Replay of UM/MSU BTN - 2nd look thoughts
Three big things I saw that I don’t recall seeing as much on Saturday, or at least as bad as it really was in 2nd look in last 1.5 quarters.
1. Cade missed lots of throws. More than I recalled. He can’t throw deep accurately at all, always overthrow. Still baffled why we run fades with 5-9/5-10 receivers too.
2. O line got no push running the ball. We were very one dimensional, again more than I remembered. Shocked how bad the running game looked in Q4.
3. MacDonald scheme seems very odd/poor. . We did a ton of 6 guys at line 1 LB,1 Safety, and 3 CB’s on their WR’s. When MSU line/walker got through front 6, it was Walker beating Ross and a safety (Hawkins/Moten), WHY? That seems like the dumbest D ever to stop a stud RB from breaking a long one. Just baffled this is what they decided to do. I bashed the LB’s after the game. Yes Ross and Hawkins/Moten whiffed in open field, but why we putting these dudes on an island?
Sorry, I know we have hashed out MSU game for days. But, if you’re like me, when you watch live you don’t notice all the nuances of each play, and don’t get an entire feel for everything. You just see the outcome. Few of the above really puzzled me in rewatching.
Thoughts? Don’t recall us hitting on the 6-1 defense too much.
November 2nd, 2021 at 11:19 PM ^
Never want to see that game again.
November 2nd, 2021 at 11:27 PM ^
I can't even bring myself to watch again. Obviously in a close game where we lost the lead and had chances to put it away early there are tons of missed opportunities. Players, coaches, scheme, refs, dumb luck..... Everything is magnified in a game like this.
That being said.....I really do wonder sometimes what type of QB performance would make this message board and website happy. Cade threw for almost 400 yards, hit guys in stride down the middle of the field all night, got little help from Corum or Johnson with drops, lost All to an injury for a while, and didn't have Ronnie Bell. Yet here we are again with him missing open WR as the #1 thing here on this post. I am sure he did....and maybe had he hit a couple more and throw for 400+ yards we win....just not in my top five observations from the game. I don't think freshmen Henne makes some of the posters here happy....even Brady himself misses a pass now and then.
My keys.....
1. Defense got abused with tempo
2. Overturned TD changed the game. Momentum, score, emotions.....all of it.
3. Too many small mental errors with the key false start, holding near the goal line, dropped swing pass by Corum, drop by Johnson, JJ fumbles.
4. Running game was adequate and needed a big play or two.
November 2nd, 2021 at 11:38 PM ^
^ ^ ^ These points are 1000% better than the OP's takes.^ ^ ^
November 2nd, 2021 at 11:43 PM ^
My takes from above weren’t on overall game or things I have seen we talked about a ton. Tempo obviously. Turnovers. Officiating. I just noticed the 3 above as something new tonight I didn’t notice as much Saturday.
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:01 AM ^
If his receivers do not drop three perfectly thrown passes, Cade completed 70% of his passes for over 400 yards. It is statistically false that Cade "missed lots of throws."
The rest of your observations were fine, but it's hard to recover from your first take being that bad.
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:16 AM ^
4th Q he missed several. Maybe lots is wrong word. But if you watched again, last 3 drives he had 5+.
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:43 AM ^
This has been rehashed multiple times. He missed throws but he also made many. Did you happen to notice anything positive in your second watch? See, that would have made this more entertaining. Otherwise, sounds like another thread to whine about this team. Onward. We are ranked #7. If we beat OSU, we may have a shot at CFP. Cade is the starter and he is good. Not great yet. Good performance for essentially a first year starter on the road against a rival with a good team.
November 3rd, 2021 at 1:34 AM ^
On the Fly over they suggested Cade went 2-7 down the stretch. Certainly not all on him though.
They also said they went 6-1 once the entire game. So you were probably seeing 5-2.
