OT: Golf, PGA Championship - general comments and the pursuit of maximizing revenue in light of tradition
It’s Saturday morning and the PGA Championship is beginning it’s third round at Oak Hill in Rochester, New York.
Though I don’t play as much as I did before the kids were born, I still love the game - playing when I can, and following the majors.
The venue, Oak Hill, is a tremendous golf course - designed originally by Donald Ross. I love the layout, architecture, and difficulty. So, the fact that there are about ten players under par thus far is fine with me. It’s 7300+ yards and playing as a par 70 - a very tough test.
What does bother / concern me is the timing of the event. It’s mid May, and though it’s raining today - again, not a problem - but, frost delays in the opening round bring the scheduling of this major into question.
I grew up with the “old” schedule.. Masters in April, US Open in June, The (British) Open Championship in July, and the PGA in August. This schedule was spread out, allowed courses to be in near ideal conditions when championships were conducted, etc. (No commentary about the USGA course setup for US Opens.)
It seems to me the FedEx Cup and the dollars that are involved forced the tour and major championship schedule forward. It’s not something I care for. When is enough… enough?
I’ll watch a bit - but will wonder how magnificent this venue would be if the PGA were held there in August, instead of mid May.
Any thoughts?
You're not wrong. Golf has seemed to be on the decline for a while now, and messing with the schedule doesn't help. Neither does the fracturing of the Tour and the player base. The FedEx Cup is a contrived championship in a sport where the four majors have always been the true prize. Just some odd choices lately, which is a shame.
To your point, I grew up near Rochester, NY, and you'd be lucky to be reliably playing this time of year. The climate is such that the ground can still freeze at any time, so it's a day to day thing. I'm glad they're still holding the tournament there, but August in Central NY is a much safer bet than mid May. But cash is king, so they'll make do, I suppose. I just hope the region doesn't lose out on future tournaments because of the scheduling crunch.
Great comment. If it was a Ryder Cup in September - with cool morning temperatures, or a possible frost - it would be fine. Oak Hill really looks fantastic. And, it seems like they set it up like a very tough, but fair - US Open than a PGA.
The rain, and especially predicted wind - have the potential to make today’s scoring conditions extremely challenging / difficult. But, this being said - the greens aren’t going to be ridiculous as US Open setups become too often.
Enjoy - and, thanks again for your perspective.
The PGA has always had a bit of trouble fitting into the calendar. Masters is when it is in April. US Open on Father's Day. The British Open in July. PGA has actually moved around a lot in its history. And football is a big problem for it. From the official source of information and truth, Wikipedia:
After World War II, the championship was usually in late May or late June, then moved to early July in 1953 and a few weeks later in 1954, with the finals played on Tuesday. As a match play event (with a stroke play qualifier), it was not uncommon for the finalists to play over 200 holes in seven days. The 1957 event lost money,[9] and at the PGA meetings in November it was changed to stroke play, starting in 1958, with the standard 72-hole format of 18 holes per day for four days, Thursday to Sunday. Network television broadcasters, preferring a large group of well-known contenders on the final day, pressured the PGA of America to make the format change.[10]
During the 1960s, the PGA Championship was played the week after The Open Championship five times, making it virtually impossible for players to compete in both majors. In 1965, the PGA was contested for the first time in August, and returned in 1969, save for a one-year move to late February in 1971, played in Florida. The 2016 event was moved to late July, two weeks after the Open Championship, to accommodate the 2016 Summer Olympics in August.[11]
Before the 2017 edition, it was announced that the PGA Championship would be moved to May on the weekend before Memorial Day, beginning in 2019. The PGA Tour concurrently announced that it would move its Players Championship back to March the same year; it had been moved from March to May in 2007. The PGA of America cited the addition of golf to the Summer Olympics, as well as cooler weather enabling a wider array of options for host courses, as reasoning for the change. It was also believed that the PGA Tour wished to re-align its season so that the FedEx Cup Playoffs would not have to compete with the start of football season in late-August.
I admit I was caught by surprise when I saw the first round scores that a major was being played this weekend.
Likewise I don't like the early season compression of the golf season for a finish I don't really care about. (End of the year Ryder or President's cup is a much bigger deal).
