[Bryan Fuller]

This Is Not A Searchbits But It's Not That Far Off Comment Count

Brian December 9th, 2020 at 1:50 PM

Well, folks: here we are. Michigan has still not announced an extension for Jim Harbaugh. Warde Manuel has said he will talk with Harbaugh after the season

“Jim and I will meet — as we have said — at the end of the year to discuss the program and where we’re going to go and all those different things,” Manuel said. “How rumors get started about things before both Jim and I sit down and have a conversation, I’m not going to get into. That’s not for me to try and track down.”

…which is hypothetically the 19th if Michigan is able to play this bonus crossover game. That happens to be after the early signing day, which is the 16th, and there is much consternation about this timeline.

Now: a lot of people are reacting to things that have not been said. In the same press availability the above quote comes from Manuel mentioned that he is in frequent conversation with his head football coach:

“You know we sit down we talk, you know, sometimes we’ll talk in November and and just in general to get a sense. We’ve had a lot of conversation in between. It’s not like we don’t talk, almost on a sometimes daily basis depending on the issues, sometimes weekly. It just... I don’t want to make anybody feel or think that Jim and I have been sitting around just waiting and not talking to each other about things we have had a lot to talk about.”

Manuel isn't sitting in his office wondering what's going to happen when he talks with Harbaugh. If there isn't something signed by now there's a reason.

[After THE JUMP: take a breath]

Waiting is fine

One issue with waiting is fairly easy to address: if recruits sign and Michigan makes a coaching change they can let recruits out of their LOIs, as is standard practice. The lack of landing spots then isn't going to be much different than the lack of landing spots now since the early date is now the de-facto Signing Day and most classes are complete or close to it.

Meanwhile, Michigan's gotten plenty of on-field data in year six of Harbaugh's tenure. One crossover game isn't going to change the equation significantly. But there is a variable out there: the interest level of NFL teams. Harbaugh has a ten million dollar buyout and you may have heard that there's a pandemic.

The coronavirus is stressing athletic departments to the point where Texas, one of the schools in Michigan's more-money-than-God tier, might end up sticking with Tom Herman. The context here is unprecedented:

Horns247 reported Sunday if Texas couldn't land Meyer, there’s a chance Tom Herman will remain as coach of the Texas Longhorns.

"There was an opportunity here too good not to pursue with Urban (Meyer)," the university source said. "If he's a definite no, we just need to step back and assess."

Paying a $25 million buyout to let go of a four-year coach who is 31-18 (.632) and replacing him with a three-time national championship coach like Meyer is one thing. Paying a $25 million buyout without a clear-cut alternative to Meyer is another thing, the source said.

Texas has already shot Herman's recruiting to hell with a very public flirtation with another coach. Sticking with him for a do-or-die season because you can't justify the dollars for the candidates available is hard to imagine in a normal year.

Harbaugh's buyout isn't as punitive as Herman's but it would be much easier to make a change if Michigan was off the hook for it. This was a theme of one of those Sam Webb posts in which he puts OPINION in bold and italics several dozen times in the gossamer hope people will read and comprehend: "In my OPINION, that will open the door wider for NFL dalliance. And if it gets to that point, my OPINION is that will be a mutual preference."

Extended timelines are justified here.

What about decommits?

There is a MAKE A DECISION NOW camp that dreads the possibility that Michigan will tank this recruiting class by dawdling. I find this argument unpersuasive. We've gotten unfortunately familiar with what happens with transition classes, and it's usually a few departures that don't wait around to see whether there's actually going to be a change. When Hoke got fired only one decommit happened within a month of the announcement, and a couple months later Mike Weber was a February signing day decision between OSU and Michigan that apparently swung when Michigan signed Karan Higdon.

Michigan did lose a handful of players during the season (decommits from George Campbell, Damien Harris, and Shaun Crawford were months before the 2014 spiraled into the ground); the bulk of what Hoke was able to cobble together stuck. Extending Harbaugh now might save Michigan a commit or two, but if this is actually going in the direction of a change that was likely to happen anyway.

What about getting candidates poached?