November 3rd, 2021 at 6:13 AM ^
Funny how statistics works... these are still pretty small number/sample sizes, so "streaks" will happen. If you looked at all of his 4th quarters, or all passes through the air greater than a certain distance, then MAYBE you can start to discern some patterns, but I'd posit that time remaining in the game has less of an impact on his throwing than the type of pass. The misses in the late game just hurt more for fans, and it sucks double after a hot streak early. Doesn't necessarily mean anything.
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:54 PM ^
Down the stretch includes the last drive, where we HAD to throw due to the clock. So MSU was clearly selling out for the pass.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:49 AM ^
This is absolute truth.
Cade was poor down the stretch in the 4th.
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:48 AM ^
I know it's bad form to blame the officiating, but something I haven't heard mentioned is the aggregious takedown of one of our lineman on Walker's fumble TD, I believe. Walker is stopped by the humanity of the lines, but right before he bounces to his left one of our guys is there to grab him. He never gets the chance as #75 simply mauls him and prevents from doing so by grabbing him and tackling him. I can't even tell you who it was, #75 was all over his body as he tackled him to the ground.
November 3rd, 2021 at 4:04 PM ^
Speaking of the officiating, it's funny listening to Sam Webb trying to get agreement from his weekly guests, Eric Adelson and Steve Clarke, regarding the reversal of the strip sack recovery for a TD. They won't buy in.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:38 AM ^
I will say that the OP has a point in regards to UM does always seem to throw fades to our smaller receivers.
I would have loved to have seen a couple fade attempts to Andrel down the stretch. Maybe they did, but I sure as hell am not going back to watch to see if they did.
November 3rd, 2021 at 1:29 PM ^
This has been an issue all season--throwing fades to ninja slots. Unfortunately the guy who is supposed to get those looks is Johnson, and he has not shown any ability to go up and win a 50-50 ball. I was looking for him to take a step forward, especially when Bell went down, but he has regressed. IMO Anthony has already emerged as the #1 outside threat on this team as long as Bell is out. And at least they've figured out what they have in Erick All as a receiver. He is an All-B1G talent now and I hope we get one more season out of him.
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:00 AM ^
“Holding.” That was a weak ass call and one that had zero impact on the play. Unlike the multitude of holds committed against Hutchinson every week that go uncalled. As much as I want these particular refs shot into the sun it isn’t just them who royally suck, or us, getting screwed. It is mind boggling how bad college football refs are. Just spotting the ball is a comedy of errors each and every week.
November 3rd, 2021 at 7:32 AM ^
The Big ten officials as a whole have been horrible about holding this year. Wait until you play PSU: their O-line strategy is: tackle everyone trying to get through the line....the refs probably won't call most, or ANY of it. Hutchinson will feel like a running back getting tackled on every play....
November 3rd, 2021 at 8:48 AM ^
Hutchinson already gets abused like that by opposing OL. Usually by a desperate lineman, so it’ll be interesting to see a team whose OL strategy is based directly on that and getting away with it.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:05 AM ^
Hutchinson feels like that already and you can see they are coached to exaggerate being held, which I don't like but is necessary. As a fan you just hope for consistency of officiating throughout the game by refs who have the guts to make the correct tough call in game changing critical situations.
The whole targeting rule needs to be revisited. OSU got screwed there. The rule has good intent but could be executed much more effectively.
Also why not put a chip in the ball especially for goal line situations (score or no score)? EMU had a TD not called yesterday on a close call which thankfully wasn't a game changer. These scrums where some out of shape official comes trudging in after guys are doing God knows what at the bottom of the pile is weak. The pylon cam was a great innovation.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:02 AM ^
Americans (and most English) hate the theatric dives in soccer, but the same principal is coached: when you're driving forward with the ball in the box and a defender impedes you the odds are better of gaining the penalty when you go to ground as opposed to playing through the contact.
November 3rd, 2021 at 1:45 PM ^
My kids have had a soccer club coach teach that if you were ( legitimately) fouled from behind to fall on top of the ball so the referee HAS to call it. It definitely worked. I always liked refs who were former players who talked to the players during the game or explained their decisions in real time (but not debating), consulted with/empowered their assist referees, and weren't afraid to toss coaches ( and have the coaches tell their parents to leave the field when they were out of control).
