Hagerup apologizes, admits it was weed.
Maybe shorten the title to avoid trolls clicking.
To err is human. To forgive, divine...
And to keep getting caught over and over again is idiotic.
He's just dumb... 3 times, the same stuff... No ill will toward him, but just dumber than a box of rocks
If by "box of rocks" you mean the people who think its a good idea to be fucking with people's lives over something like this? Then yeah, he appears to be.
No I mean as in the inanimate objects commonly found on the ground. Risking your full ride at this school and the standing on the team 3 times is just dumb...
Not saying he's a bad person at all... Judgment just lacking
... But not nearly as "dumb" as the fact he even has to worry about it.
It's not as if he wasn't aware of the rules. By agreeing to participate, he agrees to comply with all team and athletic department rules as well. Whatever the merit of the rule, it was a rule he agreed to follow. Pledging one thing and doing another is a real issue.
Your opinion on marijuana does not matter. He is an athlete on a full scholarship to the University of Michigan. He knows the rules and the standard he is held to. He violated those rules and standards not once or twice, but THREE times. Also there is the small matter of breaking the law. That IS dumber than the fact that he has to worry about it.
Is getting caught three times. You have to act like a dumb sob to be caught smoking weed by authority figures on three separate occasions in a town like Ann Arbor.
I assume it would be urine tests that resulted in being caught.
I have absolutely no problem with marijuana use being a violation of team rules, and not just because it's illegal (though that in itself is a legitimate reason). It's established that marijuana use can be significantly detrimental to short-term memory for things such as verbal recall and number sequences, for a good 24 hours or more after use. This link offers more detail:
People making the "But regular students can get high and still do okay" argument miss the point. These aren't regular students. They have a de facto job that takes up 30-40 hours of their week, a job that requires a ton of study and memorization on its own.
In a sport in which players have to memorize a lengthy playbook and quickly recall plays in a span of seconds when called in from the sideline, and where they are expected to memorize their opponents' tendencies from film study, anything that can impair short-term memory can hurt performance. Not to mention that these guys have to take a full courseload of college classes and need to be able to perform there, too. A lot of them are mediocre students to begin with; using a substance that affects their memory doesn't help.
Protip when you link to something about science make sure it's the actual report and not an article about it. Then people can read the report and look at how tests were conducted and what the errors were.
Even if weed was perfectly legal, it would probably still be against team rules.
Also, your argument is ridiculous. You can't give someone a pass (or even a partial pass) because the rule in place is dumb. Otherwise, you have to give Terrelle Pryor way more of a pass than you probably do now.
Not a single one of you (ok, maybe one) has contradicted what I said (with your actual arguments) as far as I can tell.
"My argument" seems to be an assumed one.
Edit- jmblue being the exception... And wrong.
and you don't like the rule, but who cares what you think?
It's illegal and against team rules. End of story, Kelly Baraka.
I find the term "pothead" offensive. Do we have a term like this for people that are occasional drinkers or who have to have a cup of coffee every morning? Your point loses it's effectivness when you start labeling people you don't know.
I agree with the sentiment that a rule is a rule whether you agree with it or not. But don't label someone a "pothead" just because they think it's stupid to make a plant illegal.
The fact that you've been up voted to '3' for calling someone a pothead because they think a particular rule or law is ridiculous just goes to show the level of obtuse thinking of some users on this site.
fairly loose treatment of mary jane I've always wondered why this didn't happen more often with Michigan athletes.
From my experience as a student, many athletes (all sports, not just football) do smoke weed and party often. Most just do it out of season when they know there is not as tight of scruitiny and are notified of testing in advance. The day after their season ends is a big night for this. I will never forget how how hungover/stoned the hot womens soccer player in my freshman Spanish class was the day after the season was over.
things like ADHD (lot of diagnoses, lot of pot smokers) and heavy pressure to make good. Huge among athletes, and everyone knows it. I'm ambivalent, because it's just as bad or worse for your health than cigarettes, but prohibition hasn't worked.
Save the Puritan horseshit for someone else's post, please. We have all heard many times now that it's unacceptable to some of you anyway. Who cares.
"It's just as bad or worse for your health than cigarettes" Um, no. No it's not.
but where did I give a Puritan horseshit opinion on this. Calling AA's treatment of pot loose is accurate compared to other cities.. its a misdemeanor and is not as heavily pursued to enforce as other cities.
