit, but Nebraska had a couple of down years and still rose back to the top. Not to pick on casual fans (I'm one of them), but usually you know a great deal about your team and know very little about others, and luckily most AD's know we are dumb and don't listen. I look at Georgia and I see a crappy team, but fans of the Dawgs would have a million reasons why that team has struggled. Same with Texas. If this team makes the necessary steps forward people kind of expect from maturation and a new DC, I fully expect UM's reputation to return.
You can't really say in one breath that MGoBlog represents an insular mindset of fandom, them point to 97.1 radio show and note that the only people who called in wanted to diss RR. Both are selective audiences,
I agree, and that is kind of the point. I think that we here sometimes forget that there are other audiences out there, and they are powerful. I play basketball with five other guys who are not obsessive UM followers like me, and they get most of their information there. I'm not trying to make a judgement on it. BUT, I don't think the power and sheer size of those audiences can be ignored.
Yes, the perception of UM as an elite program has taken a hit, but Nebraska had a couple of down years and still rose back to the top.
Exactly. And what was the biggest factor in Nebraska's turnaround?
If this team makes the necessary steps forward people kind of expect from maturation and a new DC, I fully expect UM's reputation to return.
That is probably true, but there is a big "if" in there that I don't think can be assumed as easily as others seem to. My point is that reputation and perception are hugely important and those could be restored almost instantly by the right hire making the improvements that are likely to happen as this team matures.
I find your posts to be well reasoned and thought out. I have a weird fondness of RR for some reason so I hope its not true, but it could be. If it does happen lets hope things go better.
Unfortunately most fans are just very ill informed. I have no problem listening to the radio and laughing as some random caller tries to bring down Rich Rod and Michigan football. I laugh and find it entertaining because most of the comments are really so factless that it just shows how ignorant a segment of fans can be when they don't have things their way. I consider myself a rational fan who considers all of the facts and then makes a conclusion. I would hope Dave Brandon uses a similar thought process when considering the situation Rich is facing at Michigan. If Brandon is seriously affected by the perception of uninformed radio callers then Rich Rod is definitely not the problem at Michigan and we need to find a new AD.
Most radio callers have literally no idea the talent drop off Michigan has suffered in the transition between Lloyd and Rich. Most fans who call in expect Michigan to be good because they are Michigan. It's similar to delusional Notre Dame fans. Our reputation amongst people who know football is fine. Coaches know the great football teams that Rich can put together, coaches respect Rich immensely for his knowledge of the game.
I guess I don't see why you believe our reputation with a segment of fans is all that important if our team is still improving from year to year. It's an easy formula, if Rich wins, dumb fan grows happier and the perception changes quickly. If Rich stops improving before he reaches an elite level, dumb fan will continue to complain but then rational fans and more importantly David Brandon will become unsatisfied.
When people with football knowledge start questioning whether Rich has what it takes to be a successful coach then Michigan's reputation really takes a hit. If Michigan fires Rich Rod he will be hired almost instantly and that is because he commands respect in the college football world. There is a reason why people believe he is a great coach and he was offered jobs like Michigan and Alabama. He has a lot of respect from not only his resume but he is well respected by coaches like Urban Meyer who ask for advice from Coach Rod.
Honestly the only thing that will earn any coach at Michigan or any other big time football school respect is winning. Rich Rod has reasons for not being as successful as past coaches. Most fans and audiences do not understand this. They see this as an excuse when Rich Rod is simply giving the state of the team honestly. When he begins winning again the perceptions will change again. Fans can chirp all they want but Rich Rod has pieces in place to improve again next year and that is a formula of success that perception cannot change. 7-5 was a reasonable expectation this year considering the defense and youth throughout the team. Next year 8 to 9 wins will be reasonable and so on.
Reputation means nothing if we hire some new coach and he has a bad record next year. It shuts up the dumb fan segment around the time of the hire but it doesn't really do anything positive for the football program. The sooner fans realize we are in a transition phase and that small progress is a great thing rather than a bad thing, Michigan football will be better off. Big time programs go through transitions, it happens everywhere. Michigan made the correct hire the first time and so we are improving gradually as our young players mature. This is actually one of the smoother transition phases of many of the elite programs. Places like Nebraska, Alabama and Notre Dame had years of improvement and regression. Michigan has only seen improvement even with a roster loaded with young players. And by the way Nebraska and Alabama were not good all of a sudden because Bo Pelini and Nick Saban took over. They were working with some very high caliber talent so comparing the situation to the one that RR inherited is comparing apples to oranges.