By the way, Pinehurst would be great this time of the year rather than when they usually play a US Open here and everyone is making ball stew because it's so damn hot.
I work in education, so I liked having the summer off and able to watch all day every round for each major sans the Masters (though sometimes it lined up with spring break).
Tour Championship is ok but I’d rather have the Ryder and President’s Cup in august vs September
A Wolves fan! I'm a very fairweather fan but they're the only non-U.S. national team I care about.
I used to be an avid golfer. Time has been a problem last 6 years or so and I hardly golf. I don't follow golf as much as I used to. When I saw the title, I thought it was a mistake. PGA championship in May does not sound right.
End of Tiger era kind of took away my interest. I miss the banter in the golf course with my friends and the 20 dollar skins. Fun times.
To your question, I agree with your perspective. This has become too much about money. Too many golf tournaments. FedEx cup ruined it somewhat. I thought more golf will be fun when it came about, but not anymore. Need a new hero to get my interest back. I am not prepared to watch PGA in May.
“End of Tiger era kind of took away my interest.”
He might still win one more masters before it’s all said and done for him but I don’t expect that he’ll be able to compete as well in any of the other majors. He seems to own Augusta with his knowledge of the course and it’s quirks, while the other major courses change year to year and there are plenty of guys now from one major to the next that seem to play extraordinary golf those weekends.
I still believe that if his father hadn’t passed away so soon in his life that he wouldn’t have had the off course issues he’s had that took so much away from his game, and that he’d have topped Nicklaus’ major wins record easily.
As for players I root for now I like Rahm, Schauffle and McIlroy, but none of them are anywhere as dominant as Tiger was in his prime.
Tiger’s father was a large source of the problem. Granted, Tiger would not have achieved the heights he did without him, but their entire relationship was built off Tiger’s ability and achievement, from the time he was literally 2 years old. Very similar to Michael Jackson and his father.
I don’t think Tiger had a healthy relationship with his dad, and I think his relationship with golf largely mirrors it. Tiger sought perfection in an imperfect game. The bar he sought, and that his father set for him, was simply not attainable. You simply have to look at his golf swing over the years. Nobody has ever played the game, Hogan, Snead, Annika included, who had better natural action in their golf swing. And in the middle of his prime he completely changed it in search of technical perfection. He was going to personally collapse at some point regardless of when his dad passed.
In my opinion, he is the best golfer of all time. He was, and is, a very troubled person though. He simply should not be playing competitive golf anymore, and it’s kind of tragic that he is. The game itself is physically painful to him, frankly, I think it always was mentally. The only time he seems to be at peace is playing with Charlie, treating his son specifically in a manner the opposite of how his father treated him. He is teaching him golf as “fun,” in a way that he never got to experience it.
I agree that his father was a large source of the problem, but although their relationship was what you say it was, his father was also the anchor that held his game steady, while limiting the extra curricular activity that soon absorbed his life after his dad passed. It wasn’t great for Tiger overall, but if you looked at his accomplishments in golf from start to present day, you could pinpoint where his dad passed simply by seeing the severe drop off in wins.
I have watched many clips of Tiger recently where he is either playing with his son, or talking to other golfers about playing and you can see his approach towards the game between father and son is completely different than it was between his dad and him. There is more fun and enjoyment of the game for them, as you said.
So many times a forum post about soccer draws snickers from those who dislike the game.
I thus relish this opportunity to say… golf sucks. There I said it. I mean if you enjoy playing it, great. But for those of us who don’t play, can anything be MORE boring on TV. And the field is not exactly a great cross-section of Americana.
I return you to your regular-scheduled thread.
I bite my tongue or ignore soccer threads.
My life and livelihood revolve around golf. Eat shit.
Golf is the greatest game ever created. You probably hate it because you suck at it. :)
You'd be smarter to leave it at "I don't care for the game." you don't like watching it on TV? cool. no one is forcing you to watch it, right? change the channel, problem solved.
as someone who loves the game, it's still easy to admit there are plenty of valid critiques of it. You just didn't mention any of them. but your complaint is noted for the record.
Please let me know which sport is exactly a great cross section of America. What a tool.
Blame football, or rather the popularity of football, both at the professional and collegiate level, for the move of the PGA Championship to May.