When he's made the same mistake 3 times, it doesn't look like he's going to change. At some point, you've got to let him go.
I think you have to judge each player and his attitude on an individual basis. There clearly are, and have been, consequences for his behavior. It just hasn't included permanent suspension. Coach Hoke and his colleagues have way more insight into whether Will has fundamental problems that affect his team and his ability to contribute.
My hunch is that Hoke thinks the weed thing is a significant violation simply because it is rule that is clearly out there for all to see. But I doubt he believes Will is a fundamentally flawed member of the team--he probably sees this as a simple hiccup that demonstrates a lack of intelligence more than anything. I expect Hoke will wait until after the season and keep people guessing at Hagerup's fate, but that in the end he will be back.
The problem is he has had consequences before for the same violation and obviously hasn't learned from it. I think of myself as a pretty understanding person, but I don't see any alternative to kicking him off the team.
At this point you just can't expect that he will learn from the mistake or the consequences because he hasn't shown the ability to do that the previous two times.I feel bad for the kid and wish him well, but I just can't see another way in this instance.
I think so...funny too.
I would not take his schoalrship and I would give him a chance to graduate.
The appropriate punishment would be to take the scholarship. He can graduate without it, 99.5% of us do. Hell, I'd be ok with him staying on the team as a walk-on. But that scholarship is a privledge that many, many people who would represent the University in a much better light could use. Give that money to someone who appreciates it.
But until the laws change, and the standards of the team change, you're bound to live by those rules and standards, regardless of whether or not you agree with them.
would still show up in your system and make you fail a drug test
MGoDisclaimer: This site does not condone the use of illegal substances. And we'd greatly appreciate you not contributing to the deliquency on these here pages.
It's amazing how seriously you guys take this website. Somebody on an internet message board is condoning drug use? Quick, call the cops!
Calm down. I was having a laugh.
I really hope he WILL learn his lesson this time.
feel bad for the kid. He was on the fast track to the easiest career in the world (being an NFL punter--currently ranked as the #4 punter on draft boards). Kiss that goodbye
Not necessarily. Maybe it'll be tougher for him to break into the league, but he's got the talent, and pretty much all NFL teams would give him a try-out at least
i for one hope he gets his shot at the nfl...in 2013. horrible precedent if he's allowed back on this team.
So what we get drunk
So what we smoke weed
We're just having fun
We don't care who sees
So what we go out
That's how it's supposed to be
Living young and wild and freeeeee.
Seriously though. Get your stuff together and get back next year, Will.
how this always turns into a discussion about if weed should or should not be a punishable offence for athletes. Its notation rite to be on a team, its a privilege. The same rules that apply to the general public do not automatically apply to a team, group, or club. These kids damn well know the rules. From a middle school level and up you sign a code of conduct to participate on a team.
There has been one person that thinks this shouldn't be a punishable offense. Everyone else has said pretty much exactly what u are saying, whether you think the rule/law is dumb or not, it's in place, and all athletes know that, and agree to abide by it.
Didn't harsh his mellow
Great you like to smoke weed. Stuff ruins your life. The mirror is proof.
But also may help improve life for others. No one-size-fits-all effect my friend.
It's illegal because people think it will ruin your life. However, the only ways in which it ruins people's lives are the legal issues associated with getting caught with it.
Been in corporate law with a large firm for years. I smoke a few times a week and have done very well. This stuff doesn't "dry all your brain cells." At the end of the day, I'm much more productive the next day than going out and drinking 12 drinks. Hangovers suck.
I don't think anyone is arguing that you should get high before/during work, it's just like drinking.
Been in corporate law with a large firm and large corporation for years. Just wanted to advise you not to switch to an in-house position and continue your current lifestyle. If so, you will definitely experience the adverse effect of drug use after your drug test comes back positive.
on the wrong high horse.
I guess so. Its a dumb discussion anyway. Hagerup broke a team rule (however stupid) and he got suspended. Plain and simple. Having a discussion about the merits of pot is pointless - both sides think they are right and won't budge in their opinion. FTR, I'm fine with people smoking pot. As long as it doesn't affect me, I couldn't care less.
Being intentionally vague here for the sake of privacy, but out of my group of friends that I smoke with, I got my Master's at 23 and got hired at the first job I applied to with great pay and benefits before even graduating. 3 of my friends are in prestigious grad programs and doing well in them, another is quickly moving up in a very competitive profession, another got hired to the first position he applied out of undergrad in a great spot and plans to return to grad work, finally another is running his own business very successfully.