"If this team makes the necessary steps forward people kind of expect from maturation and a new DC, I fully expect UM's reputation to return. If they do get a new DC";
who knows if he'll be better. Will RR allow him to run whatever scheme he wants, and hire his own assistants?
I expect that any new DC brought in will be given far more autonomy than Schaffer and GERG ever received. Brandon and RR probably both realize that the current situation just doesn't work, and I expect changes to be made.
You're an idiot. Address his points if you have an argument. His was a very well thought-out and articulated post, whether you agree with it or not.
Dude, it was two lines, I think he probably made his way through it. Guess what, if this board required something new in every post, there wouldn't be much said period. I, like every other person here, put out my opinion on the status of this program. I realize it means nothing in the big picture. You on the other hand decided to go with a douchey comment and try to be funny. I've evaluated that, and I think you fail.
'Rodriguez's tenure at UM is a joke to 95% of the world, and that is a huge problem."
I have MSU friends of mine taking up a collection to make sure RR stays.
I miss smash mouth football and good defense at UM. I want to believe that this O will magically transform against major teams next year, and that the D will be good enough to allow us to hang with them. But i don't see it. The O may get better... but not enough, I fear. And I don't see the D as getting much better at all.
Here's hoping we magically pull out a win vs. OSU.
I don't think RR is gone. I'd be stunned. Michigan is very conservative about such things, and he does have alot of reasons for his problems.
Rich will be around next season, G. Robinson too, and the program is moving in the right direction. The boys blew their feet off in the first half, but they did manage to outscore Wiscy's hogs in the second half. If we could make a damn FG we would've cut their lead to 7 points when it was W-31 and the good guys 21, which might have changed the complexion of the game. We almost got 'Big Mo' on our side but couldn't quite get him to bite. Rich made an impact in that locker room at the half and it showed. Mr. Brandon is an ex-baller and he knows what the hell is going on with this team and if he can't see the bright future ahead of us then he needs to take the blinders off. Besides, who gives a rats' ass what people outside the program think. As long as we do the 'right' thing, show some class, and have our hearts in the 'right' place then it doesn't matter what people think or perceive. Besides, Mr. Brandon is working on marketing the team or brand better so I don't see perception of others being an issue. Our school, football program, etc., will be marketed in a positive light. All I know is RR has the boys competing hard for an hour every game, there's no quit in this bunch. Coach has a team, not a bunch of selfish "I's", and it shows. My grandmother has been a big donator for over 50 years and she likes what she's seeing...she'll keep on donatin'. As for recruits...we'll get 'em (the good ones) because they'll see a chance to come in and play right away. Just my opinion Kilgore Trout, not that it matters to anyone...
unfortunately, the games last more like three hours. And the No quit? Ugh. That's pure Wayne Fontes. 'This team has no quit...'
I hope Michigan turns around; but we can't keep getting trounced by good teams, going waaaay behind (which is partly on the offense not being able to score in the first half) and then losing despite a 'comeback'.
I want the team to win. I want a discipined team, winning a disciplined game with toughness and grit. Not a 'We almost won and did a great job the second half and we only coughed up the ball 2 times' effort against every ranked team.
a reality check pal. Check out Brandstatter's post on his website...he's spot on. By the way...4 quarters at 15 minutes a piece is one hour of playing time...dumb ass. I know the games last 3 to 4 hours. We all want the team to win...every damn game if they could...but to knock our boys' toughness and grit? I don't see a lack of it and haven't all season for that matter. Our program is moving in the right direction, it just takes time for our kids to learn and get physically bigger before we can go toe-to-toe with the likes of Wiscy's hogs. Oh, and sorry for the 'dumb ass' remark... no offense JFW.
The issue isn't 7-5/8-4, defensive injuries, etc. Yes we have the winning record we'd realistically expected going into the season but the problem is how we've arrived at it. As Kilgore says poor first half performance by the offense.
