TheCube

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:08 AM ^

Harbaugh has been pro-active w/ regards to Kaep's protests, so this doesn't surprise me. I remember he wrote Kaep's Time magazine piece. 

Tom Herman stated the most poignant thing that I've read today about what many black athletes face. 

“Can the average fan relate? No, they can’t,” Herman said. “There’s a double standard maybe a little bit. We’re going to pack 100,000 people into DKR and millions watch on TV that are predominantly white — not all of them certainly, but most of ’em white. We’re gonna cheer when they score touchdowns, and we’re gonna hug our buddy when they get sacks or an interception.

But we gonna let them date our daughter? Are we going to hire them in a position of power in our company? That’s the question I have for America. You can’t have it both ways.”

Nailed it on the head. 

Joined: 12/19/2018

MGoPoints: 31594

MGOTokyo

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:34 AM ^

The vast majority of the country is sympathetic towards acts of police brutality and are mostly against racism.  But then comes the rioting, looting, and killing under the guise of 'legal protesting'. Great strides have been made in the US the past 20 years but so much of the progress has been lost.  One step forward, 2 steps backwards.  How many of the "protestors" could I put into a job in my office (white or black)?  It is time for the educated black leaders in our country to rise up and put an end to the violence, so that it doesn't give the racists in our country reason to continue in their ways.

Joined: 11/20/2014

MGoPoints: 1438

MgoHillbilly

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:19 AM ^

I tend to think it's mostly two steps forward and one step back. I guess I'll be happy so long as there's less racial discrimination at the end of my life than the beginning.  Seems like it just takes time for the generations that hold those views to die off since they don't change their their minds.  Most of my own family (a lot of them cops) didn't come to my wedding and I had no idea that they were racist enough not to embrace some more genetic diversity in our white trash dna. So screw 'em. My wife's family is more enjoyable to spend time with anyway.

Joined: 01/04/2017

MGoPoints: 24245

trueblueintexas

June 2nd, 2020 at 1:04 PM ^

I think James Baldwin’s statements are of great value in understanding racism. How long? How long should it take? It has already been far too long. There have already been far too many generations. 
 

The problem with racism is that it can be both generational and new. It gets passed on within families and people who didn’t learn it from their lineage can learn it from friends and on-line.  
 

Racism on an individual level will never go away. Eradicating racism out of our entrenched systems can be done but it takes the consistent and unwavering voice of a majority. This could happen much faster, but it requires a sacrifice few are truly willing to make. Unless we as individuals are truly willing to take action to give up of ourselves, we will forever be in this cycle of tragic event, outrage, prayer, and living our life until the next tragic event. That is how systemic racism gets past on generation to generation. 
 

If you want an easy action to start with, I encourage everyone to communicate (call, email, whatever) with your local leaders (Mayor, Chief of police, elected officials) calling on them to evaluate the hiring practices of your local police force. Hiring racists and putting them through training on how to use lethal force will never solve the problem. There are ways to screen applicants and candidates to help limit racists from being in a position to act on their feelings of hatred. Once you have done that, encourage and even stand up to your friends and family to get them to do the same. It may feel uncomfortable, that is how you will know you are doing something different.

Joined: 11/10/2008

MGoPoints: 36653

uminks

June 2nd, 2020 at 1:46 PM ^

The problem is you will never get good people to become Law Enforcement Officers with most saying all police are bad and racist. You will just get the hot headed GI Joe's from the military joining the police forces. A lot of these people are trigger happy, ill tempered and racist. So, the problem will just get worse.

Joined: 11/10/2009

MGoPoints: 32040

BroadneckBlue21

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:38 AM ^

Isn’t it up to the oppressive executive’s job in a democracy to execute leadership? Loaded qualifiers in here with “educated black leaders,” as if every black person isn’t educated on racism by the very society we live in. You took the facile bait of “riots are bad” to lecture us on property destruction all while the life of black people are sniffed out in broad daylight and then the police around the nation retaliate on protestors. No one condones the looting, but it is understandable. But they’re enacting in small scales the same shit CEOs did with the CARES Act with the help of Trump. You condone the looting you cannot see that is legalized? At least understand that neither helps fix things, but move the fuck on to talking about solutions that don’t put the blame on black people. Those in power should not be using extreme violence to silence dissent—even when the protestors are screaming and antagonistic.

Police need to be like good parents who de-escalate through listening (no, the protestors are not children, I’m comparing just the act of how one reacts to a heated event). Elected officials should be listening to the anger and pushing for reform. The chicken shits are afraid of losing police union votes and their base that claims moral superiority when they see looting. They move quickly away from saying racism is bad into the “but get in line” blabbering.

And, and, lame ass white people mock Obama, mock Demings, mock Coates, mock the very leaders of the black communities that want solutions. Why? Because those people demand policies. There is no reason a black conservative leader cannot come out and say “We need to fix policing against my race.” There is no reason for solutions to come from only black people, and certainly no reason solutions that acknowledge police brutality problems need come from mainly, if not mostly, Democrats. 

What you want is Uncle Tom Candace Lahrens that get in line and put the blame back on the poor and the liberal. Or, if you don’t, your rhetoric sure as hell but implies as much.

