SIAP: Druskinis booted from Michigan hockey team after being caught on camera spraypainting swastikas and homophobic slurs onto the University Jewish Resource Center
https://x.com/StopAntisemites/status/1708125586093207692?s=20
Michigan lacrosse player Megan Minturn also participated in the vandalism, but is so far only suspended and not kicked off her team. I'm not sure how either is even still allowed to attend the school. Unless Michigan has to go through some formal process to officially expel them, it's a complete failure by the University to allow them to still attend.
October 3rd, 2023 at 8:08 PM ^
It really wasn't until after WWII that you could look for a job in the classifieds without seeing "Gentiles Only" by many of the listings. Land ownership, many professions, many schools - there were always limits in place. Growing up here... you just didn't tell anyone. People didn't suspect unless you were religious.
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:12 PM ^
People changed their last names to sound less Jewish when they got here from Eastern Europe, Germany, and wherever else they came from. My family adopted a less observant/religious life once they got here in order to assimilate.
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:48 PM ^
My parents told me about signs that said, "Jews and dogs not allowed."
Fortunately, Jews in my generation have never experienced anything like that, and my children never have either. America is a golden land for us. These days there are discouraging stories, so I hope it's not changing.
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:41 AM ^
X/Twitter emboldens idiots like this. They get all wound up around their misunderstanding of what “free speech” means with their anonymous accounts that they forget there are real world consequences to speech. FAFO, jagoffs.
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:47 AM ^
You're an idiot that is all.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:33 PM ^
Good job addressing his points and making a coherent argument . . .
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:11 PM ^
I LOVE when someone gets consequences for their actions and cries free speech, clearly not understanding the concept at all.
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:46 AM ^
Yeah, that would be a no-no.
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:48 AM ^
Good riddance, asshole.
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:50 AM ^
I just do not understand what would compel someone to do this. It’s bad enough to harbor these type of thoughts privately inside your own mind, but to outwardly manifest them in such an ugly way is just, well…unforgivable. Good riddance, idiot. I sincerely hope that Johnny does some serious self-reflection in the coming months.
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:55 AM ^
Panic. Guy mighta been triggered.
October 3rd, 2023 at 12:00 PM ^
I have absolutely zero idea what you are trying to convey with this response.
October 3rd, 2023 at 12:05 PM ^
someone may have been trying to shoot him with the Gay,
I'm sure spray painting slurs was like casting a spell of protection.
October 3rd, 2023 at 6:27 PM ^
Easily dispelled. :-)
October 3rd, 2023 at 10:58 AM ^
Unless Michigan has to go through some formal process to officially expel them, it's a complete failure by the University to allow them to still attend.
yes, i'm sure there IS a formal process, but sure, let's jump right to "complete failure by the university." sheesh. hyperbole much?
October 3rd, 2023 at 11:14 AM ^
This is very disturbing. Both of these individuals should be expelled.
October 3rd, 2023 at 11:29 AM ^
I suspect both will be pursuing life outside Ann Arbor in the near future. Fuck them.
October 3rd, 2023 at 11:33 AM ^
WTF lock them up. Never again on this campus.
October 3rd, 2023 at 6:16 PM ^
While I agree that what they did is terrible and they ought to be punished, it always makes me cringe when someone throws the out “lock them up!” line for petty crimes. Personally, I don’t want to live in a society where vandalism carries a jail sentence. It is overkill both as a deterrent and as retribution.
October 3rd, 2023 at 11:46 AM ^
Here’s a question that deserves some thought. Could this be related to a team or frat/sorority rush hazing? They probably will come up with something like this as an excuse/justification or invoke free speech and claim what they are guilty of is vandalism. Hopefully it is not the result of a hazing ritual or we have deeper issues a la Northwestern to be concerned about.
Frankly, they should be subject to expulsion, with due process of course. We are a community and behavior like that and the intent that it signals is that they choose not to be part of that community. Harassment and intimidation is never acceptable.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:33 PM ^
Maybe I'm naive, but I would be pretty shocked to learn that a frat/sorority or UM sports team had "go spray paint hate speech on campus" as one of its rituals.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:43 PM ^
I agree with you. If a formal org like a club, team, or frat had "hate speech vandalism" as a normal part of their onboarding process, we'd know about it by now, because there'd be hundreds or thousands of instances every year. It's not like people in Ann Arbor wouldn't notice.
October 3rd, 2023 at 11:11 PM ^
And people were shocked about the allegations against Coach Fitz and his staff at Northwestern allegedly looking the other way about "running". The same can be said ad nauseam about other scandals in the BIG e.g. Sandusky, Nasser, Anderson. The fact is that "it can’t happen here" is an understandable defensive reaction. But without a thorough investigation nothing should be ruled out.