The last 3 presidents have all admitted to smoking, another of the candidates and former New Mexico governor Gary Johnson is actively pro-legalization and an open smoker.
People who are "addicted" to it are the result of an addictive personality, the chemical dependency caused by weed is less than alcohol, caffeine, or tobacco. Weed is also less harmful to you than alcohol or tobacco, and in ways can be beneficial through stress reduction and helping deal with nausea.
The only real argument I can understand for keeping it illegal is that there's no easy, accurate test yet like a breathalyzer to test drivers for driving while stoned. However, this shouldn't be to difficult to develop, people just need to get over the stigma behind the drug in general.
Disclaimer: I'm not defending Hagerup, it's still illegal and against team rules and he knew that. I just think it still being illegal in the first place is due to an antiquated style of thinking.
But, don't forget, Bill Clinton never inhaled.
That is the purest truth.
I'm not one who bashes weed smokers, I know and associate with many. I have to ask you though...have you ever worked on a detox unit? I can tell you with absolute certainty that weed can negatively effect people lives in many more ways than just the legal ramifications. I'm not saying it is any better or worse than lots of other things out there, but to insinuate that the only way it ruins lives is through the legal issues that coincide with it is absurd. Again, I'm not judging anyone here, but that is just too far off base to let fly.
First of all, where does it say it was weed? All the article says is "Without offering details, Hagerup said he lapsed into 'old habits' and blames no one but himself. " We may suspect it was weed, and that may even be a good guess, but I don't see how we know that.
Re: the effects of weed, I think The Kings of Leon's bass player Jared Followil put it best:
"Marijuana is a gateway drug. It leads to sweatpants and Cheetos."
For the record, I don't smoke. But man people like to speak in sweeping generalizations about weed on a board that regularly publishes an "it's ___day, whatcha drinkin'?" post wherein tons of folks brag about their C2H50H fix for the night. And they do so w/o approbation from this board's members, even though we're all aware of the damage alcohol does in our society. (And for the record, I do drink socially.)
Re: Will H., I hope he gets his head on straight and puts this silliness behind him. If he was smoking weed, I hope he stops at least so long as he's on the team - that's selfish behavior, and self-destructive when you're a full scholarship athlete. I thought his apology was sincere and hopefully this shakes some sense into him. He's just 21, and has his whole life ahead of him.
This is not getting enough attention. It doesn't explicitly say it was weed. There's a pretty long discussion here based on speculation.
My friend ate a Marijuana once and gained 20 pounds. Shit kills, yo.
The rule he broke is irrelevant. It could be team policy to forbid jaywalking. If you break that policy three times, with notice that there will be indeniable proof if you break the policy, you don't deserve to be part of the team.
Being part of a football team is very different from being a student. You do not live in a democracy, your coach is the first and last word on all things policy. Rules are strict but they are clear and breaking those rules results in punishment or worse yet loss of scholarship. Every player knows this and coaches view it as a sign of disrespect for those that still roll the dice. Bottom line, Will should be gone.
Seriously, if weed is more important to you then the Michigan football team then Hoke and Co should just boot him off the field already. Give him plenty of free time to smoke up with mommy and daddy paying for his school.
3 strikes is plenty. Obviously missing games is not punishment enough for this kid.
Michigan Football > weed
Get your head together Will. I realize in the city of A2 they think it's acceptable but it's still an illegal drug and doing any kind of illegal substance should be a dismissal. Bo kicked players off his team when he found about their pot smoking (per his book).
Like Rick Leach. Oh, wait...
Rick probably would have been better off if he had stopped at the MJ....
Rules are rules are rules. We all did stupid sh*t when we were young. The issue I'd be worried about is what are my parents going to do to me!??!? If I pissed away my full-ride athletic scholly to a premier football U....wouldn't be purdy. $50,000 a year I'm guessing. An opportunity to make millions to kick the ball a few times. Is anyone going to want to draft that kid?
If you are a freshmen living in south quad and want to toke on a jibber....I say go for it. If you are a full ride scholar athlete with the opportunity of lifetime....you may want to hold off on that for at least 4 years.
This is not Nam! There are rules!