Today if we manage to bag 10 points in the first half and we don't have to go into panic mode as much in the 4th. Maybe it makes a difference, maybe it just makes the score closer. I don't know.
If Purdue had managed to score an offensive touchdown or two we might be screaming about the Purdue loss still.
Basically if we were winning or losing games in a manner along the lines of the Illinois game I'd be more content with the losses (if such is possible). That kind of play would point to "Functional offense / horrible defense." Yet we're getting flashes of brilliance out of the defense. They kept us in the game today in the first half while the offense got shut out.
So when I'm judging the coach staff I'm not judging the record, I'm not judging the defense, I'm judging the fact that in year three of a rebuilding program by a guy known for the spread offense, our offense has trouble showing up against B10 teams. Lots of turnovers in some games, long droughts of listless production and panicked second half comebacks to make the score look closer than it was.
That's why the staff is feeling heat, because the one thing we thought they'd manage to get working isn't working against the top levels of the B10.
I know RR's a smart guy and he managed to win a BCS Bowl with WVU, yet I look at him at Michigan and I see the place kicker disaster, the defense that seems to shift fronts every week and I have a hard time having faith we have some kind of master long plan that everyone is sold on. Three years and we can't put at least one consistent unit on the field. Best we have is our offense which seems to have two modes: "Kill everything in our path" or "Hibernate".
Once Michigan won that 7th game and the NCAA went "meh" at the investigation, RichRod's job was secure for at least one more season. I'm sorry* if this information is upsetting to you.
I suggest that you stop listening to sports talk radio call in shows. Making any decision based on what those callers think would be anti-leadership. Seriously, that stuff will kill your brain cells.
*I'm not actually sorry.
This team still needs bigger,faster and better running backs. Not much production from them,which would give the offense another threat. DR needs to get better with his throws.He missed wide open receiver early in game that would have been a t.d. Receivers are very good,but they drop passes a little too much and need to make receptions to keep drives alive. The defense needs to get bigger ,faster and older.. Need more depth at D line and linebacker. The special teams need vast improvement especially at kicker. I was listening to the game on the radio and the announcers said that after our kicker missed the short field goal it looked like it demoralized the D. A good kicker is very important to the team. It can cost you a couple of wins a year .
I agree about the RBs. I think we came close to the ideal QB / RB package for this offense last year. A solid passer with great scrambling ability and a hard down hill runner with break away speed. Unfortunately, they never seemed to be healthy at the same time and one was a true freshman.
you should root for Wiscy instead. Maybe we can get Adrian Peterson to run the rock for us. Maybe we can bring Brady back so we don't have any more errant throws. Maybe we can get Des Howard back so we don't drop any more passes. Maybe we can bring the Bears 'D' from the 1985 season to come and play for us. Maybe we can bring in Adam Vinatierre so we don't miss any more field goals. Would that make you happy? I read your post and I'm left muttering to myself "Blah...Blah...Blah." Jesus...get real fella...
I merely posted comments about what I noticed about the game and what I think the team needs. No need to cop an attitude,loser.
Sick of this crap. If you can't see progress, I don't know what to tell you. I will make sure to tell the driver to speed up when all you haters are trying to hop onto the bandwagon next year. I eagerly anticipate the droves of " RR is a genius " next year. Until then, I wish you all a great night.
RR will be around for awhile so the 'haters' better get used to it. They better hope I'm not drivin' the bus 'cause we might see some flattened body parts if you know what I mean...
Is this the Michigan team we want to see? Hell no. However, you need to be completely jaded by anger not to see progress.
- Wisconsin fans have got to be the nicest fans around. I had quite a few near me in the stands, and all I heard them do was cheer for their team, relatively quietly I might add. Only once did the Wisconsin fans start a "let's go Badgers" chant that I heard. This team is 10-1, they've got a right to some swagger, but they had none. They were almost too quiet.
- I also had an "UNACCEPTABLE" Mich fan behind me. He started screaming himself hoarse just before the half. Actually, he was kind of entertaining.
- Booing at end of halftime - I can't imagine that had a very good impact on the visiting recruits. That said, I hate RRs decision not to call TO. You can't play the game with a goal "not to screw up". Be aggressive, let Denard chuck a few downfield and see what happens.