Sympathy is feeling sorry for people when you don’t understand what they are going through. Sympathy is passive. Compassion and empathy by whites is needed. Action by whites alongside black people is needed. 

Joined: 01/12/2015

MGoPoints: 6310

Broken Brilliance

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:56 AM ^

Anyone forcing the false dichotomy of choosing which is worse between looting and social injustice is a fucking moron. Lots of them on social media today.

I'm in Nashville for the week and I've gone out and scrubbed graffiti with people of all ages, color, and sexual orientation who live here and not in the burbs. Instead of being a keyboard warrior go and do something in your community that brings people together instead of trying to villify and alienate people.

Joined: 09/07/2010

MGoPoints: 7711

Perkis-Size Me

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:54 AM ^

Everything you built up in that post, you lost with "It is time for the educated black leaders in our country to rise up and put an end to the violence." 

You seriously think they haven't been trying this for the last 165 years? 

Joined: 11/30/2011

MGoPoints: 105739

Lan DIm Sum

June 2nd, 2020 at 12:49 PM ^

Which channel has only black people looting and rioting?  The channels I have show a diverse group of furious young people whose emotions are, predictably based on the lack of change and accountability from their government, out of control.  Police destroy private property, kill unarmed civilians (blacks at 2.3 times the rate of whites), but they aren't held accountable.  They have extra-legal protections.  But the fed-up kids in the streets, oh they're criminals and their rage justifies police brutality in this never-ending cycle.  Why do you think other developed countries don't seem to have this problem with their police-community relations?  We're literally the only developed country on Earth with this problem, but it must be because of the angry kids looting Target and Whole Foods.  BTW, what "killing are the protestors doing".  There are millions of young people out confronting police who are responding in many places with outsize violence.  A few people, police included, are likely to be killed in this cauldron.  But you say it like the protestors are targeting police for assassination.  

Joined: 04/04/2015

MGoPoints: 133

dragonchild

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:10 AM ^

That's not a stand; that's just a statement.

I mean, it's better than nothing, and I know this conflation is common, but the distinction matters when people are taking literal stands in the streets.

Joined: 10/13/2011

MGoPoints: 60910

maize-blue

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:16 AM ^

Are they going to take a stand on the brutality OSU inflicts on them every season?

Joined: 01/10/2013

MGoPoints: 44662

throw it deep

June 2nd, 2020 at 12:41 PM ^

Not a chance. They're perpetual victims who think everything bad that happens in their life is somebody else's fault. Nobody on this team is taking responsibility for their failures, and the coaches are not holding players to a high standard of work ethic. Most of the guys we recruit would rather transfer to a lesser school than put in the work to earn a starting spot here. They'll spend all summer protesting and then wonder why Wisconsin is faster and stronger than them.

Joined: 09/22/2019

MGoPoints: 457

ScooterTooter

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:17 AM ^

Two questions:

What is the goal of the protestors? What does progress look like?

What are you as an individual doing to achieve this goal? 

Joined: 06/01/2017

MGoPoints: 5841

ScooterTooter

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:28 AM ^

1. We've already decreased the number of police killings of unarmed black people from 78 in 2015 to 25 in 2019. Do you think this speeds up a process that is already taking place? This seems plausible. 

2. This is a common refrain: Does it actually work toward the main issue here which is creating equal outcomes between black and white Americans? 

Joined: 06/01/2017

MGoPoints: 5841

Toby Flenderson

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:40 AM ^

1. My concern is not simply the raw number of deaths, but the police culture that continues to emphasize a lack fo accountability and bias against Black bodies. I would also want to see numbers of the times using excessive force and other performance measures. 

2. I think economic empowerment of disenfranchised groups can help those communities support one another. I also think that voting in politicians that emphasize criminal justice reform is important, which is why I vote Democrat. 

Joined: 01/16/2012

MGoPoints: 21392

Toby Flenderson

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:02 AM ^

Well I am not White but a non-Black POC. I saw your reparations argument below and I think that you are trying to make an argument that I don't really see people making here. Democratic governments can elect individuals that cater to social justice initiatives that do not fall under such extreme measures. While some faction of the movement support such matters, I for one, do not. If you saw my comments below, I do not view the issue of socio-economics to be the sole solution to historical unrest (although to your point, I did mention donating to organizations). I think significant public policy changes, which respect to police accountability, redistribution of local/state resources towards other organizations, ban of voter-ID laws, and affirmative action measures are also important. 

 

Joined: 01/16/2012

MGoPoints: 21392

ScooterTooter

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:08 AM ^

Why is this extreme?

I'm asking people who believe in something to act on that belief. Okay, you aren't white, but for white people who believe in white privilege, how is this not the easiest solution to the problem? You don't have to wait for legislation to pass or deal with racist Republicans. You don't have to go through ineffective programs where money is siphoned off. 

You can directly seek out black people to give your money to. Its money that you have in part because you have white privilege, so what are you really giving up other than something you don't deserve?

