Michigan bag men?

God, that stupid f***ing god-awful piece of dogsh** movie.  I hate it. If it were a baby seal, I’d club it.

Agreed.

There are definitely levels of egregiousness.

"Paying players" however is just one type of cheating. Wasn't it just last year where something like 3 or 4 Clemson players tested positive for steroids?

The best way is to understand that everyone speeds in their car, so, the overwhelming majority of the time (exceptions only prove the rule), if you get a speeding ticket, chances are a) you were going WAY over, or b) you speed a lot.

In other words, if someone gets a DUI, the chances that it was there first time driving drunk are very very slim, unless they are under 18 or so.

Basically, I think Harbaugh is suggesting that there are teams that operate recklessly, so considering the administration, the local police, and so, so, so many levers are partial to their own school, if something actually comes out, chances are it wasn't the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, or 4th time, it was likely the 45th time.

And different schools/cultures simply have different standards.

Have you ever been to a hospital/medical facility in Florida? (or the south in general?) It's literal grab-ass shenanigans.

There's levels to this.

That may well be true for Alabama now. But if you think they went from a losing record to the top rceruiting class overnight with no money changing hands... well that's also naive.

That's always been my take.  The paying the players thing never bugged me because nobody really gets hurt there; it just wish the NCAA would make it legal so schools could exploit that advantage.  My guess is if it ever came up for a vote the smaller/poorer SEC and ACC schools would freak out because a level playing field kill them on that front.

My bigger issue with "dirty" programs are academics and the use of PEDs.  My guess is UM is pretty good on both, or at least as good as you can be and still be competitive.  But when a bunch of Clemson guys get popped for PEDs and Dabo cries ignorance, or a bunch of guys rather clearly commit academic fraud to stay eligible, that bothers me more because that's hurting the athlete in the long run.  And on that metric, UM does pretty well.

I agree there is a spectrum and it is not black and white.  And while I think UM takes more care to be clean than most there is no way they are 100% clean.  But, I also know after Saban's first year at Bama where they went 7-6 he got the #3 recruiting class to follow that up and has not been outside of the top 5 classes ever since.  He was able to land classes before he ever won there.  And, if you look at his coaching tree (Jimbo Fisher, Kirby Smart, Jeremy Pruitt) those are also some of the most alleged payers of players.  Fisher recruited like a mad man at FSU and now got T A&M a top 5 class after going 9-4.  Once Kirby Smart got to UGA they have had top 5 classes every year even after he went 8-5 in his first season.  So, all these guys got top classes before ever winning 10 games.  Meanwhile people question if UM only wins 10 games, but can't beat OSU will that be enough to keep getting kids to go there.  So, I think Saban and his guys are likely all at the high end of the extra benefits scale.

It is a sliding scale, no one is 100% clean and that includes UM.   It’s dirty because the NCAA says it is.  When they don’t enforce the rules it becomes a way of life for all.  

A bribery scandal that has shaken the world of college basketball took a step into college football Tuesday, with the courtroom testimony of a key government informant. According to multiple reports, he claimed to have given cash over a period of many years to football players from Alabama, Michigan, North Carolina, Northwestern, Notre Dame, Penn State and Pittsburgh

https://www.google.com/amp/s/beta.washingtonpost.com/sports/2019/04/24/courtroom-testimony-pulls-college-football-into-college-basketball-bribery-scandal/%3foutputType=amp

I don't think Michigan is 100 percent clean either, but what about Justin Feagin? He was supposedly paid? He was a middling 3 star. I don't remember hearing about that. 

wrong on the Fab 5. Yes Webber did, and Rose admitted to taking some from Ed Martin, but not as a bribe to go to Michigan. And there has never been any evidence of King/Jackson/Howard getting anything. But don't let facts get in the way of the Fab 5 myth. It's easy to throw that out there and most believe it. 

I gave a green paper clip, $.13, and a pack of Pokemon cards to Rashan Gary to come to Michigan.

Well, technically people could only provide proof of a bagman.  It's impossible to prove there are NO bagmen at all.  So if anyone has any credible info to share, it could only hurt UofM.

You're not fully clean unless you're zest fully clean. 

The players were not getting tats.  They were getting drugs.  That's why the DEA knew about the situation and notified Tressel.  The tattoo parlor was just a cover for the drug dealing, and that's why Tressel had to lie about the whole thing.

Yeah, I expressed my guess on the matter while explicitly acknowledging that I don't have any way of actually knowing (just like probably everyone else on this board). You literally said "I'm sure there are violations" in your own response directly above mine. OP's thread asked "what do you think" so don't act like my response was arrogant, especially when I explicitly said it was just a guess.