This is really about candidate, singular. Matt Campbell is the hot name after leading Iowa State to its first regular season conference championship since 1912—not a typo. He's come up in connection with Texas, but now it looks like Texas might not be in the market. The only other open P5 job right now is Vanderbilt. USC is 4-0 and Clay Helton is set to continue his tightrope walk. Dennis Dodd's hot seat list as of a couple weeks ago is 1) ludicrous (Jimbo Fisher's 10-year, fully-guaranteed contract is on it) and 2) completely devoid of potential openings that would tempt Campbell if Texas and USC stay on the sidelines.

Speaking of Dennis Dodd saying things, he was apparently on the sports talk radio saying Campbell wasn't interested in anything other than Notre Dame or Ohio State. This is immediately suspicious because neither of those jobs is likely to open any time soon, and then a Toledo-based reporter—Campbell coached the Rockets for four years—who knows Campbell personally detonated that:

If Michigan makes a change, Campbell will be there.

Okay but is the NFL interested?

This is a league that will put anyone named Schottenheimer in a head job. Hereditary? Awesome. Retread? Hell yeah. College? Doesn't count. Mike Florio writes the same "Harbaugh to the NFL" article every year. This year's edition:

Per multiple sources, Harbaugh is believed to be eyeing a return to the NFL, as a head coach.

Another source said that teams are doing their homework on Harbaugh, who instantly took the 49ers to the NFC Championship and who nearly led the team to a Super Bowl win in his second season with the team.

While Harbaugh has lost plenty of luster during his tenure in Michigan, it’s impossible to forget his accomplishments with the 49ers. The fact that his brother, John, continues to be one of the most successful coaches in the NFL won’t hurt, either.

Hard to take Florio seriously on this topic since he literally does this every year and has been completely wrong every year. There was an outburst of articles yesterday, all based on a couple of John U Bacon tweets:

This got extrapolated into "bidding war!" by folks aggregating Bacon when the original tweet does not state anything close to "there will be a bidding war for Jim Harbaugh." I think it's likely that someone takes a shot on Harbaugh if he's available.

Burying the lead

Is he available? Bacon reports that the extension on the table for Harbaugh is for less money with a lower buyout. These are circumstances where coaches will often look elsewhere if there are acceptable options.

Also in John U Bacon: he apparently asserted that if Harbaugh's back next year the only assistants to return would be Ed Warinner and Sherrone Moore on XM yesterday. So your options here are all new staff or almost all new staff.

Comments

funkifyfl

December 9th, 2020 at 2:05 PM ^

"Also in John U Bacon: he apparently asserted that if Harbaugh's back next year the only assistants to return would be Ed Warinner and Sherrone Moore on XM yesterday. So your options here are all new staff or almost all new staff."

 

Really happy to see that Warinner is at least getting the credit he deserves.

Watching From Afar

December 9th, 2020 at 3:43 PM ^

He has been getting plenty of praise over the last 2 seasons. He's a good OL coach and literally no one else has said otherwise.

It's surely some extension of the play calling, but the OL hasn't actually been all that great overall though. Their run blocking last year was average as they sat in the 50s for most of the season efficiency wise. This year (yes there have been injuries) they still have constant TFLs or 1 yard gains into a mess of bodies. They had Hayes and Mayfield against MSU and still ran into blobs of guys for 3/4 of that game. Against Indiana they ran for 13 yards and that wasn't because Indiana didn't worry about the pass. Milton threw for 300+ yards. Ran for less than 3.5 YPC against Rutgers.

Not saying fire the guy along with everyone else, but the OL hasn't reached some crazy high level. They've been solid compared to the wild swings in play from the QBs and WRs.

Watching From Afar

December 9th, 2020 at 5:54 PM ^

They lost 4 starters to the NFL off a line that was a little above average in run blocking for a majority of the season. They had to claw their way to 100 yards against Army and were under 4 YPC against PSU (and a smattering of eh games elsewhere). They had a 1st rounder in Ruiz and one of the best rookie OL in Onwenu yet they ran into brick walls for long stretches of the season.