October 4th, 2023 at 12:48 AM ^
I'm not ruling it out. Like I said, maybe I'm naive, but it just seemed to me that student groups would have enough awareness to know that having your members go out in daylight and tag places on campus with hateful slurs was just...I just assume that they all would have more sense than that. Not necessarily as individuals (obviously), but as an organization. Maybe it's just wishful thinking.
In the meantime, I have since discovered that only Druskinis used a slur. Minturn spray-painted her initials.
The AAPD tweeted out a picture with the actual graffiti. Uncensored, so I am not embedding, but here's their tweet.
October 3rd, 2023 at 6:16 PM ^
Not a house on campus would put kids up to this. Not on their worst day.
October 3rd, 2023 at 11:56 AM ^
First and foremost, what this kid did was despicable, inexcusable and deserves to be expelled. With that said, is there a way that people close to him can help him learn and become a better person? While I never done anything that bad, I certainly made some knucklehead mistakes in my day (i.e. I've been to jail) and I'm glad I had a support network that helped me grow. I hope he can find something similar.
October 3rd, 2023 at 12:06 PM ^
I would prefer if this could be a teachable moment, but I think that depends on the circumstances and suspension:expulsion have to be on the table. That’s why, as others have noted, we don’t want to jump to conclusions here and let due process take its course. On the face of it, the video evidence seems to say it all, but then again, questions remain that an investigation would uncover. Was this coordinated and planned? Why in broad daylight? Why were two athletes involved? Is there a connection there?
October 3rd, 2023 at 12:50 PM ^
I agree. People can and do grow and there must be a way forward for these two to atone for their mistakes. I do think that based on what we know they do deserve to be expelled for what they've done - it's hard to imagine that their choice of spray-paintage wasn't deliberate. And forgiveness goes hand-in-hand with justice. You can't be like 'my bad, wont' happen again' for something like this.
I am concerned about the fact that they got to putative adulthood and still thought that this was okay; this indicates that they might not have the support system at home they need to grow and learn from this. I hope I'm wrong and hope that two individuals own what they did and become better people in the end - just not on campus.
Also, it rates mention that this is hardly isolated behavior, even in Ann Arbor. There's a group that protests a local synagogue across that street every weekend and one of its organizers is a notorious Holocaust denier. I would be very surprised if Druskinis knew who these yobs were, but my point is these are not just isolated 1% wingbats who think this way. They're in our community. I still remember a family friend who lived in Shaker Heights. I was a grade school kid at the time so don't remember the whole context but I absolutely remember her saying it was hard to do business in Shaker because of all the Jews here. I think we were at her house, or someplace private, but she said that sotto voce as if she knew it was wrong to say it but said it anyways.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:09 PM ^
They're adults. They don't need to learn that drawing hate symbols is wrong, they know that. The time for learning this on anyone else's time was when they were children.
:upscale()/2014/11/12/011/n/1922283/82141bda5c5ffb22_giphy-2.gif)
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:49 PM ^
Anytime something like this happens, i.e. hateful expressions but no physical injury to any people, and only nominal property damage, I think the "education vs punishment" discussion becomes relevant. And I think both elements are important. A purely punitive approach may cause the perpatrators to lean more into their hateful thoughts and identity. On the opposite end, a purely educational approach does nothing to protect those whose sense of safety was harmed or threatened by the original offense.
October 3rd, 2023 at 2:16 PM ^
Agreed 100%. There was a poster above that said "lock them up!". Really?!
Far too often we place purity tests onto people that we could probably not pass ourselves. I mean, we had Donovan Edwards post something antisemitic last year. We gave him the opportunity to learn and become a better person because of the event, and he stayed on the team. I'm not suggesting that this hockey player deserves to be reinstated, but rather we need to help him learn to be a better person after his punishment. Otherwise, he'll continue down the road of hatred and judgement.
October 3rd, 2023 at 6:13 PM ^
The hard thing is, we don't really know if Donovan Edwards became a better person, i.e. changed his mind about the stuff he posted. How can anyone know that for sure? What measures that? Couldn't someone just learn that he can't say the controversial stuff out loud because it offends people but he damn well still thinks it and says it among like-minded people? I'm not trying to be difficult here, I'm just trying to point out that the idea that we can teach people to stop believing certain things is kind of iffy. We can teach them not to behave a certain way, but we can't teach them to stop believing in something that is a part of who they are and what they've been taught since they were young. They have to do that themselves. (What if the hockey player's parents are the source of this homophobia? How do you tell a kid his parents are wrong and horrible people?)