For the amount of money bet on games and the importance of power 5 conference matches, you like to see better officiating in all NCAA games ( this is not a UM getting jobbed bitch).
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:18 PM ^
Where was the pylon/goal cam Saturday? It would have easily showed the Walker fumble and probably gave a better glimpse into the sac fumble.... but it was no where to be seen during a FOX 4K televised game?! I call bullshit and complete fix. This game was never gonna get away from Sparty and their 12th men.
November 3rd, 2021 at 2:02 PM ^
It was just an example of how things could be used to improve important game defining decisions like they do in the NFL. I think the NCAA won't incorporate those cameras in regular season games unless all teams can afford/use it. It has been used by ESPN in the NCAA playoffs recently?
OSU and UM used to get all the home field calls during the Bo and Woody days ( and JoePa at PSU) because the part time refs, who sold insurance or did other jobs as their main jobs, were intimidated by the those personalities and there was no replay.
I don't believe there was an intentional fix and it makes our fanbase look as bad as those whom we criticize. We didn't get any favors but any grand goals this team has are still in front of this team.
November 3rd, 2021 at 7:35 AM ^
Was watching this week’s “The Journey” on B1G network last night, they did a segment on Junior Colson, was very interesting, learned a lot about the young man. Didn’t know he was adopted out of an orphanage in Haiti. Great story.
Anyway, the program also sprinkled in footage from last weekend’s game, included field level camera views of most of the big plays, esp KWIII runs, like the 4th Qtr run to put MSU ahead. This field level footage so clearly shows Hutch being egregiously held (and Welshof to a lesser degree) on that TD play, wrapped up from behind with the lineman locked on to the inner collar of his shoulder pads impeding his ability to move towards the runner. Gives you a totally diff view of how bad, and uncalled, the holding must continually be during game play.
I think a few early warning holding calls by the refs might help keep that shit in check when the game is on the line.
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:26 PM ^
They did give Sparty a warning flag. It came after a UM sack to stop the clock for MSU the drive before halftime. I started laughing right when the flag came out because it was so obviously pathetic and tried helping their drive. Smh
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:55 AM ^
I struggle with the idea that the overturned TD changed the momentum. Michigan played the next 12 minutes of game time and 40+ minutes of real time or whatever it would have been to a 10-0 score. Did it feel like the momentum was gone was Sanristil scored to make it 30-14? Because I have to tell you, I didn’t feel it.
I agree with your other points though. And yeah, no chance in hell I’m watching that game again. I really struggled to sleep the next two nights.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:08 AM ^
The one thing I notice from our run game is that if Corum or haskins get 20 carries, one of them will break at least one long run.. but they usually take 18 to 20 carries to do it.
We didn't lean on them enough in the 2nd half.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:25 AM ^
honest take on Cade is that he is good. He is nowhere near Brady or Henne.
He passed for a lot of yards on Saturday, but 25% of them came on 1 play, which he was not really responsible for
He is also not of the caliber that OSU is putting on the field, and that is probably where this all comes from. At the beginning of the season, one of our strengths was that Michigan had a QB with some experience and OSU had someone who hadn't thrown a football in 2 years. Now this kid is on heisman watch, and Cade is a game manager.
it seems like a development thing at Michigan...which has been said ad nauseum.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:03 AM ^
Cade played well, but he didn't play well enough. Michigan should have thrown for 500+ on that secondary. Michigan fans get so excited when a Cade throws for nearly 400 yards because we're used to seeing him throw for 150. We threw for 400 yards and yet only scored 10 points in the second half. Cade made some great throws, but also left a lot on the field. Part of it is his fault and part of it is the coaches fault for not being aggressive and throwing more and instead deciding to run into brick walls on first and third downs.