Recall heading into this season we were expecting a more Wisconsin-like OL (in age/experience - NOT production) wherein you RS all your freshman, maybe even most of your sophomores, and then have a bunch of guys starting 2 or 3 years as upperclassmen. If not the pure athleticism and snap cout, there was at least age.

Filiaga is a RS Senior

Stueber is a RS Junior

Vastardis is a RS Senior

Hayes is a RS Sophomore as is Mayfield.

That OL was playing all but 1 drive of the MSU game and was average. Zinter is a true freshman and has already passed (at least) 3 guys older than him if not more. The backup OTs are an OG that moves back out and a RS freshman (better than a true freshman).

Again, Warinner is a good OL coach, but the OL has been just that since he got here. Good. Play calling obviously has something to do with it, but far too many runs are a mess of bodies piled up 1 yard downfield with a RB taking on a LB at 2 yards. "Isn't good" should not be the expectation with the bodies they have and the years of coaching they've received. Good, not great, should be the floor with a good OL coach and a bunch of highly rated guys who have been on campus 2+ years.

umgoblue11

December 9th, 2020 at 2:07 PM ^

Again, I will reiterate why hold a press conference if that was going to be your response to a question that you know you were going to get asked? And I humbly disagree with your point— it makes it look like Michigan is disorganized and does real harm to the program.

In a vacuum, sure just release the kids from their LOI. But there are real consequences for doing that. You’re going to piss off every HS coach, recruit and their family and risk being dragged on social media. Someone I know that recruits against Michigan is already using Warde’s words against guys in 2022. 

It’s not just about this year and this recruiting class, it’s about the future of this program with or without Harbaugh. 

Rabbit21

December 9th, 2020 at 2:17 PM ^

If players are released from their LOI's then while there may be some hurt feelings I have a feeling that it can be smoothed over with communication along these lines.  "This is not an ideal situation for anyone, no-one expected the season to be like this and to go in such a way that my hand was forced in going in a different direction.  At the same time the schedule was such that the timing pushed the decision into late in the year and I had to be careful to make the right choice.  I recognize none of this is ideal, but this is a year of extraordinary circumstances."  Yeah, its not going to make people feel better right away, but this is a shitty situation all around.  Frankly, if the players aren't sure about the situation, they do have the ability to not sign the LOI and wait until the February signing day.  

In any case if there is a new coach relationships are going to have to be rebuilt ANYWAY and frankly, if the coach you're referring to is who I think it is, he's ALWAYS going to negatively recruit Michigan as hard as he can and will just find a different angle, so... who the hell cares about that particular angle?

umgoblue11

December 9th, 2020 at 2:25 PM ^

The media does not care about nuance. The first line on ESPN.com after the presser was Warde saying waiting till end of season to make a decision. Just wait to see how hard we will be dragged by the media if that happens. It doesn't matter if we release them from LOI, it will be headline EVERYWHERE in sports Media: Michigan waits till after Signing Day to announce the decision. Finebaum, Stephen A, Sirius XM, ESPN, everywhere. Why are we commiting seppuku on this? 

Even if you remove the negative recruiting angle, which in this case honestly it's not negative recruiting it's just the truth. It's just a bad look for Michigan. If my kid was going to sign with Michigan on the 16th and they announced a MAJOR deal after that fact I would never trust the admin. 

1VaBlue1

December 9th, 2020 at 2:50 PM ^

I doubt like hell that they're doing anything in a vacuum where recruits are concerned.  They can ask - even in a dead period, they can call the program and ask questions - and UM will answer as best they can.  As long as UM is being truthful with what they know, even if that's nothing, there won't be any hurt feelings.  Disappointment, sure.  But that's very different from hurt feelings.

BTW, Pete Finebum, Stephen A Dipshit, and all the others can eat their bags of dick...

umgoblue11

December 9th, 2020 at 3:28 PM ^

Man for a group of folks who are so upset that Michigan and Belleville don't like each other but don't see how this could torpedo Michigan, well I don't know what to tell ya. Remember when Brandon was here and everyone was dragging him for PR blunders? I think I try to be tempered in my response, but I am very nervous about how the admin is handling this. 