October 3rd, 2023 at 5:01 PM ^
Should make them join and participate in some sort of lgbt club so they can spend some real time with some real people and realize their prejudices are ridiculous.
October 3rd, 2023 at 12:35 PM ^
Good. If these allegations are true, this is the only course of action.
October 3rd, 2023 at 12:50 PM ^
There's stupid, then there is next level stupid. The cost/benefit of these actions... But then again, hate was never about logic.
October 3rd, 2023 at 12:54 PM ^
They deserved to be punished and possibly expelled, but it's also being sensationalized. They marked up the walkway not the actual building and there were no swastikas. People saying lock them up are insane. They need to be punished and given the opportunity to learn and mature, but no need to ruin their life.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:24 PM ^
Maybe watch the video first? He doesn’t just spray paint the sidewalk. He also walks close enough to the door to get his picture taken in front of it. He knew what he was doing.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:38 PM ^
My bad. He painted the sidewalk AND gets close to a door. So . . . your point is what? Being punished and face and expulsion as I suggested isn't good enough. He needs to be thrown in jail as well? Tarred and feathered? What you thinking is appropriate for a 21 year old freshman?
October 3rd, 2023 at 2:53 PM ^
Who is saying jail? AFAIK, you’re the only one on here mentioning jail, as a strawman to try and pretend this wasn’t antisemitism.
October 3rd, 2023 at 5:05 PM ^
At least one person in this thread said 'lock em up' so not a strawman. Also with more details it sounds only homophobic not antisemitic.
October 3rd, 2023 at 5:58 PM ^
Meh. It was inappropriate behavior regardless, but technically it wasn't antisemitic. It was homophobic. But if it was antisemitic I wouldn't pretend it wasn't. And someone did say lock them up so I'm responding to that. But maybe they did mean lock them up in a random room and not jail which . . .also a bit of an over reaction. Why is parsing out the facts in the context of these types of issues perceived by some like you as approving of the bad thing? Is it like how some people who are obsessed with being anti gay are usually gay themselves? Are you insecure because you have some antisemitic tendencies? Do you feel the need to clarify that murder is bad before discussing the facts and nuance of a murder case? What are we doing here? Nobody said what they did was okay. Certainly not me.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:37 PM ^
Nobody is ruining his life. He did something that is socially unacceptable, irresponsible, and demonstrative of being filled with hate for certain people. He broke team rules of conduct. The punishment for which is being kicked off the team. He is free to join some other team. He also (probably) broke University rules of conduct, for which he may be expelled. If he is, he is free to attend another college. This isn't the end of his life and he's not being barred from playing hockey or attending another school.
Stop acting like an adult need be coddled for the stupid decisions they may make.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:42 PM ^
Wat?
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:45 PM ^
I don't think you read my comment. I literally said he should be punished and face expulsion. Then I said throwing him in jail is insane. And then after that statement I said no need to ruin his life. Getting jail time can impact your life. A commenter above suggested he should be locked up. Go ahead and copy and paste the part where I said he should be coddled for his decision. I think my response is pretty balanced and fair. It feels like folks like you are eagerly waiting for these situations to occur so you can condemn and shout from the rooftops how bad racism is. That's fine, but how do we actually change people's hearts and punish them in a way that allows for that opportunity. Saying lock em up is a bit much.
October 3rd, 2023 at 4:25 PM ^
I will agree with you here. I took my reading comprehension from this line: "...but it's also being sensationalized. They marked up the walkway not the actual building and there were no swastikas...." This reads that you're making light of the whole situation and thus treating the rest as farce. This is why I posted what I did - my bad for some poor comprehension noticed on a re-read because of your follow-up post (which I'm replying to now). Had you not followed up, I wouldn't have replied here!
Nonetheless, I'm not shouting from any rooftop, nor do I think he's being treated unfairly or should be locked up. He can exercise his free speech where ever and however he wants. But 'free speech' does not imply there are no consequences...
October 3rd, 2023 at 5:51 PM ^
Def not making light of it. Just pointing out that apparently there were no swastikas and it's been sensationalized when it doesn't need to be. Sensationalizing just makes people more cynical when it comes to these issues. Homophobic stuff is bad enough on it's own.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:05 PM ^
Fuck them both. Idiots at best, bigots at worst. Good riddance either way.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:19 PM ^
No need to kick them out if you can educate them.
October 3rd, 2023 at 1:32 PM ^