Golf is just like every other sport that doesn't want to compete on weekends with football in America. The PGA Tour wants to have a playoff system, and they want that to be done prior to football starting. That's the reason for the scheduling change.
Granted, they still have events in the fall, but they're lower tier ones. And I think LIV golf has events scheduled during football season. But no sport wants to compete with football.
The FedEx playoffs are now exclusively in August --- to try to avoid football.
But the funny thing ---- the only memorable FedEx playoff event in recent memory was in September 2018, up against an NFL weekend, NFL Week 3. Tiger winning the Tour Championship that year.
What I take out of that ---- golf's primary issues aren't really the calendar. It's a lack of interesting characters in the post-Tiger era.
(the other thing: Tiger won that tournament, the last one of the playoffs, but still didn't win the playoffs as a whole. That's hard to explain to the non-die hard)
have a love for the game from my childhood but it will probably be years (or never) before I watch the majors or events like the ryder again. It's like a bad taste in my mouth.
after several years off, not sure if I can get motivated to play again but all the nice underused courses these days make it tempting.
Most of those courses have gone from underused to closed or in such bad shape they aren’t worth playing. The list of playable courses outside of golf destinations is shrinking, rapidly.
I don't know about that - I'm in A2 and you can't swing a dead wolverine without hitting a course that's in decent or better shape, and affordable. Hell, two of the nicer public courses in the immediate area are a city-owned (Leslie Park) course and a county-owned (Pierce Lake) course.
been a long time but leslie is a fun course. good memories. glad but not surprised it is still doing fine. Played pierce lake once too, very nice as I recall.
Pierce Lake found itself on Golf Digest's "Top Ten Best Value Public Courses" list a few years ago. I play it frequently and I'm constantly impressed by the fact that it's so cheap for how nice it is, while also being impressed by how nice it is given it's county-owned. And it's fun, without being easy.
This is so untrue. I live in Troy and within a half hour drive, there are many excellent courses in good or excellent condition with very reasonable rates compared to the rest of the country.
Orchards, Cherry Creek, Pine Knob, Twin Lakes, Shepherds Hollow, Fieldstone, Greystone, Pine Trace, Sanctuary Lake, the two Oakland U courses, Myth, Glacier Club, Boulder Pointe, Copper Hills.
This is just off the top of my head. And even the munis like the two Birmingham nine hole courses, the Royal Oak course, Sylvan Glen in Troy and Crystal Lake in Pontiac are decent golf courses and very affordable.
Yes, but the courses you list are not “underused.” In the same area, Heather Highlands, The Jewel, Captains Club, Copper Ridge, and a number of others are either closed or are basically goat farms now. The courses you listed aren’t underused, they are packed, always.
Be happy you get to watch Oak Hill on TV, whatever date or time. The tour plays dogshit venues week in and week out. Seeing Andrew Green’s work highlighted is cool, it’s a unique aspect of our sport that you won’t find in any other.
A chance to watch the best players compete on the best golf courses is extremely rare. You get it 5-6x per year. I Don’t care if it’s May, July, or December.
I don’t know about “dog shit.” There are only so many great golf courses, particularly ones that can handle galleries. Warwick Hills was probably among the worst courses that tour players played when the Buick was there and that is a pretty good track.
Luckily, I do know. Absolute dogshit, week in, week out.
I am aware of the restrictions based on size of property.
Seems to me that the schedule is fine if TPTB are more climate-conscious in their course selections for the event. The Fed-Ex Cup isn't going anywhere, as such, the schedule seems likely to stay as is. Nothing wrong with playing the PGA in mid-May, just pick venues/locations where weather is less likely to be a factor.
Well for one this was scheduled before the change in dates. But I frankly, like the new schedule. It is more organized with one significant pro event per month from March to September starting with the Players and finishing with the Ryder or Presidents Cup.
I agree that some of the new scheduling results from newer money grabs like the playoffs and Presidents Cup, but professional golf (LIV excluded) has done a better job of balancing tradition in profits far better than most other sports.
The June and august scheduling for the us open and PGA favored northern courses a lot more than the current schedule. But with the PGA moving their headquarters and building a major championship course in the Dallas area, August wasn’t going to work, unless players and fans were asking for heat strikes. They had to move to May to accommodate the infrastructure they built.