Just letting everyone know that our rivals and other coaches are using our AD's words against us for kids this year and the next few classes. We're essentially throwing the baby out with the bathwater.  

1VaBlue1

December 9th, 2020 at 3:48 PM ^

I have no doubt that people are using this - and everything else - for negative recruiting.  They're going to do that anyway, for any reason.  And, for the record, I'm not very impressed with how Manuel or Harbaugh are handling this crummy season.  But I'm also not going to cry like a little bitch over every grievance, nor would I espouse catering to recruits aside from giving them truthful answers to any questions they have.

Some 'croots are going to go elsewhere, and some will stay.  Whoever is coaching next year will have to coach with the ones that stay.  Nothing changes about that regardless of how this is handled.

ptmac

December 9th, 2020 at 4:07 PM ^

One possibility is Warde said this just to buy some time and has no intention of waiting until the end of the season to can Harbaugh.

In this case, there is an offer, Harbaugh can accept it or go to the NFL. If it goes until Dec 19, then he is coming back and no recruits are burned. Everything looks legit, etc.

ERdocLSA2004

December 9th, 2020 at 6:16 PM ^

One possibility is Warde said this just to buy some time and has no intention of waiting until the end of the season to can Harbaugh.

If this is true then you don’t put a deadline out there.  You say something like, “we are talking daily and hope to have an agreement on the future of the program any day now”.  You keep people on the edges of their seat wondering if tomorrow will be the day.  If you give people a deadline, they don’t expect to hear anything until that day so they make plans if they don’t want to wait.

blue in dc

December 9th, 2020 at 5:04 PM ^

If we weren’t 2 and 4 and Harbaugh hadn’t lost the last two games to Ohio State by an average of 26 points this wouldn’t be a problem.   
 

There are 4 options for the program at this point:

1. Retain Harbaugh - if that is the plan, we should clearly do it before signing day.  If we do retain him but wait, you are 100% justified in everything negative you are suggesting

2. Fire Harbaugh now and hire someone before signing day - Easier said than done - have to pay Harbaugh’s buyout and not clear that your top choices will want to talk during the season.

3. Fire Harbaugh now and wait to hire - still pay the buyout and have all the negative perception issues you cite - worst of all worlds

4. Take the approach that Warde has taken.   Unless you like option #1, this doesn’t seem to be the horrible option you make it out to be.

Option 4a would be to take option 4, but be less public about it.    I’m really not sure this is much better.   The same speculation will exist.   The closer we get to signing day, the bigger the story will become.   Speculation will be ripe that we are going to fire Harbaugh because obviously we would have extended his contract if we were going to keep him.  If he gets fired afterwards it is an even bugger story that the recruits were kept in the dark   Here we are being 100% upfront about the uncertainty.

 

 

bluesparkhitsy…

December 9th, 2020 at 6:12 PM ^

This basically tracks my view as well, and #2 isn't an option this year because of the buyout.  It's not that Michigan couldn't pay it; it's that this would create huge backlash within the department in light of the layoffs, and it frankly would be unfair to many people Michigan cares about.

Other than retaining Harbaugh (which is *not* the preferred plan, or Warde would be building him up in a big way right now), option 4 is really the only acceptable option.  

I should note that there is an option 5, which is to do what Texas did and essentially conduct a public hiring process while letting the incumbent dangle, but that is extraordinarily dickish and would kneecap Harbaugh if he were to end up staying. 

There may be much to criticize later, but at this moment, all signs are either neutral or point to this being done thoughtfully.

ERdocLSA2004

December 9th, 2020 at 6:28 PM ^

You’re forgetting option 5.  Harbaugh tells Warde to stuff it, stays on as coach and he works thru the end of his contract as a lame duck coach destroying 2 years of recruiting cycles.  
 