- Is it just me, or was there less RAWK music? I remember specifically one time in the 3rd on a critical 3rd down where I expected crap from the speakers, and instead they let the band play The Victors. Please do more of this.
- I loved the first onside kick call, even though we didn't recover it.
- I'm getting tired of hearing "they kick great in practice."
- Keep RR, send GERG on his merry way.
- I bet we beat tOSU next week.
The defense didn't stop Wiscy but they did get in there way. In the first half the defense put the offense in position to have the lead, and build on a lead. The offense did nothing! The defense clearly played hard, but became worn down. The offense seems to score only when the opponent scores.
My questions (2), why did they wait until the second half to turn it on? Why does RR continue to try fgs when he obviously doesn't have anyone who can kick one?
Pre-season, I thought 8-4 was realistic. Based on 2009, I figure we could beat either MSU or Iowa at home after near misses on the road. I chalked up Wisconsin and OSU as loses. Consequently, yesterday’s loss was not unexpected.
Nevertheless, there were certain troubling factors: (1) our defense really is weak. Not just weak as in bad, but physically weak. Chris Speilman pointed out that Michigan’s scheme wasn’t the problem, it was how weak and small we are. Once our players get blocked, they’re done. They don’t shed and recover. Even Mouton was getting destroyed. In contrast, when I watched Iowa v OSU, I noticed that even on perfectly blocked plays, defenders on both teams were able to recover and prevent the ridiculous long plays that Michigan gives up every week. (2) The coaches don’t seem to see the same personnel weaknesses that we as fans see. Why is Gallon still returning kicks? He’s not just bad, he’s horrific because he can’t hold on to the football. Why did it take 11 games to get Stonum back in the kickoff return game? Why 11 games before trying Dileo? Same with the kicking game. Broekheizen (sp?) is not the answer. He blows. Gibbons is on scholarship. If RR is going to give anyone the benefit of the doubt, why not the kid we’re paying to play? The defensive side has been debated all season, but yesterday confirmed to me that right now Cam Gordon may look good in a uniform, but he is not a good football player. Poor tackling, poor angles, etc. The one position I never noticed until the massive changes was the spur position. Why did the coaches feel the need to mess with that? (3) 3-3-5 doesn’t work in the Big 10, at least with our personnel. The elite teams in the Big 10 have huge offensive linemen and like to run the football. It’s no coincidence that these are the teams trouncing us. The 3-3-5 may be good against the spread, thus wins over IU, Purdue and Illinois make sense, but it doesn’t hold up against MSU, Iowa, Wisconsin and soon OSU. We need bigger bodies, not speed to compete with Big 10 elite teams. Why don’t the coaches understand that. We don’t need 3 safeties. We need 4 really big dudes on the line. Roh and Black are small. Wouldn’t they be better as weekside DE’s in a 4 man front. If Martin isn’t 100%, wouldn’t our line be more effective with 2 guys in the middle like Patterson and Washington?
My guess is the RR will be back, but I pray that DB gives him an ultimatum about the defensive side of the ball. RR needs to fire GERG, hire a big name DC and get out of the way. The other thing Speilman pointed out was that we don’t have 5 stars on defense. I believe that this is caused by GERG and RR. I think any big time recruit would look at us and say “why the F would I play in a 3-3-5 scheme if I want to go pro?” It’s a valid point. The only way to get around that is to bring in a great defensive mind that will attract great players. I can’t imagine anyone dreaming of playing for GERG because the Broncos were awesome in 1997 or whatever.
of the Capital One Bowl, Lloyd's last game. The defense was big and fast, AND BLITZED THE QB. Where have the big D-line and LBs gone? Why do we never blitz anymore? Obi Ezeh was a freshman in this highlight, and he played well. Shows you just how bad a coach can make a player. Ron English was a good DC. WHY THE HECK DID HE LEAVE? So, now we've got Gerg for hopefully only one more game (get a interim for the bowl game), recruit some big boys, and START BLITZING. It actually works!
you have a secondary who can cover man to man. It doesn't work well if you have a secondary who WILL be beaten by a hot read. We have the latter now. They didn't in 2008's Captial One Bowl.