Joined: 06/01/2017

MGoPoints: 5841

taistreetsmyhero

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:57 AM ^

Voting Democrat is a half-measure, at best. The Democratic Party would be on the right of the spectrum in most first-world countries across the globe. A vote for Biden and establishment democrats isn’t a vote for criminal justice reform. It’s a vote for a “lesser evil,” which is its own kind of evil. 

Joined: 08/08/2012

MGoPoints: 39396

Toby Flenderson

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:03 AM ^

Yes, electing Joe Biden will not solve the racial injustices on its own, but is is irresponsible for individuals who are educated to protest vote against Joe Biden.

In a two-party system, you will never get a candidate that agrees with you on everything. The goal should be to elect Joe Biden and force him to be the most progressive president he can be. 

Joined: 01/16/2012

MGoPoints: 21392

Rickett88

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:55 AM ^

There are a lot of people that want to do better and are willing to help. That is why churches (who are made up of mostly conservative voters) give more money to charity then any one else. 

The issue isn’t wanting to help to get things better, but the problem comes when people concede and give up status to make things more equal (which is good!) but then the people that are helped want them to give up more and more with no end in sight. 

The type of people that abuse the system like that (looters in this instance), are what’s making it hard for Independent thinkers to get fully on board  

 

Joined: 08/21/2012

MGoPoints: 10566

Rickett88

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:13 AM ^

1) it’s not fair to assume the person you are talking to or about has lived their whole life in privilege. Isn’t that exactly what the protests are about now? Privilege looks different in each situation. 

2) again we are all doing mental gymnastics telling ourselves that someone is luckier or has it better then us, and if we were only in their situation our lives would be better. We all, myself included, need to take responsibility for our choices and be ok with the outcomes that we had a hand in. 

Joined: 08/21/2012

MGoPoints: 10566

taistreetsmyhero

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:43 AM ^

I'm not going to play the futile game of trying to convince you white privilege is a thing. I'd only ask you, as a free and independent thinker and seemingly caring churchgoer, to join one of the protests, listen to the message, and then decide if their voices don't deserve to be heard because of the rioting that happens when they go home.

Joined: 08/08/2012

MGoPoints: 39396

ScooterTooter

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:54 AM ^

Okay here is an answer: Every white person who voted for Hillary Clinton could end our race problems tomorrow. Do you want to know how? 

You could give black people your money. 

You believe in white privilege. If you truly believe in it, then what you have is at least partially unearned due to your whiteness. So why not give it black people? 

Take the median black income and for 10 years, everything you make over that number, give it to black people. 

Sell everything you have that is excessive and give the proceeds to black people. Second home? Car? Either sign the deed over to a black person or sell it and give them the money. 

For that 10 year period, change your beneficiary on any retirement plan or insurance policy and name a black person. 

This is direct action. It does what nothing else we have tried will do: It will equal the economic outcome for black Americans to that of white Americans. 

You do not have to wait for racist Republicans to solve the problem. 

Donating money to organizations is pointless. Its been done. Its the racial version of trickle down economics. Donating your time is bullshit. Decolonizing your bookshelf doesn't do a damn thing. 

Think about it from the event that has us all talking about this: If a UM grad white person was giving Floyd George 50,000 a year would he need to use a counterfeit bill to pay for anything? 

So why not? 

Joined: 06/01/2017

MGoPoints: 5841

Rickett88

June 2nd, 2020 at 10:59 AM ^

This is exactly it. People hate others telling them what to do with their money/stuff/valuables/life goals, but when asked how much you are contributing past where you don’t feel the pain of the gift... it typically isn’t even close. 

It is great to help others, no matter how small or large the amount, but don’t think that money is the only way to do this. People are too wrapped up in $ to show how much they care. Go donate your time with the youth in some of these areas, show them your experience of how you made it, so that way the youth of America isn’t dependent on the government to do for them, but they are able to find opportunities to succeed for themselves. 
 

Your time is your most valuable asset, and we spend too much time complaining online and donating money we have no idea where it goes, instead of getting to know the people we are trying to help. 

Joined: 08/21/2012

MGoPoints: 10566

Rickett88

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:19 AM ^

And that’s where we will disagree as a teacher at title 1 schools for 8+ years now. I’ve just seen how giving kids something without any of their work behind it to understand the value of what they are given just doesn’t work in the long run. 

We are on the same team with the same goal, just different ways to get there. Don’t forget that. 

Joined: 08/21/2012

MGoPoints: 10566

ScooterTooter

June 2nd, 2020 at 11:26 AM ^

We (and by we I mean our country) have tried all kinds of education reforms. 

We have had protests and riots.

We've had all manner of poverty programs. 

We've had black leaders call for more policing and then less policing. 

We've had black leaders call for strict drug sentencing and then softer drug sentencing. 

Practically every corporation has diversity initiatives and departments.

We've put black people in positions of power, increased the number of black role models on TV, etc. 

There are all manner of charities and entities that profess to help black people. 

We've done it all and from what I can tell on this thread, people still think we are in the same spot. 

So why not do the one thing that hasn't been done and just give money to black people? And why shouldn't it come from the people who believe they don't deserve what they have anyway? 

Joined: 06/01/2017

MGoPoints: 5841