Granted, this is probably least likely but may be Harbaughs best financial option if 1.) he doesn’t think his nfl prospects are decent, and 2.) he assumes, like the rest of us, he’ll only be around for 1 more season if he re-signs anyway.  He then plays a game of chicken with Warde to see if he’ll fire him.  If all of the above are true, and his proposed extension is a significant reduction in pay and buyout, Harbaugh could be getting more to go this route.  Considerably more if Warde fires him.  It all depends on the details of the proposed extension but you never know.

JamieH

December 10th, 2020 at 12:54 AM ^

Um, Manuel can fire Harbaugh whenever he wants.  Michigan just has to pay the buyout.  So if Harbaugh is back next season, it's because Manuel decided that was the best option.  Which----given the screwed up nature of everything, it might be.  

Basically, unless Manuel can lock up Campbell, we are probably better off just sticking with Harbaugh at this point.   Harbaugh has not been the disaster some are making him out to be.  Yes  THIS YEAR has been a disaster. But before now, his teams have been good, just not great.  He's been the Earl Bruce of Michigan football.
 

Jimmyisgod

December 10th, 2020 at 8:41 AM ^

Keeping a coach because you don't think you'll land the guy you really want is a bad mentality.  You evaluate the coach by his performance, then you either extend him or let him go, after you let him go then you see who you can find.  There are always good coaches available, you just have to find them.  Saying Campbell won't be available so keep the coach you think should be fired is a loser mentality.

JFW

December 9th, 2020 at 3:15 PM ^

We're taking a one day problem and turning it into a docu-drama. If this was something Harbaugh was doing directly people on this board would be puking themselves as to his incompetence and tone deafness. But because it might get them the magical change they want 'Meh, it'll be fine.'

tah15

December 9th, 2020 at 3:19 PM ^

Agreed! And, that extension "contract" gives Harbaugh leverage for negotiating his new NFL contract ("See, things aren't that bad; they still want me."). Warde saying he's waiting till the end of the year = "Hey NFL, come and get him!" People think there is this ongoing back and forth between Warde and Harbaugh. Not so! Warde and Harbaugh have this all worked out for transitioning him to the Jets. It's all part of the game. Harbaugh gains leverage for new NFL contract. Warde avoids "firing" Harbaugh and eating his final year. The new coach (hopefully Campbell) gets to finish his season. Everyone wins. Sure, we'll lose some recruits, but that's the cost of a coaching change. Bottom line: the program and Harbaugh need a fresh start. 

tah15

December 9th, 2020 at 4:58 PM ^

I'm just saying the optics, which we take at face value on these boards, are all part of the overall negotiation game. The NFL does know this! Warde is saying Jim is available, but not for free. The price for Jim in the NFL has probably never been better for a team like the Jets (whose owner loves Harbaugh). Khakis would at least make them competitive again (until he hits his 4th year). 

Where in Minnesota are you? I live in Minneapolis. 

sharks

December 9th, 2020 at 4:15 PM ^

For whatever it's worth, I recall OSU recruits being asked about negative recruiting when Urban stepped down, and the consensus was that only Penn St went negative.  I'm not in Sales, but I've heard the old saying about it being better to talk up your product than talk down the competition's.

Mocha Cub

December 10th, 2020 at 12:23 AM ^

"You're committing to a school that may or may not have a head coach & coordinators that recruited you. It will be all new people that haven't built any relationships with you and don't know your game as well. We've been recruiting you for months and care about your future. Michigan won't even tell you who the head man will be until AFTER you sign on the dotted line on signing day."

Some may call that negative recruiting. I'd call that being a straight shooter with a kid. Everything is true. If said (and I'm sure it is being said), it would have put doubt in my mind when I was 17-18 years old.

Rabbit21

December 9th, 2020 at 2:10 PM ^

Regarding recruiting I have a feeling there will be a couple of defections, but this class has hung together so far for a LONG time, with few additions or changes.  I would imagine this dynamic will mostly hold.  

The more important part is Michigan moving on to something different as the Harbaugh era has gotten beyond stale and I think a breath of fresh air is needed for the program, given Matt Campbell coached at Toledo, he knows the area and likely still have contacts he can leverage here.  

Fingers crossed that either the Jets or the Lions solve Michigan's problems for it.  We'll see.