Of my former teammates were busted for pot. When I say several, I mean 9 people in one instance. Coach Hoke had a discussion with the team about it, and to this day he is still the reason why I will not smoke anymore. Coach told us that he really did not care whether or not marijuana is harmful or helpful, he really did not care what our opinions on it either. But at the end to the day, "it is still against the law." That makes the legal consequences of it far worse than any possible physical damage it may or may not cause to one's body/mind. That really resounded with me, and although I certainly have dabbled here and there since then, or "relapsed into old habbits," that discussion has always been what I think about the next morning.
People that say weed only ruins your life because of the legal issues it causes are fucking nuts. I know plenty of people that can't stop fucking smoking weed and basically do nothing now besides that. Sure it should be legal, but like alcohol some people fucking abuse that shit man.
Regarding the team rules, they're the TEAM RULES. Everyone has to follow them, so no argument from me there. But regarding smoking pot, some people handle it well and some people don't. Some people can do it recreationally, and some people can't function without it. It isn't always harmless.
That explains this...
Ugh what the hell...Ya'll know what this gif is.
But can someone help me?
That's the first thing I thought of, too.
Team rules are team rules. Coach Hoke may have many reasons for setting them; it's not for us as fans to question his reasoning for them since we are not players who are bound by them.
The players, on the other hand, know the rules and presumably the consequences for not following them. Hagerup would actually know them better than most.
I find it very interesting that the comments between Floyd and Hagerup are vastly different.
A couple other thoughts:
---People are holding Hagerup to "3 strikes" and they're pissed. Yet many of them wanted Demar Dorsey on this team (a kid past 3 strikes and was bound to make more mistakes in college --- which he did, just not at Michigan)
---I didn't read anywhere where Hagerup pleaded to remain on the team or asked for sympathy. He just apologized. Why is everyone jumping down his throat for apologizing? I see all this "blah blah blah" stuff. I'm not sure just because you have a problem and mess up doesn't mean you can't apologize. Not saying you should get a break over the apology, but what's wrong with simply apologizing? What is he supposed to do? Say "fuck it, I'm a lost cause..." take is bong and walk into the sunset?
Are you seriously comparing the Will Hagerup issue to the Demar Dorsey issue?
Not sure how you can ask for forgiveness for DD and berate Hagerup.
When it comes to sitiations like this, I like to look at it from a parent point of view. What would I do if it was MY son who was the one in trouble? (NOTE: I'm the dad of a 19year old freshman at Michigan and a 17 year old daughter and I've coached kids for many years.)
Personally, in this case, if it were my son who just got suspended from the team for the third time, I'd be doing a lot more yelling than apparently the coaches did. I'd be furious that my son was so selfish (AGAIN) that he refused to think of his teammates before himself. I'd be disappointed in him and myself, but as Coach Hoke says, this is a learning moment. If he lost his spot on the team, I'd be sick to my stomach for him, but I'd also agree with the punishment.
Yeah, and whatever Floyd did too; lets change whatever rule/law he broke to make whatever he did no big deal. That'll fix it.
Heck, staying out late isn't against the law. Why are there team curfew rules???? Get rid of those too!
P.S. Marijuana is not "widely" used. I'd venture a guess that the number of users is less than 25% of the population, if even close to that percentage. In no corner of the world is that "wide use."
Makes sense to me. I'm not into using it but I'm not one to butt into other people's lives. To each their own. As long as it doesn't effect me I'm fine with it.
Marijuana (used by less than 25% of the population)
Makeup (used by less than half of the world's women and some men)
Oral contraceptives (used by less than half of the world's women)
Dermatologists (no way these are used by more than 25% of the population)
"Less than 25% of the population" is the dumbest metric for "widely used" I've ever heard of.
Cute. I used 25% because it seemed like a good number. Personally, I think its probably down around 5% but I was sure to get hammered for using that number too.
FTR, using percentages based on the world population is also dumb.
With very little difference shown in trends, annual usage is measured at over 10%, and monthly usage 5-6%. So no, it's not exactly like "everybody is doing it."
The point was that marijuana is widely used.
while 3 positive tests for weed get you temporarily suspended because:
A. The coaches are concerned he may be an addict and it's not his fault.
B. When he apologizes, he's sincere.
C. There isn't another all league punter on the roster for next year.
D. All of the above
E. He wasn't putting other people's lives at risk.
Maybe that's a possibility too.
Because if you're talking about what I think you're talking about, we all know there was more than that.