November 3rd, 2021 at 11:01 AM ^
I saw the substitution issue being exploited by MSU and called it out a month ago.... what I don't understand is hearing Hutchinson mention it post game how we gotta leave our players on field.... does he not speak up a month ago ? I saw it was gonna be a problem, and they wait AFTER the catastrophe to see it.
November 2nd, 2021 at 11:29 PM ^
Are you a masochist? Why would you watch . . . that again?
And it felt like the defense was (mostly) fine when they managed to get set. Can’t confirm because I’m not a masochist.
November 3rd, 2021 at 8:45 AM ^
This seems like a fun thing to do again....
November 2nd, 2021 at 11:46 PM ^
Watching it again makes me want to fire Harbaugh even more
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:38 AM ^
Lucky for us, you are not AD. Same crap every thread.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:54 AM ^
Go away, FFS.
November 3rd, 2021 at 1:32 PM ^
You're right. I actually love losing to MSU and OSU.
November 2nd, 2021 at 11:50 PM ^
I recall Walker generally not doing a ton until late in the game, mostly on plays that seemed well equipped to stop the play MSU had called and Walker making a lot out of a little - as he has done to every other team. In the midst of a 4th quarter come back, it seems like a better idea to force the RB to win several one on one battles out of the back field than potentially give up a one play passing TD because you left you're DBs on islands to defend the far less likely one play TD run. It sucks that Walker was good enough to win those matchups and get big yards out of otherwise well defended plays, but sometimes you just tip your hat and live with the outcome. I think most other RBs get some yards on those late runs, but not 15+ yard chunks/TDs. In that scenario, Michigan forces passing plays into heavy coverage and people are probably a lot happier right now.
November 3rd, 2021 at 7:34 AM ^
The problem with this scenario is that this wasn't a one time thing. There have now been a few teams now that broke off long runs against us for this very reason. Don't think for a minute this wont happen against OSU if McDonald doesn't get it figured out.
November 5th, 2021 at 10:26 PM ^
The inside gap runs have been broken down on Michigan Insider. A former DC said you will see twists from the front end of Michigan's defense in the future. This will make it harder for the OL's blocking scheme.
November 3rd, 2021 at 9:31 AM ^
Walker had 87 yards and 2 TDs in the first half, he did damage all game long.
November 2nd, 2021 at 11:54 PM ^
Losing sucks. It’d be super neato if we didn’t do that again anytime soon
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:41 AM ^
Bruh…seriously, why the hell would you watch that again. You need to go to therapy.
November 3rd, 2021 at 1:59 AM ^
I also watched it again because I kept seeing “instant classic” and “best game of the year” thrown around. So I muted the audio, convinced myself it was two other teams, and rewatched it.
IF, and I mean IF you can temporarily block out the storylines and BPONE, it was actually a really good game. But…once you unblock, it still sucks.
November 3rd, 2021 at 5:45 AM ^
Maybe if you're a neutral party or MSU fan. Otherwise it's a visual equivalent of a colonoscopy.
November 3rd, 2021 at 10:29 AM ^
100%. There is no “if” when you are a Michigan fan.
November 3rd, 2021 at 1:24 PM ^
I don't talk college football with a lot of other Michigan fans (live on the east coast), but one person I DO talk a lot of cfb with is a Bama grad.
He has little hesitation bagging on the Big Ten year in and year out, but he came away impressed by our performance and the game as a whole: "lived up to the hype". A lot of the rest of the country did too.
At the beginning of the season, I wanted at least a 7-5 record and for the team to show some promise and some fight, and that's happened. Lot of the horseshit remains, but I am keeping to my pre-season expectations.
Anyway, none of our opinions really matter... beat Indiana!
November 5th, 2021 at 10:59 AM ^
I've watched it at least four times already. My family is less than thrilled.
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:53 AM ^
It is time to move on to the next game. Beat the Hoosiers ass!!!
November 3rd, 2021 at 12:53 AM ^
I'm actually impressed you managed to watch that shit again. You couldn't pay me to.
November 3rd, 2021 at 6:44 AM ^
why the fuck would anyone do this?