And I feel a lot better about our punter depth than our receiver depth, so I doubt C has anything to do with it. Whatever "it" is, because we're not finished yet.
Weed is technically a drug and has addictive properties. That's why people do other harmful things despite the consequences. Before people start calling the kid selfish and other negative things, it would be helpful to know what the culture was like around him and the other players on the team smoking weed and drinking, to treat their addiction and foster a dependent free lifestyle.
You can't applaud the coaches for "doing the right thing" by suspending him, if they are not supporting these kids to overcome their addictions. That's part of grooming these guys into responsible men.
Weed addictive? That's just, like, your opinion man.
But seriously, alcohol forms stronger chemical dependencies than pot.
he needs to move on to the NFL....They don't care what you do there.
I know I am late to this party and i completely understand that weed is technically illegal and the coaches have to lay down rules because they have to maintain authority, but...weed, man? WEED?
Ugh, this bothers me on so many levels. This country needs to let it go on the weed thing. I don't even like weed and i know it is better for me than alcohol. I love me some alcohol though... ladies.
"Technically illegal"?? Is that kinda like "almost a virgin"? It's illegal. That's it. The kid broke the law. I hate to see a good talent go, but 3 times he put his own illegal interests before the interests of the team. Buh-bye. He can smoke himself out of the NFL now.
In Ann Arbor, as you might put it, it's kinda like "a parking ticket".
One, pot is not illegal in Colorado or Washington anymore. Oregon's pot laws enforced in such a way that it is only "technically illegal."
Two, as far as "the kid broke the law" and that's it for him attitude. Here's some other illegal things (in many states) for you.
impersonating a person of the clergy
not using headlights when your wipers are on
Of course, it is still illegal in Michigan--the only state relevant to Will. Not to mention that possession still violates federal law in every state.
Marijuana is a controlled federal substance. Until that changes, purchase/possession/distribution are federal crimes and that means you're at the mercy of your local US Attorney if you get caught.
""And, if the local DA feels like running for something next year, he could also go to jail." - Sports Night, "The Reunion"
should Hagerup's time with the Wolverines be over. jk
Don't be suprised if he remains on scholarship that suspensions increase under Hoke. College kids smoke weed. If there is no threat to be booted even after getting busted 3 times, where's the threat? Smoke up Johnny!
I don't know how "sincere" Hagerup's apology really is. With Floyd, this was his first time being suspended (unless there's an event that's slipping my mind), it would have been his last game as a Wolverine, and it would have been against his home town team. The language of his apology and just all the extenuating circumstances don't make me doubt the sincerity of his apology.
With Hagerup, not so much. If he was so sincere, he wouldn't have gotten suspended 3 times for the same thing and would have stopped by now. Maybe this is really the last time, or maybe it's just him pgyy-backing off of Floyd's apology to save face. I obviously don't know which for sure, but if I had to guess, I'd guess the latter.
From up here on my moral high horse.
So I think they should throw him off the team to enforce their rules, but I don't understand the view that he must be stupid because of this. He's a college student committed to his own freedom, come what may. That's not exactly rare.
Realizing that that the NFL tests for marijuana and cocaine were really effective, he did nothing but drink and do LSD in season. Lots of LSD.
Seriously though, what will they do with athletes in Colorado and other states where weed's now legal? What will they do at Michigan if weed returns to the glory months of early 1972?
Interesting idea. Weed could be another recruiting tool for schools in states where it's legal. There could even be endowed positions in the athletic department funded by rich potheads, to provide resources to draw recruits.
I don't smoke marijuana but it shouldn't be illegal. It was just legalized in my state. Whether Hagerup should be smoking it is another question.
Since it is a rule, and one that Hoke enforces, the problem with giving him one more chance, is why should anyone expect he won't do it again? His transgressions don't affect just him--they have the potential to be disruptive to the team.
I really think pot should be legal, and "college kid smokes pot" isn't exactly a rare occurance. However, when one is an elite athlete, anything that makes a small fraction of a second's difference in his reflexes can affect performance. He knows the rules, and is getting a four year scholly. Is it too much to ask to just say no?
Ironically, at MSU and OSU, whose fans will be having the most fun with this story, he would never have been suspended in the first place due to the "off the field doesn't count if you perform on the field" rule.
You already know what his response would be: "I Iearned it from watching you, Dad!".
Littering and? Littering and? Littering and?
NOW YOU DONT GET TO PLAY IN THE OUTBACK BOWL